Britons would now vote to stay in EU, want second referendum: poll

[MarkyM3]

George Soros has donated at least £800k to date. See https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44331013. (dated June 2018 so may have donated more since). 

 

Earlier quoted on this thread as being involved in the push for a 2nd referendum so fair to assume there is money involved. 

 

Is it appropriate that a foreign billionaire involved in the internal politics of the UK? He didn't seem to care to much about the UK when pocketing billions in the early '90s after the ERM debacle. He is free to do what he wants under current UK law but seems strange to me.......

 

NB Sorry did not use quote function correctly - this is reply to tebee ????

Edited January 7, 2019 by MarkyM3

[yogi100]

22 minutes ago, tebee said:

Do we have any evidence that Mr Soros is financing the remain camp? 

 

George Soros contributes funds to Brexit Remain campaign - The ...

 

https://www.thenational.ae/.../george-soros-contributes-funds-to-brexit-remain-campai...

1.  

Feb 8, 2018 - Billionaire investor George Soros has contributed £400,000 (Dh2 million) to a campaignwhich is aiming to overturn Britain’s exit from the European Union. ... “George Soros’s foundations have along with a number of other major donors also made significant contributions to our ...

Missing: evidence ‎| ‎Must include: ‎evidence

Remain campaign scores with support from Beckham and Soros ...

 

https://www.ft.com/content/b7b335d8-379e-11e6-9a05-82a9b15a8ee7

1.  

Jun 21, 2016 - Once it seemed that the only thing George Soros and David Beckham had in common was an experience of big-money moves out of the UK.

Missing: evidence ‎| ‎Must include: ‎evidence

 

Now you post some evidence that Soros is NOT funding it or disprove the evidence you just have been shown.

Edited January 7, 2019 by yogi100

[Thingamabob]

If there is another referendum the only options would be May's deal or Leave with no deal. Remain already eliminated in the last referendum.

[baansgr]

12 hours ago, MARK74 said:

"The poll of more than 25,000 voters was commissioned by the People's Vote campaign, which is spearheading an increasingly vocal push for a second referendum on Brexit."

I may be wrong but most polls commissioned by a non impartial source seem to get the result they require to meet their agenda.

The same people stating 700,000 attended a rallie in London whereas the true figure given by the Met is 200,000.

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

See above:

1. Cancel A50

2. Invoke A50 again 

 

None of that requires consent from the other 27 or the EU. 

Good. Then we have 2 years to advise intent for WTO so that the EU can decide if they want a deal or not!

[Grouse]

I posted an animated explanation of WTO on a similar thread. No effect

 

STILL leavers go on about things they don't understand

 

One leave poster stated such nonsense I had to have a cup of tea!

 

You see this is the problem with democracy. It requires a common level of knowledge and intelligence.

 

I don't see that.

 

Frankly I trust the EU far more than I trust HMG

[AlexRich]

12 hours ago, NE1 said:

You can't have a second vote , that is not democratic. 

It would set a very expensive and trouble making precedent. 

The vote was put to the people and the people voted , that is the end of it.

Otherwise you will end up with a " Red shirt / Yellow shirt scenario" .

General election , Tories won ,  we want another vote. Labour won , we want another vote.

 

 

A democratic vote based on the facts is by definition democratic. People change their mind when promises are not deliverable ... and that is what is happening here. The so-called “will of the people” is now to remain in the EU.

[AlexRich]

16 minutes ago, baansgr said:

The same people stating 700,000 attended a rallie in London whereas the true figure given by the Met is 200,000.

Then you’ll be happy to test the will of the people? 

[Baerboxer]

12 hours ago, NE1 said:

You can't have a second vote , that is not democratic. 

It would set a very expensive and trouble making precedent. 

The vote was put to the people and the people voted , that is the end of it.

Otherwise you will end up with a " Red shirt / Yellow shirt scenario" .

General election , Tories won ,  we want another vote. Labour won , we want another vote.

 

 

 

 Based on your logic, the Brexit referendum isn't democratic and couldn't have been held as the first referendum voted to join in!

 

Of course other votes can be had. That's what democracy is all about. You don't vote politicians in office for life!

[baansgr]

6 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I posted an animated explanation of WTO on a similar thread. No effect

 

STILL leavers go on about things they don't understand

 

One leave poster stated such nonsense I had to have a cup of tea!

 

You see this is the problem with democracy. It requires a common level of knowledge and intelligence.

 

I don't see that.

 

Frankly I trust the EU far more than I trust HMG

The vast majority of remainers have a brainwashed blinkered vision of the world and detest anything that is good about the UK yet would give their last to some mud hut sponging 3rd world nation that dosnt give two hoots about them. Call that intelligence?

[Baerboxer]

19 minutes ago, Thingamabob said:

If there is another referendum the only options would be May's deal or Leave with no deal. Remain already eliminated in the last referendum.

 

Only in the mind of Tories and Brexiters.

 

Get real! The rules can't be made up as you go along to suit your agenda!

[nauseus]

47 minutes ago, MarkyM3 said:

Well.....I would vote for Brexit again (I am a UK resident, unlike most on this thread, living and working in the UK for 2/3 of the year). Not that we should be contemplating a second vote - faith in democracy will surely be at rock-bottom this were to happen as it means the EU becomes the equivalent of Hotel California - you can check out but you can never leave.

 

The way this process has played out has been an eye-opener, but not totally surprising to me. Theresa May handed over all important negotiations to a team led by a senior civil servant who is a self-proclaimed Europhile. The Brexit ministers were mere window dressing and hardly had any hand in proceedings. How on earth she thought she could sell the deal that she agreed is now on the table is unclear but I have more than a suspicion that was the expectation.

 

By reaching this point with only a few few months left and no expectation the deal will be passed in Parliament, there was inevitably going to be a push for another referendum. Get enough voters fed up with the constant uncertainty and lack of clarity and count on enough disaffected people to swing it the other way when they vote again. Ireland had to have a 2nd go at the Lisbon Treaty to get the "right" answer. Meanwhile, Corbyn's shower - who couldn't run a p!ss up in a brewery - can't agree their own Brexit policy so offer nothing else. I do give him credit though for stating he does not support a 2nd referendum. 

 

If the EU had actually offered Cameron any reasonable concessions prior to the referendum- which he actively sought and other EU members proudly stated they would offer nothing - then its likely the vote would never have been lost. The main concession he wanted was some kind of temporary emergency brake on immigration. Net migration has been around 250-300k per annum for years and the public infrastructure is under strain. Not something most posters on this thread have any clue about. Anthony Blair has a lot to answer for in this regard - when the new Eastern European economies joined in 2004 he ignored the transitional arrangments and immediately gave unfettered access to the UK labour market. Ireland was the only other country to do this, others (I believe) did not allow unfettered access until the transitional arrangements ended in 2011. Consequently we now find ourselves where we are. Of course, we also have a very weak system covering non-EU citizens. I work in IT (well paid and therefore have no personal axe to grind wrt wage suppression by cheap labour) and have seen skilled visa abuse for years. 

 

Couple of other points - branding Brexit voters as "old and white" or racists (I consider my neither) is pathetic and lazy. Also, saw an early poster mentioned the EU would love to be shot of the UK. Well.....in 2017, the EU enjoyed a £67 billion annual surplus in trade over the UK. And the UK is one of the few net contributors to the EU budget and has been throughout. Most countries are permanent takers. So the poster of that statement might wish to think more deeply about it. Is it in the EUs interest to lose this plus the £40 billion payoff they are seeking for a negotiated Brexit? If the UK leaves without a deal and reverts WTO (and why not, successful economies like Australia, SIngapore etc operate on said rules) then we ought to pay no settlement imo unless a deal is presented.   

 

Also wondering why we have billionaire George Soros financing the remain camp. What relevance does this guy have to the internal politics of the UK. Would it be appreciated for a UK billionaire to finance a campaign in respect of the Mexican wall, for example?!

 

Post of the year. Spot on and thank you. 

 

After so long spent dithering with weak and wobbly "negotiations", May's mushy plan will rejected too close to 29th March, with no time left to negotiate an alternate agreement. This whole dubious process is designed to force another vote, to keep us in. Britain needs a leader, not this silly moo.

[Baerboxer]

2 minutes ago, baansgr said:

The vast majority of remainers have a brainwashed blinkered vision of the world and detest anything that is good about the UK yet would give their last to some mud hut sponging 3rd world nation that dosnt give two hoots about them. Call that intelligence?

 

From your post, we can all see the level of deep and well researched knowledge you have about the character of those who voted to remain in the EU, and the UK foreign aid policies.

 

You've certainly demonstrated your intelligence adequately.

[baansgr]

13 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Then you’ll be happy to test the will of the people? 

The same people stating 700,000 attended a rallie in London whereas the true figure given by the Met is 200,000., dont circumvent this fact, its a down right lie so why on Earth would believe any other figure or poll they give

[nauseus]

4 hours ago, tebee said:

You would have to be 89 or older now  to have fought against the natizs in ww2 - so somewhat less than 1% of the UK population - I don't think they are the problem.

 

And the war debt was to the US - our allies. 

The financial debt to the US was all part of the cost of freedom. This was paid of in large part by taxes on the same people who fought WW2 (and lived). You forget too easily. Shame. Shame.

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, Spidey said:

Issue is that we didn't know what we were voting on first time around, It's only now that people have a reasonable knowledge of what Brexit really entails. Someone likened it to a game of tennis. In the first set one of the players was blindfolded.

Myopic remainers is my guess.

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, Grouse said:

So many misunderstandings. I'm too old to explain everything. Just abstain.

Sorry you don't understand, Grouse.

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, Justin Side said:

I don't think anyone would disagree with that observation.

You don't?

[baansgr]

19 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

From your post, we can all see the level of deep and well researched knowledge you have about the character of those who voted to remain in the EU, and the UK foreign aid policies.

 

You've certainly demonstrated your intelligence adequately.

Exactly, thanks for the compliment and pleased you agree with my remarks

[Loiner]

2 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

in EU there is free movement of labour, jobs are for citizens in EU, not for scousers or geordies.

 

Exactly why we must Leave now! Jobs are for the native population, not for imported zero hour wage slaves.

While Remain loving business owners have enjoyed the cheap labour of Eastern and Southern Europe, local workers have either not been able to get jobs or have been ground down to the same pay levels. The ones who can't get a job resort to benefits. Why should the UK taxpayer be supporting locals on the dole, while the EU nationals are leaving their own stricken countries economies to undercut ours? Even from a purely capitalist view point, that principle is not acceptable.

[Spidey]

7 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Myopic remainers is my guess.

Nope. Brexiteers wearing rose tinted glasses and willing to believe the complete BS spouted by Boris & co.

[tebee]

54 minutes ago, MarkyM3 said:

George Soros has donated at least £800k to date. See https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44331013. (dated June 2018 so may have donated more since). 

 

Earlier quoted on this thread as being involved in the push for a 2nd referendum so fair to assume there is money involved. 

 

Is it appropriate that a foreign billionaire involved in the internal politics of the UK? He didn't seem to care to much about the UK when pocketing billions in the early '90s after the ERM debacle. He is free to do what he wants under current UK law but seems strange to me.......

 

NB Sorry did not use quote function correctly - this is reply to tebee ????

OK no problem.

 

So if Arron Banks £8 million or the mysterious bung the DUP received before the referendum, turned out to be from foreign sources would you consider the referendum itself tainted?  

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, Stupooey said:

IF (and it's a big if) the UK leaves the EU on 29/3, then:

- about 900,000 who voted for Brexit will no longer be alive

- nobody under the age of 20 3/4 will have been given the opportunity to help determine the long-term future of their country

 

Call this democracy? More like necrocracy to me...

The Morbid Report January 2019. Issue No.1.

Get issue No.2 free. 

[tebee]

1 minute ago, Loiner said:

Exactly why we must Leave now! Jobs are for the native population, not for imported zero hour wage slaves.

While Remain loving business owners have enjoyed the cheap labour of Eastern and Southern Europe, local workers have either not been able to get jobs or have been ground down to the same pay levels. The ones who can't get a job resort to benefits. Why should the UK taxpayer be supporting locals on the dole, while the EU nationals are leaving their own stricken countries economies to undercut ours? Even from a purely capitalist view point, that principle is not acceptable.

But what about the 1 million Brits who have gone the opposite direction and got jobs in the EU ? Should they all have to give up those jobs and return to the UK unemployed ?

[Spidey]

9 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Sorry you don't understand, Grouse.

Oh but he does understand. The problem is that you only want to hear the nationalistic, jingoistic rhetoric.

 

All other rational and factual talk is filtered out by you.

[NE1]

33 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Of course other votes can be had. That's what democracy is all about. You don't vote politicians in office for life!

No , because by law there has to be a referendum every 4 years. Everybody knows that. You just can't call for another vote cos' you didn't get what you wanted.

[AlexRich]

28 minutes ago, baansgr said:

The vast majority of remainers have a brainwashed blinkered vision of the world and detest anything that is good about the UK yet would give their last to some mud hut sponging 3rd world nation that dosnt give two hoots about them. Call that intelligence?

They also happen to be of higher intelligence in general, and don’t spend their life on conspiracy web sites soaking up the propaganda devised by zealots with their own agenda. The Rees Mogg’s of this world want a low tax, low regulation, small government, privatised NHS, Britain ... I doubt that’s what the working class areas in England who voted Brexit want ... they seem to think they will be showered in riches from the Brexit “dividend” and won’t see another foreign face on their high street ... they are going to be very disappointed on both points. Taken for fools by posh boys ... nothing ever changes.

[melvinmelvin]

2 hours ago, Spidey said:

May's deal is terrible. No deal is worse. That's why we need another vote.

 

If you don't think that the economy is going to suffer with no deal, just look what's happening now with the threat of no deal.

 

Thinking that "it'll be alright on the night" is, as I said, pure madness. Ask anyone who understands something about the economy. 40 baht/£ ? Say goodbye to the halcyon days of the exchange rate.

 

 

how would another vote save you from calamities?

 

what would be the questions on the ballot paper?

 

fancy May crap? tick here .....

fancy hard Brexit crap? tick here ......

 

thank you for voting, please do not wipe

your buttocks with the ballot before putting it in the box

 

 

[nauseus]

7 minutes ago, Spidey said:

Nope. Brexiteers wearing rose tinted glasses and willing to believe the complete BS spouted by Boris & co.

The BS was incoming from all directions. You really need to acknowledge that. 

[Spidey]

Just now, melvinmelvin said:

how would another vote save you from calamities?

 

what would be the questions on the ballot paper?

 

fancy May crap? tick here .....

fancy hard Brexit crap? tick here ......

 

thank you for voting, please do not wipe

your buttocks with the ballot before putting it in the box

 

 

That isn't what is being proposed.

 

Vote would be: Accept deal on the table or remain.