Extreme Brexit could be worse than financial crisis for UK: BoE

[nontabury]

On 1/12/2019 at 3:15 PM, sandyf said:

You are perfectly free to believe that Japanese companies and their investment is of little significance to the UK and that Mr Abe has no say in the matter.

Having a rant about the Japanese economy has little bearing on the UK problems.

 

 The main problem we have,is remainers intent on stabbing their own country in the back.

 As for project fear:-

 

 

[anon676545345]

On 1/14/2019 at 7:58 AM, rixalex said:

No. This isn't about pettiness. This is about civility and courtesy, and why for some reason you lack it and chose to attack me as being stupid for reading your sentence as being a statement, when there was a question mark at the end. However, as can be clearly seen by the quoted sentence below:

 

 

...your sentence is indeed a question, but one that contains within it, a statement about "many Brexiteers".

 

When i replied to you on that statement, contained within your question, disagreeing with you that many Brexiteers do take that view, it would have been one thing to disagree with me and argue that in your opinion many Brexiteers do hold that view, but you didn't. Instead you accused me of being stupid for not being able to understand question marks.

 

As i say, i am genuinely baffled as to what this aggressive and confrontational approach is all about.

 

This is why I refer to remain supporters as scum, every post they make is insulting and condescending, they post links to articles that contradict their position simply because they don't understand what they're talking about. But because the BBC tells them that remainers are 'educated' and leavers are not they assume the mantle of intellectual superiority, then when faced with a reasoned argument they intentionally misrepresent your position to create a straw man, it's like the old adage "never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience".

Edited January 15, 2019 by Chartist

[bristolboy]

6 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

This is why I refer to remain supporters as scum, every post they make is insulting and condescending, they post links to articles that contradict their position simply because they don't understand what they're talking about. 

"every post they make is insulting and condescending,"

This is why I refer to some Brexit supporters as dishonest.

[dick dasterdly]

3 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

This is why I refer to remain supporters as scum, every post they make is insulting and condescending, they post links to articles that contradict their position simply because they don't understand what they're talking about. But because the BBC tells them that remainers are 'educated' and leavers are not they assume the mantle of intellectual superiority, then when faced with a reasoned argument they intentionally misrepresent your position to create a straw man, it's like the old adage "never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience".

 

Still no need to resort to remainer 'insult' tactics.

 

It doesn't support ANY POV, it just indicates an inability to argue sensibly. 

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

This is why I refer to remain supporters as scum, every post they make is insulting and condescending, they post links to articles that contradict their position simply because they don't understand what they're talking about. But because the BBC tells them that remainers are 'educated' and leavers are not they assume the mantle if intellectual superiority, then when faced with a reasoned argument they intentionally misrepresent your position to create a straw man. 

...says the one who’s making a fool out of himself while trying to mock others. 

[rixalex]

10 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

This is why I refer to remain supporters as scum, every post they make is insulting and condescending, they post links to articles that contradict their position simply because they don't understand what they're talking about. But because the BBC tells them that remainers are 'educated' and leavers are not they assume the mantle of intellectual superiority, then when faced with a reasoned argument they intentionally misrepresent your position to create a straw man, it's like the old adage "never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience".

I don't agree with calling them "scum".

[bristolboy]

4 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Still no need to resort to remainer 'insult' tactics.

 

It doesn't support ANY POV, it just indicates an inability to argue sensibly. 

Nice one. Insults are remainer tactics? And I guess in your mind "Still no need to resort to remainer 'insult' tactics." is not in itself an insult.

[sandyf]

On 1/13/2019 at 10:11 AM, talahtnut said:

Sandy, you're taking the 'p' out of us..'UK a major player

in the EU'.  Did you mean major payer perhaps?

'As I heard someone say yesterday'....  Brilliant, now

we understand your POV.

Of course when all else fails try a bit of sarcasm.

How many countries were in the EC when the UK became a member? Many of the EU directives started life as an EC directive, how many countries in the EC were capable of making a constructive contribution in the formation of these directives and technical standards? The UK as BAE had a 20% stake in the original consortium that became Airbus, the flagship of European aviation. The UK was the prime mover in the creation of the ECHR which became incorporated in EC/EU law.

Regardless of your POV, the UK was a major player and like many other UK initiatives the politically inept have flushed it all away.

 

[anon676545345]

1 hour ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

...says the one who’s making a fool out of himself while trying to mock others. 

 

Emerging markets represent 11.60% of the MSCI ACWI Index

[sandyf]

On 1/13/2019 at 9:50 AM, Grouse said:

The UK is over crowded.

What constitutes overcrowding?

It is not long since we saw the FS praising Singapore and even the most densely populated areas of the UK are nowhere near Singapore levels.

Overcrowding is more of a perception generated by various factors,

lack of accommodation,overrun GP's, hospitals, NHS in general,inefficient public services, schools, etc etc.

All of this is under government control, I was recently told the waiting time for a response to an enquiry from the DWP was around 12 weeks, would that be too many enquiries or not enough staff.

The government knows how many people live in the UK but resources provided during the austerity regime fell well short of what was required and there is very little indication of things getting any better. Robbing Peter to pay Paul is not going to resolve very much.

If the underlying problems hadn't been allowed to get out of hand in the first place we wouldn't be in this mess.

[anon676545345]

15 minutes ago, sandyf said:

What constitutes overcrowding?

It is not long since we saw the FS praising Singapore and even the most densely populated areas of the UK are nowhere near Singapore levels.

Overcrowding is more of a perception generated by various factors,

lack of accommodation,overrun GP's, hospitals, NHS in general,inefficient public services, schools, etc etc.

All of this is under government control, I was recently told the waiting time for a response to an enquiry from the DWP was around 12 weeks, would that be too many enquiries or not enough staff.

The government knows how many people live in the UK but resources provided during the austerity regime fell well short of what was required and there is very little indication of things getting any better. Robbing Peter to pay Paul is not going to resolve very much.

If the underlying problems hadn't been allowed to get out of hand in the first place we wouldn't be in this mess.

 

The EU's Maastricht criteria have ensured continent wide austerity 

 

https://www.europeaninstitute.org/index.php/112-european-affairs/special-g-20-issue-on-financial-reform/1180-austerity-measures-in-the-eu

 

Always cracks me up when someone claims to be anti-austerity but is pro-EU the 2 just don't mix the EU is pro-austerity and has forced austerity measures on Greece, Portugal, Ireland and Italy. The EU is deeply Neo-liberal which essentially is a political and economical ideology advocating a globalised economy under the control of a financial elite, outside the regulative control of any state jurisdiction.

[sandyf]

3 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

The EU's Maastricht criteria have ensured continent wide austerity 

 

https://www.europeaninstitute.org/index.php/112-european-affairs/special-g-20-issue-on-financial-reform/1180-austerity-measures-in-the-eu

 

Always cracks me up when someone claims to be anti-austerity but is pro-EU the 2 just don't mix the EU is pro-austerity and has forced austerity measures on Greece, Portugal, Ireland and Italy. The EU is deeply Neo-liberal which essentially is a political and economical ideology advocating a globalised economy under the control of a financial elite, outside the regulative control of any state jurisdiction.

So the EU didn't provide enough housing, doctors, nurses, teachers, care workers etc etc, must have missed that bit.

[welovesundaysatspace]

1 hour ago, Chartist said:

 

Emerging markets represent 11.60% of the MSCI ACWI Index

I posted the MSCI World. And it amazes me how someone who doesn’t know that the MSCI World isn’t the MSCI ACWI keeps telling others they lack “sound economic knowledge” and “don't understand what they're talking about”. Are you really surprised why Brexiteers are called uneducated or uninformed? You’re the best example. 

 

 

(For clarification, I was posting the chart of an iShares ETF tracking the MSCI World.)

 

 

 

Edited January 15, 2019 by welovesundaysatspace

[bristolboy]

7 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

The EU's Maastricht criteria have ensured continent wide austerity 

 

https://www.europeaninstitute.org/index.php/112-european-affairs/special-g-20-issue-on-financial-reform/1180-austerity-measures-in-the-eu

 

Always cracks me up when someone claims to be anti-austerity but is pro-EU the 2 just don't mix the EU is pro-austerity and has forced austerity measures on Greece, Portugal, Ireland and Italy. The EU is deeply Neo-liberal which essentially is a political and economical ideology advocating a globalised economy under the control of a financial elite, outside the regulative control of any state jurisdiction.

What's strange to me is that all these small government conservatives in the UK condemn the pro-austerity EU for doing exactly what they want done in the UK.

And do try to keep in mind that the UK is not in the Eurozone so those austerity measures don't constrain the UK one bit.

Edited January 15, 2019 by bristolboy

[anon676545345]

46 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

I posted the MSCI World. And it amazes me how someone who doesn’t know that the MSCI World isn’t the MSCI ACWI keeps telling others they lack “sound economic knowledge” and “don't understand what they're talking about”. Are you really surprised why Brexiteers are called uneducated or uninformed? You’re the best example. 

 

 

(For clarification, I was posting the chart of an iShares ETF tracking the MSCI World.)

 

 

 

 

Typical remainer straw man tactics my points were on the trade deficit, inflation and the devaluation of the £ having positive effects on the UK's manufacturing PMI. You're not addressing my points, just focusing on the irrelevant MSCI Index.

[welovesundaysatspace]

52 minutes ago, Chartist said:

Typical remainer straw man tactics my points were on the trade deficit, inflation and the devaluation of the £ having positive effects on the UK's manufacturing PMI. You're not addressing my points, just focusing on the irrelevant MSCI Index.

No, your “points” were calling me “a remainer without sound economic knowledge” while you’re the one who doesn’t know that the MSCI World doesn’t contain China and India and that the MSCI ACWI is a different index. 

 

If you cannot remember what your “points” were, I am attaching them here again. So next time you’re trying to mock someone make sure you did your homework, so you don’t look like a fool. 

[aright]

1 hour ago, bristolboy said:

What's strange to me is that all these small government conservatives in the UK condemn the pro-austerity EU for doing exactly what they want done in the UK.

And do try to keep in mind that the UK is not in the Eurozone so those austerity measures don't constrain the UK one bit.

The EU's problems will not be fixed by austerity.

It has been obvious for many months the EU is in a, self inflicted, parlous condition and its hard to believe anyone would want to be part of the club. Paris and the French economy is burning, Italy and Spain have 40% youth unemployment, Greece has serious financial problems (debt default) Hungary is fenced in, citizens voting patterns express anger and disenchantment, anti EU parties continue to grow, and meanwhile Germany continues to prosper while selling its independence to Russia for cheap gas. I understand they are now technically in recession (this says a great deal about an economy which goes into recession when global car sales collapse). The Euro was never going to work when the DM was replaced as its value gave Germany a huge competitive advantage. Germany chooses not to share the benefits of their massive trade surplus (contrary to EU rules but ignored) with the other EU countries which defies the "we are all in it together" ethos.

The EU is determined to make the EU27 a EU1 and every set back is answered with a demand for greater integration as they see this as the only way to solve the problem

The BBC and MSM in the UK are in the main disregarding these problems as are many "land of milk and honey" remainers on this forum.

How much easier would it have been for the EU had they not sent Cameron away with an empty begging bowl and a flea in his ear. Many will answer this with we can better change the EU by working from within. Tell me what political party I can vote for to do that.

The UK should be putting as much clear water between ourselves and the EU as possible. I would want to remain friends and trade partners with the EU but we cannot remain under their control.

 

 

 

[7by7]

On ‎1‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 4:58 AM, rixalex said:

No. This isn't about pettiness. This is about civility and courtesy, and why for some reason you lack it and chose to attack me as being stupid for reading your sentence as being a statement, when there was a question mark at the end. However, as can be clearly seen by the quoted sentence below:

 

 

...your sentence is indeed a question, but one that contains within it, a statement about "many Brexiteers".

 

When i replied to you on that statement, contained within your question, disagreeing with you that many Brexiteers do take that view, it would have been one thing to disagree with me and argue that in your opinion many Brexiteers do hold that view, but you didn't. Instead you accused me of being stupid for not being able to understand question marks.

 

As i say, i am genuinely baffled as to what this aggressive and confrontational approach is all about.

 I, too, am baffled; baffled as to why you cannot simply either accept that you were wrong or, better still, stop going on and on about it!

 

No one is interested and all you are doing is making yourself look more and more petty.

 

Last from me on this ridiculous matter.

[wreckingcountry]

The number of “project fear “ stories run on here are pretty pathetic ! Of course Thaivisa doesnt have to adhere to any balance ! I could list dozens of positive stories regarding No deal Brexit but what’s the point ! Just remember UK people voted to leave EU! There was nothing about any “deal”

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

 

 

[rixalex]

 I, too, am baffled; baffled as to why you cannot simply either accept that you were wrong or, better still, stop going on and on about it!
 
No one is interested and all you are doing is making yourself look more and more petty.
 
Last from me on this ridiculous matter.

There's nothing baffling about why I am not accepting I'm wrong. It's because I'm not. The fact that I'm not is a few posts up on this page in black and white there for everybody, including yourself, to see.

Sent from my SM-G610F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[baboon]

1 hour ago, wreckingcountry said:

The number of “project fear “ stories run on here are pretty pathetic ! Of course Thaivisa doesnt have to adhere to any balance ! I could list dozens of positive stories regarding No deal Brexit but what’s the point ! Just remember UK people voted to leave EU! There was nothing about any “deal”

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

 

 

So list them, then. There is nothing stopping you.

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 hours ago, wreckingcountry said:

 Just remember UK people voted to leave EU! There was nothing about any “deal“

Nothing about any deal? They even touted it the easiest deal in history. 

 

UK people didn’t vote to leave the EU? They voted for castles in the sky they were promised. 

[rixalex]

Nothing about any deal? They even touted it the easiest deal in history. 

 

UK people didn’t vote to leave the EU? They voted for castles in the sky they were promised. 

No, there was nothing about a deal on the ballot paper. Just "remain" or "leave".

 

Regarding things being said in the campaign run up, I think most voters appreciate that if someone says something, unless they are going to be the ones driving the thing forward, the ones in power, it might not mean a lot.

 

The deal would though have been a whole lot easier had we just set out to leave on WTO terms right from day one, and simply left it to the EU to approach us if they had a better offer or idea. Instead we have had this shambles of a government that has tried to appease the winners, the losers and the EU. No conviction. No strength. No leadership. No vision. That sums up May's time in office. And that's why Brexit is in the mess it's in.

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G610F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

[talahtnut]

The French 'yellow vest' is the only way to deal with the EU.

 

[sandyf]

If Brexit doesn't get rid of Northern Ireland, there is always a plan B.

 

The government will decide on the future of the landmark legislation once “the process of leaving the EU concludes”, a letter to a parliamentary inquiry says.

 

The wording was described as “troubling” by the Lords EU Justice Sub-Committee, which warned the letter casts doubt on repeated pledges to protect the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR).

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-human-rights-act-repeal-brexit-echr-commons-parliament-conservatives-a8734886.html

 

From the Belfast Agreement.

 

(b) the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) and any Bill of
Rights for Northern Ireland supplementing it, which neither the Assembly
nor public bodies can infringe, together with a Human Rights
Commission;
(c) arrangements to provide that key decisions and legislation are proofed
to ensure that they do not infringe the ECHR and any Bill of Rights for
Northern Ireland;

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

If Brexit doesn't get rid of Northern Ireland, there is always a plan B.

 

The government will decide on the future of the landmark legislation once “the process of leaving the EU concludes”, a letter to a parliamentary inquiry says.

 

The wording was described as “troubling” by the Lords EU Justice Sub-Committee, which warned the letter casts doubt on repeated pledges to protect the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR).

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-human-rights-act-repeal-brexit-echr-commons-parliament-conservatives-a8734886.html

 

From the Belfast Agreement.

 

(b) the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) and any Bill of
Rights for Northern Ireland supplementing it, which neither the Assembly
nor public bodies can infringe, together with a Human Rights
Commission;
(c) arrangements to provide that key decisions and legislation are proofed
to ensure that they do not infringe the ECHR and any Bill of Rights for
Northern Ireland;

I would like to see NI reunified with the south. I think there would be a majority for that and it would kill off the DUP permanently. What a freak show they are!

[sandyf]

23 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I would like to see NI reunified with the south. I think there would be a majority for that and it would kill off the DUP permanently. What a freak show they are!

I have a friend in Belfast and he was over here a couple of weeks back and he said the same, many in NI are just sick to death of the whole fiasco. He also said it is not an easy option, that the hard core unionists wouldn't take it lying down.

[sanemax]

29 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I would like to see NI reunified with the south. I think there would be a majority for that and it would kill off the DUP permanently. What a freak show they are!

I do have some friends from Eire , Southern Ireland , and they do not want unification with the North , they are content with their six Counties and are happy the way they are 

[melvinmelvin]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

I would like to see NI reunified with the south. I think there would be a majority for that and it would kill off the DUP permanently. What a freak show they are!

 

wouldn't take many Belhavens for me to agree to that.

it would solve a host of problems

 

presuming that the UK will Brexit,

make an Ireland-NI border, ordinary style,

after all, it is not uncommon that countries are surrounded by borders

 

should that result in the Irish bombing and throating each other, up to them,

the Irish have hundreds of years of experience with throating each other.

 

there ought to be some limits to how far the UK should bend over in order to make the mini population

in NI not taking to the bombs

[dick dasterdly]

4 hours ago, Grouse said:

I would like to see NI reunified with the south. I think there would be a majority for that and it would kill off the DUP permanently. What a freak show they are!

"I would like to see NI reunified with the south."

 

Agree with this entirely - as long as there is a referendum and the majority in N.I agree.  And this may possibly happen if there is a genuine brexit.