The best path to becoming a long-term visa holder as a non-retiree, working-age tech entrepreneur.

[Cricky]

3 hours ago, jackdd said:

I call bullshit on these sources, probably made up

The english is too good, which makes me doubt that a Thai has written this. Probably everybody here knows the english skills of people in the immigration offices, do you seriously think they could write a text with only minor mistakes?

The immigration officer allegedly said "Any foreigners working or starting a business in Thailand", but we are not talking about a business in Thailand, but abroad, so obviously he didn't even understand what this is about.

The DoE officer allegedly said "so foreigners are required to have a work permit to do so." But it's not possible to get a work permit when "working online". If this person is actually working at the DoE he should know that it's not possible to get a work permit, so why would he say "required to have a work permit"? He would say something like "first you need to found a company in Thailand ..."

 

So all sources that you have which say working online is illegal all come from a dubious website and allegedly quote people working in Phuket.

On the other hand we have real world cases of immigration police raiding places with foreigners working online on tourist visas and they found nothing illegal.

And if this isn't enough, did you ever think about why immigration police does not raid many more coworking spaces? Really easy to find people working online while being on tourist visas there.

You make some very good points here.

 

3 hours ago, jackdd said:

I call bullshit on these sources, probably made up

 

3 hours ago, jackdd said:

So all sources that you have which say working online is illegal all come from a dubious website and allegedly quote people working in Phuket.

 

[DrJack54]

Hells bells. This thread isn't about digital nomads or work permits etc etc. I have read the op over few times. Its a complete crock. Read carefully some of statements and subsequent statements.

You could call me a CEO

I employ 50 people

Im young 25

My legal team

I love this great country

I could list many more. Complete wind up.....55555. 

Edited December 17, 2018 by DrJack54
Error

[faraday]

9 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

What happened to the original question from 25yr old CEO with 50 employees. At least he was interesting.

Apparently, some magazine called Fortune has been looking at his financials.

 

Tipped for CEO of 2019: allegedly.

 

[JLCrab]

8 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Read carefully some of statements and subsequent statements.

You could call me a CEO

I employ 50 people

Im young 25

My legal team

I love this great country

I could list many more. Complete wind up.....55555.

My favorite was "very high demand field in a disruptive industry,"

[Ratt Thai]

On 12/17/2018 at 6:13 AM, FarangDoingHisThing69 said:

am American, so Amity seems like a good choice. 51/49 ownership with 49% having preferred voting rights is perfectly acceptable and rather common, isn't it? But in my case yes I believe 100% would be fine. Hiring requirements and otherwise are all the same I believe, 4 Thai workers = 1 visa for you, the farang trying to get the visa. Not too bad of an option, especially if you can make a profit doing it.

Just look up american treaty together with what kind of visa's

You will be surprised that even a TE visa can be used. ( if you don't need a WP )

https://www.sunbeltasia.com/amity-treaty-americans-can-qualify-for-no-work-permit?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7Nbc1N-23gIVRYFwCh2VIggrEAEYASAAEgLi2fD_BwE

 

I do not state this is accurate, but it is at least interesting to read

[FritsSikkink]

"My plan is this:

1. File SMART visa S-class ("startup") application

2. Get endorsement from DEPA

3. Gather all required materials in digital and physical form, originals included"

 

If you read the PDF, you will find that step 2 and 3 are required before step 1. 

 

"Could anyone give advice for a young entrepreneur who has discovered a deep love for the Thai people?"

 

You will find out that to do business with Thai companies, you need to know local people here and to proof to them that you are not all talk but actually have a lot of experience in making things happen. Being a young foreigner who doesn't know the culture and language is an uphill struggle. 

First learn to know the country and its people a lot better than you do now, make friends with people who been here for a while and listen and ask a lot. Get a English speaking lawyer of one of the bigger firms, setup a company, get an accountant, a secretary who can translate for you, open an office, get a cleaner and staff that understands your business.

Now you can get a Non B visa and a work permit.

 

Don't talk BS like I work 24/7, as I am sure you sleep every now and then too. 

[LivinLOS]

21 hours ago, jackdd said:

When i called the DOE (had my GF call to avoid missunderstandings), they said working online is not considered working in Thailand so it doesn't require a work permit and can be done on a tourist visa, was indeed quite clear.

 

 

So obviously you have this in writing with a named officer.. As I provided you ?? 

[Cricky]

Seventeen foreigners have been arrested for working illegally following a raid on a condominium in Chiang Mai.

The raid, which took place at 12.30am on Friday found 17 Westerners of various nationalities providing online English classes to people in China from a room in the ground floor of the Riverside Condo.

 

 

http://www.samuitimes.com/17-foreign-english-teachers-arrested-chiang-mai-working-illegally/

[jackdd]

22 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

 

So obviously you have this in writing with a named officer.. As I provided you ?? 

Do you know how a phone works?

Did you provide a photo of a document issued by a immigration / DOE officer stamped and signed by him? Then i didn't see this, could you please point me to it? I only saw your link to some dubious looking website which says somebody did allegedly write something, but this is most likely not authentic for various reasons as explained in my previous post

 

24 minutes ago, VYCM said:

Seventeen foreigners have been arrested for working illegally following a raid on a condominium in Chiang Mai.

The raid, which took place at 12.30am on Friday found 17 Westerners of various nationalities providing online English classes to people in China from a room in the ground floor of the Riverside Condo.

 

 

http://www.samuitimes.com/17-foreign-english-teachers-arrested-chiang-mai-working-illegally/

They were working for a company at an office in Thailand and probably also got paid by this company in Thailand. This is obviously not the same as working at home with a business abroad and getting the money from abroad.

Edited December 19, 2018 by jackdd

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, jackdd said:

Do you know how a phone works?

Did you provide a photo of a document issued by a immigration / DOE officer stamped and signed by him? Then i didn't see this, could you please point me to it? I only saw your link to some dubious looking website which says somebody did allegedly write something, but this is most likely not authentic for various reasons as explained in my previous post

If you had followed this issue over the years you would know exactly the source of those quotes (in fact the sources are named) as it came from the issues and answers section of the Phuket gazette which's online website was taken over by Thaiger. All that data was established by the Phuket gazette interviewing officials on the record for a clear answer. 

To back up exactly what those links say about vlogging and blogging, a 'job' which doesnt have thai clients or income. 

https://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/1288963/my-mate-nate-charged-vows-to-continue-prank-videos

 

Quote

Thai law requires internet-based workers to have a work permit, which he has never had. 

The exact same thing was established at the time with this whole high profile case. 

[jackdd]

26 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

All that data was established by the Phuket gazette interviewing officials on the record for a clear answer. 

A clear answer? I explained to you already why these answers aren't clear and they look more like the person who wrote them didn't even understand what the interview was about or had any idea what they are talking about. Was the interview originally hold in Thai and then translated? If so, where are the original answers? Who translated it?

 

26 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

To back up exactly what those links say about vlogging and blogging, a 'job' which doesnt have thai clients or income.

I recommend you read my previous posts again, i explained to you already how "my mate nate" is not the typical online worker, beginning with that he has Thai clients, Thai income and Thai employees.

I think it's funny that you use him as an example, but as far as i can see he never got prosecuted for working without a work permit, did he?

 

26 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

" Thai law requires internet-based workers to have a work permit, which he has never had.  "

The exact same thing was established at the time with this whole high profile case. 

But only if the internet based business is based in Thailand, not if it's a business abroad, that's at least what the actions of authorities in the past show.

Edited December 19, 2018 by jackdd

[SheungWan]

Thailand is an obstacle course, not an opportunity, for running a small business. Sorry, but the OP has feathers in his head if he wishes to pursue this pathway. The best realistic pathways for basing such a business in the region are either Hong Kong or Singapore. There is a decision to be made as to what are his priorities are in life. One might lead to success. The other surely is a dead end. Can't have your cake and eat it with this story.

[AGareth2]

hope springs eternal

loved the sales pitch

[FritsSikkink]

17 hours ago, jackdd said:

A clear answer? I explained to you already why these answers aren't clear and they look more like the person who wrote them didn't even understand what the interview was about or had any idea what they are talking about. Was the interview originally hold in Thai and then translated? If so, where are the original answers? Who translated it?

 

I recommend you read my previous posts again, i explained to you already how "my mate nate" is not the typical online worker, beginning with that he has Thai clients, Thai income and Thai employees.

I think it's funny that you use him as an example, but as far as i can see he never got prosecuted for working without a work permit, did he?

 

But only if the internet based business is based in Thailand, not if it's a business abroad, that's at least what the actions of authorities in the past show.

If you live and work here, even if you clients are abroad, you still have to pay tax here. You probably don't do that either.

[jackdd]

11 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

If you live and work here, even if you clients are abroad, you still have to pay tax here. You probably don't do that either.

Only if you bring the income into Thailand in the year it's earned. So i do of course only bring savings from last year and the years before into Thailand.

[FritsSikkink]

20 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Only if you bring the income into Thailand in the year it's earned. So i do of course only bring savings from last year and the years before into Thailand.

Utter nonsense, not when you work here, then you will have to pay tax. 

[jackdd]

28 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Utter nonsense, not when you work here, then you will have to pay tax. 

But i don't work here. If i would work here i would not have to bring my income / savings into Thailand

Edited December 20, 2018 by jackdd

[FritsSikkink]

1 hour ago, jackdd said:

But i don't work here. If i would work here i would not have to bring my income / savings into Thailand

You do, but enough said, you and many people who have their online business make up their own rules, call every existing rule a "grey area".

The fact is you don't have the appropriate visa, don't have a work permit and don't pay tax while you live and work here.

The sooner the government gets strict with tourists visa's the better. If you want to live here and work obey the law.

Goodbye. 

[jackdd]

9 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

The fact is ...

... nobody working solely online on a tourist visa ever got prosecuted for working, even though these people are easy to find in coworking spaces. This quite clearly shows that the Thai authorities don't think these people are doing something illegal.

Goodbye.

[overherebc]

Can you get an ED visa to study Thai tax laws?

????????????????

[jacko45k]

5 minutes ago, jackdd said:

... nobody working solely online on a tourist visa ever got prosecuted for working, even though these people are easy to find in coworking spaces. This quite clearly shows that the Thai authorities don't think these people are doing something illegal.

Goodbye.

Strange association. Does the same apply to those on motorbikes without helmets and those running red lights?

[mokwit]

On 12/18/2018 at 5:59 AM, JLCrab said:

My favorite was "very high demand field in a disruptive industry,"

I kinda liked that it was "disruptive" technology with military applications - I think it is pretty good that a 25 year old with only 25 employees has found a disruptive military technology in the face of the US , Russia and China spending billions for any edge in that area. My advice to the OP is to consider the risk of being kidnapped.

 

Just in case all us older guys clutching our sides laughing are wrong, I would make the serious point that unfilled niches here are sometimes unfilled for a reason and checking availability of GENUINELY qualified staff is one of the first thing I would check with tech/programming ( I know, they all work online and you manage 50 of them them from home with your CEO skills,  so does not apply in your case [starts laughing again])

[Rama]

best option is to go the Vietnam and get a long term visa at the airport - a Vietnamese visa....

[farangx]

12 minutes ago, mokwit said:

I kinda liked that it was "disruptive" technology with military applications - I think it is pretty good that a 25 year old with only 25 employees has found a disruptive military technology in the face of the US , Russia and China spending billions for any edge in that area. My advice to the OP is to consider the risk of being kidnapped.

 

I don't know what those 25 employees are doing at home, they probably managed another 25 of their own.  But I will offer my application to the government here for 1 baht, yes 1 baht only.  All I am asking in return is a good letter of reference to help me secure my first contract.  Excuse me, I have to go start working on my application.

 

Edited December 20, 2018 by farangx

[mokwit]

1 minute ago, farangx said:

I don't know what those 25 employees are doing at home, they probably managed another 25 of their own.  But I will offer my application to the government here for 1 baht, yes 1 baht only.  All I am asking in return is a good letter of reference to help me secure my first contract.  Excuse me, I have to go start working on my application.

 

maybe it is actually biological tech like protein powders or diet pills - they might have "military" applications. I'm wondering if the OP is a MLM distributor maybe - that would explain being a CEO of a disruptive tech business employing 25 people aged 25.

 

Actually I think the business is actually posting click bait for web boards.

[overherebc]

8 minutes ago, mokwit said:

maybe it is actually biological tech like protein powders or diet pills - they might have "military" applications. I'm wondering if the OP is a MLM distributor maybe - that would explain being a CEO of a disruptive tech business employing 25 people aged 25.

 

Actually I think the business is actually posting click bait for web boards.

Maybe the cure for Ebola??

[jackdd]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Strange association. Does the same apply to those on motorbikes without helmets and those running red lights?

You never heard of a motorbike being fined for driving without helmet or running a red light?

[jacko45k]

27 minutes ago, jackdd said:

You never heard of a motorbike being fined for driving without helmet or running a red light?

Yes I have, and a lot more riders not being fined for driving without helmet or running a red light.

Edited December 20, 2018 by jacko45k

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, mokwit said:

Just in case all us older guys clutching our sides laughing are wrong, I would make the serious point that unfilled niches here are sometimes unfilled for a reason and checking availability of GENUINELY qualified staff is one of the first thing I would check with tech/programming ( I know, they all work online and you manage 50 of them them from home with your CEO skills,  so does not apply in your case [starts laughing again]) 

 

If all online workers, then why base the business in Thailand instead of a good foreign-business-friendly destination like Panama or similar - regardless of where one chooses to "live"?   The capital-requirements, reporting, etc are much better offers - not to mention taxes.  If needing to do business in Thailand, just open a branch here.

 

But, if he is looking for on-site staff, then your point is spot-on.  If Thailand were to change their policies to make it easy for foreigners to set up business here, many small tech firms would come to set-up shop - bringing-in any needed on-site staff, who would love the location.  But given immigration's attitudes, and the business-setup overhead, I don't see that being viable any time soon.

Edited December 20, 2018 by JackThompson

[JLCrab]

13 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

If Thailand were to change their policies to make it easy for foreigners to set up business here, many small tech firms would come to set-up shop - bringing-in any needed on-site staff, who would love the location.  But given immigration's attitudes, and the business-setup overhead, I don't see that being viable any time soon.

Let's just face it Jack: When it comes to RTP Thai Immigration. the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the Thai Ministry of Industry, the Thai Ministry of Information and Communication Technology, etc., you have a much better idea as to what is right for Thailand than they do.

Edited December 20, 2018 by JLCrab