Which embassies have cancelled issuing the affidavit? list?

[sleepy99]

I usually go down to the local bar each week in my area and meet a few friends, lots of nationalities. 
I would like to gather some useful information that I can share with others in person.

Can someone tell me the exact list of embassies that have cancelled issuing the affidavit?

The ones that I know of are,

US, UK, Australia and Denmark ? (not sure about the danish one)

are these all? 

What about the ones like Belgium, Canada, Norway, Sweden, Netherlands, Germany etc. ?? 

Edited December 19, 2018 by sleepy99

[Carib]

Yes, those are all. 

[sleepy99]

1 minute ago, Carib said:

Yes, those are all. 

Wow, that's very surprising. I hope that the other embassies remain supportive towards their citizens in regards of the affidavit.

[sleepy99]

Also, surprisingly, a lot less than I thought. I do understand that since these few do make up a large majority of the expats living here, it is troublesome for those affected. But considering the embassies of a lot of other big countries (Germany for instance) do support affidavits. I hope the only 4 embassies that have cancelled it, will reconsider and bring it back. 

Edited December 19, 2018 by sleepy99

[Aforek]

Wait ! it's the reaction of the embassies: we don't know yet what will be the reaction of Thai immigration when they see that some countries have the letter and the others have no letter 

why do you want that the four embassies reconsider their position ? to please their citizens ? they have decided that they can't confirm the money people have , it's what Thai immigration want 

France ( my country ) doesn't ask proof of revenue either ; do you think immigration will accept that people declare anything they want, even if they have no money ? 

[Swiss1960]

Also, surprisingly, a lot less than I thought. I do understand that since these few do make up a large majority of the expats living here, it is troublesome for those affected. But considering the embassies of a lot of other big countries (Germany for instance) do support affidavits. I hope the only 4 embassies that have cancelled it, will reconsider and bring it back. 

Careful with your statement, a lot of this depends on the pension structures of the countries. Example of Switzerland:
- level 1 pension by Swiss government called AHV
- level 2 pension by private companies from your previous work
- level 3 pension by banks from your explicit pension savings
Swiss Embassy will ONLY affidavit for level 1 pensions, as those are controlled and checked by the Swiss government

Sent from my SM-A730F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[luckyluke]

All pensions in Belgium are paid by " The National Pension Office ".

 

 

[garyk]

1 hour ago, Aforek said:

Wait ! it's the reaction of the embassies: we don't know yet what will be the reaction of Thai immigration when they see that some countries have the letter and the others have no letter 

why do you want that the four embassies reconsider their position ? to please their citizens ? they have decided that they can't confirm the money people have , it's what Thai immigration want 

France ( my country ) doesn't ask proof of revenue either ; do you think immigration will accept that people declare anything they want, even if they have no money ? 

Yep, that is right on target. That is the 64 dollar question!

I am very curious to see what is going to happen! If they only target the four that have dropped out so far, then it is pretty obvious what is going on!

 

[wgdanson]

53 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

All pensions in Belgium are paid by " The National Pension Office ".

 

 

All State Pensions in UK are paid by Dept of Work & Pensions (DWP).

 

[luckyluke]

49 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

All State Pensions in UK are paid by Dept of Work & Pensions (DWP).

Are they easy to verify ?

It is in Belgium.

I agreed, years ago, that some authorities can have access to my data.

As if I said no, they won't do it, how would I know it ?

[wgdanson]

2 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

Are they easy to verify ?

It is in Belgium.

I agreed, years ago, that some authorities can have access to my data.

As if I said no, they won't do it, how would I know it ?

Of course the British Embassy COULD get access to the DWP records with a lot of hassle, court order maybe (data protection and all that).

But it is not only State Pension they were needing to verify/confirm for the Immigration. Private pensions, share divis, rental income.................................oh where have you been these last two months?

[kingstonkid]

8 hours ago, Aforek said:

Wait ! it's the reaction of the embassies: we don't know yet what will be the reaction of Thai immigration when they see that some countries have the letter and the others have no letter 

why do you want that the four embassies reconsider their position ? to please their citizens ? they have decided that they can't confirm the money people have , it's what Thai immigration want 

France ( my country ) doesn't ask proof of revenue either ; do you think immigration will accept that people declare anything they want, even if they have no money ? 

Thai immigration has set the requirements they only care if the embassies can be trusted.  When it comes to the US and UK these are probably 2 of the biggest number of expats.  They are according to people on TV the 2 laziest.

Most other embassies ask for proof.  Therefore they can sign and know that you are not BSing them.

 

I would imagine that immigration is got to do the same thing and ask for the paperwork that you gave the embassy to justify the letter.  If you are above board you have no worries

 

[robertson468]

This really is a lot of B***sh*tt.  I receive a pension from the UK Army, Civil Service and Dept of Works and Pension.  These would need to be verified only ONCE as pensions, issued by the respective Agent on behalf of the Government, because thereafter the individual produces the updated Annual Pension Rate by the Pension providers.  The fact that the British Embassy "layabouts" cannot be bothered to assist in this way is beyond pathetic idleness on their behalf.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Very disallusioned!

[Russell17au]

When all this first started I ask my 10 year old step daughter how much was the Australian aged pension and it took her 5 minutes to have the reply simply by using Google, it is public knowledge what the pension rate is and it is available on the computer. My 10 year old step daughter could verify my income but my embassy cannot and that is supposed to be manned by adults who are supposed to know what they are doing but they cannot verify my pension. To me that is nothing but laziness and as they cannot perform a simple task like checking the pension rate then they should all be sacked and replaced with 10 year old children who can do the task

[MadMuhammad]

13 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

When all this first started I ask my 10 year old step daughter how much was the Australian aged pension and it took her 5 minutes to have the reply simply by using Google, it is public knowledge what the pension rate is and it is available on the computer. My 10 year old step daughter could verify my income but my embassy cannot and that is supposed to be manned by adults who are supposed to know what they are doing but they cannot verify my pension. To me that is nothing but laziness and as they cannot perform a simple task like checking the pension rate then they should all be sacked and replaced with 10 year old children who can do the task

Yeah because it’s the employees problem. How about you petition your government? You know, the people that are supposed to be working for you....

[jimn]

Only the American embassy have ceased the affidavit.

[Russell17au]

4 minutes ago, MadMuhammad said:

Yeah because it’s the employees problem. How about you petition your government? You know, the people that are supposed to be working for you....

You are way behind by several weeks with that comment because I have emailed the Minister for Foreign Affairs, the Minister for Human Services, the Shadow Minister for Foreign Affairs, the Shadow Minister for Human Services, plus the Opposition Leader, they have all acknowledged receiving the email but it is typical politics and if you think that they do things for us then you are living in a fantasy dreamworld, they are typical politicians from every country in the world and they are only in it for themselves.

[Russell17au]

1 minute ago, jimn said:

Only the American embassy have ceased the affidavit.

You should catch up with things. The UK embassy ceased the accepting of applications for income letters on the 12th December, the US embassy ceases issuing affidavits on 31 December, the Australian embassy ceases witnessing Statutory Declarations for income on the 7th January and the Danish embassy has already ceased issuing letters of income from the end of November, so you should check your facts before posting.

[thailand49]

11 hours ago, sleepy99 said:

Also, surprisingly, a lot less than I thought. I do understand that since these few do make up a large majority of the expats living here, it is troublesome for those affected. But considering the embassies of a lot of other big countries (Germany for instance) do support affidavits. I hope the only 4 embassies that have cancelled it, will reconsider and bring it back. 

Just because the four has made the decision I haven't heard anything about whether Thai Immigration will accept the others?

[NoshowJones]

28 minutes ago, MadMuhammad said:

Yeah because it’s the employees problem. How about you petition your government? You know, the people that are supposed to be working for you....

A UK government working for us?? They only work for themselves. Oh! and of course other countries who they give our money away to with foreign aid.

[Russell17au]

11 minutes ago, thailand49 said:

Just because the four has made the decision I haven't heard anything about whether Thai Immigration will accept the others?

Thai Immigration will continue to accept letters of income from every country that issues then as there has been no change in the immigration laws and the letter of income is the requirement for the income system of finance for the visa extension applications. It is only that the 4 embassies are not issuing the letters of income to support their citizens visa extension applications

Edited December 20, 2018 by Russell17au

[StevieAus]

2 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

Thai immigration has set the requirements they only care if the embassies can be trusted.  When it comes to the US and UK these are probably 2 of the biggest number of expats.  They are according to people on TV the 2 laziest.

Most other embassies ask for proof.  Therefore they can sign and know that you are not BSing them.

 

I would imagine that immigration is got to do the same thing and ask for the paperwork that you gave the embassy to justify the letter.  If you are above board you have no worries

 

I don’t know if it is the Embassies being lazy and cannot comment on the US and UK.

If we go back to Feb 2017 the Aus Embassy was asked by Thai Immigration to verify the information being stated in the Statutory Declarations being issued, to which they agreed.

This lasted for about a month until they were overruled I understand by Canberra ( Australia) on the basis that it was not their role to verify the information contained in the declaration which is correct in the case of a Statutory Declaration.

I suspect also there may have been privacy, concerns about potential litigation etc, who knows in this world in which we live.

That said each year I have produced to Immigration when renewing my retirement extension a letter from my pension fund in Australia and copies of my Thai bank account in addition to the Embassy letter.

The first two I would have thought should be more than enough for Immigration rather than a document I have signed myself.

[NanLaew]

11 hours ago, Aforek said:

... France ( my country ) doesn't ask proof of revenue either...

For clarity, what exactly does the French citizen living in Thailand have to provide to the French consular services in Bangkok for them to issue an attestation to the applicants financial status that is accepted by Thai Immigration.

 

Please be very, very precise.

 

Thanks!

NL

[StevieAus]

56 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

When all this first started I ask my 10 year old step daughter how much was the Australian aged pension and it took her 5 minutes to have the reply simply by using Google, it is public knowledge what the pension rate is and it is available on the computer. My 10 year old step daughter could verify my income but my embassy cannot and that is supposed to be manned by adults who are supposed to know what they are doing but they cannot verify my pension. To me that is nothing but laziness and as they cannot perform a simple task like checking the pension rate then they should all be sacked and replaced with 10 year old children who can do the task

But not everybody gets the same amount particularly since they ramped up the assets test also there are people like myself who have a private pension and get zero  and others, I know two, who derive their income from other sources in Australia.

On the subject of laziness you might want to read my post at the end of this section.

[Russell17au]

3 minutes ago, StevieAus said:

But not everybody gets the same amount particularly since they ramped up the assets test also there are people like myself who have a private pension and get zero  and others, I know two, who derive their income from other sources in Australia.

On the subject of laziness you might want to read my post at the end of this section.

I know many who are on the flat Australian Aged pension and it does not involve invasion of privacy as the Australian Aged Pension and the Veterans Affairs pensions are set amounts and the rates are open public knowledge that anyone can access with the use of a computer. As for private pensions and other income then it would be up to you to provide the embassy with the verifiable proof of income. But the government pensions are easily verifiable.

[overherebc]

8 hours ago, luckyluke said:

Are they easy to verify ?

It is in Belgium.

I agreed, years ago, that some authorities can have access to my data.

As if I said no, they won't do it, how would I know it ?

I get tax returns notices every year on two private pensions but not an individual return on my state pension. You would think that is enough proof.

[D3030]

Does it matter?

 

I  thought the immigration officer will no longer accept income affidavits from any  country starting 1 Jan 2019?

 

In fact I read some folks have already been informed by the IO in the area(s) they live in, that if they are using the 65000 BT a month "proof of income" method and were providing income affidavits from their embassy(s), that they needed to transfer those funds into a Thai bank every month and provide bank statements instead.

 

Also, some dude supposedly challenged the U.S. Embassy concerning them not doing the income affidavits anymore, and it sure sounded like they stopped that service because it would be a moot point, since they were apparently told by the Thai government that they would no longer accept them as proof of income - effective 1 Jan 2019.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2018 by D3030

[jimn]

48 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

You should catch up with things. The UK embassy ceased the accepting of applications for income letters on the 12th December, the US embassy ceases issuing affidavits on 31 December, the Australian embassy ceases witnessing Statutory Declarations for income on the 7th January and the Danish embassy has already ceased issuing letters of income from the end of November, so you should check your facts before posting.

I am 100% sure of my facts, are you? The British and Danish Embassies issued an income letter based on proof of income provided to them by post or email. You Australians as you say do a Stat Dec. That only leaves the American Embassy with a Affidavit where they swear that they receive a certain income. So rather than being so quick off the mark and try to correct me, you should check your facts. In fact I purposely posted that as I wanted to see who would be first. Congratulations for being the first.

[jimn]

4 minutes ago, D3030 said:

Does it matter?

 

I  thought the immigration officer will no longer accept income affidavits from any  country starting 1 Jan 2019?

 

In fact I read some folks have already been informed by the IO in the area(s) they live in, that if they are using the 65000 BT a month "proof of income" method and were providing income affidavits from their embassy(s), that they needed to transfer those funds into a Thai bank every month and provide bank statements instead.

 

Also, some dude supposedly challenged the U.S. Embassy concerning them not doing the income affidavits anymore, and it sure sounded like they stopped that service because it would be a moot point, since they were apparently told by the Thai government that they would no longer accept them as proof of income.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wrong. Until Thai Immigration say otherwise. Embassy letters are valid for 6 months from the issue date.

[NanLaew]

3 minutes ago, jimn said:

I am 100% sure of my facts, are you? The British and Danish Embassies issued an income letter based on proof of income provided to them by post or email. You Australians as you say do a Stat Dec. That only leaves the American Embassy with a Affidavit where they swear that they receive a certain income. So rather than being so quick off the mark and try to correct me, you should check your facts. In fact I purposely posted that as I wanted to see who would be first. Congratulations for being the first.

Hair splitting. Semantics?