Ex-Trump lawyer Cohen, in guilty plea, says made payments at candidate's direction

[FritsSikkink]

50 minutes ago, Curt1591 said:

I don't spend that much time on these topics. I find all the insults and name calling quite childish and annoying.

It has been on television, news papers, radio, internet, what more do you want? 

[johnnybangkok]

46 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

Not at all I was for Bernie and think Trumps a megalomaniac but I want truth, not petty liberal 'get him at all costs'.  If he's done wrong let's see it in cold, hard facts.  Paying off girls is unsavory but endemic I want to see the BIG stuff like collusion.

How many times have you guys got to be told? I mean I’ve mentioned it at least 6 times in similar threads but I’ll do it one more time. The Mueller investigation is NOT about collusion in fact “collusion” doesn’t appear at all in the original mandate. It’s about Russian interference and so far has yielded many, many indictments and, as we are seeing with Manafort, the beginning of the major convictions.

The “collusion” part is actually a deflection by the Trump team as explained wonderfully by John Oliver in his episode entitled “Stupid Watergate”(sorry tried to download the link but it wouldn’t work). 

Please have a look and educate yourself to what this is all about. 

[FritsSikkink]

8 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

Try The Truth! 

According to Trump lawyer the truth isn't the truth, so how does that work?

[Chomper Higgot]

21 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

There are 535 Senators and congressman. "Most" in this context would mean at least 268 recent scandals. Are you really contending that there was anything like that amount?

Quit bickering.

 

The real issue is how many Congressmen and Senators are implicates in Trump’s crimes?

 

We can start with Rand Paul, Devin Nunes and Paul Ryan.

[bristolboy]

13 minutes ago, IAMHERE said:

If the FBI didn't have evidence they'd just manufacture some. 

Even if that were true, it seems that now they don't need to.

[GroveHillWanderer]

30 minutes ago, Monomial said:

And yet, there is a long history of presidents doing exactly this. Trump is no different. 

Cohen has admitted to committing federal crimes “at the direction” of Mr. Trump “for the principal purpose of influencing the election.” Which as far as I understand the law, makes Trump equally guilty of the same federal crimes.

 

I'm not aware of a long history of presidents committing federal crimes in order to get elected. Can you give examples?

[Silurian]

23 minutes ago, Monomial said:

 

And yet, there is a long history of presidents doing exactly this. Trump is no different. He will fight it just like everyone else, and he will likely stay in office. Guilt is not what forces someone at that level from their post.

 

Maybe the American public should start holding public officials to a higher standard than just stating "oh well, that is just the way it is". Senator Al Franken resigned his office due to just accusations of sexual misconduct that didn't even get close to a court or a hearing. If a Senator can take such a stand up action, why shouldn't the Presidency be held to an equal (if not higher) standard?

 

Cynicism and complacency of letting a sitting president not hold themselves to any moral or lawful standard shows how far the American government (and public) has truly fallen. A felon committing president should resign in an instant. One of the president's main duties is to uphold the constitution and therefor the law. As proven time and time again, the current administration is unable to perform this duty and should thus remove themselves.

 

[Thakkar]

24 minutes ago, IAMHERE said:

If the FBI didn't have evidence they'd just manufacture some. 

 

“Trump didn’t do anything wrong, and even if he did, there is no evidence, and even if there’s evidence, it’s manufactured, and even if it’s manufactured, it’s made shoddily, and, furthermore, the packaging sucks, your honor!”

[Berkshire]

29 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

How many times have you guys got to be told? I mean I’ve mentioned it at least 6 times in similar threads but I’ll do it one more time. The Mueller investigation is NOT about collusion in fact “collusion” doesn’t appear at all in the original mandate. It’s about Russian interference and so far has yielded many, many indictments and, as we are seeing with Manafort, the beginning of the major convictions.

The “collusion” part is actually a deflection by the Trump team as explained wonderfully by John Oliver in his episode entitled “Stupid Watergate”(sorry tried to download the link but it wouldn’t work). 

Please have a look and educate yourself to what this is all about. 

Don't sweat it Johnny, these Trump dudes are in desperate denial mode.  Personally, I hope there is a mass exodus of Trump supporters from America after Trump is impeached.  That would MAGA.  But impeachment is not enough.  I hope Trump the traitor gets indicted, goes to prison, and his entire criminal organization gets confiscated by the government.  Justice is a beautiful thing.   

[Scott]

1 hour ago, Curt1591 said:

"Ex-Trump lawyer Cohen"

Is attorney - client privilege null and void when one is no longer retained?


 

My apologies for the snarky responses to your question.   I see one person did give a reasoned response.   Attorney-client privilege is still in effect, but, as noted, his documents were given to a special master, appointed by the court, to determine what would be covered by the privilege and what was admissible.   Some documents were not allowed, but  most were allowed.  

 

It should also be noted that just because Cohen was his attorney, he is not allowed to knowingly participate in criminal activity.   The paying of the hush money was criminal.

 

 

[mtls2005]

45 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

According to Trump lawyer the truth isn't the truth, so how does that work?

 

Statement by guiliani...

 

“There is no allegation of any wrongdoing against the president in the government’s charges against Mr. Cohen,” Trump counsel Rudy Giuliani said in a statement. “It is clear that, as the prosecutor noted, Mr. Cohen’s actions reflect a pattern of lies and dishonesty over a significant period of time.”

 

 

Technically this may be correct, as trump is referred to as "Candidate-1" in Cohen's plea.

 

 

 

Edited August 22, 2018 by mtls2005

[stevenl]

57 minutes ago, Monomial said:

No. The reason I will not is because it is irrelevant. The salient point is that he will be judged by people who are afraid that getting into a war with a sitting president will expose all of their dark secrets. I don't care about delving into opinions about whose scandals are worse.

 

If you want to have a rational discussion, address the main point which is that Congress is biased against impeachment and conviction due to the harm it could do to themselves if there were any retribution. Even Clinton, who was judged by a majority Republican Congress, was not ultimately convicted. Why do you think Trump's guilt matters one bit?

 

Why do you think I think Trump's guilt matters.

 

To me it is beyond a doubt he is guilty of many illegal; things. But so far his guilt hasn't mattered, and I'm not sure it will matter nin the fututre. Not because of 'Congress having done much worse', but because of Congress being afraid.

[xylophone]

4 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

Mr. Cohen’s actions reflect a pattern of lies and dishonesty over a significant period of time.”

Whilst Trump is squeaky clean as regards lies and dishonesty. You couldn't make this stuff up!

[mtls2005]

The Plea Agreement, and original Indictment.

 

Particularly damning to "Chairman-1" and "Candidate-1", whomever that might be.

 

https://www.lawfareblog.com/document-michael-cohen-plea-agreement

[mtls2005]

Cohen's lawyer, Lanny Davis, seems to be indicating that Mueller will be very interested in what Cohen has to say about trump's collusion with the Russians.

 

Ouch. That might leave a mark.

 

 

 

[johnnybangkok]

1 hour ago, Berkshire said:

Don't sweat it Johnny, these Trump dudes are in desperate denial mode.  Personally, I hope there is a mass exodus of Trump supporters from America after Trump is impeached.  That would MAGA.  But impeachment is not enough.  I hope Trump the traitor gets indicted, goes to prison, and his entire criminal organization gets confiscated by the government.  Justice is a beautiful thing.   

I try not to 'sweat it' but it can be VERY frustrating the amount of willful ignorance that comes from many of the Trump supporters here. It just amazes me that so many people can still support this guy when literally every single day (and pretty much from his first day in office) we've seen scandal after scandal, lies after lies, deceit after deceit.

Whatever your thoughts on Obama were, he at least treated the office of POTUS with dignity and respect with his greatest scandal being the time he wore a tan suit!

Many Trump supporters call themselves patriots but I cannot see how defending this guy makes you that; in fact I would argue that by defending EVERYTHING this abomination of a President does shows that your own morals are highly questionable and you really don't care about your country as you pretend to do. I can assure you, this clown is NOT helping America in the slightest and this admission of Cohen is the beginning of the end for the worst president in modern history.

 

Edited August 22, 2018 by johnnybangkok

[Curt1591]

1 hour ago, Scott said:

My apologies for the snarky responses to your question.   I see one person did give a reasoned response.   Attorney-client privilege is still in effect, but, as noted, his documents were given to a special master, appointed by the court, to determine what would be covered by the privilege and what was admissible.   Some documents were not allowed, but  most were allowed.  

 

It should also be noted that just because Cohen was his attorney, he is not allowed to knowingly participate in criminal activity.   The paying of the hush money was criminal.

 

 

No apologies necessary. Although the forum is your circus, the members aren't your monkeys.
 

3 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Try to keep up; this was covered months ago.

 

 

This was my favorite. Unlike mtls2005, who apparently follows these topics like scripture, I only pop in, from time to time, until I tire of it. 

[mtls2005]

"Because Impeachment is not about punishment, Impeachment is about cleansing the office."

 

Bet Lindsey Graham regrets the invention of videotape.

 

 

 

[riclag]

"Under U.S. election law, campaign contributions, defined as things of value given to a campaign in order to influence an election, must be disclosed. A payment intended to silence allegations of an affair just before an election could constitute a campaign contribution, some experts have said".

Some experts have opinions that conflict with other experts!

Back to the real witch hunt ,which is trying to tie candidate  Trump to a ridiculous collusion to  Russian interference, during the election!

[mtls2005]

"Trump folks are worried about impeachment more than before. The thinking goes like this: this is something tangible, not a theoretical. And it didn't come from Mueller. Does not mean it will happen, but this has moved to a different stage in their minds."

 

Maggie Haberman

 

 

 

 

[Becker]

Pathetic as usual:

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/fox-news-covering-while-manafort-010331043.html

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, Boon Mee said:

That's because he's only 'guilty' of paying off bimbos. 

No collusion. Manafort's witch hunt is a big nothing burger ? 

The paying off of bimbos was a felony campaign finance violation.  So the claim that Trump is the lawfully elected President has taken a hit.

 

The investigation, which has much broader scope than Trump actively colluding with Russia, is ongoing, and has uncovered methods used by Russia to both influence and discredit elections in the US, along with a lot else.  Let it run its course.

[Berkshire]

2 minutes ago, Becker said:

Pathetic as usual:

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/fox-news-covering-while-manafort-010331043.html

Pretty funny.  This just shows that the Trump-haters have a much better sense of humor than the Trump-supporters.  "Are cats becoming too tall?"   5555555

[heybruce]

22 minutes ago, riclag said:

"Under U.S. election law, campaign contributions, defined as things of value given to a campaign in order to influence an election, must be disclosed. A payment intended to silence allegations of an affair just before an election could constitute a campaign contribution, some experts have said".

Some experts have opinions that conflict with other experts!

Back to the real witch hunt ,which is trying to tie candidate  Trump to a ridiculous collusion to  Russian interference, during the election!

You should reference your quotes.  Regardless, it appears that the courts have decided that the payments to silence Daniels and McDougal were illegal.

[Basil B]

10 hours ago, bendejo said:

Can't help but thinking of Al Capone here -- for all he did, what brought him down was tax evasion.

All this Cohen stuff, when you get down to the core of the whole mess, had to do with DT dipping his wick.  And of course yapping off.  You'd think someone over 70 would know when to keep their mouth shut.

Yes, Probably the thing thy will get Trump on too.

[Basil B]

Wonder if they had the sense to ask Cohan who else was paid off???

Edited August 22, 2018 by Basil B

[riclag]

6 minutes ago, heybruce said:

You should reference your quotes.  Regardless, it appears that the courts have decided that the payments to silence Daniels and McDougal were illegal.

The topic news source on this thread! And of course some on  the opposite side of the fence

Edited August 22, 2018 by riclag

[Basil B]

4 minutes ago, heybruce said:

You should reference your quotes.  Regardless, it appears that the courts have decided that the payments to silence Daniels and McDougal were illegal.

Well I am sure false accounting, tax evasion and money laundering is illegal.

[heybruce]

11 minutes ago, riclag said:

The topic news source on this thread! And of course some on  the opposite side of the fence

Fair enough, though after six pages of posts following an article of this length, an little "From the OP" would help.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "some on the opposite side of the fence", but since you are not contesting the fact that the courts have determined the payments are felony campaign finance violations, that issue is settled now.

 

So much for "Trump is the lawfully elected President".

[jcsmith]

56 minutes ago, riclag said:

Back to the real witch hunt ,which is trying to tie candidate  Trump to a ridiculous collusion to  Russian interference, during the election!

The "ridiculous" collusion where he admits his son, son and law, campaign manager, and others met with Russians for the purposes of getting (illegally obtained) dirt on Hillary Clinton? Or where Michael Cohen is reported to have met with Russian officials, claims he never did, but there is reportedly proof that he did? Let's assume for a minute that this is all "ridiculous", and that when Trump's son said, "I love it!" in a response about the "Russian governments efforts to get Donald Trump elected" that the Trump campaign received nothing from the Russians.  We'll assume that Kushner, Trump Jr, Manafort, and Flynn took all took that meeting (with Trump just upstairs) with good intentions. We'll make that assumption contrary to the fact that he started talking about the dirt around this time, that the push for it happened the same day that he said on public television, "Russia if you are listening...", and the fact that Papadoupalous had a drunken conversation where he spoke about the Russian government having dirt on Hillary Clinton before it was even known that they did. Let's pretend all of that is just some weird coincidence of a hectic campaign that was incompetent but didn't realize what they were doing. That's a stretch but we'll assume it for now.

 

Even if we assume all of that, you are still left with the following questions:

 

- Why did Flynn phone Kislyak and tell him not to worry about the Obama sanctions that they'd backtrack them after they took right after they were imposed. Then lie about it?
- Why when the Trump campaign was told that Flynn was possibly compromised by the Russians, and working as an unregistered foreign agent for Turkey did they take weeks before firing him? And only did so after the news hit the public? 

- Why would Trump tell everyone else to leave the room to talk to Comey, and then ask him to let it go on Flynn? 

- Why would Trump fire Comey and admit it was over the Russia investigation on television, if he had nothing to hide?

- What is the link between the Alfa Bank server and Trump server? And why did he then hire the Alfa Bank's lawyer into a senior position his administration? This bank is oligarch controlled.
- Why were there so many Russian connected individuals at the inauguration?

- Why did his administration have amnesia about all of these Russian contacts on their security applications? Kushner for example had to revise his multiple times as different contacts became public?

- Why did Trump leak sensitive intelligence from Israel to Russian officials in their visit to the white house? 

- Why did Trump tell Russian officials on that same white house visit that Comey was fired and shouldn't be a problem any more?

- Why has Trump been publicly trying to shame Sessions into stepping down if it is not about the Russia investigation? It clearly is. Could it be because he realizes it will lead all the way to him?

- Why did they lie about the purpose of the tower meeting?  Trump himself was involved in concocting that lie, originally saying it was about Russian adoptions. They only backtracked after the emails came out where it was impossible to deny as it laid out what it was about and that it was from the Russian government. Then they changed their story to they received no dirt (so only attempted collusion).

- Why would Trump continue to refuse that Russia interfered in the election when everyone else thinks this is a given, and Putin has even admitted that they wanted to help Trump get elected? How could he stand on a podium and take Putin's side over his own intelligence community? And then try to backtrack and say "I said would when I meant wouldn't" after the fact. Then after that again start backtracking and seeming unsure of it? 
- Why did Trump meet all alone with Putin without anyone else? And why does nobody else know what was said in that meeting still today?

- Why won't Trump give an interview to clear his name if he is truly innocent?

- Why have the bulk of the officials at the top of the Russia investigation been removed from office? Why was Brennan's security clearance removed and he threatened to remove those of others in the investigation? He is targeting the people investigating him specifically.

That's without even opening the can of worms that is Devin Nunes.  If Trump is truly innocent of these ridiculous charges, then why has he invested so much time into obstructing the investigation? Because he certainly hasn't acted like an innocent man. He's acted like a guilty person who is doing everything in his power to attack the investigators, to stop the investigation, and to paint himself as a victim. If he were innocent he could have sat down with Mueller when he promised to. Told his side of the story and cleared his name. 

 

Edited August 22, 2018 by jcsmith