Thai child separation anxiety

[BritManToo]

10 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

Anyone been through a similar thing? It does seem to be a very common thing here, 

You've been manipulated into looking after another mans child.

Welcome to ThaiCuckland.

 

I've had several 'single mom' lovers, at some point in time the kid always moves in, and usually displaces you from mom's bed and mom's affections. Plenty more single mom's out there, choose again or endure being No.2.

 

PS. Never hit another man's kids, it isn't nice.

Edited June 3, 2018 by BritManToo

[Katia]

1 hour ago, Kenny202 said:

 (he speaks and understands very little Thai or English)

 

If a 2.5-year-old child still does not speak or comprehend any language (I assume it's not that he speaks a language other than Thai/English and has had very little exposure to those two), it's probably time for an assessment for developmental disabilities.

[Kenny202]

If a 2.5-year-old child still does not speak or comprehend any language (I assume it's not that he speaks a language other than Thai/English and has had very little exposure to those two), it's probably time for an assessment for developmental disabilities.

Unless you have just summed everything up from the last few posts...of course the child has development issues. He has been neglected. We are seeking a nursery school for him this week.

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[jak2002003]

16 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

You know nothing of me or my ego. I dont know how u can sum a person up from a post. It is pure ignorance. You have also surmised the issue is the child sleeping with the mother. What about when were out at tge shops and his mother wants to go to the toilet alone...and a screaming tantrum ensues...or nip around to the shops for a few minutes huh? Or have a shower alone. It is the mother who is seeking solutions and for good reason. Not me or my ego you moron. 

I have read many posts and known many people with the same issues. I was looking for advice from someone who has had and possibly corrected similar issues. Either by cuddles or positive reinforcement or disipline...whatever. It doesnt look like Im going to find it here

 

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You need to bond with the child, so the boy likes being with you and comes to you for security as well as his mother.  Then you can enjoy being with him.  Start being nice to him. stop the shouting at anything for a few weeks.  Give him sweets, toys and play games with him... just very cheap things that are easy to do.  Then when he trusts you more take him out.. just the 2 of you for short periods.  Then he will calm down and his clingy behaviour will reduce over time. 

 

Shouting, threatening and hitting a little child is only going to make the problem worse.. as he will be afraid of you... and in this case the boy is clearly badly affected by his previous life with relatives.. so you are going to have to be even more understanding.  

 

I would not even hit my dogs... let alone a tiny insecure defenceless 2 half year old... and any grown man who would smack a little kid needs a good 'snack' in the face himself by someone 10 times bigger than him.

 

If you are not happy with things... time to decided if you love your GF enough and will put in the time and work with her son.... or else just be kinder to everyone and move on with you life.  

[saakura]

36 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

You know nothing of me or my ego. I dont know how u can sum a person up from a post. It is pure ignorance. You have also surmised the issue is the child sleeping with the mother. What about when were out at tge shops and his mother wants to go to the toilet alone...and a screaming tantrum ensues...or nip around to the shops for a few minutes huh? Or have a shower alone. It is the mother who is seeking solutions and for good reason. Not me or my ego you moron. 

I have read many posts and known many people with the same issues. I was looking for advice from someone who has had and possibly corrected similar issues. Either by cuddles or positive reinforcement or disipline...whatever. It doesnt look like Im going to find it here

 

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You seem to be having anger issues, judging from your reactions to anyone who does not reply to your liking. Dont hit the defenceless child in anger.

[Sheryl]

At age 2 1/2 this is not a child, this is still a baby,

 

Far too young to understand, be reasoned with and certainly too young for the sort of "discipline" you describe. Not only will it not work (as it obviously hasn't), to the baby this is just more unfathomable abuse which renders him all the more anxious and all the more traumatized.

 

He is not misbehaving, he is unable to control or understand his actions at that age and is acting out of unbearable fear and anxiety, which your physical "discipline" is surely making worse.

 

The only way to handle behavior issues at that age,  when they are way to young to control themselves,  is to address the cause. It is not at all unusual for a child who has suffered neglect and abuse and whose mother had been in and out of his life. to exhibit the sort of clinging behavior you describe, he is seeking reassurrance that she is actually there and will take care of him, something he has good reason based on prior experience to doubt. He is acting out of fear and anxiety and can control neither those feelings nor his actions.  He's a baby.

 

Constant reassurance and plenty of love are the answer but need to be combined with great patience as it will take quite some time for him to start to feel secure. And for goodness sakes, stop your attempts to "discilpine" him as these guarantee he will not feel loved or secure, much the opposite. In fact, given your clear lack of any affection for the baby, it would be best if you kept as much away from the baby as is feasible, juts encourage the mother to be patient and show him plenty of love.

 

If/when he starts to feel securte, he will become much less clingy.

 

 

 

 

[Get Real]

2 hours ago, ChiangMaiLightning2143 said:

I have refused sex with MILFs several times because I will not bang a lady with a small child sleeping in the same room!

How considerate of you.! I guess the cocksman is worth a medal.

[Get Real]

1 hour ago, Kenny202 said:

You know nothing of me or my ego. I dont know how u can sum a person up from a post. It is pure ignorance. You have also surmised the issue is the child sleeping with the mother. What about when were out at tge shops and his mother wants to go to the toilet alone...and a screaming tantrum ensues...or nip around to the shops for a few minutes huh? Or have a shower alone. It is the mother who is seeking solutions and for good reason. Not me or my ego you moron. 

I have read many posts and known many people with the same issues. I was looking for advice from someone who has had and possibly corrected similar issues. Either by cuddles or positive reinforcement or disipline...whatever. It doesnt look like Im going to find it here

 

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With comments like that, you are not worth any help from anyone, according to me. But I guess if you can´t be humble and understand a child, then the difficulty of understanding adults must be totally unfathomable.

[lemonjelly]

Poor little fella has been through a lot and he’s only 2, I’m not surprised he’s insecure. Go easy on the physical punishment, I think he just needs some understanding and love mate. You could have a great affect on his life if you accept him into yours, and as others have said, it’s not fair on him or your gf to resent him; he didn’t choose any of this mess. 

[USNret]

First laugh is "Thoughtful, caring, submissive".    Yeah right; she slipped that 2-year-old right through the door when you weren't paying attention.  That's submissive alright. 

Ok, so now we have established that you are clueless; let's get to the heart of the matter... the poor kid has had a crappy life. You are presumably "the grown up" in the relationship (which many have already questioned) so put yourself in the child's place.  Just 2 1/2 years old, and already abandoned 3 times -- by his dad, then his mom, then the relative caregivers.  No wonder he goes ape-sh!t when mom is out of sight for a moment -- by his experience, that means he is about to be abandoned once again.  How about helping to establish a caring environment where the child can be assured there are grownups in his life who won't dump him once again, and who will always take care of him through thick & thin.  You are doing exactly the opposite for the poor child; shame on you. 

Psychological studies have shown that a child's greatest fear is abandonment by or death of the parents.  You do understand that a 2 1/2 year old is utterly dependent upon adults to take care of him, feed him, keep him safe?  And yet from his perspective, the entire world has turned away from him, multiple times. What a crappy life so far!  He has no coping mechanism; you have seen fit to undermine all he can think of to do, which is to demand attention.  What else is left to him? 

All of that from a dysfunctional childhood thus far, and then on top of that add in Terrible Twos. Bad enough in a well-adjusted child; catastrophic for this poor waif.  Read up on Terrible Twos; it's not just some myth.  There are real reasons why kids go through this phase; they are aware enough of the world to want to establish some control, and yet powerless enough that they cannot.  The result is frustration.  In your household, this is magnified & much of it is your fault.  How about next time, give the kid some reassurance; at least pretend like you care & love him unconditionally.  Of course, you don't so that would be hypocritical so on balance the best course might be to bail out before the poor child actually starts to develop some affection for you and be abandoned yet again. 
 

[Katia]

1 hour ago, Kenny202 said:

Unless you have just summed everything up from the last few posts...of course the child has development issues. He has been neglected. We are seeking a nursery school for him this week.

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There's a difference between "withdrawn" and "does not understand language," though.  He should understand what is said to him, even if he does not/cannot respond (for whatever reason).  Some kids are silent for psychological reasons.  Others just start talking at a late age (and when they do, often in more complete sentences than younger children do).  But if he is not even comprehending what you say to him, that doesn't sound like simply a late start to talking.  That would suggest to me that he either is developmentally delayed for some reason, or has hearing issues.

[Kenny202]

Listen lets be clear here. The child isnt receiving regular beatings. Were talking about a slap on the leg. Nor is the child withdrawn or a cowering mess. Hes actually quite a confident happy child. All of the above has been assumed and forgive me if I seem to have painted that picture. The child just hasnt had anyone sit and speak to him or teach him anything. He is picking things up very fast now. His behaviour is not of a terrified damaged child...more of a child that has never been given any attention and he's making up for lost time. I never shout or dicipline any child out of anger nor do I scream and rant, at anyone. Again assumptions.

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[Get Real]

33 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

Listen lets be clear here. The child isnt receiving regular beatings. Were talking about a slap on the leg. Nor is the child withdrawn or a cowering mess. Hes actually quite a confident happy child. All of the above has been assumed and forgive me if I seem to have painted that picture. The child just hasnt had anyone sit and speak to him or teach him anything. He is picking things up very fast now. His behaviour is not of a terrified damaged child...more of a child that has never been given any attention and he's making up for lost time. I never shout or dicipline any child out of anger nor do I scream and rant, at anyone. Again assumptions.

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If all this is true, then you have 2 options. The first one is to be supportive and care about your girlfriend and her child. Never ever hit, or discipling by smacking as you choose to say, an already unsecure child. Actually never smack a child at all, due to that you are supposed to be the one that knows better. The other choice you have is to leave now, before you are making yourself a part of this childs next disappointment.

That´s the hard fact. It was no one liner either. You choose if you take the information to your heart and stand up like a real man, or if you are going to make another arrogant and agressively irresponsible reply once again. If you didn´t know this information and advice before, maybe a thanks would be in order instead. That´s a good start in the long line of change you have in front of you.

Edited June 3, 2018 by Get Real

[markwhite]

"and may have been physically abused"

 

"I don't smack soft. I just can't seem to break him."

 

Did you read your own post?

[Sheryl]

Listen lets be clear here. The child isnt receiving regular beatings. Were talking about a slap on the leg. Nor is the child withdrawn or a cowering mess. Hes actually quite a confident happy child. All of the above has been assumed and forgive me if I seem to have painted that picture. The child just hasnt had anyone sit and speak to him or teach him anything. He is picking things up very fast now. His behaviour is not of a terrified damaged child...more of a child that has never been given any attention and he's making up for lost time. I never shout or dicipline any child out of anger nor do I scream and rant, at anyone. Again assumptions.

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You cannot sit and speak with/explain things to a 2 1/2 year old. I really urge you to do some research into early child developement. Your approach and comments are appropriate for a child of at least 5 years and older but not for a toddler.

A 2 1/2 year old will pick up only the emotional content when you speak to him and what this one needs to hear is love and reassurance.

A combination of love, patience and better understanding of early childhhod development is the answer.

One of the characteristics common to all of child abusers is a lack of realistic understanding of the child's stage of development and corresponding capacities: they genuinely assume the child has more understanding and self control than is the case and in general respond to the child's behavior as if it were coming from someone much older. Not all abusers are sadistic monsters; many are well intentioned people who honestly think they are practicing appropriate parenting. They simply do not understand the child's level of development and behave as if the child were much older than is the case.

The appropriate way of responding to 2 year old behavior is entirely different from appropriate response to rhe same behavior coming from say a 6 year old.

Please take this to heart and either read up on or get professional advice as you will otherwise do harm not only to this child but also to your own. Ages 2-4 are still too young to reason or control their actions. It is important to introduce discipline but at appropriate age and with age-appropriate expectations. Introduced too early and with premature expectations results in much harm.

A 2 1/2 year is way too young to ever be left alone, needs to always be in the care of a trusted adult. ...trusted by the child. The reason the mother is unable to step away for even a second is that it results in his being without such....as you are not seen as safe to be with from his point of view. You do not love him (even a small infant can sense that), in fact would rather he were not there (ditto) and have at times inflicted physical pain. Naturally having his mother step away leaving him with you terrifies him. His resulting tantrums are a natural survival mechanism.

You can't help how you feel and given that, you are not going to be someone he feels secure around (though you can improve matters somewhat). And indeed the mother does need to be able to step away from him from time to time. I therefore suggest you hire a warm, loving nanny to help out with the child care. Must be a very living, warm and protective type and don't expect him to trust her quickly, it will take time before he is secure with her but given time and assuming the nanny is consistently loving to him it will happen, which will give both you and the mother some breathing space.

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[Kenny202]

You cannot sit and speak with/explain things to a 2 1/2 year old. I really urge you to do some research into early child developement. Your approach and comments are appropriate for a child of at least 5 years and older but not for a toddler.

A 2 1/2 year old will pick up only the emotional content when you speak to him and what this one needs to hear is love and reassurance.

A combination of love, patience and better understanding of early childhhod development is the answer.

One of the characteristics common to all of child abusers is a lack of realistic understanding of the child's stage of development and corresponding capacities: they genuinely assume the child has more understanding and self control than is the case and in general respond to the child's behavior as if it were coming from someone much older. Not all abusers are sadistic monsters; many are well intentioned people who honestly think they are practicing appropriate parenting. They simply do not understand the child's level of development and behave as if the child were much older than is the case.

The appropriate way of responding to 2 year old behavior is entirely different from appropriate response to rhe same behavior coming from say a 6 year old.

Please take this to heart and either read up on or get professional advice as you will otherwise do harm not only to this child but also to your own. Ages 2-4 are still too young to reason or control their actions. It is important to introduce discipline but at appropriate age and with age-appropriate expectations. Introduced too early and with premature expectations results in much harm.

A 2 1/2 year is way too young to ever be left alone, needs to always be in the care of a trusted adult. ...trusted by the child. The reason the mother is unable to step away for even a second is that it results in his being without such....as you are not seen as safe to be with from his point of view. You do not love him (even a small infant can sense that), in fact would rather he were not there (ditto) and have at times inflicted physical pain. Naturally having his mother step away leaving him with you terrifies him. His resulting tantrums are a natural survival mechanism.

You can't help how you feel and given that, you are not going to be someone he feels secure around (though you can improve matters somewhat). And indeed the mother does need to be able to step away from him from time to time. I therefore suggest you hire a warm, loving nanny to help out with the child care. Must be a very living, warm and protective type and don't expect him to trust her quickly, it will take time before he is secure with her but given time and assuming the nanny is consistently loving to him it will happen, which will give both you and the mother some breathing space.

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Sheryl...I deeply respect ur advice as always but things just arent anything like you have described re afraid to be alone with me, Im unsafe and a child abuser. The issues have been going on long before I came into their lives and in fact have improved. I have 4 happy and successful grown up children in Australia who I raised alone from an early age so Im not new to all this. Again I respect ur expertise but if you think it is possible to control 2 x 2.5 year olds on an outing etc with nothing more than a cuddle and a few supportive words I would suggest youve never tried it



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[Damrongsak]

Some kids are born to try your patience, I think.  Our younger boy didn't have any of the disrupted family stuff, but he was a tough one sometimes.  At age two, he would get frustrated with things to the point he'd stop breathing.  If he took a notion and misbehaved, there was no point in smacking him.  He would have endured a beating to the death.  Some are just wired that way. He was a little slow to develop in some ways, one might say.  Took about 16 years for him to begin to come into his own.  At age 29, he's a delight.  Conservative, intelligent and a cracker-jack machinist.  Never give up!

 

So, be patient.  Be aware.  And every minute of each day is a new starting point. 

[Kenny202]

artding kids, I have one son at an age of 21 in my home country. He have a soft tough of something called Catch 22, which you probably never heard of. I have a daugther in Thailand that has hyperactivity disorder. That´s why I consider myself an expert on child behaviour and how you should treat them.

Haha. This just keeps getting betterer [emoji23][emoji23]??

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[Sheryl]

Sheryl...I deeply respect ur advice as always but things just arent anything like you have described re afraid to be alone with me, Im unsafe and a child abuser. The issues have been going on long before I came into their lives and in fact have improved. I have 4 happy and successful grown up children in Australia who I raised alone from an early age so Im not new to all this. Again I respect ur expertise but if you think it is possible to control 2 x 2.5 year olds on an outing etc with nothing more than a cuddle and a few supportive words I would suggest youve never tried it



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It is not possible to control the bahavior of children that young, period. You can physically restrain them from running into traffic and the like, put things out of their reach, and otherwise modify the environment ("child proofing") to limit potnetial harm from their antics. But you cannot reason with them or teach them how to behave. In a few years yes, now, no. This is what I am trying to explain.

Nobody thinks of themselves as a child abuser and many sincerely believe what they are doing is correct or necessary. A key ingrediant is a lack of congruency between the developmental age of the child and the expectations and approaches of the caretaker and this comes through very clearly in what you have written. So much so that I three times wrnt back to the original post thinking I must have tead the age wrong or perhaps you meant to write "12" rather than "2".

My adopted grandson also had severe separation anxiety after his mother abruptly walked out on both husband and him, and even now some 6-7 years later is still not completely over it, though much improved. We managed it with patience and love, nothing more, encouraging him where possible to be more independent but never forcing him past his comfort level and certainly no sort of punishment when he evidenced fear of being abandoned --- and he was a great deal older than yours is.

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[blackcab]

I have removed a large number of posts in this thread, and warnings have been issued. If members continue their uncivil posts then be assured I will issue posting holidays.

[473geo]

If you can get the little guy settled into pre-school shortly then your major concern is rapidly diminishing - not an easy task - so good luck and hope it all works out.

[Sheryl]

If they are able to get him into preschool that will certainly help by providing the mother with some breathing space but getting a child with separation anxiety to tolerate being left at school can be very, very difficult. I have known it to fail (school refusing to keep the child because they cry or tantrum uncontrollably after the parent leaves).

 

The best approach is for the mother to accompany him at first, staying in sight throughout but encouraging him to join in the activities. Gradually decrease involvement until all she does is stay silently in sight at bavk of room. Then start leaving the room for brief periods and returning. Gradually lengthen the intervals out of the room until eventually she is just dtopping him off and picking him up.

 

How long that will take can be anywhere from a few days to several weeks. Patience is key. Avoid setting off severe anxiety as that will be counterproductive but stay away as long as he can tolerate it and keep slowly prolonging the duration once he begins to be interested in activities or toys at the school.

 

 

 

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[blackcab]

A flame post has been removed and the poster has been suspended.

 

I do not want to close this thread as I believe it is important for everyone to be able to state their beliefs and opinions, even if the opinions of some members are very different from the opinions of other members.

 

Please do post, but please also post in a civil manner. Flaming other members is not the best way to get your point across.

[Orafi]

Child abuse is never the right thing to do.
Most of the men and also women don't feel anything for a child that biologically is not their own. That's a fact. And an adoption of another person's child comes as the last option.
For me it was different. I'm happy my thai wife was a single mother. To be honest I can say I wanted that.
So this planet is full of humans with all kind of different opinions and minds.

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