Online Teaching

[youreavinalaff]

It still seems to me beyond mad that people think that this subject is black and white and won't even acknowledge things that have been said, to the contrary of the law, by immigration officials.

[Neeranam]

On 20/04/2018 at 8:45 AM, Happy Grumpy said:

^ why?

 

There's nothing illegal about being remotely employed by a foreign company (non-Thai), dealing with foreigners (non-Thai), in foreign locations (not in Thailand) , while being paid (and paying the tax) in your home country, and that money staying there, while in your own property while happening to be here.

This is true. 

[Neeranam]

21 hours ago, Scott said:

Years ago, I was doing some writing for a magazine and decided that Thailand would be a nice place to do so.   The research was done, it was a matter of just getting it written.   The magazine and the article was not based in Thailand.    I was paid outside the country, but I was told to get a non-B and a work permit.  

 

At that time both were much easier than now.   But that was the instructions from the Embassy where the non-B was granted.  

I wrote for the, "Thailand Times" newspaper over 20 years ago without a work permit. Have also worked for universities without one.

On all my time here, I've only ever known of 2 teachers to get done for not having a WP.

[Johnniey]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

On all my time here, I've only ever known of 2 teachers to get done for not having a WP.

That was because of another reason. They just used the WP thing as an excuse to kick them out the country.

[Neeranam]

3 hours ago, Loaded said:

It still seems to me beyond mad that people on this thread are still arguing that working in Thailand as a teacher doesn't require the appropriate visa and work permit.

Online teaching is not considered as working in Thailand. Quite simple really.

 

 

[Loaded]

Online teaching is not considered as working in Thailand. Quite simple really.
 
 

Online teaching hasn't been noticed yet. It hasn't been considered at all yet. It's still working without the appropriate visa and work permit. Anicha.

Sent from my CPH1701 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[pearciderman]

21 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Online teaching is not considered as working in Thailand. Quite simple really.

 

 

 

You could not be further from the truth.

[Happy Grumpy]

On 4/21/2018 at 10:31 AM, Loaded said:

It's still working without the appropriate visa and work permit.

Nothing wrong with working on a Non-Imm visa (O, for example)

 

No Thai company/business.

No business or company in Thailand.

No Thais involved at any level.

No money coming into Thailand - Paid into a home country account with tax paid, and staying in a saving's account there.

Doing it alone in your own property, while here.

 

WP not needed. As already stated by the WP company earlier in the thread. 

 

Cheers. 

 

 

[Loaded]

1 hour ago, Happy Grumpy said:

Nothing wrong with working on a Non-Imm visa (O, for example)

 

No Thai company/business.

No business or company in Thailand.

No Thais involved at any level.

No money coming into Thailand - Paid into a home country account with tax paid, and staying in a saving's account there.

Doing it alone in your own property, while here.

 

WP not needed. As already stated by the WP company earlier in the thread. 

 

Cheers. 

 

 

Jeez

 

You need a work permit if you work on a non-immigrant O (based on marriage to a Thai?)

 

 

Edited April 22, 2018 by Loaded

[Neeranam]

10 hours ago, pearciderman said:

 

You could not be further from the truth.

If the company you work is not in Thailand, I forgot to mention.

Same as stock traders and other such gamblers.

Is trading cryptocurrency illegal in Thailand? No, it isn't.

 

 

[Happy Grumpy]

3 hours ago, Loaded said:

Jeez

 

You need a work permit if you work on a non-immigrant O (based on marriage to a Thai?)

 

 

 

You sure do when employed by a company that's in Thailand. Don't forget to pay the taxes too.

 

Cheers.  

[Happy Grumpy]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Is trading cryptocurrency illegal in Thailand?

Of course not.

 

Same as online tutoring. Pay the taxes if the money is coming into Thailand - just get your Tax number etc to pay - of course you don't need a WP to make money here and pay the tax on it.

 

Cheers. 

 

 

Non-Imm visa.

Tax number.

 

Done. :)

Edited April 22, 2018 by Happy Grumpy

[gk10002000]

much of this thread mixes up the issues of getting a valid visa, getting a valid when required work permit, breaking thai laws that are not immigration laws but deal with income earned, tax reporting, etc.  Most monetized youtubers, vloggers do not make much money.  Some claim they do, and many are seduced by the idea of hanging out in Thailand, and not working a 9 to 5 job.  Sounds fun at first.  But most don't any sort of proper visa to say and are always fighting that, most live a very spartan lifestyle, most are not saving or investing anything, most don't have proper travel insurance, or medical insurance.  Nothing wrong with taking an adventure and giving things a go, but run the numbers, do your research.  Do you vloggers think you are the only people posting about Thailand?  what makes you so special from the hundreds or thousands of other people posting out there that would make them go to your sites?  Take a reality pill then evaluate things again

[pearciderman]

12 hours ago, Neeranam said:

If the company you work is not in Thailand, I forgot to mention.

Same as stock traders and other such gamblers.

Is trading cryptocurrency illegal in Thailand? No, it isn't.

 

 

 

The ONLY thing that matters is where YOU are, not the company, client or taxes paid.

 

If YOU are in Thailand working in any capacity, (and that can mean virtually anything according to the law), then you must have a work permit.

 

Bar room lawyers who tell you any different, are wrong.

[Neeranam]

24 minutes ago, pearciderman said:

 

The ONLY thing that matters is where YOU are, not the company, client or taxes paid.

 

If YOU are in Thailand working in any capacity, (and that can mean virtually anything according to the law), then you must have a work permit.

 

Bar room lawyers who tell you any different, are wrong.

Advising online teachers to get a work permit is strange advice. I don't believe they can get one.

It's like advising someone to get aWP of they teach their neighbour in his house. Nobody cares, probably 90% of teachers here teach extra classes privately or for a language school, and yes without paying tax. Nobody cares. 

I teach some students in Brazil and Mexico, but I do pay tax on it, but in the USA.

I teach the daughter of a deputy commander of police at his house.

I have taught a group of CSD police.

I taught all the Klong Tan police before the Asian games. I've taught at the home of the head of Bangkok traffic police. None of them cared Abbott a WP.

Do you know any individual online teacher,  working at home, or any tutoring at a house or language school to have been charged? I don't.

Again, nobody cares. Don't go scare mongering, and giving bad advice..

 

[pearciderman]

30 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Again, nobody cares. Don't go scare mongering, and giving bad advice..

 

OK, let's deal with the above in order.

 

Do not confuse lack of enforcement with legal, two totally different things.

 

Scaremongering, where in any of my posts have I mentioned arrests or punishments for working without a work permit.

 

If by "bad advice", you mean simply stating what the law says, then guilty as charged.

[pearciderman]

37 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Do you know any individual online teacher,  working at home, or any tutoring at a house or language school to have been charged? I don't.

 

Where were these two teachers working? These are your words, not mine.

 

"On all my time here, I've only ever known of 2 teachers to get done for not having a WP."

 

Posted Saturday at 09:29 AM ·

[Happy Grumpy]

1 hour ago, pearciderman said:

The ONLY thing that matters is where YOU are, not the company, client or taxes paid.

 

If YOU are in Thailand working in any capacity, (and that can mean virtually anything according to the law), then you must have a work permit.

Actually, that's not true at all.

 

It's what you are doing, how you are doing it and who you are doing it for.

 

For example, the alien employment act... for aliens that are employed here (not remotely for non-Thai companies that have nothing to do with Thailand and paid into and taxed in home country accounts) lists numbers of exemptions where no WP is required.

 

Cheers. 

Edited April 23, 2018 by Happy Grumpy

[Happy Grumpy]

31 minutes ago, pearciderman said:

If by "bad advice", you mean simply stating what the law says, then guilty as charged.

You've already shown that you don't know the law.

 

"If YOU are in Thailand working in any capacity, (and that can mean virtually anything according to the law), then you must have a work permit."

 

The Alien Employment Act lists out a number of exceptions. 

 

You're wrong and don't know what you'r talking about. 

 

Cheers.

[pearciderman]

7 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

The Alien Employment Act lists out a number of exceptions. 

 

You're wrong and don't know what you'r talking about. 

 

Cheers.

 

OK, let's clear up that the OP is in no way shape or form talking about either diplomatic or consular missions, as they do not require work permits. Below is a list of things that a foreigner can do without a work permit, you may notice that online teaching is not on it.

 

Based on the opinion of the Council of State, the DOE issued the Notification in March 2015, specifying the following activities not considered as ‘work’ under the Act:
1. Attendance at meetings, discussions or seminars.
2. Attendance at exhibitions or trade exhibitions.
3. Visits to observe businesses or to meet for business dialogues.
4. Attendance at special lectures and academic lectures.
5. Attendance at technical training and seminars.
6. Purchasing of goods in trade exhibitions.
7. Attendance at board of directors meetings of one’s company.

[Happy Grumpy]

5 minutes ago, pearciderman said:

online teaching is not on it.

 

Of course not.

 

Working remotely (and privately) for a non-Thai company that doesn't have any connection to any Thais or Thailand, while paid and taxed into a home nation account, and which money never enters Thailand, doesn't fall under the Thai Alien Employment Act. Obviously.

 

If it did they would have the process set up to get one. As it doesn't fall under the Thai Alien Employment Act, they don't. 

 

 

Cheers.

 

 

[pearciderman]

3 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

the Thai Alien Employment Act. Obviously.

 

Did you mean The new Royal Decree on Managing the Work of Aliens (2017) , as this cancels and replaces the two main pieces of legislation regulating foreigners working in Thailand, namely the Royal Decree on Bringing Alien to Work in the Kingdom B.E. 2559 (2016) and the Alien's Work Act B.E. 2551 (2008).

 

Seems you are referring to legislation that is no longer extant.

 

 

[MikeyIdea]

Jesus, this must have been one of the most stupid threads I have read in a long time

 

The Alien Employment Act or whatever replaces it lists out a number of exceptions but you must have a work permit to work in Thailand in any other profession if you (as where your body is) are in Thailand when doing it, internet or otherwise. Then, we have the Thai-effect. No one will care until it becomes really noticeable and anyone can safely go on with internet teaching for now, people will start to get kicked out one day, I don't know if I still will be alive when that happens and I don't think anyone else knows either. Anyone who thinks it is wrong if/when he/she gets kicked out one day is an immoral idiot

 

Anyone who does internet teaching in Thailand should pay tax in Thailand or he/she does not deserve to be here and should leave, it's easy to do also without work permit and taxes are miniscule

 

Michael

 

 

 

Edited April 23, 2018 by MikeyIdea

[duanebigsby]

3 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

Jesus, this must have been one of the most stupid threads I have read in a long time

 

The Alien Employment Act lists out a number of exceptions but you must have a work permit to work in Thailand in any other profession if you (as where your body is) are in Thailand when doing it, internet or otherwise. Then, we have the Thai-effect. No one will care until it becomes really noticeable and anyone can safely go on with internet teaching for now, people will start to get kicked out one day, I don't know if I still will be alive when that happens and I don't think anyone else knows either

 

Anyone who does internet teaching in Thailand should pay tax in Thailand or he/she does not deserve to be here and should leave, it's easy to do also without work permit and taxes are miniscule

 

Michael

 

 

 

Immigration and the Gov't have repeatedly said they were not interested in digital nomads or online teachers working from home. 

The time may come, like you say, when that is no longer the case. As for taxes...if the $6 billion dollar a year prostitution industry isn't paying any tax why would an online teacher?

[MikeyIdea]

6 minutes ago, duanebigsby said:

Immigration and the Gov't have repeatedly said they were not interested in digital nomads or online teachers working from home. 

The time may come, like you say, when that is no longer the case. As for taxes...if the $6 billion dollar a year prostitution industry isn't paying any tax why would an online teacher?

Of course I think that anyone who works with internet teaching in Thailand because he/she enjoys living in Thailand should pay tax here or leave

 

That is common sense and has nothing to do with that there are Thai citizens who do not

Edited April 23, 2018 by MikeyIdea

[duanebigsby]

1 minute ago, MikeyIdea said:

Of course I think that anyone who works with internet teaching in Thailand because he/she enjoys living in Thailand should pay tax here or leave

 

That is common sense and has nothing to do with that there are Thai citizens who does not

If you try to pay tax here without a work permit it might bite you on the ass. 

[SlyAnimal]

https://www.chiangraitimes.com/17-foreigners-arrested-in-chiang-mai-for-teaching-english-online.html

Does the above article perhaps answer everyone’s questions on the legality of teaching online?

They were teaching from an office, Not from home, but even the teachers with work permits were arrested as their work permits related to teaching at schools not online.

Doing it from home you’re unlikely to get caught, just like you’re unlikely to get caught vaping at home or going out in public with no underwear but it’s illegal and the police can arrest you for it.

As for whether you should do it or not, that slim chance of being caught committing a crime that no one knows about and no one cares about.... it’s a possibility.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Neeranam]

I had no idea not wearing underwear was illegal.

 

Simplest way is to become a Thai citizen, which is much easier to do these days, then no work permit is required. If working for an American company, one pays tax there, not here due to a tax treaty.

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, pearciderman said:

 

Where were these two teachers working? These are your words, not mine.

 

"On all my time here, I've only ever known of 2 teachers to get done for not having a WP."

 

Posted Saturday at 09:29 AM ·

Answer my question first then I'll explain to you.

 

How many teachers do you know who have been deported for not having a WP? How long have you been teaching here?

[SlyAnimal]

17 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Answer my question first then I'll explain to you.

 

How many teachers do you know who have been deported for not having a WP? How long have you been teaching here?

If you refer to the article I posted above, there's an example of 17x teachers being arrested for not having work permits (admittedly for teaching English online rather than at schools though)

Also the below article is an example of schools being raided.  Admittedly, raided looking for "Black people", and it specifies that they were looking for visa violations rather than work permit violations, but you'd still want to be careful, particularly if you're not Caucasian.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/news/crimecourtscalamity/crime-crime/2018/03/23/123-more-foreigners-arrested-in-raids-on-schools-hostels/