Thai immigration to show leniency to foreigners applying for retirement & marriage extensions

[lamyai3]

2 hours ago, ukrules said:

I have a feeling that there's going to be many changes coming.

 

There's an election in March, the supposed result of the election will follow sometime later in the year.

Probably right, hopefully BJ's meteoric rise through the ranks will see him promoted out of his present position before he can disturb the status quo any further.

 

Regarding elections, date is now confirmed 24th March, results would be declared within 60 days of the poll. 

[sometimewoodworker]

23 hours ago, finnishmen said:

hmm, must lookinmg what happen next year my visa, i can only send my pension salary ewery month 700€ about 23000 bht to my wife bank account, i no have own account no can open ewery bank want have work permit papers, im old pension no need work permit, i no make work newer again.

You can get a bank account without a work permit. You just have to go to different branches or different banks until one will open the account without a work permit.

 

It will help if you go with your wife as rules have a habit of changing when there is a Thai family member (or high status Thai) doing the talking.

[Fookhaht]

Moi renewed his Retirement Extension yesterday w/absolutely no problems.
As long as you have the bank letter & the passbook, it's a piece of cake. [emoji846]

What is this “letter?” What are the minimum points the letter must address? Is there a template or sample anywhere?

I keep hearing about three things: passbooks, statements, and letters. What does immigration want to see?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Fookhaht]

My local Immigration office told me that when I renew my Marriage Extension in August they will want at least 2 months records of foreign transfers to a Thai bank, which is helpful. When I told them Bangkok Bank want a Residency Certificate from Immigration they said OK, but it will cost me 500bht. This was not so helpful because last year they did not charge me a fee for Residency, when I transferred the registration of my pick-up from another province.

 

There is no fee for a residence certificate. Any money required for such a document is an under-the-table bribe. I confirmed this at Khon Kaen which refused to give a receipt for the 600 baht they wanted for this document. They know that if you take such a receipt to the anti-corruption authorities, the shit will hit the fan.

 

When a policeman or a government official refuses to issue a receipt for monies paid, you know it’s tea money.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

[jacko45k]

17 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

17 hours ago, jesimps said:

Watch this space for compulsory medical insurance!
 

If it comes in it will be a mistake, many people will leave. If they offered a cash in the bank option that would be a fair alternative. Not all of us want to subsidise the obese unhealthy lot

You are kidding right, after all the whingeing about  having to show income for an Extension you expect this to get a nod of approval from all those in dread of a Thai bank account!????

Edited January 24, 2019 by jacko45k

[jacko45k]

17 hours ago, elgenon said:

It doesn't mention the 800,000 option. Is that still viable?

Yes yes yes

[jacko45k]

17 hours ago, jesimps said:

Mine from the Brit Embassy only said that they'd seen the evidentary documents that I'd presented to them. Hardly implicating themselves. I'm still yet to be convinced that all the other embassies apart from famous four thoroughly verify the evidence at source.

They do not, I have read at least one post stating another Embassy gave the equivalent of a Stat Dec and still does so. 

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Can I just leave and reapply from Australia leaving my funds in my Australian accounts, and supply the embassy with relevant bank and superannuation statements, health certificates and police clearance?

 

If you mean getting a new Non-IMM OA (a multiple entry one year validity visa), yes you can and why not. You seem familiar with the process. You need only do it every 2 years, as an Entry to Thailand just prior to the expiry of the Visa would give another 12 months permission to stay. That could be kept alive if you need to leave Thailand by getting a re-entry permit. 

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, GreatEastern said:

I can show the cash deposits on my bank statements for the past 12 months (no atm slips needed ????????????).  The question is if that's going to work instead of showing (overseas) bank to (local) bank transfers. 

No, how does domestic cash deposits fulfill the transfers from overseas requirement?

The OP details the exception to 12 monthly transfers that will be accepted during the first year. 

Simply time to initiate monthly transfers, or try and build up a deposit to 800k.

Edited January 24, 2019 by jacko45k

[OJAS]

15 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Perhaps we all need to contact our home country respective foreign ministers about the emabssies refusing to issue the letters, and see if they will consider the effects it is having on their expats

 

 

14 hours ago, lamyai3 said:

This was happening at the end of last year, with a petition etc to the UK embassy, but seems to have fizzled out somewhat. 

Have already tried that tactic in the case of the British Embassy, but all I got back from the FCO Complaints section in London was a reply which did little more than regurgitate what the Embassy had already told me previously!

[zydeco]

Hardened 65K/month now and the baht strengthening, especially against the US dollar. Squeeze is on.

[tropo]

Excuse me if someone has already covered this over the last 17 pages, but what type of bank documentation will be accepted by Thai Immigration? Will online printed statements suffice, or will we need a bank letter stating that the money came in every month... or does one order from the bank a full year's worth of bank statement? 

Edited January 24, 2019 by tropo

[Kadilo]

3 minutes ago, tropo said:

Excuse me if someone has already covered this over the last 17 pages, but what type of bank documentation will be accepted by Thai Immigration? Will online printed statements suffice, or will we need a bank letter stating that the money came in every month... or does one order from the bank for a full year's worth of bank statement? 

The way I read it is “all of the above” 

The  letter from the bank is a must as with the 800,000 now, and the rest is back up. 

Experts along shortly.........

Edited January 24, 2019 by Kadilo

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, tropo said:

Excuse me if someone has already covered this over the last 17 pages, but what type of bank documentation will be accepted by Thai Immigration? Will online printed statements suffice, or will we need a bank letter stating that the money came in every month... or does one order from the bank a full year's worth of bank statement? 

It may be the standard letter from the bank confirming your account similar to what is used now for the money in the bank option and copies of your bank book or a statement from the bank.

It is not really clear at this time if the banks will make a special letter proving the transfers in or that immigration will really expect one.

[Jingthing]

It may be the standard letter from the bank confirming your account similar to what is used now for the money in the bank option and copies of your bank book or a statement from the bank.
It is not really clear at this time if the banks will make a special letter proving the transfers in or that immigration will really expect one.

That's been my assumption. Just a balance letter the same as for the bank methods.

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[Jingthing]

The way I read it is “all of the above” 
The  letter from the bank is a must as with the 800,000 now, and the rest is back up. 
Experts along shortly.........

Bank method stands as before without showing monthly imports.

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[JackThompson]

10 hours ago, Thainovice 88 said:

Wondering about the new rules for 65000 per month. Is that for one person? Does it for a couple you need 130,000 to show? What about people who have bought property? Does it count or we still have to have the said amount every month?

Many thanks in advance for the info.

Property can only be used in the case of an extension granted based on investments in Thailand, which is another topic entirely.  It will not help at all with extensions for retirement or marriage to a Thai.

 

If you and your spouse are both foreigners, one can get the Retirement extension based on income, and the other can get an extension w/o any financial requirement, simply by being married to the person with the retirement-extension. 

[JackThompson]

21 hours ago, Jingthing said:

21 hours ago, jesimps said:

Watch this space for compulsory medical insurance!
 

Well it's being discussed for OA visas but not extensions as yet. ...

Yes - no agent-angle for OA Visas - only extensions.  Makes sense.

 

I have to wonder if farangs not paying medical-bills is really an issue.  All they could get w/o money is immediate-care to keep them from dying - not extended-treatment.  But assuming this is a real issue, let's see what the total is, divide that by total "months in country" of all foreigners, and have all foreigners pay that fee/mo for their permits-of-stay.  I would guess it would amount to less than 100 baht/mo per foreigner.

 

But, I suspect this issue is more useful as a "bash farang" tool and/or a way to generate business for private insurance companies, than anything to do with significant loses incurred to the Thai medical system by foreign indigents on extensions-of-stay based on retirement.  The cheap-labor foreigners on L-Visas already get into the Thai medical system - and they would be the ones who would be unable to afford care (corporate welfare: taxpayers subsidizing the costs of companies' cheap-labor).  Therefore, a cost-neutral solution, such as I suggested, is unlikely to ever be discussed.

[luckyluke]

5 hours ago, Fookhaht said:

When a policeman or a government official refuses to issue a receipt for monies paid, you know it’s tea money.

 

Even receiving a receipt is no guarantee it is a genuine one.

i doubt there is one receiving a receipt,  daring to let it check for authenticity.

And by whom & where ?

[jacko45k]

6 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

I have to wonder if farangs not paying medical-bills is really an issue.  All they could get w/o money is immediate-care to keep them from dying - not extended-treatment

I expect it is. Some people stay in hospital a good time and can run up quite a tab without supporting insurance. It will vary hospital to hospital but one I am thinking of does this. They aren't keen on letting you out without paying though and may even try to hold your passport. 

(The bills can really run up fast! 30,000/ night in ICU!)

[JLCrab]

16 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Therefore, a cost-neutral solution, such as I suggested, is unlikely to ever be discussed.

Nothing that you have ever suggested is likely to be discussed.

[farangx]

39 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

I have to wonder if farangs not paying medical-bills is really an issue.  All they could get w/o money is immediate-care to keep them from dying - not extended-treatment.  But assuming this is a real issue, let's see what the total is, divide that by total "months in country" of all foreigners, and have all foreigners pay that fee/mo for their permits-of-stay.  I would guess it would amount to less than 100 baht/mo per foreigner.

 

But, I suspect this issue is more useful as a "bash farang" tool and/or a way to generate business for private insurance companies, than anything to do with significant loses incurred to the Thai medical system by foreign indigents on extensions-of-stay based on retirement. 

Only 100 baht/mo per foreigner Jack, that will attract many sick farangs to this country.

 

Mandatory medical insurance from here or home country for all farangs is the way forward.  We are not suppose to burden the Thais with our medical expenses in Thailand ....

 

[JackThompson]

4 hours ago, farangx said:

Only 100 baht/mo per foreigner Jack, that will attract many sick farangs to this country.

 

Mandatory medical insurance from here or home country for all farangs is the way forward.  We are not suppose to burden the Thais with our medical expenses in Thailand ....

I 100% agree that Citizens should not pay one setang for foreigner's medical costs - in any country - ever.  I never advocate any change in policy which would lower the standard of living of Thais - or, in this case, the quality/stability of their health-care system.  What I proposed is a way to prevent that.

 

I was not talking about "medical insurance"  - rather, any emergency-service provided to stabilize a dying foreigner, before they are sent home, where they get treatment, or don't - but that is not Thailand's problem.   Currently, if you cannot pay, the most they will do is stabilize you - most often victims of accidents, many here as short-term Tourists.  Those are the costs to which I am referring - and what one might find on "go fund me."

 

If someone wants "medical insurance" for long-term care and treatment, that is a completely separate issue.  This is available on the open-market - and very affordable, compared to many other countries. 

 

I do not support letting people show up at an advanced-age and "just buy in" to the Thai public-health system, as someone at age 20 might (the latter paying in for decades before a significant medical-event is probable).  This would - exactly as you say - be a magnet for people who would be a financial-burden to the Thai medical system.  A sound actuarial analysis - such as private health insurance companies use - is appropriate for any consideration along those lines.

Edited January 24, 2019 by JackThompson

[JackThompson]

5 hours ago, jacko45k said:

They aren't keen on letting you out without paying though and may even try to hold your passport. 

Yes, the care isn't "free" - and I doubt the total cost / foreigner is significant - but would be glad to see a cost-neutral system put in place to end the concern entirely.

[SPREX]

Please check !!!

New rule 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s5gkhddeq3e426a/Le Mémorandum le plus urgent FR .pdf? dl = 0

Hold rule 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/47ifeb28dqvce4d/ORDER OF THE IMMIGRATION BUREAU REFEENCE HOLD .pdf?dl=0

Edited January 24, 2019 by SPREX

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, SPREX said:

Please check !!!

New rule 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s5gkhddeq3e426a/Le Mémorandum le plus urgent FR .pdf? dl = 0

Hold rule 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/47ifeb28dqvce4d/ORDER OF THE IMMIGRATION BUREAU REFEENCE HOLD .pdf?dl=0

Per your comments in red within the document - the bank-money method has not changed.  At the top of the new rules, note:

Quote

... "the Immigration Bureau has adjusted requirements on evidence of income for visa extension"

It only adds a new way to show income. 

A complete document showing it all in one place would have been much better - avoided much confusion. 

And, ideally, every post on this topic needs to have this pinned at the top: 

Quote

"The New Changes Only Affect the Income Method of meeting the financial qualifications, for people from countries whose embassies no longer provide income-letters.  The Bank-Method Remains The Same.  If your embassy still gives out income-letters, you can still use them as before."

 

[D3030]

On 1/22/2019 at 3:53 PM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Don't think so... The above letter update still says must present bank statements from Thai bank(s) showing the transfers....  The above memo isn't changing the prior order, just clarifying about 1st year enforcement.

"Where this is the case, the Pol Lt. Gen Hakpal has instructed immigration officers that from 1 Jan to 31 Dec 2019 they have discretion to accept evidence of less than 12 monthly transfers from "overseas." <<<<<< So who knows.. Did Pol Lt. Gen Hakpal verbally inform IOs the transfers must come from overseas?

 

Then the word "descretion" - The IOs have the discretion to accept evidence of less than 12 monthly transfers.......  I hate the word "discretion".

 

So, anyone that has not opened a Thai bank account yet, they should and start those monthly deposits.. 

 

 

Edited January 24, 2019 by D3030

[JLCrab]

4 hours ago, D3030 said:

Did Pol Lt. Gen Hakpal verbally inform IOs the transfers must come from overseas?

The word' overseas' is in the original released document but I wouldn't worry about that. The high end Hua Hin realtor pushers in their promotion documents refer to villas with an "ocean view" so a transfer from Phuket to Pattaya might be considered "overseas"  by some of you clever guys.

Edited January 24, 2019 by JLCrab

[JLCrab]

7 hours ago, JackThompson said:

I never advocate any change in policy

Where do you advocate any change in policy? Do the IMM or MoFA folks ever request of you policy recommendation documents or proposals?

[jacko45k]

9 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Yes, the care isn't "free" - and I doubt the total cost / foreigner is significant - but would be glad to see a cost-neutral system put in place to end the concern entirely.

I believe in the case I was heard of a substantial cash deposit up front was required, and when I had to get some treatment, similarly a chunk was taken from my CC before we could proceed. If a person can pony that up, perhaps they will go ahead and treat and allow a bill to be run up, You will get a daily visit from accounts dept at your bedside though!