Airline/Immigration flight rules

[Bert Jones]

I am retired in Thailand with a retirement/extension visa stamped in my passport.

I booked a return ticket to the UK with British Airways. This was 3 years ago.

 

When checking in at the BA desk at Heathrow for the return flight, I was informed by the check-in clerk, I wouldn’t be allowed to take the flight as it was against the ‘rules’. It was only by showing the clerk my retirement visa stamp with the date stamped in my passport, that I was permitted. I didn’t want to hold up the queue so didn’t protest too much, other than state I could have obtained a VOA at Thai immigration, to which the clerk replied she was only following procedure...didn’t think too much of it and have flown back to the UK since and not had this issue.

I booked a flight to Georgia (Europe) with Ukraine airlines recently from BKK. When checking in for the return flight, I was informed by the clerk that ‘it was not possible’ and again, only by showing them my passport retirement stamp, would they print my boarding pass and allow me to take the flight.. Again, I pointed out that I could always get a VOA from Thai immigration but they didn’t agree with me.

What is going on here?? I had a similar issue about a year ago travelling to Penang from Phuket, the airline tried to insist I bought a return ticket back to Thailand as my Thai GF would be refused entry. I refused stating that it was an issue for me not them … They seemed somewhat perturbed, but relented.

I suspect this is some sort of ‘up sell’ or does anyone have a more plausible explanation ?

 

[Vacuum]

I fail to understand your "issues". You have an extension stamp in your passport which they'll notice when you check in.

[JackThompson]

You have to show a return-ticket to travel to Thailand for a VOA or visa-exempt entry.  Showing your Retirement extension (or a valid visa) removes that requirement - but you must sometimes speak to a supervisor who is aware of this.

It is possible your Thai GF could be refused-entry to Malaysia if she travels there w/o a return-ticket - but I am not familiar with what the rules are for Thai nationals entering Malaysia.

Edited March 4, 2019 by JackThompson

[richard_smith237]

IF you are getting a Visa Exemption stamp up arrival you still have to meet criteria upon arrival: i.e. 20,000 baht in Cash and an onward or return flight within 30 days.

 

IF checking in, the Airline staff are checking that you have a return flight. IF you are using the return leg of your ticket you don’t have a return flight and thus must present a valid visa. 

 

It seems that upon check in the Airline staff were unable to locate your Visa Extension (*or unable to understand it), hence the question. 

 

Airlines are responsible for your return should you not be permitted entry - this is why they need to ensure that you either have a valid visa or are holding an onward or return ticket.

 

Its quite normal that the airline checks your visa status and recently are doing so more regularly. 

Edited March 4, 2019 by richard_smith237

[Bert Jones]

Thank you very much for the prompt responses.

 

This sentence seems to answer this issue..."Airlines are responsible for your return should you not be permitted entry - this is why they need to ensure that you either have a valid visa or are holding an onward or return ticket"

I didn't realise this. 

I'm getting very negative in my old age and assume the worst of people...

Thanks again Guys.

[steve187]

as others have said, its normal procedure, for flights to Thailand with no visa/re-entry permit requires a ticket out of Thailand within 30 days of arrival

[Date Masamune]

Unfortunate but Thailand is becoming known for denying entry to people who even have valid visas. I know a guy who has an Elite card Korean Airlines in Inchon said was fake because it wa not “machine printed” and denied boarding initially. Finally he got a supervisor to admit him as his 15 or so Thai admissions stamps from day of visa were obvious proof he could enter Thailand. No apology. Korea also has the “face” culture rubbish.

 

[Bert Jones]

For all the criticism that gets heaped on Thailand fom these bb's, having spent a month in miserable Georgia with what must be the unhappiest of people on the planet...my gf and I are so happy to be back. For all their faults, the Thai people are so much nicer to live a life with. They really do for the most part, have a happy collective mindset...they really do smile quite a lot...we just don't see it/notice it after a while. I was considering moving on from Thailand...but not now. Even when I add up the negatives (and there are many)...I love Thailand and it's people.

[Date Masamune]

Atlanta or Shshalikashvili?

[stanleycoin]

4 minutes ago, Date Masamune said:

Unfortunate but Thailand is becoming known for denying entry to people who even have valid. I know a guy who has an Elite card Korean Airlines in Inceon said was fake because it wa not “machine printed” and denied boarding initially. Finally he got a supervisor to admit him as his 15 or so Thai admissions stamps from day of visa were obvious proof he could enter Thailand. No apology.

Even some Airlines,  don't employ the smartest people at times. 

[DrJack54]

57 minutes ago, stanleycoin said:

Even some Airlines,  don't employ the smartest people at times. 

Richard-Smith gave the comprehensive answer to op above. Think some are being tad harsh on airport staff who are not io. I fly in/out of los ever 2 weeks. The airline staff check for visa. If flying to countries where I need one. For example I being oz need visa for my flights to Vietnam. On flights into Thailand I need show my reentry stamp (same as the op). The permission of stay stamp alone would not suffice. Personally, I have permit page with tag and show airline staff as soon as they have checked identity page.

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, Date Masamune said:

Unfortunate but Thailand is becoming known for denying entry to people who even have valid visas. I know a guy who has an Elite card Korean Airlines in Inchon said was fake because it wa not “machine printed” and denied boarding initially. Finally he got a supervisor to admit him as his 15 or so Thai admissions stamps from day of visa were obvious proof he could enter Thailand. No apology. Korea also has the “face” culture rubbish.

 

The Elite Card he has (if that’s what you mean - i.e. the Gold Thai Elite Credit Card) is pretty much useless for Immigration Purposes and proof of Visa for flying. 

 

The Proof of Visa is the Thai Elite Visa which is stuck into the passport - its is this which airlines are looking for not a ‘card’

 

As the airlines are responsible for the costs of returning any rejected passengers it would be up to the Supervisor to make the final call based on whether or not he could be convinced that the Passenger is not a high risk of rejection upon arrival in Thailand. In this case it seems your friend was successful in convincing the airline staff he was not ‘at risk of rejection’ based on his travel history, but having a ‘gold colour Thai Elite card’ would have meant nothing to the Korean Airlines staff who only want to see a visa page. 

 

I’m not sure any apology was necessary for them doing their job.

[Date Masamune]

He showed them the valid Elite visa in his passport and and 15 or so entry stamps to Thailand and they initially claimed his visa was fake because it was not machine printed. That is stupidity not “doing their job”.

 

[roadrunner32]

If you hold a retirement or any non immigrant visa you need to get a re entry permit when you flight abroad If you don't have it the airlines doesn't boarding you unless you have a ticket to leave Thailand within 30 days. I honestly didn't understand very well what happened to that guy.

Edited March 4, 2019 by roadrunner32

[cornishcarlos]

5 minutes ago, roadrunner32 said:

If you hold a retirement or any non immigrant visa you need to get a re entry permit when you flight abroad If you don't have it the airlines doesn't boarding you unless you have a ticket to leave Thailand within 30 days. I honestly didn't understand very well what happened to that guy.

 

Correction, if you are on an extension to stay then you need a re-entry permit. If you have a Non Imm visa you have to leave every 90 days anyway... 

[jacko45k]

The airlines are required to confirm you have a flight out of Thailand within the limit of a VWOA, usually 30 days. When you show them the current Retirement Extension/ Re-entry Permit they realize the VWOA restrictions do not apply.

Edited March 5, 2019 by jacko45k

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

The airlines are required to confirm you have a flight out of Thailand within the limit of a VOA, usually 30 days. When you show them the Retirement Extension they realize the VOA restrictions do not apply.

A visa on arrival is only for 15 days and is only available for those from 21 countries that qualify for it after making a application for it.

You are writing about a 30 day visa exempt entry not a VOA.

You show your re-entry permit not your extension of stay stamp if you have one. The airline will know what a re-entry permit is.

[jacko45k]

9 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

A visa on arrival is only for 15 days

Thanks, I must  do better on terminology. Carried it over from the OP.

Edited March 5, 2019 by jacko45k

[Percy P]

On 3/4/2019 at 11:07 AM, Bert Jones said:

Thank you very much for the prompt responses.

 

This sentence seems to answer this issue..."Airlines are responsible for your return should you not be permitted entry - this is why they need to ensure that you either have a valid visa or are holding an onward or return ticket"

I didn't realise this. 

I'm getting very negative in my old age and assume the worst of people...

Thanks again Guys.

Never had problem as stated .recently flew in from Bali were they wouldn't give me a visa because l couldn't show them a booking to where l would be staying in Thailand. Never mind, I arrived at DM airport and got a VOA, 30 days. No problem

[Satcommlee]

I think this is what airlines do when they are overbooked and looking to bump people... 

 

Was the flight full by any chance?

Edited March 5, 2019 by Satcommlee

[Jaggg88]

5 hours ago, Satcommlee said:

I think this is what airlines do when they are overbooked and looking to bump people... 

 

Was the flight full by any chance?

No, they do this because they would have to fly you back at their expense if Thai IO refuses to let you in. When I travel to Thailand with my wife and son I usually go for 3 weeks so just get a visa exempt but my wife and son stay for 6 weeks and have to show their Thai passports at check-in as well as the UK passports. Even if the Thai passports have run out they will still be accepted and can be used at check-in and Thai Immigration - easy to renew a Thai passport at a local office in Thailand.  

[DrJack54]

6 hours ago, Satcommlee said:

I think this is what airlines do when they are overbooked and looking to bump people... 

 

Was the flight full by any chance?

You replying to which post?

I fly EVERY week. I have never been on flight with zero spare seats. Excluding red seats. 

[DrJack54]

7 hours ago, Percy P said:

Never had problem as stated .recently flew in from Bali were they wouldn't give me a visa because l couldn't show them a booking to where l would be staying in Thailand. Never mind, I arrived at DM airport and got a VOA, 30 days. No problem

Don't take offense but why didn't you do online booking for accom?

VOA? Do you mean visa exempt stamp 30 day. Do Bali still do setv? I thought they stopped. Any advice from members would be good. Ubonjoe help!

Edited March 5, 2019 by DrJack54
Error

[scotinsiam]

21 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

A visa on arrival is only for 15 days and is only available for those from 21 countries that qualify for it after making a application for it.

You are writing about a 30 day visa exempt entry not a VOA.

You show your re-entry permit not your extension of stay stamp if you have one. The airline will know what a re-entry permit is.

I had an horrible experience recently where the airline staff were either stupid or crooks in Phnom Penh

 

 

 

[steve187]

15 hours ago, Percy P said:

Never had problem as stated .recently flew in from Bali were they wouldn't give me a visa because l couldn't show them a booking to where l would be staying in Thailand. Never mind, I arrived at DM airport and got a VOA, 30 days. No problem

you received a visa exempt 30 day entry, which should have required a ticket out of Thailand within 30 days to allow boarding of the aircraft, not a voa 15 day entry

Edited March 6, 2019 by steve187

[Bert Jones]

I'm now a little confused about VOA! What's the difference between 'visa exempt' and VOA? according to wiki UK citizens don't need a visa and are permitted to stay for 30 days.

hTtps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_requirements_for_British_citizens

[elgenon]

On 3/3/2019 at 8:07 PM, steve187 said:

as others have said, its normal procedure, for flights to Thailand with no visa/re-entry permit requires a ticket out of Thailand within 30 days of arrival

Can you get an extension to a VOA or a Visa-exempt?

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, Bert Jones said:

I'm now a little confused about VOA! What's the difference between 'visa exempt' and VOA? according to wiki UK citizens don't need a visa and are permitted to stay for 30 days.

A visa on arrival only allows a 15 day entry and is only available to those from 21 countries and normally costs 2000 baht after applying for it. And the 15 days cannot be extended.

A visa exempt entry is for 30 day and can be extended for 30 days at immigration for a fee of 1900 baht

List of countries that for both of them is here. http://www.consular.go.th/main/contents/filemanager/VISA/Visa on Arrival/VOA.pdf

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, Bert Jones said:

I'm now a little confused about VOA! What's the difference between 'visa exempt' and VOA? according to wiki UK citizens don't need a visa and are permitted to stay for 30 days.

hTtps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_requirements_for_British_citizens

VOAs are what Indians, Chinese, and some others get - a "visa" is issued "on arrival" allowing a 15 day stay.  This normally costs 2000 Baht,  but offered free now, to keep the "total visitors" numbers up, by bringing in poorer "package tour" travelers, from those countries.

 

Visa-Exempt (meaning you enter w/o a visa at all) entries are what most Euros and Americans get - 30-days.

 

Then there are bilateral agreements for Visa-Exempts, which include some for 90-days.

 

10 minutes ago, elgenon said:

Can you get an extension to a VOA or a Visa-exempt?

You can get a 30-day extension of ordinary Visa-Exempt entries (not necessarily those from bilateral agreements, though).  VOAs not applicable.

 

Edit: see UJ's link for the full list of these.

Edited March 6, 2019 by JackThompson

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, Bert Jones said:

I'm now a little confused about VOA! What's the difference between 'visa exempt' and VOA? according to wiki UK citizens don't need a visa and are permitted to stay for 30 days.

hTtps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_requirements_for_British_citizens

The difference is clear.

 

Visa Exemption Stamp on arrival - 30 days entry to Thailand (free of charge) for those from qualifying countries. 

 

Visa on Arrival - XX days Visa issued at the VOA Desk at the airport (Fee's apply).

 

 

The first indicates that agreements have been made to permit citizens of 'some countries' (i.e. UK) entry into Thailand without a Visa for 30 days - the Stamp in the passport upon arrival is a Visa Exempt Stamp marking the date of entry. 

 

The second is actually a Visa which for those citizens from countries which do not have the above agreement with Thailand but where VOA formalities have been agreed (i.e. China). 

 

Citizens from Countries which fall into neither category have to obtain their visa from an Embassy outside of Thailand prior to entry.