Very bad case scenario -- what if you're blacklisted but still have assets in Thailand?

[mercman24]

ha ha * i wouldnt keep too much in a Thai bank*  only about 400,000 baht  for all retirees ,  what a farce that is.

[findlay13]

8 hours ago, lamyai3 said:

I was given this advice about 15 years ago regarding buying a condo, by a friend here who already owned a couple. She pointed out that the country is somewhat unstable, and that while you're welcome to buy here, there's no guarantee you'll always be able to live here. 

I was given it by a bloke who ran the Brisbane Australia end of the Kangaroo Club in the PI.He said all these blokes want to buy a bar/hotel/restaurant etc.in the PI.He said yes you'll live ok but don't expect to be able to get your money out again.In other words don't invest more than you're willing to walk away from.

[mngmn]

Once money and assets are under control you need to think about relationships. Thailand only provides security in relationships for one year at a time in the form of non-immigrant visas or extensions of stay.

 

Other countries may be far more generous and grant a longer term residency to your child or partner. It is a good idea to organise this before you get deported if you want to continue living with your partner or child. Although it probably also means leaving Thailand for a few years while they establish residency.

 

Edited March 18, 2019 by mngmn

[4675636b596f75]

16 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I want to add that I want to ask people to NOT post here saying such things can't happen and don't happen. You are wrong.

I just heard of a case of a man deported and blacklisted for a ONE DAY overstay. Not at the airport of course where it would have been OK. 

It can happen. So just deal with that reality, and respond to this question if you know something, and don't if you don't. 

I heard of a case of a woman was standing in line at the border.  While waiting her turn for processing a swarm of killer bees singled her out.  They chased her.  She instinctually ran for the border not thinking that she had just crossed the border without getting stamped out of Thailand and without her passport.  When she tried to cross back to Thailand, she was refused.  The other country refused her entry as she had no passport.  

 

I hear that 3 years later, she is still living in the middle of the bridge.

 

It can happen and it did.  Deal with it.

[Jingthing]

12 minutes ago, mercman24 said:

ha ha * i wouldnt keep too much in a Thai bank*  only about 400,000 baht  for all retirees ,  what a farce that is.

If using the bank method, it's at least 800K for five months of the year under the new rules.

[Jingthing]

6 minutes ago, 4675636b596f75 said:

I heard of a case of a woman was standing in line at the border.  While waiting her turn for processing a swarm of killer bees singled her out.  They chased her.  She instinctually ran for the border not thinking that she had just crossed the border without getting stamped out of Thailand and without her passport.  When she tried to cross back to Thailand, she was refused.  The other country refused her entry as she had no passport.  

 

I hear that 3 years later, she is still living in the middle of the bridge.

 

It can happen and it did.  Deal with it.

Sounds like a good movie.

[Jingthing]

11 hours ago, david555 said:

Could be done online between both party's , Staying in Cambodia (even temporary …). remember that you can in Thai baht notes only 50 000 baht  cash ..... but to Cambodia 350 000 , (before 500 K) and changing to a western currency in short notice could be a little problematic .Cambodia would be my first option if would happen to me , as cheap flights (paid by me of course ) for a helping hand to come over to arrange things .

Cash under control is the first emergency thing to secure 

I've never heard of legal documents being signed online in Thailand. It's an interesting idea but I'm very skeptical if that's actually ever possible. 

[Spidey]

3 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Sounds like a good movie.

So what's the story of the guy who got blacklisted after being one day over?

[david555]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I've never heard of legal documents being signed online in Thailand. It's an interesting idea but I'm very skeptical if that's actually ever possible. 

By online I mean to deliver any needed permission or document to a helping person  not direct meant to Thai government 

[Jingthing]

11 hours ago, luckyluke said:

In such a case there is, like always, the optimistic and pessimistic approach. 

 

Here in this particular case there is also the realistic approach. 

 

Optimists don't have to plan anything as nothing will happen to them. 

 

Pessimists should start to take actions now. 

 

Selling their Condo now and continue to 

live here in renting, sell the car/motorbike and use the Bath bus, eventually taxi and walk. 

The biggest possible amount of cash should always being immediately available. 

 

The realistic approach would being to take your chances, not ignoring that people are deported, but that there is a minimal possibility it may be yourself. 

 

 

And of course there is also :

Doing nothing that may give a possibility to Immigration to eventually deport you. 

 

Something the gross of us apply. 

 

But  this is not really relevant for this topic. 

That's more of a philosophical post but I hear where you're coming from. That's one thing I'm considering. Given the current "situation" in Thailand (for those that don't think it's a "situation" I can't help you) I'm considering more strongly about selling my condo before I've made firm plans to leave Thailand. Doing that I may still stay in Thailand but I won't have the stress of the condo albatross, and I'll also be in a position to voluntarily leave quickly if/when that makes sense. 

I think other people might want to consider that as well. If I lost all my assets here, it could easily ruin the rest of my life. 

The old advice don't invest more here than you can afford to lose is totally correct. I can't afford to lose it so it's too late for me.

[Jingthing]

11 hours ago, david555 said:

...

 

BTW  @Jinthing a tip for next doomsday topic  could happen ….what if you sudden are victim of bank fraud internet way or other …..and your 800K is missing or under level ….. not your fault , but can happen and immigration shall not make exceptions …?

Enjoy JT.

Baiting post ignored. All other baiting posts will be ignored. If people insist on posting such garbage, get your jollies, but don't waste your time directing such garbage to me personally. 

Edited March 18, 2019 by Jingthing

[Spidey]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Baiting post ignored. All other baiting posts will be ignored. If people insist on posting such garbage, get your jollies, but don't waste your time directing garbage to me personally. 

You baited us saying the thread was based on the scenario of a guy you knew who got blacklisted after one day overstay.

 

Put up or shut up.

[mngmn]

16 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

and this is why we have rule number one for living in Thailand.

 

Never bring more into the country than you are willing to lose.

 

 

Rule number two. Always consider any houses you buy/build for you wife/girlfriend/husband/boyfriend/other a gift (even if you currently refer to it as my/our house).

 

When deciding how much to spend on this gift see rule number one.

Edited March 18, 2019 by mngmn

[Jingthing]

11 hours ago, Bang Bang said:

I have decent cash assets here from working many years. For which reason I am setting up a DeeMoney ac. so that I can transfer moneys out of here. I have only just applied so my DM ac. isn't up and running yet. But I assume that when it is, and is linked to my Kasikorn bank ac., I will be able use DM remotely to get at my Thai stash (just like Transferwise works in the US). If this is true then it takes away the OP's headache re cash savings.

 

I am setting this up not because I expect to get blacklisted (well, who knows) but because I might be away to another country for an extended period.

 

I never bought a condo or a car. Love the country but never quite felt the confidence to own rather than rent.

 

My advice to the OP re his condo: Since you are worried about selling it in case you are stuck outside, I would settle the matter by selling it now, right away, like someone above suggests. My calculations (YMMV) show that the amount to buy a condo here, equivalent I guess to what you would gain selling, if invested even conservatively in the market, will bring in more than enough to rent an equal place. Renting is cheap in Thailand.

 

Plus your worries are over, which matters too. I like being in a configuration in which I can pick up stakes and be gone without a trace in 24hrs. I've been here now more than 10 years living light. It's alright.

Yes, thanks.

Very good points.

Yes I am considering selling my condo to reduce the stress.

The tricky part is that if I do end up staying in Thailand much longer I would probably be better off keeping it (assuming do very bad case scenarios). So it would be better to see closer to actually leaving, but there is something to be said for selling anyway, to lower the stress of being venerable to losing so much. 

 

I totally agree about DeeMoney. I haven't done so yet, but absolutely it's a good idea to get that set up. 

 

I want to say I really appreciate the subset of members such as you that are taking this topic seriously, because it is a serious topic. 

[david555]

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Baiting post ignored. All other baiting posts will be ignored. If people insist on posting such garbage, get your jollies, but don't waste your time directing such garbage to me personally. 

O jinthing now you disappoint me as this was only meant as a funny bit sarcastic note ….

[Jingthing]

8 hours ago, Cryingdick said:

 

You can't just continue to open threads and have hostility when it isn't music to your ears. you seem to think any thread you open is purely yours to curate.

Another garbage baiting post ignored. 

[Spidey]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I want to say I really appreciate the subset of members such as you that are taking this topic seriously, because it is a serious topic. 

It would be a serious topic if you could give us some detail of the guy who got blacklisted for one day overstay.

 

I presume that your reluctance to do so is because it never happened.

[david555]

A side note :
For those who for a serious reason could forsee the need to go UNDER those limits  i think it would be wise to not take under before you voided your ret .ext. 
example by going out country whiteout a re entry...,so making your ret .Ext. void …,by air and re enter on visa exempt (or other ..) 
Then you can witdraw/ use the money whiteout being in breaking those rules , who is only for the ret.ext holders , and as under visa exempt you are not ..., so never a problem to arrange as soon as  financial possible back to a ret.ext operation , so you never broke their rulings !!  And avoiding any bad history stamping on your file or passport . 
Use their rules in your favor.... 

On contrary if you would have go under when still a ret ext. holder ! 

[Jingthing]

6 hours ago, Leaver said:

I was referring to my managed fund, not a term deposit. 

 

I'm not going to change my portfolio, or liquidate some assets, just because Thai immigration say so.

 

I am single, do not work here, do not own property here, and do not have a business here.  I'll leave my fund and assets as is.  They have been serving me well, paying well over a bank in returns.  It funds a good lifestyle in this region. 

 

Vietnam will profit from the new visa laws, but I will return to Thailand as often as tourist visas allow me to do so. 

 

I will maintain control over my finances and assets, not Thai immigration, who are forcing foreigners to capitalize Thai banks.

Sounds very wise but not really on topic. The topic here is about people that have major assets in Thailand and those people are all vulnerable if their immigration status here goes south. 

[Jingthing]

4 hours ago, cracker1 said:

I think if I was "Blacklisted" I would appoint one of my family or friends, Power of Attorney, and buy them a ticket to Thailand to go and dispose of my property.

Interesting.

However, are you sure that a POA done abroad has any legal standing in Thailand?

That would be a realistic solution for some if it does, but if I were to guess I would assume the POA document would need to be done in Thailand, which of course if you can't come here, you can't do. 

[Bang Bang]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yes I am considering selling my condo to reduce the stress.

Methinks that's key to happy expat life. Owning a bunch of stuff isn't.

 

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

The tricky part is that if I do end up staying in Thailand much longer I would probably be better off keeping it (assuming do very bad case scenarios).

I am not sure about this. My case: rent of 20k b. a month for a 70 sq.m. 2-bedroom near Victory Monument. This place would sell for 8-10 mil easy. Assuming 8mil. I am paying 3% of that to live here. YMMV.

 

Heck, I believe there are FDs in the US that pay nearly 3%, not to mention the markets which have been on a roll the past 10 years.

 

If you're from the US (Europe might be similar) you might look first into a safe 3-4% investment opportunity back home, then sell your condo, invest accordingly and rent off the proceeds. This unshackles you from Thailand totally.

[Spidey]

37 minutes ago, 4675636b596f75 said:

I heard of a case of a woman was standing in line at the border.  While waiting her turn for processing a swarm of killer bees singled her out.  They chased her.  She instinctually ran for the border not thinking that she had just crossed the border without getting stamped out of Thailand and without her passport.  When she tried to cross back to Thailand, she was refused.  The other country refused her entry as she had no passport.  

 

I hear that 3 years later, she is still living in the middle of the bridge.

 

It can happen and it did.  Deal with it.

Are you sure that she isn't living under the bridge?

[Jingthing]

6 hours ago, Leaver said:

The other option is, you arrange your affairs to live lite in Thailand, so you can go at a moments notice, and you chose an alternative place to go to, which most people call their Plan B.

 

This is what I have done.

 

I will view Vietnam as my primary place of residence in the future, and Thailand will be my extended holiday visits, through tourist visas.

 

At any point Thailand deny entry, or refuse a visa, no big deal, head back to Vietnam until I can come back to Thailand.    

I will comment on the Cambodia and Vietnam idea as a tactic people can use if they feel their immigration status will soon be in jeopardy. That is do proactively before any potential issues with deportation, etc. That would be even still owning the large assets here, set up residence in Cambodia based on a one year visa or Vietnam (which may just be based on three months, then visa runs, depending) as a base and then being close enough to Thailand actively work on liquidating and exporting your Thailand assets. A problem I see with that is if that take you a long time, then you would have the problem with Thailand blocking you for that. Also this issue, and this is down in the weeds, but it's a sincere practical question.

 

Suppose you did that and were working on liquidating your Thailand assets via trips to Thailand from Cambodia or Vietnam (or Malaysia, etc. for that matter). If you own a condo, wouldn't it be a RED FLAG to put your own condo address on the landing form? In the sense that it would look like you're living in Thailand on 30 day stamps or tourist visas? So what to do? Put down a hotel and then move to your condo, but then you would need to report your new residence address to immigration yourself, right? Because immigration would see the hotel report and then nothing if you don't. 

[JAFO]

While the obvious is do not get blacklisted

 

That said,

 

• House and land are in my wife's name, no issue, problem addressed.
• Car, truck and motos in my name outright and I would contact an attorney in Thailand to get a POA for them to be sold. All proceeds would be brought to me.
• I keep all my financial assets in the US. Any money here I would send my ATM card and have the money removed and meet my wife in a neighboring country. If the amount was over the limit, then it would be 2 trips and we would call it a vacation.

Pretty simple in my case

[JaiLai]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I will comment on the Cambodia and Vietnam idea as a tactic people can use if they feel their immigration status will soon be in jeopardy. That is do proactively before any potential issues with deportation, etc. That would be even still owning the large assets here, set up residence in Cambodia based on a one year visa or Vietnam (which may just be based on three months, then visa runs, depending) as a base and then being close enough to Thailand actively work on liquidating and exporting your Thailand assets. A problem I see with that is if that take you a long time, then you would have the problem with Thailand blocking you for that. Also this issue, and this is down in the weeds, but it's a sincere practical question.

 

Suppose you did that and were working on liquidating your Thailand assets via trips to Thailand from Cambodia or Vietnam (or Malaysia, etc. for that matter). If you own a condo, wouldn't it be a RED FLAG to put your own condo address on the landing form? In the sense that it would look like you're living in Thailand on 30 day stamps or tourist visas? So what to do? Put down a hotel and then move to your condo, but then you would need to report your new residence address to immigration yourself, right? Because immigration would see the hotel report and then nothing if you don't. 

Yeah, it's a nightmare.......

 

You'll end up ill with all the worry, it's really not necessary.

 

"What happens if" - may never happen!

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, JaiLai said:

Yeah, it's a nightmare.......

 

You'll end up ill with all the worry, it's really not necessary.

 

"What happens if" - may never happen!

Baiting post ignored.

[Jingthing]

9 hours ago, BritManToo said:

What about being blacklisted with my Thai 7 year old son?

I do wonder what would happen to him if I didn't come back.

 

I don't care about the house/car/m/c.

Sure, of course, but I wouldn't be so crass as to label a child an asset. 

[Luckysilk]

What happens to my Tesco points if I'm blacklisted ? Can I transfer them to another Tesco in another country ?

 

[Jingthing]

4 hours ago, ancharee said:

Can't wait till tomorrows episode  '' Bad case scenario number 3 or is it 4 '' 

Baiting post ignored.

[JaiLai]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Baiting post ignored.

It's not ignored, you've replied???