Combination of Income and Bank Balance to equal 800K Baht

[David Walden]

53 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Well, not exactly.

I'm not frustrated by newbies in general.

I am specifically frustrated with your posts here about O-A visas and reentering with them while still valid when the actual topic has nothing to do with that.

The actual topic here is about applications for annual extensions based on retirement done at immigration offices in Thailand using the combo method.

At this point, combo method applications with embassy letters should be expected to be accepted as they have been for many years, but combo method applications without embassy letters appear to be much more problematical. I hope like others that situation will improve but I wouldn't bank on that.

I think the best advice without embassy letters is to do an 800K seasoned bank application if you can until the uncertainty about combo method applications without embassy letters is resolved (if ever). 

We will indeed start to see more reports of such attempted applications over time as there will be people not prepared to make any other type of application that also failed to get their embassy letter last year when they could (referring here of course to nationals impacted by the stoppage of letters). 

A bigger wave of such reports can't really be expected until several months from now until after the letters obtained last year run out of validity time (reportedly six months). So I guess starting in about JULY is when this stuff really hits the fan for larger numbers. 

It is very hard to understand anything about these posts.  Like I say I've been trying for 7 years.  There are lots of issues that need to be cleared up before many people can get satisfactory results from their retirement visa applications...Thai Immigration has painted themselves into a corner with pedantics.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, David Walden said:

It is very hard to understand anything about these posts.  Like I say I've been trying for 7 years.  There are lots of issues that need to be cleared up before many people can get satisfactory results from their retirement visa applications...Thai Immigration has painted themselves into a corner with pedantics.

Well, it can be a moving target.
There have been issues with varied enforcement at different offices for many years.

But now we have a really new thing that is very much unresolved at this point in time.

That is combo applications without embassy letters.

There is no reason at this point (but that could change too) to consider that there will be any change with combo applications with embassy letters.

Also of course very new are income based applications without letter when there is the full 65K income but I see the topic here is combo method applications, not full income method applications. 

Edited January 22, 2019 by Jingthing

[luckyluke]

8 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Also of course very new are income based applications without letter when there is the full 65K income but I see the topic here is combo method applications, not full income method applications. 

Crystal-clear.

However I am afraid David Walden won't make head or tail of it.

[brian1314]

1 hour ago, David Walden said:

It is very hard to understand anything about these posts.  Like I say I've been trying for 7 years.  There are lots of issues that need to be cleared up before many people can get satisfactory results from their retirement visa applications...Thai Immigration has painted themselves into a corner with pedantics.

David,
I am a retiree trying to follow this post with regard to the new regulations and the combo method of obtaining extensions, so please, please, please stop posting off topic comments about OA visas

[David Walden]

1 hour ago, brian1314 said:

David,
I am a retiree trying to follow this post with regard to the new regulations and the combo method of obtaining extensions, so please, please, please stop posting off topic comments about OA visas

To use the combo method as I said Australians are in a good position.  The Australian Centrelink Social Service will pay your pension in to your bank account at their expense anywhere in the world each 4 weeks and that is irrefutable proof that you are getting your pension in a Thai bank of about Bt500,000 per year from the Aus Gov.  You should be able to put another Bt300,000 in a Thai Bank a/c for 3 months to qualify to receive a Retirement visa.  The reason why this should be so is that it is simple proof.  To make it work it has to be simple and provable (sadly lacking in the past).  The Embassies and Thai Immigration are not going to peruse long winded profit an loss statements and company structures, shares, family trusts, etc for you so you can get a visa.  In the past, the Embassies sort of pinned the tail on the donkey had a wild guess and Thai Immigration accepted this as it came from an Embassy.  This is simply not going to happen in future (I think, TIT).  When I got my retirement visa in Australia I used the statement from my Bank managed retirement fund showing a surrender value of more than the required amount.  Very simple for the Embassy.  The lady at the Thai Embassy said "some people bring share certificates, bonds company profit and loss statements etc. an all sorts of stuff for us to look at and they will not do it, it could take all day. They have to be able to prove they have Bt800,000 in a bank a/c, or a retirement fund like mine or prove they have proof that they have a pension.  It must be simple preferable a single amount of say Bt300,000 and a pension to add up to Bt800,000 per year and then only after a year at least.  If you do it properly it will all work out in about 10 days and you will arrive in Thailand to be good for 2 years stay.

Edited January 22, 2019 by David Walden

[kalasinswede]

On ‎1‎/‎21‎/‎2019 at 8:38 AM, ubonjoe said:

You can show the money in a bank in your home country when you apply for a OA visa at a Thai embassy or official consulate.

It only needs to shown in a Thai bank if applying for an extension of stay based upon retirement at immigration here,

The Swedish embassy still issues income affidavit. Can't I just still use that in the future. Öls advice.

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, kalasinswede said:

The Swedish embassy still issues income affidavit. Can't I just still use that in the future. Öls advice.

You can still use that to prove your income when applying for an extension of stay at immigration.

[kalasinswede]

28 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You can still use that to prove your income when applying for an extension of stay at immigration.

Thank you

[NoshowJones]

On 1/20/2019 at 3:43 PM, Kwasaki said:

Recent threads only mentioned 800K in bank for no less than 3 months.

A combination method of saving in bank and a monthly amounting to 800K is still in play as I understand it.

The problem is the verification of monthly earning amount to satisfy Thai immigration whether it be combination or the 65,000 per month.

I would go to your immigration office and ask them. 

Good advice, different IO offices will give you different answers.

[flexomike]

20 hours ago, Jingthing said:

My understanding is that O-A visas are always issued these days with multiple reentry permits by default.

Yes but the multi expires on the date the visa expires, so if on extension of Visa have to get a new reentry permit You can get almost two years out of a O-A multi, but after the visa expires at one year it is now necessary to purchase a reentry permit

[NoshowJones]

On 1/20/2019 at 4:23 PM, allane said:

Post # 3 is both off topic, and irrelevant to the OP's question. The "Combination Method" is not allowed for Marriage Visas, or extension of same.

It is true that the combination method does not apply to the marriage extensions, but it does reply to the retirement extensions.

[Jingthing]

It is true that the combination method does not apply to the marriage extensions, but it does reply to the retirement extensions.

Yes.

However there is now evidence of enforcement that people may face rejection if applying with the combo method but no embassy letter. People should heed this warning and consider preparing for an 800k bank application instead. At least for the time being.

 

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

[AAArdvark]

On 1/21/2019 at 1:57 AM, Isaanman said:

This is true. I received my O-A visa from the Thai Consulate in Washington D.C. with a notarized copy of my US bank account showing current sufficient funds done at the bank the day before I submitted my request for the visa at the Consulate. The hour after we received the visa in our passports, we were able to use that money in our US bank and got 2 years' stay in Thailand out of it-- a great way to do it, if you can, IMHO! 

If you are doing it at the embassy in DC, there is no need to have it notarized nor to have dated the day before.  If it is done at a consulate like at LA or NYC it might be. 

[AAArdvark]

On 1/21/2019 at 11:32 AM, David Walden said:

I prefer to use simple English so that people know what I'm trying to tell them.  I am talking about my personal experience.  I was given a permit or extension or permission to stay in Thailand which is valid for a year after my original visa expired...I don't care what the Thais want to call it.  I'm using it as a verb, not as a noun.

In simple English, you had better start making deposits in a Thai bank because you will need it next time..

[Jingthing]

17 minutes ago, AAArdvark said:

In simple English, you had better start making deposits in a Thai bank because you will need it next time..

Not if he wants to do serial 0-A visas, which is what I've gleaned from his posts, but I could be wrong. 

[raysunshineray]

On 1/21/2019 at 8:38 AM, ubonjoe said:

You can show the money in a bank in your home country when you apply for a OA visa at a Thai embassy or official consulate.

It only needs to shown in a Thai bank if applying for an extension of stay based upon retirement at immigration here,

Hi Ubon Joe,

Do you know whether the combination method is also an option when applying for OA visa in home country (UK)?

If it is an available option, are there similar problems to doing this in Thailand when it comes to proofs of income? 

I have a state pension and a private pension - all documented, and these can be shown.

I wonder whether existing documents confirming pension are enough or any additional proofs required?

Would an additional specific letter from the pension providers perhaps be required, or existing documents legally attested?

This question arises from the fact that IO in Thailand have asked for further proofs of income (specifically mentioning pensions recently) from certain Embassies (US, UK etc) which they have said they cannot provide. 

One can't simply assume that it would be a different matter when applying in one's home country.

Thanks for your time and valuable advice.

[ubonjoe]

15 minutes ago, raysunshineray said:

Do you know whether the combination method is also an option when applying for OA visa in home country (UK)?

No problem at the embassy in London.

"Bank statement or evidence of adequate finance showing a deposit of the amount equal to and not less than 800,000 Baht or an income certificate with monthly income of not less than 65,000 Baht, (approximately £20,000.00 / annum) or a deposit account plus a monthly income totalling not less than 800,000 Baht. If you send a copy of bank statement, the original reference letter from the banking concerned is necessary."

Source: http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/en/services/7742/84508-Non-Immigrant-visas.html#7

You could use pension proof of them provided source of the or a statement from them.

Is different since you would be dealing with an embassy that is under the MFA not immigration here.

[snooky]

Fine, you have your 65K a month income and not much more, from your home country, which you bring in each month.  Then, you may need to go back to your home country for several months for whatever reason, family, health, etc., and you will need that 65K to use as expenses in your home country.

 

Since you will not be here to transfer or send money to your home country (which in itself is difficult to do without a lot of paperwork at a local bank), will you lose your visa extension as there will be no money coming into this country for that period of time that you are in your home country?

 

Or, if you continue to send your monthly funds here, how do you access it back in your home country other than using your debit card to purchase things.  I am not sure if you can use a debit card to withdraw funds in either EU or America.  One friend has suggested the use of a Travel Money Card...??

 

 

Edited January 23, 2019 by snooky
add thoughts

[steve73]

10 minutes ago, snooky said:

Since you will not be here to transfer or send money to your home country (which in itself is difficult to do without a lot of paperwork at a local bank), will you lose your visa extension as there will be no money coming into this country for that period of time that you are in your home country?

 

Send money back to your home country using Dee money.

[madmen]

For those renting out property here on air bnb it will count as income as the payment is sent from abroad

[Mr Grumpy]

On 1/20/2019 at 4:39 PM, BobBKK said:

400k and 32,500?

 

65,000 x 12 doesn't = 800,000

No, but "UK" pension payments are not monthly, they are every 4 weeks. Hence the calculation should be 65,000 X 13 = 845,000. Bingo!

[Jingthing]

3 hours ago, victorpeeke said:

No, but "UK" pension payments are not monthly, they are every 4 weeks. Hence the calculation should be 65,000 X 13 = 845,000. Bingo!

Nope.

It's true the 65K x 12 is under 800k.

That is the rule, 65K x 12 does not need to meet 800K.

Bank method 800K does.

It's been this way for many years but now some nationals have the big problem of forced full imports with no embassy letters.

[David Walden]

22 hours ago, AAArdvark said:

If you are doing it at the embassy in DC, there is no need to have it notarized nor to have dated the day before.  If it is done at a consulate like at LA or NYC it might be. 

Well yes, it is an abuse of process and an insult to require an applicant to have an original bank statement issued by your bank, a police report from the state police commissioner, a medical from your doctor and all documents of the 36 pages of your application signed by a JP.  That is all 36 pages.  But the Thai Embassy in Canberra would not issue the visa unless all 36 pages of the application were signed individually by a JP, my JP is a friend and neighbor.  He just kept on making comments as he signed these 36 pages which were unprintable on these pages and laughing (funnyman)...What all of them?  5555.  We are only here to witness your signature.  He would only sign each of the 36 pages if I signed before him because as he said "I'm only witnessing you signing., I have no idea what's in the documents.  He signed all the pages reluctantly as a friend because I told him they wouldn't give me the visa unless he did sign (TIT in Australia).

    Like I often say   "I sent you a five page letter because I didn't have time to write you a one page letter".

Edited January 24, 2019 by David Walden

[wgdanson]

16 hours ago, victorpeeke said:

No, but "UK" pension payments are not monthly, they are every 4 weeks. Hence the calculation should be 65,000 X 13 = 845,000. Bingo!

Unless your friendly IO says that HE wants 65k PER MONTH and ignores the one month in which the 13th payment is made.

And who is getting a UK pension of 65k a month? Certainly not me.

[David Walden]

21 hours ago, raysunshineray said:

Hi Ubon Joe,

Do you know whether the combination method is also an option when applying for OA visa in home country (UK)?

If it is an available option, are there similar problems to doing this in Thailand when it comes to proofs of income? 

I have a state pension and a private pension - all documented, and these can be shown.

I wonder whether existing documents confirming pension are enough or any additional proofs required?

Would an additional specific letter from the pension providers perhaps be required, or existing documents legally attested?

This question arises from the fact that IO in Thailand have asked for further proofs of income (specifically mentioning pensions recently) from certain Embassies (US, UK etc) which they have said they cannot provide. 

One can't simply assume that it would be a different matter when applying in one's home country.

Thanks for your time and valuable advice.

If you have a state pension in UK and a private pension as well and that private pension in a recognized fund and has a surrender value of equal to BT800.000, your UK Thai Embassy should just accept that as enough to obtain a retirement visa.  That's how I do it in Aus.  I don't even mention the Centrelink Government Pension or the cash I have in my bank. The surrender value of Bt800,000 is all I need.  Like the lovely lady at the Aus Thai Embassy in Canberra says "Don't put in your application about Aus Pension or money in the bank that will only confuse immigration.  The surrender value of Bt800,000 is enough".  Of course, some people have given all their money to a pension fund for the whole of life cover.  They have no surrender value you get a regular payment until you are dead and no refunds.  This type of pension is seldom issued now in Aus and petty well all Super Fund investment policies have a surrender value.  My Surrender value is published on my fund account each day, it changes in sympathy with the share market value.  I can take as much as I like or as little as 6% of the balance each year (that's the law as it is in a tax-free environment).  You don't have to get a download just a statement must an original document from the fund and signed, not a copy (so you can't download it).  The lady at the Embassy agrees that my Aus pension, plus the money I take from my bank managed pension fund each year would also get me the pension.  "But don't do it that way just put the surrender value on your application and say no more, we treat it as money in a bank OK". It's proof you have Bt800,000 to live off for the next 12 months."  Works well, Visa all sorted out is less than 10 days.  Arrive in Thailand with everything in order and you can stay up to 2 years. (see the previous post about that)

[Pattaya46]

3 minutes ago, David Walden said:

If you have a state pension in UK and a private pension as well and that private pension in a recognized fund and has a surrender value of equal to BT800.000, your UK Thai Embassy should just accept that as enough to obtain a retirement visa.  That's how I do it in Aus.

Please...

When will you stop to bring your story of O-A visa in threads that are about Retirement Extension only !!!

You probably get this request from others more than 10 times already ! But you continue !!! 

[Jingthing]

Please... :angry:
When will you stop to bring your story of O-A visa in threads that are about Retirement Extension only !!!
You probably get this request from others more than 10 times already ! But you continue !!! :sad:

There is nothing wrong with discussing OA visas per se but it would be much better to happen on an OA visa specific topic.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[FPizzle]

I was under the same impression. Income + deposit = 800,000 baht =  OK! I was never under the impression that the income had to be deposited monthly in a Thai bank account. Why would I deposit 66,666.66 baht per month here when my living expenses are less than 35% of that amount. Since none of my financial institutions or US Social Security have digital affiliations with Thai banks the deposit per month scenario would be a disaster. And as a US citizen I have obligations in the US that also need to be paid so moving all my money here would make paying my US obligations a disaster. So is there anyone out there that can straighten this out. What do we need, what is acceptable, when do we all leave! 

Here's the link to the article - Immigration to show leniency!

[Jingthing]

I was under the same impression. Income + deposit = 800,000 baht =  OK! I was never under the impression that the income had to be deposited monthly in a Thai bank account. Why would I deposit 66,666.66 baht per month here when my living expenses are less than 35% of that amount. Since none of my financial institutions or US Social Security have digital affiliations with Thai banks the deposit per month scenario would be a disaster. And as a US citizen I have obligations in the US that also need to be paid so moving all my money here would make paying my US obligations a disaster. So is there anyone out there that can straighten this out. What do we need, what is acceptable, when do we all leave! 

Here's the link to the article - Immigration to show leniency!

Here goes.

 

As a US national you can no longer get an embassy income letter.

 

So your choices are 800k in Thai bank seasoned for 3 months. Sure thing.

 

Or

 

Import at least 65k into Thailand monthly. Full income method. Leniency only means that this first year you won't need to show 12 months back. Next year you will.

 

 

Or

 

You could try to do a combo application without embassy letter.

 

Similar to full income but the monthly imports less than 65k so as you said add bank account funds.

 

However there is currently troubling evidence that there is a good chance combo applications without embassy letter will be rejected. At best there is great uncertainty about that method.

 

My suggestion for you is the 800k bank method if you can.

 

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

[UKresonant]

Time now,  great three options above....

 

Do the 65000 baht income figures and the 800000 baht requirements come with a validity period, are they valid for Calendar years 2019 & 2020, and would notice be given 13 months ahead of any change? A quality deficiency in the prospectus perhaps?

Why would you transfer 3 times what you need, or tie up financial resources from home country, spend money on additional transfers at unmatched frequencies, if once you fill in the application form on that day the rules & values change and it's all wasted effort.