Pulled aside and grilled at BKK about visa history.

[bkk321]

Hi

 

I arrived today (17.9.18) to BKK from UK on a 30 day visa as I didn't leave enough time to send my passport to London and get it back.

 

I got pulled aside and my history checked right in front of me. They asked why I was here so long on tourist visas and accused me of working here.

 

I said I didn't work here but had an online business and they said you cant stay here that long on tourist visas and that I was a visa runner.

 

Prior to 12th May 2018 I was in Thailand since May 2016 with a 2 week trip to Vietnam/Hong Kong. Mostly doing TR visa runs to Loas and a few visa runs to Cambodia/Myanmar. The last 3 months I have been in the UK selling a flat.

 

Anyway they let me in for the 30 days, but he put on my record that I would leave 14.10.18 as per my onward ticket and that I was a visa runner or TR visa abuser. He did say I can still extend but they might say no.

 

He was polite but the other lady with the bad teeth looked so smug and pleased with herself.

 

Any advice on what I did wrong or could have done to avoid this would be helpful ?

 

 

 

[Pepper9187]

Similar story happened to me last month (except my last 3 years history was barely 50/50 between Thailand and France, so, even worst).

 

 

What do you mean by "he put on my record that I would leave 14.10.18 as per my onward ticket and that I was a visa runner or TR visa abuser"

Did he stamped / wrote anything on your passport ? Was it an just a verbal warning ?

 

My understanding is they have received clear instructions to pull aside anyone with "Tourists background" and trying to enter TH with a visa exempt, and even deny some.

As long as you have a TR visa, it's fine, visa exempt seems to be a big "no no" right now.

[bkk321]

1 minute ago, Pepper9187 said:

What do you mean by "he put on my record that I would leave 14.10.18 as per my onward ticket and that I was a visa runner or TR visa abuser"

Did he stamped / wrote anything on your passport ? Was it an just a verbal warning ?

 

 

I mean he physically typed it into the computer on MY record! Nothing in the passport but plenty of verbal warning about staying long time on TR. I would have preferred it in my passport.

 

I think your correct about them looking for tourist history, my passport didn't reveal much....until she brought up my history.

 

Thanks!

 

 

[billd766]

You could always apply for a 3 month visa and not use all of it.

 

Granted it will cost a bit more in time and money but it should save the hassle.

 

You could always apply for a second passport on business grounds which may also help.

 

I used to have 2 long ago when I was working and used one for Muslim countries and the other for the rest.

[tifino]

3 minutes ago, billd766 said:

You could always apply for a 3 month visa and not use all of it.

 

Granted it will cost a bit more in time and money but it should save the hassle.

 

You could always apply for a second passport on business grounds which may also help.

 

I used to have 2 long ago when I was working and used one for Muslim countries and the other for the rest.

luckyily Thailand doesn't have problems with visitors with Israel stamps in their Passport

[Pepper9187]

28 minutes ago, bkk321 said:

I mean he physically typed it into the computer on MY record! Nothing in the passport but plenty of verbal warning about staying long time on TR. I would have preferred it in my passport.

 

I think your correct about them looking for tourist history, my passport didn't reveal much....until she brought up my history.

 

Thanks!

 

 

Yah the problem is the combination of entering with a visa exempt + old visa / stamps on the passports, it rings a bell now at the immigration.
 

My case was the other was around, my passport was messy with lots of old visa and stamps, however if they would have checked carefully on their computer they would have noticed that i had only stayed in Thailand 3 month within the last 13 months, didn't care, they arrested me 2 hours and threatened me like you.

 

Just that you know, since i had a similar experience (not sure whether they registered anything on their computer though) i just changed my passport which was full anyway and applied for a TR visa in an embassy, i re-entered via DMK airport with no problem at all 10 days ago, no warning, no long time waiting / computer check, no question.

 

 

Edited September 17, 2018 by Pepper9187

[billd766]

11 minutes ago, tifino said:

luckyily Thailand doesn't have problems with visitors with Israel stamps in their Passport

 

That is one reason that I had 2 passports.

 

Another reason was that I was due to go to Angola and handed my passport to the company to get the visa. 3 days later they wanted me to go to South Africa and when I pointed out that I had no passport they sent me to Newport (Mon) to get a second passport. 

 

I explained it to the duty officer and duly got a second passport.

[bkk321]

Pepper 9187.....did they mark anything in your passport? Did they go through your history on the computer?

 

I was asked to sit on the chairs to the right of the immigration lines.

 

Thanks

[bkk321]

3 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

That is one reason that I had 2 passports.

 

Another reason was that I was due to go to Angola and handed my passport to the company to get the visa. 3 days later they wanted me to go to South Africa and when I pointed out that I had no passport they sent me to Newport (Mon) to get a second passport. 

 

I explained it to the duty officer and duly got a second passport.

Hey billd766, how long ago was this? Was the second passport in the name of a LTD co. or your name and just a duplicate?

 

Thanks

[Pepper9187]

3 minutes ago, bkk321 said:

Pepper 9187.....did they mark anything in your passport? Did they go through your history on the computer?

 

I was asked to sit on the chairs to the right of the immigration lines.

 

Thanks

Nope they didn't mark anything on my passport.

 

The first officer (at the counter), after checking the computer started to ask basic questions in Thai, do you have a girlfriend, where do you live ... which i answered, then she said sorry have to ask my supervisors, which questioned me at the next counter for 20 minutes, then called another "supervisor" which pulled me apart in a different place (no more counters) and asked the same questions, then called another "supervisors" which did the same all over....

 

Only the lady at the counter had access to a computer, all the next "supervisors" were just trying to understand my passport w/o computer access, that's when it all went bad i guess ! I mean good luck trying to understand a 3 year old passport full of TH / Laos visa with dozens of stamps.

Edited September 17, 2018 by Pepper9187

[billd766]

1 minute ago, bkk321 said:

Hey billd766, how long ago was this? Was the second passport in the name of a LTD co. or your name and just a duplicate?

 

Thanks

 

It started back in the 1990s and I kept it going through to I think 2007.

 

They were all in my name.

 

These links may help you.

 

https://www.businesstraveller.com/features/apply-second-uk-passport/

 

https://pointstobemade.boardingarea.com/2018/02/22/getting-a-second-uk-passport/

 

https://www.gov.uk/browse/abroad/passports

 

https://www.britishpassportsuk.co.uk/second-british-passport-application.html

[bkk321]

1 minute ago, Pepper9187 said:

Nope they didn't mark anything on my passport.

 

The first officer (at the counter), after checking the computer started to ask my question, do you have a girlfriend, where do you leave ... which i answered, then she said sorry have to ask my supervisors, which questioned me at the next counter for 20 minutes, then called another "supervisor" which pulled me apart and asked the same questions, then called another "supervisors" which did the same all over.

 

Only the lady at the counter had access to a computer, all the next "supervisors" were just trying to understand my passport w/o computer access, that's when it all went bad i guess !

I see, thanks for clarifying. many similarities to my experience but also different.

I too did not get anything marked into my passport.

But they went into my history extensively, i could see all photos ever take of me at immigration points and a log of entry and exit dates. He even told me where i was staying in Bangkok last time.

 

Lucky for you, I dont think anything was noted on your history!!

 

I think now I just can't stay without staying away for a few weeks in between TR visas. Although until now they cant have checked my history. Also big risk flying into BKK if they don't let you in.

 

Thanks.

 

[Pepper9187]

1 minute ago, bkk321 said:

I see, thanks for clarifying. many similarities to my experience but also different.

I too did not get anything marked into my passport.

But they went into my history extensively, i could see all photos ever take of me at immigration points and a log of entry and exit dates. He even told me where i was staying in Bangkok last time.

 

Lucky for you, I dont think anything was noted on your history!!

 

I think now I just can't stay without staying away for a few weeks in between TR visas. Although until now they cant have checked my history. Also big risk flying into BKK if they don't let you in.

 

Thanks.

 

Weird !

 

I can't tell for sure, i mean they were holding / checking my passport in front of me and weren't looking at any computer, now it doesn't mean that another immigration officer wasn't doing the background check somewhere else with my passport number ... guess we'll never know.

 

 

[rwdrwdrwd]

Happened to a friend of mine, they threatened to refuse entry, and initially told him he had to buy a flight back to the UK before they would let him in. They eventually accepted a flight to Malaysia after speaking to my wife.

They do put a visible flag on the computer system - he went immediately to extend it to see if they would and the (friendly) immigration officer mentioned it, but did the extension anyway.

He's been out and back since (with a visa) and had no further issues.

Edited September 17, 2018 by rwdrwdrwd

[bkk321]

3 minutes ago, rwdrwdrwd said:

Happened to a friend of mine, they threatened to refuse entry, and initially told him he had to buy a flight back to the UK before they would let him in. They eventually accepted a flight to Malaysia after speaking to my wife.

They do put a visible flag on the computer system - he went immediately to extend it to see if they would and the (friendly) immigration officer mentioned it, but did the extension anyway.

He's been out and back since (with a visa) and had no further issues.

Yes thats the felling they were giving me. That i was not getting in today.

 

How long dd your friend stay outside of Thailand for before coming back on a TR visa? i asked the IO this question and he didn't specify but implied a month or so. 

 

Thanks.

[rwdrwdrwd]

It was Don Muang BTW - I hear they are much harsher on regular Visa Exemption entries.

The immigration officer said he had to leave for "6 months", but he signed up with a Muay Thai school that offered an ED visa, flew with the paperwork to Ho Chi Minh, spent a few days there waiting for the application to be granted, then flew back with the visa - no issues at all on return to Suvarnabhumi, nor with in country extensions since - he did use the VIP immigration service upon arrival which may have been a factor.

[Thian]

This never happened to me but i don't use tourist visa's anymore since some years.

 

I did get questioned at the immigration about my business passport though...i just needed a new passport and asked for one with more pages cause Asian countries always use a lot of space/pages with all their stamps/visa's.

 

She accused me of working in Thailand because i had a passport with many pages...i told her i never worked in thailand and she let me pass.

 

I think it's best to apply for a new passport regularly if you want to use tourist visa's.

[elviajero]

5 hours ago, bkk321 said:

Any advice on what I did wrong or could have done to avoid this would be helpful ?

If you have a long history of tourism you should avoid using the visa exempt scheme and always enter using Tourist Visa.

 

Entering with a visa doesn’t guarantee you won’t be questioned again, but it should reduce the chances. That is all you can do. The longer you stay as a tourist the more the chances of being questioned/denied entry increase.

[gk10002000]

Sure seems visitor unfriendly to people that maybe just like to fly and visit a country often!   Getting tourist visas in advance is a bit of a pain with mailing documents, risk losing ones passport, having to plan a trip in advance, show bookings, etc.  The reason I first chose Thailand was because I could just get up and go and fly there without basically any planning.  My contractor jobs often ended abruptly and it was greatly convenient to then just book a flight and jet off for a one or two month holiday.  But it is what it is.  Forewarned is forearmed.   

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, gk10002000 said:

Sure seems visitor unfriendly to people that maybe just like to fly and visit a country often!   Getting tourist visas in advance is a bit of a pain with mailing documents, risk losing ones passport, having to plan a trip in advance, show bookings, etc.  The reason I first chose Thailand was because I could just get up and go and fly there without basically any planning.  My contractor jobs often ended abruptly and it was greatly convenient to then just book a flight and jet off for a one or two month holiday.  But it is what it is.  Forewarned is forearmed.   

The new e-visa should change all that when they introduce it in a few months.

 

 

[gk10002000]

2 hours ago, ukrules said:

The new e-visa should change all that when they introduce it in a few months.

 

 

That could be convenient if SETVs single entry tourist visas are issued from online and if the Thai officials then honor the visas once a person arrives.  I have seen a lot of stories from other countries, Oz for example that have an online visa but then for various reasons deny entry upon arrival and after the person has paid for the trip, traveled etc.   I understand and agree that there can be extreme circumstances that might warrant some refusal upon arrival, but a lot depends on how good the online application is and the subsequent coordination with Thai officials upon arrival

[stevenl]

According to your immigration records you are living in Thailand, and that means immigration is asking you to do so on a non-immigrant visa/extension in stead of on tourist visa. Their records indicate you are not a tourist.

[bkk321]

On 9/18/2018 at 7:15 AM, stevenl said:

According to your immigration records you are living in Thailand, and that means immigration is asking you to do so on a non-immigrant visa/extension in stead of on tourist visa. Their records indicate you are not a tourist.

I would gladly do so on a non-immigrant visa if there was one that I was eligible for. 

 

 

[bkk321]

On 9/17/2018 at 10:57 PM, rwdrwdrwd said:

It was Don Muang BTW - I hear they are much harsher on regular Visa Exemption entries.

The immigration officer said he had to leave for "6 months", but he signed up with a Muay Thai school that offered an ED visa, flew with the paperwork to Ho Chi Minh, spent a few days there waiting for the application to be granted, then flew back with the visa - no issues at all on return to Suvarnabhumi, nor with in country extensions since - he did use the VIP immigration service upon arrival which may have been a factor.

Whats the VIP imm service upon arrival? Sounds good!

[JackThompson]

On 9/17/2018 at 9:06 PM, bkk321 said:

you cant stay here that long on tourist visas

... is not true.  Doing Out/In on Visa-Exempts is something else, and there is a Ministerial Order with some vague guidelines to this effect.

 

Glad you got in. 

• You did nothing wrong per the law - were gone for 3 mo, so not "visa-running" (quick out/in) on your current entry. 
• The IOs at the Bangkok Airports don't like longer-stayers, so have invented their own rules - such as "you have stayed too long as a tourist" or "over 180 days", etc, and they may reference longer-stays in past years.
• They cover-up the fact they are using made-up rules, by applying legal refusal-stamps which reference the Immigration Act - though these were inconsistent with what they just told the person was the reason for their rejection, and did not request information pertinent to the stamped-reason.

Solutions for those staying here longer who do not qualify for non-Tourist visas/extensions are:

• Always have 20K Baht worth of cash or travelers checks when you enter
• Never enter Visa-Exempt by-air unless an occasional and/or short-term visitor
• Avoid entering Thailand at the Poipet/Aranya border-point or in airports (or from Poipet) entirely, since some with Tourist Visas have been refused-entry (even with the cash) and/or interrogated and threatened with refusal of entry.

Many seem to do OK flying in with a Tourist Visa repeatedly.  The odds are in your favor if you have a valid Visa for entry, but I personally would not chance it. 

At land-borders, other than Poipet/Aranya, no problems are reported in recent years entering with a valid Tourist Visa.  Even Visa-Exempt, 2x by land per calendar year is permitted, and you just need the cash to show and, in the case of Malaysian crossings, to stay out one night before returning.

Edited September 19, 2018 by JackThompson

[billd766]

2 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

... is not true.  Doing Out/In on Visa-Exempts is something else, and there is a Ministerial Order with some vague guidelines to this effect.

 

Glad you got in. 

• You did nothing wrong per the law - were gone for 3 mo, so not "visa-running" (quick out/in) on your current entry. 
• The IOs at the Bangkok Airports don't like longer-stayers, so have invented their own rules - such as "you have stayed too long as a tourist" or "over 180 days", etc, and they may reference longer-stays in past years.
• They cover-up the fact they are using made-up rules, by applying legal refusal-stamps which reference the Immigration Act - though these were inconsistent with what they just told the person was the reason for their rejection, and did not request information pertinent to the stamped-reason.

Solutions for those staying here longer who do not qualify for non-Tourist visas/extensions are:

• Always have 20K Baht worth of cash or travelers checks when you enter
• Never enter Visa-Exempt by-air unless an occasional and/or short-term visitor
• Avoid entering Thailand at the Poipet/Aranya border-point or in airports (or from Poipet) entirely, since some with Tourist Visas have been refused-entry (even with the cash) and/or interrogated and threatened with refusal of entry.

Many seem to do OK flying in with a Tourist Visa repeatedly.  The odds are in your favor if you have a valid Visa for entry, but I personally would not chance it.

 

However the IO on the desk is usually the person who lets you in or not and his decision is normally final, though it is possible that you can call for his supervisor and he may be over-ruled.

[JackThompson]

1 minute ago, billd766 said:

However the IO on the desk is usually the person who lets you in or not and his decision is normally final, though it is possible that you can call for his supervisor and he may be over-ruled.

Based on reports I have read, the supervisor always seems to get involved in refusal cases.  In one case cited in this thread, it was the supervisior's supervisor who seemed to make the call.

[stud858]

I would have said that you have a lot of money and don't need to work. Surely, the officers must be aware that there are rich people that don't need to work in Thailand and only come to relax. Enjoy the sun, and spend money. Show your bank statement and problem solved.

[Straight8]

2 hours ago, stud858 said:

I would have said that you have a lot of money and don't need to work. Surely, the officers must be aware that there are rich people that don't need to work in Thailand and only come to relax. Enjoy the sun, and spend money. Show your bank statement and problem solved.

Shit office you got me..... it was my long life dream to enter this country and work for 25,000 baht a month

 

Anyone working otherwise would most likely be legal and have a WP.

 

Time for Immigration officers to use a little bit of common sense.

[Suradit69]

On 9/17/2018 at 9:06 PM, bkk321 said:

I arrived today (17.9.18) to BKK from UK on a 30 day visa as I didn't leave enough time to send my passport to London and get it back.

 

You mean you came with no visa and wanted to be allowed to enter visa exempt.

 

On 9/17/2018 at 9:06 PM, bkk321 said:

the other lady with the bad teeth looked so smug and pleased with herself.

Pretty sure her teeth were irrelevant to the situation, but obviously you felt a loss of face so you took the opportunity to say spiteful things about her (behind her back, so to speak).