"Easy Ride" for pensioners in Thailand now over, says Pattaya Radio

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"Easy Ride" for pensioners in Thailand now over, says Pattaya Radio

 

File photo/The Nation

 

A Pattaya Radio station said that the issue of the British Embassy stopping providing certification of income letters to its nationals means an end to the easy ride of foreigners living in Thailand. 

 

The report on Fabulous103FM said they had contacted the embassy who said there were not now in a position to ensure financial statements were correct. 

 

They and perhaps other embassies could not be held liable for financial details. 

 

Fabulous103FM - that operates out of Pattaya - stated that those caught offering "under the table" payments would be "caught out".

 

The changes come in the wake of Maj-Gen Surachate Hakparn taking over as the new chief of immigration last week. 

 

"Big Joke", as he is affectionately known in the media, has promised to get tough on criminals.

 

 

Fabulous103FM said that while foreigners were still welcome it was clear that "the gloves were off" now and the "heat is on" for expats in Thailand without a visa*. 

 

They also said that companies offering "visa services" were coming under scrutiny.

 

It is not yet completely clear as to whether the change is as a result of British Embassy policy or they have reacted as a result of pressure from the Thai authorities.

 

Requests to several people at the British Embassy for comment and clarification have been made but no replies have been received except a standard automated reply that one of their officers was out until Wednesday.

 

However, the Canadian Embassy in Bangkok on Tuesday told Thaivisa: "there is no plan to change anything related to income letters for the immediate future".

 

Responses to a Thaivisa story on the issue revealed that an increasing number of expatriates and people living in Thailand were seriously concerned about their future.

 

Some stated on a thread that they were considering leaving Thailand.

 

Many others commenting believed the move was likely to have been ordered by the Thai authorities in a bid to close a loophole that allowed those who have insufficient funds or income to remain in Thailand long term.

 

Other expats questioned how the new requirement would be interpreted and implemented by immigration offices in Thailand, which are known for their inconsistency when it comes to enforcing rules.

 

One expat in Hua Hin told Thaivisa: "it will simply be easier and cheaper to just go back to the UK soon".

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2018-10-09

 

* - Edited to add: the "heat is on" for expats in Thailand without a visa. 

 

[Jingthing]

Let's break down what's happening objectively.

 

The British embassy will stop issuing income letters. They are telling their nationals wanting to use an income method to show bank deposits in Thailand instead. Thai immigration officially still REQUIRES embassy income letters of all nationals. Confused? You should be. For now, it would be rational for Brits to prepare to use the 800K bank in a Thai bank method and ignore the strange advice from their own embassy.

 

For now, this appears to only be a British thing in stopping the income letters. 

There is no hard evidence that it will spread, only fear and rumors.

 

As far as CORRUPTION. As far as VISA AGENTS and IMMIGRATION OFFICERS engaging in corruption allowing applications that don't even begin to comply with the rules get accepted in exchange for cash payments, the possibility that there might someday be a CRACKDOWN has always been there. Is that crackdown going to happen soon? Maybe. Maybe not.

 

Personally I have always warned people not to use visa agents in that way because you never know, someday it might bite you real bad. 

 

As far as people doing LEGIT applications, bank or income (if not British) there is as yet no confirmed news that there is any change at all. 

 

Maybe there will be such changes soon, and I understand the reason that people of all nationalities are freaking out and that's including people not engaged in corruption, but I think it's time to CHILL until we actually hear confirmed news of such major changes (for all nationals). 

 

Brits who are going to have problems complying even legitimately, OK, it might be time for them to panic. 

 

Edited October 9, 2018 by Jingthing

[simoh1490]

Once again it's the scammers who have made it difficult for those people who have played by the rules, that was true when it came to misuse of tourist visa's to live here, education visa's, marriage visa's and now scrutiny of income. 

[darksidedog]

Utter pile of rot. Yesterday I bumped into a visa agency guy I have known for years. He told me last week things looked tough. Yesterday, everything was back to normal. Has anyone here ever known a crackdown on anything to last more than a week?

I am sure there will be fun and games, and probably payments to deal with the proof of finances issue, but nothing of substance is likely to change.

[watcharacters]

1 minute ago, darksidedog said:

Utter pile of rot. Yesterday I bumped into a visa agency guy I have known for years. He told me last week things looked tough. Yesterday, everything was back to normal. Has anyone here ever known a crackdown on anything to last more than a week?

I am sure there will be fun and games, and probably payments to deal with the proof of finances issue, but nothing of substance is likely to change.

 

So you're essentially saying this entire thing was one big wind up?

 

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

Utter pile of rot. Yesterday I bumped into a visa agency guy I have known for years. He told me last week things looked tough. Yesterday, everything was back to normal. Has anyone here ever known a crackdown on anything to last more than a week?

I am sure there will be fun and games, and probably payments to deal with the proof of finances issue, but nothing of substance is likely to change.

Yes, you're right, "crackdowns" tend to be some PR noise for a little while, and then fade, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible for a crackdown someday to actually be real and persistent. 

[simoh1490]

Yes, even if this is a PR stunt some will get caught up in the mess at some point.

[Samui Bodoh]

Perhaps I am missing something, but...

 

If you have the money, you will not have a problem. If you don't, what are you doing here?

 

Forgive me, but what is the big deal? They aren't going to toss people in the ocean, are they?

 

It seems like a simple administrative matter and a solution will come.

 

Chill.

 

Edited October 9, 2018 by Samui Bodoh

[darksidedog]

1 minute ago, watcharacters said:

 

So you're essentially saying this entire thing was one big wind up?

 

Wind up might be the wrong terminology. It made big waves out there, which is no bad thing if you are looking for some votes a little way down the track. I dont know if the Embassy letter issue is of coincidental timing, but what was not possible regarding visas on Friday last week, apparently was possible again yesterday, so you can draw your own conclusions.

[Jingthing]

Just now, Samui Bodoh said:

Perhaps I am missing something, but...

 

If you have the money, you will not have a problem.

If Thai Immigration required the letter before, then some alternative will be found.

 

Forgive me, but what is the big deal? They aren't going to toss people in the ocean, are they?

 

It seems like a simple administrative matter and a solution will come.

 

Chill.

 

Thai immigration has ALWAYS required embassy income letters for income based applications. Thai immigration has made no announcement that they will change that as yet. Let's deal with FACTS, rather than assumptions and wishes, shall we?

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

Wind up might be the wrong terminology. It made big waves out there, which is no bad thing if you are looking for some votes a little way down the track. I dont know if the Embassy letter issue is of coincidental timing, but what was not possible regarding visas on Friday last week, apparently was possible again yesterday, so you can draw your own conclusions.

Well you're making a reasonable prediction based on past history. But past history doesn't always predict future events. 

Edited October 9, 2018 by Jingthing

[poanoi]

it might be a step to make using agents compulsory,

it was always up to immigration to shit on your application, proof or not, maybe standardize it so no more bribes can be demanded

Edited October 9, 2018 by poanoi

[watcharacters]

3 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

Wind up might be the wrong terminology. It made big waves out there, which is no bad thing if you are looking for some votes a little way down the track. I dont know if the Embassy letter issue is of coincidental timing, but what was not possible regarding visas on Friday last week, apparently was possible again yesterday, so you can draw your own conclusions.

 

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...?

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

The stories and posts on this issue are multiplying like weeds, and getting to be a bit of a circle jerk -- now we've got ThaiVisa reporting on 103FM reporting on ThaiVisa..... Yeesh!!!

 

However, there was one interesting nugget in the above report that I hadn't yet seen elsewhere:

 

Quote

However, the Canadian Embassy in Bangkok on Tuesday told Thaivisa: "there is no plan to change anything related to income letters for the immediate future".

 

If accurate, PERHAPS, that is a good sign that the British Embassy decision re income letters won't be the first in a wave of similar actions by other country embassies here.

 

[Samui Bodoh]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Thai immigration has ALWAYS required embassy income letters for income based applications. Thai immigration has made no announcement that they will change that as yet. Let's deal with FACTS, rather than assumptions and wishes, shall we?

"..Let's deal with FACTS, rather than assumptions and wishes, shall we?"

 

You are assuming that thousands of people are going to have trouble; that is not realistic.

 

 

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

"..Let's deal with FACTS, rather than assumptions and wishes, shall we?"

 

You are assuming that thousands of people are going to have trouble; that is not realistic.

 

 

I have no idea what you're talking about now. I have made no such statement. I am saying that I find it irresponsible of the British embassy to stop income letters and then suggest that their nationals use proof of bank deposits instead BEFORE Thai immigration has officially changed their policy on always requiring income letters for income based applications. 

 

The responsible thing would be to say, well we won't do the letters anymore, Thai immigration requires the letters, so be prepared to do 800K baht bank applications or if not, be prepared to leave Thailand. The British embassy does not make Thai immigration policies!

Edited October 9, 2018 by Jingthing

[wgdanson]

4 minutes ago, poanoi said:

it might be a step to make using agents compulsory,

it was always up to immigration to shit on your application proof or not, maybe standardize it so no more bribes can be demanded

Never had Immigration in either Jomtien or Phitsanulok 'shit' on my application. If you have the correct amount of money, and the correct documentation....no problems. This new rule is has been made because you could tell the Brit Consulate anything you wanted about your gross UK income, and they would issue the signed letter, no questions asked. Now the Thai lot have got wise to this scam and are closing the loophole.

[poanoi]

2 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

Never had Immigration in either Jomtien or Phitsanulok 'shit' on my application. If you have the correct amount of money, and the correct documentation....no problems. This new rule is has been made because you could tell the Brit Consulate anything you wanted about your gross UK income, and they would issue the signed letter, no questions asked. Now the Thai lot have got wise to this scam and are closing the loophole.

but i had, the right amount of money etc,

but the officer just kept asking for additional proof until my visa was up and i had to leave country applying for another visa

Edited October 9, 2018 by poanoi

[blackhorse]

Let's assume for a minute it is real. So now we can not use the income lump sum combo either?

[shackleton]

I was at the Immigration in Chaeng Wattana   this morning  for my Non O  retired  visa using the British Embassy Pension letter 

everything went well asked the Immigration Woman if she was aware of any future changes regarding the British Embassy not providing  the Pension letters 

she said she was not aware as of this moment  advised me on the Thai Bank options which I was already aware of thank her for the information 

in and out in just over 90 minutes 

[simple1]

The link provided by UK Embassy to Thai Immigration with their announcement (use Google translate)

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_22

Edited October 9, 2018 by simple1

[poanoi]

2 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

Let's assume for a minute it is real. So now we can not use the income lump sum combo either?

no, the only alternative now for brits is 800k in thai bank account, or agent

Edited October 9, 2018 by poanoi

[Jingthing]

Just now, blackhorse said:

Let's assume for a minute it is real. So now we can not use the income lump sum combo either?

Combination applications are just a variation of income based applications. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

20 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

I am sure there will be fun and games, and probably payments to deal with the proof of finances issue, but nothing of substance is likely to change.

 

I think you need to distinguish in your comments between the supposed crackdown on visa agents vs the British Embassy/income letters issue.

 

Things may or may not change under Hakpal regarding use of visa agents. But for Brits at least, the Embassy income letters halt clearly means a big change. And it remains to be seen for now whether that will be an isolated move, or one followed by other countries' embassies.

 

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, shackleton said:

I was at the Immigration in Chaeng Wattana   this morning  for my Non O  retired  visa using the British Embassy Pension letter 

everything went well asked the Immigration Woman if she was aware of any future changes regarding the British Embassy not providing  the Pension letters 

she said she was not aware as of this moment  advised me on the Thai Bank options which I was already aware of thank her for the information 

in and out in just over 90 minutes 

That's because there has indeed been no announcement from Thai immigration of changes. For now, everyone including Brits can use their income letters. Obviously when the British embassy stops issuing income letters, Brits won't be able to use income letters any longer if they need a new one but there is no reason to assume their existing letters won't be honored as old as six months as from all other embassies. As of now, Thai immigration REQUIRES income letters of ALL nationalities. 

 

I am making another assumption here. If the British embassy actually had OFFICIAL word from Thai immigration that income applications showing the bank deposits would be accepted from their nationals without an income letter, they would have explicitly said that in their very loud announcement of change. Because that's a very important detail. 

Edited October 9, 2018 by Jingthing

[Dmaxdan]

There does seem to be a bit of sensationalism creeping into the way this ongoing story is being reported. Nobody likes change but if we choose to live here legally then it will always at the whim of the powers that be, whether that be your country's embassy or the Thai immigration.

Having said that I do get a mental picture of all the British embassy staff hiding under a table in the hope that this will all blow over soon and they can get back to their Ferrero Rocher parties.



Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[dick dasterdly]

18 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Let's break down what's happening objectively.

 

The British embassy will stop issuing income letters. They are telling their nationals wanting to use an income method to show bank deposits in Thailand instead. Thai immigration officially still REQUIRES embassy income letters of all nationals. Confused? You should be. For now, it would be rational for Brits to prepare to use the 800K bank in a Thai bank method and ignore the strange advice from their own embassy.

 

For now, this appears to only be a British thing in stopping the income letters. 

There is no hard evidence that it will spread, only fear and rumors.

 

As far as CORRUPTION. As far as VISA AGENTS and IMMIGRATION OFFICERS engaging in corruption allowing applications that don't even begin to comply with the rules get accepted in exchange for cash payments, the possibility that there might someday be a CRACKDOWN has always been there. Is that crackdown going to happen soon? Maybe. Maybe not.

 

Personally I have always warned people not to use visa agents in that way because you never know, someday it might bite you real bad. 

 

As far as people doing LEGIT applications, bank or income (if not British) there is as yet no confirmed news that there is any change at all. 

 

Maybe there will be such changes soon, and I understand the reason that people of all nationalities are freaking out and that's including people not engaged in corruption, but I think it's time to CHILL until we actually hear confirmed news of such major changes (for all nationals). 

 

Brits who are going to have problems complying even legitimately, OK, it might be time for them to panic. 

 

As a Brit. reliant on the Brit. embassy providing a (perfectly legitimate) proof of income letter, I'm panicing!

 

Is this true?  Are Brits. no longer going to be able to obtain proof of income certification from our embassy??

[ozziedave007]

Spoke to Australian Embassy couple of days ago....nothing has changed for us....

 

[SkyNets]

Wait what!.... there's still a British embassy here ? lol

[Jingthing]

Just now, dick dasterdly said:

As a Brit. reliant on the Brit. embassy providing a (perfectly legitimate) proof of income letter, I'm panicing!

 

Is this true?  Are Brits. no longer going to be able to obtain proof of income certification from our embassy??

It is true that the British embassy will stop issuing such letters after a certain date. If you can get one before that ending date and it won't be older than six months at time of your application, that should work for at least one more extension. This is assuming this is a British only change which as of now is all we know about. The rest is fear and rumors.