27 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

On news now the EU can say no to another extension and UK goes, makes me wonder what is EU up to they have already said there's no more negotiation on the deal.

Well they’re not begging the UK are they?!

 

26 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

On news now the EU can say no to another extension and UK goes, makes me wonder what is EU up to they have already said there's no more negotiation on the deal.

They wish to cut that Gordian Knot , time is up , patience too , politeness vanishing is next to come if no solution ….

Theresa May could bring the U.K. a Gold medal if kicking the can would become a Olympic discipline … 

unsurpassed !! ????

24 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

On news now the EU can say no to another extension and UK goes, makes me wonder what is EU up to they have already said there's no more negotiation on the deal.

Leaving with no deal is not only extremely damaging for the UK, it is for the EU as well.  Therefore they are bending over backwards to give Britain a way (and time) to find some sort of workable deal.

 

This latest move by May certainly seems to be her most bizarre so far.  I can't see where she is going with this and if she thinks it will bring some sort of consensus then I am very doubtful. 

33 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Is it getting difficult for you to keep up. Some reading for you to keep you up to speeds with facts.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/12176234/Nine-deceptions-in-our-history-with-the-EU.html

 

http://www.theeuroprobe.org/edward-heath-and-a-letter-from-the-foriegn-commonwealth-office-1972/

 

http://www.vernoncoleman.com/euillegally.html

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/article-228953/HOW-FOR-40-YEARS-THE-BRITISH-PUBLIC-HAS-BEEN-LIED-TO--.html

I nice selection of impartial media outlets!! it's no wonder brexiteers live in a dream world when they take the aforementioned as fact!! I assume you watch Fox News too?? 

6 hours ago, Loiner said:

Ann Widdecombe:

“We’ve got the worst Prime Minister since Anthony Eden," She said on the BBC's Newsnight.

“We’ve got the worst leader of the opposition in the entire history of the Labour party.

“And we’ve got the worst Parliament since Oliver Cromwell.”

but apart from that things are OK right?

5 hours ago, micmichd said:

Tell me one reason why UK should want to ride a dead horse?

You had more than two years to learn about the benefits of being part of the EU. If you still have to ask you are a hopeless case.

And yes, I know the EU is not perfect but still a lot better than any alternative.

32 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

On news now the EU can say no to another extension and UK goes, makes me wonder what is EU up to they have already said there's no more negotiation on the deal.

She will get her extension, Germany doesn't want a no deal exit.

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

You had more than two years to learn about the benefits of being part of the EU. 

 

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And yes, I know the EU is not perfect but still a lot better than any alternative.

 

 

Not in my opinion........... nor in the opinion of 17m+ others.

 

 

Those 2 years have only hardened the sentiment against the EU.

 

4 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

She will get her extension, Germany doesn't want a no deal exit.

So talking with Labour will get the deal through a 4th 6th 9th time I've lost count and if it does there's no real change on 1st deal which was rejected, makes no sense.

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

You had more than two years to learn about the benefits of being part of the EU. 

 

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And yes, I know the EU is not perfect but still a lot better than any alternative.

 

 

Not in my opinion........... nor in the opinion of 17m+ others.

 

 

Those 2 years have only hardened the sentiment against the EU.

 

5 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

Not in my opinion........... nor in the opinion of 17m+ others.

Those 2 years have only hardened the sentiment against the EU.

So then it should be no problem to let the voters confirm that they still want to leave with the available deal, correct?

As far as I see many of the 17m believed many of the lies i.e. about the extra money for the NHS, the idea that the UK will get a very special deal, etc.

In short: People vote for the cake and they want to eat it including lots of cherry picking. And they expected all the unicorns will come out after the UK leaves the EU. What is left of that dream? Anything?

And lets not forget that the leavers violated campaign laws, were financed from outside the country, etc.

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

So talking with Labour will get the deal through a 4th 6th 9th time I've lost count and if it does there's no real change on 1st deal which was rejected, makes no sense.

Not really.  I have a theory, probably pie in the sky but I am trying to see where May is going with this latest move.  It could be that she knows that Corbyn will not change his position and she won't change hers and their talks will break down. Then, you are left with another round of indicative votes.  She has been very anti them so far but this would give her a chance to pass the buck.

 

Could be completely off the mark but....  She spent 7 hours with her cabinet yesterday before coming out with last nights statement.  Apparently some members of her cabinet are spitting blood over her decision but none of them have resigned over it.  So much for principles then!

18 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

So then it should be no problem to let the voters confirm that they still want to leave with the available deal, correct?

As far as I see many of the 17m believed many of the lies i.e. about the extra money for the NHS, the idea that the UK will get a very special deal, etc.

In short: People vote for the cake and they want to eat it including lots of cherry picking. And they expected all the unicorns will come out after the UK leaves the EU. What is left of that dream? Anything?

And lets not forget that the leavers violated campaign laws, were financed from outside the country, etc.

 

 

Your focus on one bus advert is quite pathetic.

 

I no longer fear a second referendum- it won’t happen, but I do not fear it. I know more Leave voters who will now vote Leave, than I do Leave voters who would change.

7 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Your focus on one bus advert is quite pathetic.

 

I no longer fear a second referendum- it won’t happen, but I do fear it. I know more Leave voters who will now vote Leave, than I do Leave voters who would change.

It’s the former Leave voters that will simply stay at home that will make the difference.

 

The recent pitiful turnout in demonstrations supporting Brexit is a better measure of public sentiment than what people might tell someone who they know to be an ardent Brexiteer.

16 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

I have a theory, probably pie in the sky but I am trying to see where May is going with this latest move. 

I can't see it going anywhere unless she gets Labour MP's to vote for the deal but would it go through then.?

 

As you said leaving with no deal is not only extremely damaging for the UK, it is for the EU as well so if the EU gets a hit too, so be it.

 

7 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Your focus on one bus advert is quite pathetic.

 

I no longer fear a second referendum- it won’t happen, but I do fear it. I know more Leave voters who will now vote Leave, than I do Leave voters who would change.

On a slightly lighter note.  I don't want a second referendum because it would just deepen the wound that Brexit has inflicted on the country.  But I think that remain would win for a couple of reasons.  One is that there are now considerably more young people eligible to vote and a number of old people have popped their clogs since the referendum. ????

 

 

 

 

Do you forget Cameron posting pro eu bog paper to every UK household.
He should be charged with GROSS MISUSE OF PUBLIC MONEY.

So then it should be no problem to let the voters confirm that they still want to leave with the available deal, correct?
As far as I see many of the 17m believed many of the lies i.e. about the extra money for the NHS, the idea that the UK will get a very special deal, etc.
In short: People vote for the cake and they want to eat it including lots of cherry picking. And they expected all the unicorns will come out after the UK leaves the EU. What is left of that dream? Anything?
And lets not forget that the leavers violated campaign laws, were financed from outside the country, etc.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

In your dreams

It’s the former Leave voters that will simply stay at home that will make the difference.
 
The recent pitiful turnout in demonstrations supporting Brexit is a better measure of public sentiment than what people might tell someone who they know to be an ardent Brexiteer.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

21 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s the former Leave voters that will simply stay at home that will make the difference.

 

The recent pitiful turnout in demonstrations supporting Brexit is a better measure of public sentiment than what people might tell someone who they know to be an ardent Brexiteer.

Yes that was said before the referendum. It is easy to get a jolly boys outing with a bunch of lefty, liberal, tree huggers for a picnic. People should have to prove they are UK citizens. A bit like online petitions. The pen is mightier than the sword, as shown in the last referendum result. I am sure your friends here will continue to put pictures of skinheads in Union Jacks and talk about spoonies.

11 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Yes that was said before the referendum. It is easy to get a jolly boys outing with a bunch of lefty, liberal, tree huggers for a picnic. People should have to prove they are UK citizens. A bit like online petitions. The pen is mightier than the sword, as shown in the last referendum result. I am sure your friends here will continue to put pictures of skinheads in Union Jacks and talk about spoonies.

Odd you don’t address the declining numbers supporting Brexit marches.

 

 

16 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Yes that was said before the referendum. It is easy to get a jolly boys outing with a bunch of lefty, liberal, tree huggers for a picnic. People should have to prove they are UK citizens. A bit like online petitions. The pen is mightier than the sword, as shown in the last referendum result. I am sure your friends here will continue to put pictures of skinheads in Union Jacks and talk about spoonies.

It still amazes me that people think that leavers and remainers should be slotted into political boxes.  Where I live it is Tory heartland yet 80% voted to remain.  Thousands of them went on the march which attracted a million people.  I am sure some of the twenty percent who voted leave went on the other march as well.  Political leanings have nothing to do with which way people voted.

7 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

It still amazes me that people think that leavers and remainers should be slotted into political boxes.  Where I live it is Tory heartland yet 80% voted to remain.  Thousands of them went on the march which attracted a million people.  I am sure some of the twenty percent who voted leave went on the other march as well.  Political leanings have nothing to do with which way people voted.

Finally an intelligent response in the last 20 minutes. .????

 

Well It doesn't mean I agree. So can you give some facts on that or is it an opinion. Not saying opinions don't count. I would have thought that those who put their mark on the paper with an x have a lot to do with political leanings.

 

How do you know they were UK citizens? As a the press and others use this as an indicator of public opinion which is not accurate.

3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Odd you don’t address the declining numbers supporting Brexit marches.

 

 

What would the leavers be marching for, the 17.4 million referendum thought they had won the right to leave the EU. Now they see that voting is a sham, the only time our governments listen to the people is when the government gets an answer it wants to hear. Democracy has been put on trial and has lost, it will take decades for it to recover, if ever. 

People whether Tory or Labour will never vote again, and why should they when their vote has about as much validity as one piece of paper on a bog roll. I cannot predict the future but I hope the days of both parties are numbered, I still believe that there are many good MPs on both sides of the house, but they are being brought down by the dross that remains

1 minute ago, vogie said:

What would the leavers be marching for, the 17.4 million referendum thought they had won the right to leave the EU. Now they see that voting is a sham, the only time our governments listen to the people is when the government gets an answer it wants to hear. Democracy has been put on trial and has lost, it will take decades for it to recover, if ever. 

People whether Tory or Labour will never vote again, and why should they when their vote has about as much validity as one piece of paper on a bog roll. I cannot predict the future but I hope the days of both parties are numbered, I still believe that there are many good MPs on both sides of the house, but they are being brought down by the dross that remains

Well they might want to get off their backsides and march for what they voted for, because right now they are getting zilch.

 

With respect to all your other points regarding democracy.

 

One could easily conclude that regardless of whether or not Brexit ever happens, the whole mess has been a very successful effort to undermine faith in the democratic process.

 

cui bono?

May now faced with the prospect of the Tory party falling appart.

 

Only fitting really, given the Brexit referendum was an attempt to stop just that happening.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/apr/03/theresa-may-warned-brexit-pact-with-corbyn-could-tear-tories-apart

21 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Odd you don’t address the declining numbers supporting Brexit marches.

 

 

So you are now equating marches that can have a multitude of people joining them, as a sign of support for a political belief. I will say it again. online petitions, marches in London (doesn't represent a true account of the country) mean nothing.

 

I am sure you are going to tell me that they are all in 'spoonies' or signing on.

 

Have you ever considered that its only those who can't accept a democratic referendum result that march and stamp their feet like children. Those who voted leave don't.

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Well they might want to get off their backsides and march for what they voted for, because right now they are getting zilch.

 

With respect to all your other points regarding democracy.

 

One could easily conclude that regardless of whether or not Brexit ever happens, the whole mess has been a very successful effort to undermine faith in the democratic process.

 

cui bono?

So by your logic, if someone wins the National Lottery they have to march up and down outside Camelot offices with placards stating 'I want to win the lottery', you'll probably get the CEO putting his head out of the window shouting, 'you've already won it ya daft ha'peth, go home'

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

So by your logic, if someone wins the National Lottery they have to march up and down outside Camelot offices with placards stating 'I want to win the lottery', you'll probably get the CEO putting his head out of the window shouting, 'you've already won it ya daft ha'peth, go home'

Brexit as gambling on lottery.... it gets better by the day. 

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Brexit as gambling on lottery.... it gets better by the day. 

Voting has become a lottery.