Britain can end Brexit unilaterally, EU court advisor says

[nontabury]

3 minutes ago, lamyai3 said:

Indeed. Prior to the 2016 referendum, the ratio of newspaper articles supporting leave over remain was 2 to 1.

Facts do not Support your post.

The vast majority of the media was E.u biased. Added to this the government recommended,supported by a £9,000,000 leaflet campaign,that the U.k should remain in this so called union.

 

 

[mommysboy]

2 hours ago, vogie said:

It has not got a cat in hells chance of going back to the people, they might get the answer they don't want again.

As stated the country is for leave whilst Parliament is full of remainers.

The country is possibly still for leave, but at any price?  Remember the deal sold to the public most certainly wasn't the WTO deal.  Even so, I think Leave could win again.  

 

Anyway, clearly there is no compromise solution- thinking about it, how could there be?  May's deal stinks.

 

 

 

 

[mommysboy]

3 hours ago, My Thai Life said:

It's truly sad that this has to be repeated so frequently.

 

As a neutral on Brexit I can see the strengths and weaknesses of both sides.

 

But what I have difficulty with is the notion that so many people are wilfully trying to undermine democracy. Of course, there are many remainers who accept the referendum result, but they're not the ones who obsess about it on social media.

 

The UK will be ok inside or outside of the EU, but the electorate voted to leave, and leave we shall.

I can't wholly agree with that.  May came up with a deal but nobody really wants it.  Many others are suggesting alternative deals but these appear to have no traction at all (including Labour's silly offering).  Selling the WTO deal is bound to be difficult- fierce opposition is to be expected, surely, since nobody wants the downside.

 

Do you accept a WTO type Brexit or not?  That's the only question left.  It needs to be asked since this deal differs significantly from the one envisaged.

Edited December 7, 2018 by mommysboy

[welovesundaysatspace]

3 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

You're deliberately missing the point.

 

The majority of those who voted, voted for brexit - and the referendum result is being deliberately circumvented ☹️

People were promised a pink unicorn and now get an old nag. A vote based on lies and false promises has nothing to do with democracy. It should be declared void rather than implemented just another version of it. You know all this. It’s why you don’t want people to vote again. This time, the vote would happen based on the truth and facts, and people would vote against the nonsense. 

[mommysboy]

15 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

People were promised a pink unicorn and now get an old nag. A vote based on lies and false promises has nothing to do with democracy. It should be declared void rather than implemented just another version of it. You know all this. It’s why you don’t want people to vote again. This time, the vote would happen based on the truth and facts, and people would vote against the nonsense. 

They might vote against it.  Personally, I'm not so sure.  I think people are pretty set in their binary viewpoint.  No deal is viable so long as people understand there will likely be a great deal of economic and social strife.  It's incredible to me, but millions don't care.

 

Then again, many millions -Remainers and Leavers- justifiably want what was offered- full sovereignty and a free trade deal the equal of what we presently enjoy.

Edited December 7, 2018 by mommysboy

[beautifulthailand99]

3 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

Not at all, but I agree with the 2 alternatives - although IMO they should be:-

 

1) Accept the deal

 

2) Leave immediately

 

But the govt. has little time left, although hopefully (?) they've finally started making preparations for a genuine brexit?

 

It's telling that they haven't bothered up until now (assuming they have started).....

If it makes you happy holding onto crumbs of hope then ......yes great idea it will no doubt come to pass. 

[beautifulthailand99]

No more votes - elections only please with fixed-term parliaments. Surely with the Scottish ref and Brexit we can't leave decisions to the 'people'. They are too easily swayed by ignorance, Putin west-wrecking trolls, and glib fact-free car bumper sticker politics. 

[vogie]

24 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

The country is possibly still for leave, but at any price?  Remember the deal sold to the public most certainly wasn't the WTO deal.  Even so, I think Leave could win again.  

 

Anyway, clearly there is no compromise solution- thinking about it, how could there be?  May's deal stinks.

 

 

 

 

You said "leave, but at any price" nobody knows what that price could be, good or bad, we don't know, being attached to such a dysfunctual outfit is not everybodys cup of tea though and they think it is a gamble worth trying.

 

No argument about Mays deal though, although not a big fan of JC, it amused me when he had an head to head with Mrs May in the HoC. May said it is the best deal on the table, JC said, it has to be, it is the only deal on the table and by definition it is also the worst deal on the table.

[nauseus]

5 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

No more votes - elections only please with fixed-term parliaments. Surely with the Scottish ref and Brexit we can't leave decisions to the 'people'. They are too easily swayed by ignorance, Putin west-wrecking trolls, and glib fact-free car bumper sticker politics. 

Like the remainer stickers on Bercow's car window?

 

 

 

No, don't let the people have a say - too bloody risky, innit?

[My Thai Life]

24 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

Do you accept a WTO type Brexit or not?  That's the only question left.  It needs to be asked since this deal differs significantly from the one envisaged.

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.

 

The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.

 

You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 

 

- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point

- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade

- most of the world operates on WTO rules

- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end

- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.

 

All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.

 

I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).

 

Have a good evening.

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, aright said:

I think the media is biased. On Question Time last night, almost entirely devoted to Brexit, the panel of five consisted of one Leaver and four Leavers in name only.

 

In case anyone missed this broadcast,here it is. The Remoaners will be able to listen to the veiws of 4 Wafflers and one leaver.

 

 

Edited December 7, 2018 by nontabury

[malagateddy]

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.
 
The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.
 
You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 
 
- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point
- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade
- most of the world operates on WTO rules
- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to
- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food
- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)
- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant
- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home
- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end
- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.
 
All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.
 
I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).
 
Have a good evening.

A truly wonderful post Sir

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[aright]

33 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

No more votes - elections only please with fixed-term parliaments. Surely with the Scottish ref and Brexit we can't leave decisions to the 'people'. They are too easily swayed by ignorance, Putin west-wrecking trolls, and glib fact-free car bumper sticker politics. 

Who should we leave them to then?

My MP is not as academically qualified as I am. He is not as "school of life" qualified as I am. He never lived in a council house, he didn't have to pay for his own education, he was born into wealth and never had to worry about putting food on the table, he never created or ran a business and on the one occasion I had dinner with him chose a very cheap wine.

Why would I trust him to make a good or better decision than me? 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.

 

The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.

 

You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 

 

- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point

- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade

- most of the world operates on WTO rules

- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end

- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.

 

All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.

 

I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).

 

Have a good evening.

How is WTO free trade when there are tariffs constantly involved?

 

Naturally UK can say "We don't want to tax your products, which you export to UK". That doesn't mean that other countries would be as eager to follow that silly policy. 

 

Now, let's say, you can put  0 import tax (tarif) for importing chicken meat to UK. That sounds good, as for example one of your politicians mentioned importing frozen chicken meat from Thailand. All the consumers should be really happy for the cheap prices!

 

But what would the sheep farmers think about that? They no longer are not able to sell their sheep meat to other countries, as all others keep their tarifs (import taxes) as they are. All others don't want to mess with their own productions. 

 

Now everybody enjoys cheap chicken meat from Thailand.. and all around the world as everybody is keen to export to UK due nill import tax. How that would affect to your own farmers? Who would be buying lamb meat for €20/kg when you can buy chicken meat for €2/kg?

 

Without tarifs (import taxes) local production halts as there is always someone else, who can produce the goods cheaper than you.

 

That's why EU have tariffs. To support local production, which is not a bad thing. It does give work for the EU people. 

 

So enjoy your cheap chicken meat while you witness your own agricultural sector being vanished. It'll better be darn good chicken meat!

 

For the other points, there are similar chess or even Go moves behind the simple checkers moves.

[bristolboy]

 

30 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.

 

The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.

 

You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 

 

- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point

- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade

- most of the world operates on WTO rules

- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end

- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.

 

All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.

 

I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).

 

Have a good evening.

 

26 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

A truly wonderful post Sir

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Are you sure about that?

Actually, it's not a simple thing at all to revert to WTO rules. It could take years.

Brexit and the WTO option: Key questions about a looming challenge

"In practice, the UK would have to detach itself from the EU and regularise its position within the WTO before it could sign its own trade agreements, including with the EU. As Roberto Azevêdo, the WTO’s director-general, said recently, there is no precedent for a WTO member extricating itself from an economic union while inside the organisation. The process would not be easy and would likely take years before the UK’s WTO position was settled, not least because all other member states would have to agree."

https://www.ft.com/content/5741129a-4510-11e6-b22f-79eb4891c97d

 

 

 

Edited December 7, 2018 by bristolboy

[bomber]

24 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.

 

The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.

 

You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 

 

- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point

- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade

- most of the world operates on WTO rules

- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end

- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.

 

All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.

 

I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).

 

Have a good evening.

The euro to explode in 6 months,who on earth has predicted that cos i aint seen/read it anywhere,it wont happen 27 nations would suffer badly,a pauper with a already decimated currency is the loser,a few rioters in paris and the EU/euro is apparently going to crumble,dream on 

[melvinmelvin]

2 hours ago, mommysboy said:

I can't wholly agree with that.  May came up with a deal but nobody really wants it.  Many others are suggesting alternative deals but these appear to have no traction at all (including Labour's silly offering).  Selling the WTO deal is bound to be difficult- fierce opposition is to be expected, surely, since nobody wants the downside.

 

Do you accept a WTO type Brexit or not?  That's the only question left.  It needs to be asked since this deal differs significantly from the one envisaged.

 

WTO deal?

WTO type Brexit?

 

what on earth is that?

has never been on the table since A50 was triggered

 

what people make up!!!

 

how about a haggis type Brexit

or maybe

fish and chips in soggy newspaper Brexit

or a French type Brexit

[nauseus]

40 minutes ago, bomber said:

The euro to explode in 6 months,who on earth has predicted that cos i aint seen/read it anywhere,it wont happen 27 nations would suffer badly,a pauper with a already decimated currency is the loser,a few rioters in paris and the EU/euro is apparently going to crumble,dream on 

Few rioters in Paris? Righty ho.

[damascase]

1 hour ago, My Thai Life said:

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.

 

The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.

 

You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 

 

- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point

- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade

- most of the world operates on WTO rules

- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end

- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.

 

All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.

 

I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).

 

Have a good evening.

Just a couple of points. WTO rules enter into force, by default, when there is no agreement with the EU. Indeed it is only a starting point, a basis from which the UK can start negotiating trade agreements with other countries. Until such agreements are in force, all other WTO Members will treat the UK, tariff-wise, in a non-preferential way resulting in duties being due in situations where currently there are zero tariffs in place under the many agreements of the EU with third countries. Keep in mind that when the UK would choose to grant zero tariffs on some EU goods, the UK must apply these same zero tariffs on such goods from any other 163 (?) WTO Member country. And frictionless? Goods would still have to be declared to Customs, there will not be free circulation of goods as currently within the EU Customs Union. Under WTO, the ‘free-est of free trade’???? For ‘free trade’ you need to negotiate agreements - and how would the UK under WTO rules be in a much stronger negotiating position for future talks with the EU? After Brexit under WTO, the UK would be in the unique position of being the only developed country without so much as a single trade agreement. Isn’t that a rather weak starting position? ‘WTO doesn’t require a hard border in Ireland’: WTO doesn’t cover border arrangments at all, this will have to be settled between the EU and the UK, one cannot introduce a ‘soft border’ unilaterally. 

Edited December 7, 2018 by damascase
Typo

[mommysboy]

 

What does need to be said: The EU Free Trade Deal, really isn't free, is it?

 

Now, that's not to endorse WTO but it has its attractions.  Crucially, it does fulfil Brexit in idea.

 

I'm sure there would be a heavy price to be paid initially, although it really need not be as bad as portrayed.  Whether the people are willing to pay this price is a matter that needs informed debate, and possibly a public vote.  

[mommysboy]

14 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

WTO deal?

WTO type Brexit?

 

what on earth is that?

has never been on the table since A50 was triggered

 

what people make up!!!

 

how about a haggis type Brexit

or maybe

fish and chips in soggy newspaper Brexit

or a French type Brexit

I was trying to avoid the term 'no deal Brexit'- it's become rather a tainted phrase.  Because in reality UK will still be free to trade with whomsoever it wants.  I'm not making anything up.  There is a trading world outside the EU you know. Not that I'm particularly for it, it's just that there seems to be no compromise solution.

 

 

[aright]

11 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

I was trying to avoid the term 'no deal Brexit'- it's become rather a tainted phrase.  Because in reality UK will still be free to trade with whomsoever it wants.  I'm not making anything up.  There is a trading world outside the EU you know. Not that I'm particularly for it, it's just that there seems to be no compromise solution.

 

 

 

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, My Thai Life said:

Always a pleasure to hear from you MB, but I'm not sure I agree completely with your premise.

 

The important question was asked a couple of years ago, and the British electorate voted to leave the EU. This was preceeded and followed by the commitment of both parties.

 

You mention that WTO differs from the one envisaged: a few points in response to that - 

 

- WTO is just the starting point, not the end-point

- WTO is just free trade, actually the free-est of free tade

- most of the world operates on WTO rules

- WTO rules would allow us to operate with frictionless zero tariff imports from the EU in key sectors if we chose to

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

- WTO is available now - this is an important point - one thing we can all agree on is that much of the last 2 years has been wasted - WTO would bring that to an immediate end

- WTO would put the UK in a much stronger negotiating position for future EU talks.

 

All of this detail needs to be seen in the light of developments in the EU: severe riots in France, extremely high youth unemployment in the EU, the far right entering main stream political assemblies across the EU, the ongoing and increasing problems with more EU integration, lack of migrant policy, fiscal problems including the Euro which are forecast by many to explode in the next 6 months.

 

I'd like to expand, but I've got to go out and won't be back online today, so I'll leave it there (I haven't had time to check for typos).

 

Have a good evening.

Great posting and a real education.

 

Really, the politicians on both sides were handed a poisoned chalice: nobody could have secured a 'good deal', because the Leave campaign promised everything to everybody, not the least of which was a free trade deal with sovereignty. That's not to say the Government hasn't performed particularly poorly however.  

 

Leave voters have been let down.  They did win after all.  Yet, I think it's a step too far to assume that the win was a mandate for the so called 'no Deal Brexit'- that likelihood simply wasn't countenanced, indeed I think it was dismissed as project fear.

 

 

 

 

[mommysboy]

DP

Edited December 7, 2018 by mommysboy

[Guest]

30 minutes ago, damascase said:

- WTO rules would allow us to reduce costs of imports in key sectors, notably food

- following on from the previous point: we currently pay a huge amount to import food from the EU - in the form of CAP subsidies, these disappear with WTO (tariffs always need to be considered together with subsidies, quotas and non-tariff barriers)

- WTO does not require a hard border in Ireland, and renders the backstop discussion irrelevant

- WTO allows the 39 billion to be used at home

I'm just going to have a piss with these ones.

 

I already explained, why each country or in case of EU, economical are are smart to put import taxes (aka tarifs) to foreign products. It's to protect county's own manufacturing. If there is no tarifs, you can say goodbye to your own production as there is always someone who can produce products which are cheaper.. mostly in the developing world. 

 

Currently you pay nothing to import food from EU. Currently you pay some tariffs importing food outside of EU. This is to protect EU's internal productivity, which means also to protect UK's productivity.

 

If tarifs goes puff.. UK's productivity goes puff.

 

While WTO probably doesn't require hard border between EU and then left UK, EU does require it. Simply because we don't want to receive goods from UK, which might or might not be imported from lower quality productivity countries like Thailand or USA and then moved to the EU. We prefer to keep our internal market goods quality as good as possible. We don't want to have cheap chicken from Thailand, which is filled with antibiotics nor cheap chicken from USA, which is washed with bleach. Those products are for you, UK, not for us in EU.

UK has already agreed to pay the B39 for it's previous agreements. That money includes huge range of deals. Erasmus programs, which allow EU youth to visit and study in other countries. Scientific studies which always takes time to conduct. Roads projects in continental Europe as well as within UK... Lot's of that money is to be spend for the future of UK as well as for the future of EU. 

 

So if you say "We don't pay that 39 Billion", you'll stop all the programs for the youth, science and development also inside in UK. 

 

With that statement UK is also going to send a message to the world, to the countries which are perhaps going to do a trade deals, give passporting rights to UK services, that UK is no longer a country to be trusted.  Naturally EU will hear that yell loud and clear as well, like any other countries does.

 

Is that what you envision UK to be in the future? Is that what you envision to be seen by others in the future?

 

If it is, then do and go for the harders brexit there is. I simply no longer care. Nor do many others anymore.

[melvinmelvin]

42 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

I was trying to avoid the term 'no deal Brexit'- it's become rather a tainted phrase.  Because in reality UK will still be free to trade with whomsoever it wants.  I'm not making anything up.  There is a trading world outside the EU you know. Not that I'm particularly for it, it's just that there seems to be no compromise solution.

 

 

there sure is a huge trading world outside of eea

 

and yes, there does not seem to be what you could call a compromise exit here

 

I just reacted negatively to trade possibilities being coupled to brexit options, fairly separate issues

 

how about a NAFTA-Brexit?

rename the FTA from North America to North Atlantic - might be possible

 

[Guest]

Let me conclude my rant. How freaking arrogant and stupid a well respected country like UK could have become?

 

For me, it was utter disbelief, what I learned during these two years I plunged into British politics. 

 

I actually thought British were rather smart and logical people. Now I know better. You are nothing more than colder climate Italians with sexual frustrations. 

[bomber]

33 minutes ago, aright said:

 

i think this brexit idea will work after all,Cuba and Venezuela will be our saviour once comrade corbyn takes over and gets the old British Leyland factories up and and running again then he will strike the mother of all trade deals with them to buy millions of Morris Itals,them 1950s Chevy's have had their day time to move on.

[malagateddy]

Let me conclude my rant. How freaking arrogant and stupid a well respected country like UK could have become?
 
For me, it was utter disbelief, what I learned during these two years I plunged into British politics. 
 
I actually thought British were rather smart and logical people. Now I know better. You are nothing more than colder climate Italians with sexual frustrations. 

Bet your glad you got rid of your bile...now you can turn your attention to the massive youth unemployment in some of your oh so wonderful eu member countries like Spain..Eire..Greece etc etc [emoji6]

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[bomber]

6 minutes ago, oilinki said:

Let me conclude my rant. How freaking arrogant and stupid a well respected country like UK could have become?

 

For me, it was utter disbelief, what I learned during these two years I plunged into British politics. 

 

I actually thought British were rather smart and logical people. Now I know better. You are nothing more than colder climate Italians with sexual frustrations. 

Smart ???? logical ???? the politicians couldnt run a bath,80% of the population if given a machine to print money would break it,sitting drinking and watching TV and ordering take aways is the highlight of the day for many.But they claim to be superior ????