Thailand’s English proficiency is getting worse: study

[Fex Bluse]

24 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Ever thought about, they don't want to mix with people who refuse to adept to the country they live in.

Thousands of hours? Not a quick learner then.

Have you ever thought about why Westerners in many other countries learn the local languages in higher percentages?

 

Japan has plenty of 'Gaijin' farang who speak Japanese. Taiwan and China, same. Korea, same but to smaller degree. 

 

Thais don't show any welcome or interest in westerners beyond superficiality. And, they tend to be boring as well.

 

So, there is NO INCENTIVE to waste time learning a tiny, insignificant tribal language with no use outside this tiny country. Learn a language just to learn how many nasty things Thais say about farang? Or learn Thai to talk only about food all day? 

[Humpy]

Had the British seen fit to 'visit' all those years ago the Thai standards of English would have been on a par with Malaysia, Hong Kong, Singapore, India etc etc . I wonder why the British decided not to 'visit'  !!?

[melvinmelvin]

3 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Have you ever thought about why Westerners in many other countries learn the local languages in higher percentages?

 

Japan has plenty of 'Gaijin' farang who speak Japanese. Taiwan and China, same. Korea, same but to smaller degree. 

 

Thais don't show any welcome or interest in westerners beyond superficiality. So, there is NO INCENTIVE to waste time learning a tiny, insignificant tribal language with no use outside this tiny country. 

right, see your point

but if you're living here eg retired or whatever, with or without family, a knowledge of the local lingo

makes a lot of things much easier

 

[Aroyaroy]

Didn't realize Noel Gallagher was teaching in Thailand. Swallow some pride Noel, get the band back together, and start banking some decent wedge! 

[Cranky]

Clearly the list is upside down and Thailand is actually 14th - no doubt number one is achievable to go with the driving.

[wvavin]

I personally had met an English teacher for 20 years in the northern province but she just could not have the simplest decent conversation with me in English. I could not imagine what was taught to her students for the past 20 years!

[Fex Bluse]

1 minute ago, melvinmelvin said:

right, see your point

but if you're living here eg retired or whatever, with or without family, a knowledge of the local lingo

makes a lot of things much easier

 

It's true, and I did learn sufficient Thai to get around. But, i appreciate it only for the utility to avoid getting taken advantage of. 

 

Educated Thais and uneducated ones alike, that I have encountered, generally show disinterest of anything intellectual. So, what to talk about? They still don't open up, even when you speak Thai. Or, especially when they know you can understand them, they often become very quite around you. 

 

That says alot! 

[CALSinCM]

4 hours ago, MartinL said:

Quite a few years ago, I helped a first year undergrad. in Engineering with her English from an engineering viewpoint, since engineering was my former profession. She wasn't at all interested initially and happily admitted that she wanted to learn Japanese so that she could read Japanese comics. As time progressed, she became much more enthusiastic as she realised that it was all USEFUL stuff. She ended up being very good in day-to-day conversation as well as engineering-related matters.

 

A few months ago, after she'd finished her Engineering Masters in USA, spent a few years employed as an engineer and met an American boyfriend - now husband - she sent me an e-mail saying something like "Thanks for teaching me English. You changed my life".

 

WOW!!! Was I pleased to receive that compliment!!!

 

I could never be an English teacher in a school here but helping her was an experience I wouldn't have missed for anything. 

There is an object lesson here: Thai students have to want to learn, and in order to want to learn they need to see the importance.  That is also a problem in Thai culture in that most Thais are not forward thinking, they can't seem to make goals well into the future and then delay gratification until they achieve those goals. So therefore, becoming proficient in English never becomes 'important' because proficiency is at the end of a timeline which they simply can not envision. Obviously your student did.  Good for her!

[moontang]

2 hours ago, robsamui said:

There are 18 people in the company I work for - five farangs and 13 Thais. The shortest time anyone has been with the company is four years. Six of the Thai staff have been with us more than 15 years. And yet every Christmas party, the Thais all separate out and sit in a group together, away from us farangs. I can only imagine this is instinctive and thus happens everywhere to a greater or lesser degree.

I would bet they would perk up a lot if someone was handing out bottles, let alone bonuses.

[zzaa09]

44 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Ever thought about, they don't want to mix with people who refuse to adept to the country they live in.

Thousands of hours? Not a quick learner then.

Farang.

Usually slow learners. 

Not that special.

[cookieqw]

education is the way for any country to go, and schools are the tools. whether it is gained of course is down to governments.

[GinBoy2]

I think one of the telling facts is the improvement in other SEA countries.

 

Whereas Thailand has stalled, and in many respects gone backwards, the others have gone forward.

 

Other have mentioned Cambodia, but Laos. When I first went there, almost nobody spoke English. Now at least in Vientiane it's pretty ubiquitous, much better than Bangkok in point of fact

 

Vietnam has always had pretty good English, but last time I was in HCMC they seem to have cracked that Vietnamese/English accent thing, so it's pretty good.

 

I'm a pretty good polyglot for some weird DNA reason so I'm OK with them not speaking English since I speak Thai, Lao Mandarin, Spanish & French.

But the reality of the world is that English is today's Latin, and unfortunately the teaching of English is just reflective of the general education in Thailand....appalling! 

 

 

[TMNH]

2 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

This can't come as a shock to anyone surely.

 

My son, who'd lived and gone to school in Singapore, speaks absolutely fluent English, and thanks to a fabulous elementary education in Singapore could read and write.

 

When he went to High School in Thailand, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

 

I would read the 'corrections' the teacher would make in his English homework and it was past ludicrous. 

 

This was at a fairly good private school, so eventually I decided to complain.

 

The response I got was...."our pass rate is 100% so there's no problem" 

 

Therein lies the problem!

Singapore is rated in the Top Ten (I believe 3rd) as far as English proficiency in foreign countries.My guess is that because it was formerly a British territory, natives were exposed to the language more readily. I'm sure motivation  to learn a second language is another factor, but when you're exposed to more people that speak the language, it seems easier to adapt to such. On the other hand, I took 4 years of French in high school and even though I'm "fairly" proficient in the language I am not exposed to French-speaking people. Big difference when you're immersed in the language.

[TMNH]

2 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

Often I do not really understand all the focus on Thais and lack of command of English.

It is worth remembering that most people on the planet get by without speaking English.

 

Same applies to countries, the number of countries where English is not spoken is very very high,

and they get by.

 

My thought as well....unless you're employed in a job that requires at least some command of the English language, why is there so much emphasis on learning a language that you'll occasionally be exposed to?

[Fex Bluse]

2 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

Often I do not really understand all the focus on Thais and lack of command of English.

It is worth remembering that most people on the planet get by without speaking English.

 

Same applies to countries, the number of countries where English is not spoken is very very high,

and they get by.

 

2 minutes ago, TMNH said:

My thought as well....unless you're employed in a job that requires at least some command of the English language, why is there so much emphasis on learning a language that you'll occasionally be exposed to?

A big difference is that Thailand is not competitive and not really getting by well. They are desperately trying to get out of the middle income trap and not doing well. 

 

And, with an abominable education system, they would benefit immensely with a command of English. Very little useful texts are in Thai as there has never been a literary tradition here. No new science comes from Thailand.

 

Thais with no English ability (or Japanese, Chinese, French, German, Spanish) are trapped in a world devoid of intellectual advancement. 

[tingtong]

Nigeria, Hongkong, India, Pakistan....

all moderate to low proficiency.

yet all those countries list English as their official language.

 

in that light Thailand is doing just fine.

anyway, proven, that negotiating submarines or slow trains can be done without English language. so what the fuss about really?

[GinBoy2]

12 minutes ago, TMNH said:

Singapore is rated in the Top Ten (I believe 3rd) as far as English proficiency in foreign countries.My guess is that because it was formerly a British territory, natives were exposed to the language more readily. I'm sure motivation  to learn a second language is another factor, but when you're exposed to more people that speak the language, it seems easier to adapt to such. On the other hand, I took 4 years of French in high school and even though I'm "fairly" proficient in the language I am not exposed to French-speaking people. Big difference when you're immersed in the language.

When we lived in Singapore we actually did the Singapore thing of 'English First' so at home our primary language was English, but we still spoke all of the other languages. I speak and write mandarin so that helped, but English was the glue

My wife taught me Thai & Lao, as well as our son, but that was gonna happen organically, so everyone was fluent in all three.

I'm fluent in Spanish from birth, although I rarely use it now, but language is something in our DNA, you either get it or you don't

[FritsSikkink]

43 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Thais don't show any welcome or interest in westerners beyond superficiality. And, they tend to be boring as well.

 

So, there is NO INCENTIVE to waste time learning a tiny, insignificant tribal language with no use outside this tiny country. Learn a language just to learn how many nasty things Thais say about farang? Or learn Thai to talk only about food all day? 

Pretty racist, ill informed drivel.  

[NeoDinosaw]

5 hours ago, Phuketshrew said:

Surprised that Australia didn't make the list ????

I couldn't find England listed either.  Have we become so bad ?

[Rhys]

EF... so stand up hook up shuffle to the door, and into the EF Classes.... Hmmmmm

[CALSinCM]

2 hours ago, mike324 said:

Its no surprises that education continues to slip backward, its not only English. Even basic subjects such as math, Thais have been dropping down the index. It goes to show no government have made any improvements in the education sector. Ironically the education ministry also has one of the highest budgets, its all squandered on useless and over price stuff.

When the object of 'education' is actually indoctrination, and money that should go to funding educational programs are diverted toward junkets, special perks for puuyai administrators, and programs that do nothing to decrease class size, hire quality, motivated instructors, or upgrade deficient curricula - well, this is what you end up with.  Don't expect anything to change.  The first thing that needs to change in the culture of corruption as well at the culture which is based on status, hierarchy, privilege, and social stratification with the 'elites' running the show and demanding the serfs to prostrate themselves to their economic masters.  I'm hoping the youth kick off that old, tired yoke of status consciousness and social serfdom because until they do, this country and its people will not progress.  The education system simply teaches the children of the serfs to conform.

[Rhys]

Sadly never going to happen.. especially during construction periods at the universities...

[zzaa09]

I'm perplexed as to the intense angst towards Thais [and anywhere else] and their language proficiency. 

 

Why? 

[Denim]

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

 

Doesn't matter how many native English teachers you employ , if the students lack any real motivation you can't expect them to learn much.

[shaemus]

5 hours ago, drhugo said:

They were obviously paying too much attention in class . . . 

 

 

Nailed it.

[orchidfan]

It truly as pathetic here. Compared to Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia and even China (lived in all of these) their ability to read ,write or understand English is hopeless.

The only people I come across here (after many years) are those who are university educated AND involved in international business.

How otherwise can they communicate with Cambodians , Burmese, Vietnamese and Chinese?? Only in mutually speaking ENGLISH .

Even these "well educated" business people are pretty dreadful in both their spoken and written English. 

But as somebody commented,  if the teacher can't speak it or understand it. .what chance have the kids got?

A real hindrance in their commercial endeavours.

[ozmeldo]

7 hours ago, bluesofa said:

I was surprised that Myanmar is so low in the proficiency ratings. I always assumed that English was well spoken there. Perhaps it's just in larger cities?

Laos doesn't even get a mention, presumably not enough Laotians took the test to even register in the rankings.

What happened is in the mid 90s the government closed all the universities and many schools and the language died with the old folks.

 

Quite Orwellian really...

[ozmeldo]

4 minutes ago, Denim said:

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

 

Doesn't matter how many native English teachers you employ , if the students lack any real motivation you can't expect them to learn much.

Depending on the school and grade motivation csn be high. The teachers need to modernize everything tjry are doing. No need to reinvent the wheel, just borrow from other countries - but do it. It's not just English, all subjects need a total overhaul.

[ParadiseLost]

I would like to see similar stats on Chinese language proficiency; if that is improving then Thailand has nothing to worry about as the west is self-destructing anyway.

 

Preparing for the new masters is a much more sensible approach - teach kids Mandarin.

[Stoker58]

  English is not just what Farang speak. English is the common business language of ASEAN and any country that can’t speak it will forever languish in the lower ranks.

  I had the misfortune of having to phone the British embassy last week and a Thai girl answered the phone. Godammit, I’ve had more fluent conversations with 7/11 shop girls.