SURVEY: Do you want Trump to finish his first term?

[lannarebirth]

2 hours ago, bristolboy said:

Really, he comes to the work without any biases at all. Where is your evidence for this? Because he says so? And the economists I previously cited who have widely differing beliefs, mostly agreed that the stimulus did have a positive effect on the recovery. With the exception of that one fellow who history has proven to be absurdly wrong.

 

Have you got a study that says the stimulus had a GDP multiplier greater than 1.0 ? Because that's what a positive effect looks like. Of course $800 Billion printed out of thin air and payable "sometime in the future" with interest, will seem positive at the time but as I said it is a hugely negative return on investment as deployed. And of course the fact that it was all borrowed money only serves to hamper future growth. I think private sector incentives would have worked much better as an economic stimulus. That is my opinion based on studies I've read. 

Edited June 4, 2018 by lannarebirth

[Chomper Higgot]

If we get rid of the ‘whataboutary’ surrounding hypothetical arguments regarding the ‘stimulus’ we can get back to the incumbent President (ie topic).

 

Perhaps the outcome of his tax giveaway to the hyper wealthy.

 

Where’s the money coming from?

Where’s the money going to?

Who wins, who loses?

 

 

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

If we get rid of the ‘whataboutary’ surrounding hypothetical arguments regarding the ‘stimulus’ we can get back to the incumbent President (ie topic).

 

Perhaps the outcome of his tax giveaway to the hyper wealthy.

 

Where’s the money coming from?

Where’s the money going to?

Who wins, who loses?

 

 

The money is coming from the sell of T-bills to the countries we have a trade deficit with.  It allows them to earn interest on the US dollars they received from us.  If it weren't for the government borrowing, these countries would have to buy from or invest in the US, ending the trade deficit.

 

The money is going to the rich, either directly or though companies paying dividends.

 

The rich win, future generations lose.  Deficits are bad under the Democrats, but, once again, far worse under the Republicans.

[bristolboy]

5 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Have you got a study that says the stimulus had a GDP multiplier greater than 1.0 ? Because that's what a positive effect looks like. Of course $800 Billion printed out of thin air and payable "sometime in the future" with interest, will seem positive at the time but as I said it is a hugely negative return on investment as deployed. And of course the fact that it was all borrowed money only serves to hamper future growth. I think private sector incentives would have worked much better as an economic stimulus. That is my opinion based on studies I've read. 

First off, almost 40 percent of the stimulus program was tax breaks. And the obvious flaw in your assertion is that had the stimulus not been passed that would have flowed to the bottom line. As the example of the EU shows, you actually lose more money by not going for stimulus spending in a financial recession/depression than you save. And given that interest rates were so low, negates your point further. If anything the stimulus was way too small given the shortfall in demand and the productive capacity of the economy. A lot of unnecessary suffering occurred because of the lunacy of the Republicans who demanded austerity when the economy was running so far below productive capacity.

I already provide you with a link to such studies. And you must have been reading very selectively to come to your conclusion. But given that you believe a certain economist came to his conclusions with no biases beforehand, I'm not surprised.

[bristolboy]

Trump Team Pushed False Story Line About Meeting With Kremlin-Tied Lawyer, Memo Shows

For nearly a year, the denials from President Trump’s lawyers and spokeswoman were unequivocal. No, the president did not dictate a misleading statement released in his son’s name...

But in a confidential, hand-delivered memo to the special counsel, Mr. Trump’s lawyers acknowledged that, yes, Mr. Trump had dictated the statement, which attempted to deflect questions about a meeting with a Kremlin-tied lawyer at Trump Tower.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/04/us/politics/trump-mueller-falsehoods-tower-meeting.html

[ballpoint]

6 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

I think you mean the Nobel Peach Prize and yes Trump thoroughly deserves that. 

He certainly deserves the Nobel Impeach prize.

 

[FritsSikkink]

14 hours ago, wolf81 said:

Many people might laugh at what I will state here, but I will write it down anyways...

 

I believe Trump could stand to become one of the greatest US presidents in the past 30 years or so. I think under Trump it's possible we will see a peach treaty between North- and South-Korea and who knows, perhaps eventually the countries will re-unite. If Trump achieves the peach treaty he will be at least more worthy for a Nobel Peace Price than Obama ever was.

 

I also think he is really a smart business-man, even if he might not give this impression. It's likely he will cause the EU to abandon the nuclear deal. In the end the nuclear deal wasn't about peace anyway, but more about giving European multinationals some new business opportunities. But it seems many of these multinationals are already having second thought now, since they still want to keep access to the US market. I do believe Iran still aims to make a nuclear weapon, so with this in mind, I think Trump makes the right choice.

 

He might also de-escalate the situation in Syria, which is something I doubt would have happened under the warmonger called Hillary Clinton.

 

So far so good. As it stands now, I hope he gets a 2nd term.I think he'll make the world a safer place.

He will NEVER get a 2nd term as he keep on lying to everybody:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-team-pushed-false-story-line-about-meeting-with-kremlin-tied-lawyer-memo-shows/ar-AAydZ8T?ocid=spartandhp

 

He will more likely go to jail.

[FritsSikkink]

Manafort will be singing soon:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/manafort-attempted-to-tamper-with-potential-witnesses-us-special-counsel/ar-AAyeuI5?ocid=spartandhp

[Chomper Higgot]

5 hours ago, heybruce said:

The money is coming from the sell of T-bills to the countries we have a trade deficit with.  It allows them to earn interest on the US dollars they received from us.  If it weren't for the government borrowing, these countries would have to buy from or invest in the US, ending the trade deficit.

 

The money is going to the rich, either directly or though companies paying dividends.

 

The rich win, future generations lose.  Deficits are bad under the Democrats, but, once again, far worse under the Republicans.

The money is also coming from stripping access to affordable health care for millions of ordinary working Americans - No healthcare for the poor, excessive tax give away to the hyper wealthy.

 

Blue Collar America rejoice!

[mikebike]

20 hours ago, wolf81 said:

Many people might laugh at what I will state here, but I will write it down anyways...

 

I believe Trump could stand to become one of the greatest US presidents in the past 30 years or so. I think under Trump it's possible we will see a peach treaty between North- and South-Korea and who knows, perhaps eventually the countries will re-unite. If Trump achieves the peach treaty he will be at least more worthy for a Nobel Peace Price than Obama ever was.

 

I also think he is really a smart business-man, even if he might not give this impression. It's likely he will cause the EU to abandon the nuclear deal. In the end the nuclear deal wasn't about peace anyway, but more about giving European multinationals some new business opportunities. But it seems many of these multinationals are already having second thought now, since they still want to keep access to the US market. I do believe Iran still aims to make a nuclear weapon, so with this in mind, I think Trump makes the right choice.

 

He might also de-escalate the situation in Syria, which is something I doubt would have happened under the warmonger called Hillary Clinton.

 

So far so good. As it stands now, I hope he gets a 2nd term.I think he'll make the world a safer place.

Maybe cut back on the day-drinkin'...

[Andaman Al]

21 hours ago, wolf81 said:

Many people might laugh at what I will state here

I agree 100%

[riclag]

And the deranged left say PT is a disgrace and unfit and he doesn't belong in the WH. Keep it up PT !

There now are more job openings in the U.S. than unemployed workers to fill them

"Early in the recovery from the Great Recession in 2009, there were more than six unemployed workers for every job opening. That ratio has been narrowing ever since. In April, there was fewer than one unemployed worker for every opening".

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-job-openings-workers-20180605-story.html

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, riclag said:

And the deranged left say PT is a disgrace and unfit and he doesn't belong in the WH. Keep it up PT !

There now are more job openings in the U.S. than unemployed workers to fill them

"Early in the recovery from the Great Recession in 2009, there were more than six unemployed workers for every job opening. That ratio has been narrowing ever since. In April, there was fewer than one unemployed worker for every opening".

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-job-openings-workers-20180605-story.html

And Trump is responsible for this how?

[riclag]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

And Trump is responsible for this how?

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/368904-economists-agree-trump-not-obama-gets-credit-for-economy

[Slip]

7 minutes ago, riclag said:

And the deranged left say PT is a disgrace and unfit and he doesn't belong in the WH. Keep it up PT !

There now are more job openings in the U.S. than unemployed workers to fill them

"Early in the recovery from the Great Recession in 2009, there were more than six unemployed workers for every job opening. That ratio has been narrowing ever since. In April, there was fewer than one unemployed worker for every opening".

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-job-openings-workers-20180605-story.html

5 minutes ago, riclag said:

That ratio has been narrowing ever since.

 

[lannarebirth]

On 6/4/2018 at 11:02 PM, Chomper Higgot said:

The money is also coming from stripping access to affordable health care for millions of ordinary working Americans - No healthcare for the poor, excessive tax give away to the hyper wealthy.

 

Blue Collar America rejoice!

 

No healthcare for the poor?  Has Medicaid disappeared or did you just make that up?

Edited June 7, 2018 by lannarebirth

[riclag]

6 minutes ago, Slip said:

 

"Even the New York Times, no friend to President Trump, has described the “wave of optimism” sweeping over Americans business leaders, saying it is “beginning to translate into the sort of investment in new plants, equipment and factory upgrades that bolsters economic growth, spurs job creation — and may finally raise wages significantly.” 

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/368904-economists-agree-trump-not-obama-gets-credit-for-economy

Edited June 7, 2018 by riclag

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, riclag said:

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/368904-economists-agree-trump-not-obama-gets-credit-for-economy

ANd I went to the original article. Since the Journal doesn't offer a complete list of the economists it surveyed I can only go on the basis of those it quoted. One was the chief economist of the national associataion of manufactures and the other was manufacturers association and the other was an economist at the Economic Outlet Group. Not surprising that these 2 economists working for organizations that cater to industry would make such statements.

Here's a sample of the kind of balderdash one of these economists cited:

“There is definitely a sense in the business community that the president’s actions on taxes and regulations have led to a more pro-growth environment for them to operate,” said Chad Moutray, chief economist at the National Association of Manufacturers."

Find me a source that's transparent about who it's surveying.

[bristolboy]

9 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

No healthcare for the poor?  Has Medicaid disappeared or did you just make that up?

If the Republicans get their way Medicaid will certainly be at least curtailed. Of course, it's currently still expanding thanks to Obamacare.

[lannarebirth]

3 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

If the Republicans get their way Medicaid will certainly be at least curtailed. Of course, it's currently still expanding thanks to Obamacare.

 

So you agree it was a bullshit post.

[bristolboy]

Just now, lannarebirth said:

 

So you agree it was a bullshit post.

Yes the post was wrong in saying the US doesn't help the poor with health care. But it could do a lot more to help the people it already does and even more for people just a little higher up on the economic ladder. Something to which Republicans are mostly opposed.

[lannarebirth]

Just now, bristolboy said:

Yes the post was wrong in saying the US doesn't help the poor with health care. But it could do a lot more to help the people it already does and even more for people just a little higher up on the economic ladder. Something to which Republicans are mostly opposed.

 

No question. The US could adopt single payer but no president of any party has suggested it, let alone fought for it.

[Jingthing]

We now have a seriously SICK person as president. He's a total HATER and he infects the nation (and the world) with his peculiar mental state. No, that's not impeachable but maybe it SHOULD be.

 

http://www.paywallnews.com/life/Opinion-|-‘I-Want-to-Hate-…’.SyWkzZLgX.html

 

Quote

NEW YORK TIMES Trump’s statements on the Central Park Five reveal the darkness at his core.
...
That to me is the thing with this man: He wants to hate. When Trump feels what he believes is a righteous indignation, his default position is hatred. Anyone who draws his ire, anyone whom he feels attacked by or offended by, anyone who has the nerve to stand up for himself or herselfand tell him he’s wrong, he wants to hate, and does so.

 

[spidermike007]

I seriously doubt he will finish his first term. More than likely he will be forced to resign, or will be impeached. The dems are going to crush the GOP come November. This is a certainty. Let us see how this plays out. Will be alot of fun to watch. The Tiny Don TV show will take a seriously dark turn, very soon I predict. Within just several more episodes.

[soalbundy]

Trump is the lowest common denominator, his ignorance and conceit along with his propensity for lying appear to appeal to the 'not haves' and the very rich alike, he is not only a danger the USA whose good standing and soft power has fallen since Obama left office, he is also a danger to the whole world and to the ideals of democracy.

[riclag]

5 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Trump is the lowest common denominator, his ignorance and conceit along with his propensity for lying appear to appeal to the 'not haves' and the very rich alike, he is not only a danger the USA whose good standing and soft power has fallen since Obama left office, he is also a danger to the whole world and to the ideals of democracy.

"A vast majority of Americans feel more optimistic about their prospects than they have in a decade. Will they really want to rock the boat come November and throw out the party at the helm? We shall see".

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/368904-economists-agree-trump-not-obama-gets-credit-for-economy

Edited June 7, 2018 by riclag

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, riclag said:

"A vast majority of Americans feel more optimistic about their prospects than they have in a decade. Will they really want to rock the boat come November and throw out the party at the helm? We shall see".

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/368904-economists-agree-trump-not-obama-gets-credit-for-economy

Those prospects are built on sand, wait until a trade war gets underway and let us see the quality of those 'new jobs' that have been created. China and probably India are the new boys on the block, America can't run around waving a big stick anymore and its moral standing under Trump is very low especially in the West, he has become a figure of ridicule.

[riclag]

14 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Those prospects are built on sand, wait until a trade war gets underway and let us see the quality of those 'new jobs' that have been created. China and probably India are the new boys on the block, America can't run around waving a big stick anymore and its moral standing under Trump is very low especially in the West, he has become a figure of ridicule.

" he has become a figure of ridicule".

Only to the hysterical deranged left that call him sick ,unfit and lacking knowledge. As long as the economy is going strong ,that ridicule will be mute. In fact the  left mania will be used in campaign ads to show how they are so arrogant and out of touch about how well the economy and foreign policy is doing.His campaign promise was to challenge the Chinese on trade. If he can help it he will use a stick if America is threaten .

Edited June 7, 2018 by riclag

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, riclag said:

" he has become a figure of ridicule".

Only to the hysterical deranged left that call him sick ,unfit and lacking knowledge. As long as the economy is going strong ,that ridicule will be mute.His campaign promise was to challenge the Chinese on trade. If he can help it he will use a stick if America is threaten .

You can't use big sticks these days because the other guy also has one but bluster and aggression seems to be his only answer. He even thinks trade wars are easy to win, worked well in the 30's didn't it. He has been warned by PM May to stay away from London if he comes to the UK, the anti-Trump demonstrations will be hard to control, nobody wants him.

[riclag]

"but bluster and aggression seems to be his only answer".

Is that happening in the NK summit,aggression ? Seems to be a little bit of confusion  here. The summit is a  act of  peaceful diplomacy.