EU to agree Brexit delay but France pushes for conditions

[webfact]

EU to agree Brexit delay but France pushes for conditions

By Richard Lough, Thomas Escritt and Gabriela Baczynska

 

FILE PHOTO - British Prime Minister Theresa May is seen outside Downing Street in London, Britain, April 3, 2019. REUTERS/Peter Nicholls

 

PARIS/BERLIN/BRUSSELS (Reuters) - European Union leaders will grant Prime Minister Theresa May a second delay to Brexit but they could demand she accepts a much longer extension as France pushed for conditions to limit Britain's ability to undermine the bloc.

 

A "flextension" until the end of the year or until March 2020, under which Britain could leave much sooner if its warring political tribes can find a majority, was shaping up to be the most likely, EU diplomats said, after envoys met in Brussels late on Tuesday to prepare for Wednesday evening's summit with May.

 

In a sign of just how far the three-year Brexit crisis has sapped British power, May dashed to Berlin and Paris to ask Angela Merkel and Emmanuel Macron to allow the world's fifth-largest economy to put off its divorce from April 12.

 

While it was not immediately clear what Merkel and Macron, Europe's two most powerful leaders, agreed with May, an advance draft of conclusions for Wednesday's emergency EU summit said Britain would be granted another delay on certain conditions.

 

"The United Kingdom shall facilitate the achievement of the Union's tasks and refrain from any measure which could jeopardise the attainment of the Union's objectives," read the draft seen by Reuters. As a full member state of the EU, Britain could in theory exercise a veto on any major policy decision.

May has asked the EU for a Brexit delay to June 30 but the draft left the end-date blank pending a decision by the other 27 national leaders on Wednesday evening in Brussels.

 

More than a week after Britain was originally supposed to leave the EU, May, the weakest British prime minister in a generation, has said she fears Brexit might never happen as she battles to get a divorce deal ratified by a divided parliament.

 

After her pledge to resign failed to get her deal over the line, she launched crisis talks with the opposition Labour Party in the hope of breaking the domestic deadlock.

 

"People are tired and fed up (with Britain's indecision) - but what to do?" one EU diplomat said. "We won't be the ones pushing the UK off the cliff edge."

 

HOW LONG?

Another EU official involved with Brexit said no European power wanted the chaos that they fear a "no-deal" exit would sow through financial markets and the EU 27's $16 trillion economy.

 

"Nobody wants to pull the plug by 13th April," said the official. "But for how long - I don't know. And France will ask a lot of questions in Brussels."

But as May arrived at the Elysee Palace in Paris to a guard of honour, she was unable to trumpet any breakthrough with Labour.

 

Shortly before she landed in Paris, an official in Macron's office said that "in the scenario of an extended delay, one year would seem too long for us".

 

He added that if Britain did delay its exit, it should not take part in EU budget talks or in choosing the next president of the EU's executive commission - and that the other 27 member states should be able to review its "sincere cooperation".

 

Irish Prime Minister Leo Varadkar said Macron would not veto May's extension but wanted conditions attached.

 

"He (Macron) certainly wants to know about conditionality, particularly the issue of the United Kingdom being involved in future (EU) decision-making," Varadkar said.

 

"STOP BREXIT"

Earlier in the day, May met Merkel at her riverside Chancellery, a short walk from Berlin's Brandenburg Gate, and departed with a warm exchange of kisses.

 

While they discussed Brexit, Germany's opposition liberal FDP party drove an advertising van past the Chancellery with a slogan reading: "Dear Theresa May. Just do it. Stop Brexit. Make the most of Europe’s opportunities."

 

Several EU diplomats said the 12-month extension proposed by European Council President Donald Tusk, who will chair the Wednesday summit, was unlikely to fly and several capitals had agreed with France that this would be too long, fearing a protracted distraction from other pressing EU business.

 

In London, British Solicitor General Robert Buckland said May would "listen carefully" to any constructive suggestions made by the EU on the length of the extension. He conceded that the government might not have managed to ratify an exit deal in parliament before European elections are held on May 23-26.

 

According to the draft conclusions, if Britain did not take part in EU parliamentary elections properly, it would have to leave on June 1, 2019.

The pound, which has seesawed so much on Brexit news that some investors have stepped away from the sterling market, rose and then dipped on speculation Merkel could offer May a better deal. Germany denied that. [GBP/]

 

DIVIDED KINGDOM

The 2016 referendum revealed a United Kingdom split over much more than EU membership, and has sparked impassioned debate about everything from secession and immigration to capitalism, empire and what it means to be British.

 

Yet nothing is yet resolved.

 

Unable to convince enough of her own Conservatives of the merits of her deal to get it passed, May is courting socialist Jeremy Corbyn, whose Labour Party wants to keep Britain more closely tied to the bloc after Brexit.

 

Labour's demands include keeping Britain in a customs union with the EU, something that is hard to reconcile with May's desire for Britain to have an independent trade policy, and potentially a second referendum on any deal.

 

After Tuesday's round of talks, Labour said it had not yet seen a clear shift in May's stance.

 

"We had further detailed and wide-ranging talks with cabinet ministers and officials today," a Labour representative said. "We have yet to see the clear shift in the government’s position that is needed to secure a compromise agreement."

 

A customs union with the EU, seen as the most likely area for compromise but so far resisted by May's government, was the first item on the agenda for the talks, which were to include finance minister Philip Hammond. Talks resume on Thursday.

 

The idea of a softer Brexit is anathema to eurosceptics in May's Conservative party who have helped to defeat her divorce deal three times this year.

 

Meanwhile, British lawmakers on Tuesday approved by a 420-110 margin May's plan to seek to delay Brexit to June 30 while she tries to strike a compromise with Labour.

 

The government was forced to hold the vote after parliament passed a law on Monday giving themselves power to scrutinise and make changes to May's request to extend the Article 50 negotiating period a second time.

 

(Additional reporting by Kylie MacLellan, William James, Elizabeth Piper and Costas Pitas in London, Gabriela Baczynska in Luxembourg, Alastair Macdonald in Brussels, and Padraic Halpin in Dublin; Writing by Guy Faulconbridge and Kevin Liffey; Editing by Mark Heinrich and Lisa Shumaker)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-04-10

[Laughing Gravy]

Just now, webfact said:

"Nobody wants to pull the plug by 13th April," said the official. "But for how long - I don't know. And France will ask a lot of questions in Brussels." 

No surprises there then.

 

2 minutes ago, webfact said:

Several EU diplomats said the 12-month extension proposed by European Council President Donald Tusk, who will chair the Wednesday summit, was unlikely to fly and several capitals had agreed with France that this would be too long, fearing a protracted distraction from other pressing EU business.

 

Of course they are worried with very good reason to be.

 

Obviously as a Brexiteer it is clear that the remaining government and MP's do not want to respect the referendum result and manifestos. Maybe a tactical retreat and infiltrate the EU parliament with Brexit MEPs and start afresh with MPs in the UK and get rid of the self serving shower we have.

 

I believe we might have lost this battle for now but not the war, as they say.

 

 

 

[Thailand]

I guess the impossible 2nd referendum will be held later this year.

By which time both the current main party leaders will have been replaced.

Then I woke up!

[JAG]

45 minutes ago, vinniekintana said:

Tryin to read between the lines here...

Flextension til the end of the year.....UK takes part in Euro-elections in May

No veto or other spanner-in-the-works until the end of the extension..

 

What will amount to an indefinite extension, without any effective presence or powers at the decision making table. The UK will be reduced more or less to "Brussels' bitch".

 

Talking of which May, why don't you just go, heavens, even the risk of ending up with Sinn Fein's bagman Corbyn would probably be preferable to your mealy mouthed, deceitful, devious, pathetic incompetence. You have utterly, spectacularly <deleted> it up beyond anyone's wildest dreams. Just go for heavens sake.!

Edited April 10, 2019 by JAG

[SheungWan]

1 hour ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I believe we might have lost this battle for now but not the war, as they say.

Battle Bus malfunction.

[SheungWan]

1 minute ago, JAG said:

What will amount to an indefinite extension, without any effective presence or powers at the decision making table. The UK will be reduced more or less to "Brussels' bitch".

Talking of which May, why just you don't go, heavens, even the risk of ending up with Sinn Fein's bagman Corbyn would probably be preferable to your mealy mouthed, deceitful, devious, pathetic incompetence. You have utterly, spectacularly <deleted> it up beyond anyone's wildest dreams. Just go for heavens sake.!

Moody Blues Go Now.

[soalbundy]

I see this as the writing on the wall, brexit is dead. A year later the Uk gets some conciliatory 'special changes' regarding continued membership, immigration reduction etc. both sides have egg on their faces but peace reigns again. 

[Loiner]

More conditions from Macron and more trickery from the EU. They don’t want our eurosceptic MEPs affecting their elections, but do want our contribution and shackles of the CU.
If May wasn’t so treasonous she would force them into not granting another extension, so Leaving No Deal. She’s allowed herself to be snookered. Won’t give up on her Remainer wish, but politically can’t be obvious in selling us down the Danube. A long extension jeopardises the Tory party and a GE, with more chance of another referendum producing another Leave vote.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[JonnyF]

Absolutely shameful.

 

One good thing from this whole debacle is that the British Electorate has learnt exactly what the political class thinks of them. There will be a huge price for this, there is no way the British electorate will just "let it go". This paves the way for years of divisiveness. Every Leaver I know believes in Leave more vehemently than ever having seen the way the EU and our own politicians have conspired to thwart the democratic result.

 

I'd favour a GE now, give the electorate the chance to show what they think of the Charlatans in the House of Commons that have shown themselves to be devious, duplicitous and utterly incompetent. 

[malagateddy]

Hopefully events will supersede her wishes..either a blind-side move to remove her by large group of tory mp's..or the white coated team will whisk her away to be mentally assessed yhen sectioned under mental health legislation, cos it's plain to see that's she's LOST THE PLOT BIG TIME!!!
I'm honestly very surprised her husband has not said to her to stand down as the PM..I mean that as it would be an act of kindness on his part to the girl he loves.

What will amount to an indefinite extension, without any effective presence or powers at the decision making table. The UK will be reduced more or less to "Brussels' bitch".
 
Talking of which May, why don't you just go, heavens, even the risk of ending up with Sinn Fein's bagman Corbyn would probably be preferable to your mealy mouthed, deceitful, devious, pathetic incompetence. You have utterly, spectacularly it up beyond anyone's wildest dreams. Just go for heavens sake.!

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[vogie]

"Well apparently rock bottom has a basement"

[Chomper Higgot]

27 minutes ago, vogie said:

"Well apparently rock bottom has a basement"

This is Brexit.

 

Keep on digging!

[vogie]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

This is Brexit.

 

Keep on digging!

The leavers provided the shovels, unfortunately the remainers were useless at using them.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

The leavers provided the shovels, unfortunately the remainers were useless at using them.

Yep, those Old Etonians who lead Brexit didn’t want to get their hands dirty.

 

But no worries, it’s Brexit, it’s always somebody else’s fault.

[geoffbezoz]

Completely shambolic situation. Would think that the EU would be only too glad to get rid of those far right morons like Rees-Mogg who now publicaly suggest that British MEPs should be obstructive  at the EU parliament.

 

Guess it won't happen but the EU should act very clearly and agree today and instruct the UK that they either leave on Friday or they revoke article 50. No other options and that is something the EU could legally instruct the UK to do. Then we will see a decisive vote in the UK parliament Thursday to revoke Article 50, followed by a General Election that will rid the country of many of current loathsome MPs and eventually see a new referendum where the public would be far better informed of the consequences of stay or leave in order to make their decision.

 

In the meantime hopefully the EU will pass legislation so that no country can leave the EU in future without 2/3 rds majority of the EU members to ensure the Euro and other country's currencies are not hammered again, as has happened now, through the actions of far right despots in any country.

[evadgib]

3 hours ago, vinniekintana said:

Tryin to read between the lines here...

Flextension til the end of the year.....UK takes part in Euro-elections in May

No veto or other spanner-in-the-works until the end of the extension..

 

For as long as we're in we have a veto. I cannot see UK accepting a gagging order ... but nothing would surprize me of late ????

Edited April 10, 2019 by evadgib

[nauseus]

14 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Completely shambolic situation. Would think that the EU would be only too glad to get rid of those far right morons like Rees-Mogg who now publicaly suggest that British MEPs should be obstructive  at the EU parliament.

 

Guess it won't happen but the EU should act very clearly and agree today and instruct the UK that they either leave on Friday or they revoke article 50. No other options and that is something the EU could legally instruct the UK to do. Then we will see a decisive vote in the UK parliament Thursday to revoke Article 50, followed by a General Election that will rid the country of many of current loathsome MPs and eventually see a new referendum where the public would be far better informed of the consequences of stay or leave in order to make their decision.

 

In the meantime hopefully the EU will pass legislation so that no country can leave the EU in future without 2/3 rds majority of the EU members to ensure the Euro and other country's currencies are not hammered again, as has happened now, through the actions of far right despots in any country.

Sounds all very democratic. Oh, wait  a minute.

[Laughing Gravy]

9 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

In the meantime hopefully the EU will pass legislation so that no country can leave the EU in future without 2/3 rds majority of the EU members to ensure the Euro and other country's currencies are not hammered again, as has happened now, through the actions of far right despots in any country. 

I guess that's your version of democracy is it. you will do well in the EU council. So what about elections in the EU states, should they all have a 2/3rds majority. Seems whats good for the goose is good for the gander right.

 

11 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Guess it won't happen but the EU should act very clearly and agree today and instruct the UK that they either leave on Friday or they revoke article 50. No other options and that is something the EU could legally instruct the UK to do. Then we will see a decisive vote in the UK parliament Thursday to revoke Article 50, followed by a General Election that will rid the country of many of current loathsome MPs and eventually see a new referendum where the public would be far better informed of the consequences of stay or leave in order to make their decision.

So what happens if  we leave with no deal. OK then? I keep hearing this mantra of being better informed about leaving the EU. The only thing that we have been informed about the whole referendum result, is that the MP's do not want to act upon it and the EU have done their very best (successfully so far) to stop us leaving.

 

What happens if leave win again and if the referendum was to happen and it was fair, why wouldn't they. if they do win what will you do.  Go for a third or even fifth.

[evadgib]

15 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Completely shambolic situation. Would think that the EU would be only too glad to get rid of those far right morons like Rees-Mogg who now publicaly suggest that British MEPs should be obstructive  at the EU parliament.

 

Guess it won't happen but the EU should act very clearly and agree today and instruct the UK that they either leave on Friday or they revoke article 50. No other options and that is something the EU could legally instruct the UK to do. Then we will see a decisive vote in the UK parliament Thursday to revoke Article 50, followed by a General Election that will rid the country of many of current loathsome MPs and eventually see a new referendum where the public would be far better informed of the consequences of stay or leave in order to make their decision.

 

In the meantime hopefully the EU will pass legislation so that no country can leave the EU in future without 2/3 rds majority of the EU members to ensure the Euro and other country's currencies are not hammered again, as has happened now, through the actions of far right despots in any country.

Mogg & Co are nothing more than 'slightly miffed and very British'.

[malagateddy]

So you would be happy if a small group of unelected corrupt group of fanatical jobsworths who fully intend to achieve jean monnets wishes ie..a united states of europe ran by beaurocrats DICTATE TO THE BRITISH PEOPLE.
Me..I would send in a special forces team or a " black ops " team to '' retire " them if they ever tried to do such a thing.
Let foreigners dictate to you..NO CHANCE!!!!!!

Completely shambolic situation. Would think that the EU would be only too glad to get rid of those far right morons like Rees-Mogg who now publicaly suggest that British MEPs should be obstructive  at the EU parliament.
 
Guess it won't happen but the EU should act very clearly and agree today and instruct the UK that they either leave on Friday or they revoke article 50. No other options and that is something the EU could legally instruct the UK to do. Then we will see a decisive vote in the UK parliament Thursday to revoke Article 50, followed by a General Election that will rid the country of many of current loathsome MPs and eventually see a new referendum where the public would be far better informed of the consequences of stay or leave in order to make their decision.
 
In the meantime hopefully the EU will pass legislation so that no country can leave the EU in future without 2/3 rds majority of the EU members to ensure the Euro and other country's currencies are not hammered again, as has happened now, through the actions of far right despots in any country.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[geoffbezoz]

3 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I guess that's your version of democracy is it. you will do well in the EU council. So what about elections in the EU states, should they all have a 2/3rds majority. Seems whats good for the goose is good for the gander right.

 

So what happens if  we leave with no deal. OK then? I keep hearing this mantra of being better informed about leaving the EU. The only thing that we have been informed about the whole referendum result, is that the MP's do not want to act upon it and the EU have done their very best (successfully so far) to stop us leaving.

 

What happens if leave win again and if the referendum was to happen and it was fair, why wouldn't they. if they do win what will you do.  Go for a third or even fifth.

Well I thought it was put to bed permanently in 1975 when I voted to remain in the EEC along with 68% of the population but time moves on, promises are not kept, and politicians for their own gain manipulate the system. Consequently Cameron thought he would gain massive public support for himself and the conservative party by going for another referendum.  It all back fired . he went, TM fumbles around because no one wanted the job, and at the end of the day the UK is the laughing stock of the developed world.  Any referendum in my view must be legally binding to be implemented and to ensure fairness it must not be governed on a parliamentary or constituency basis. No more NI voted to stay or Scotland voted to stay.  Electronic polling, location of residency is irrelevant.  For clarity and assurance that rogue politicians do not proliferate again then perhaps any legally binding referendum must have a clear majority of say 15%.    Just saying

[geoffbezoz]

8 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

So you would be happy if a small group of unelected corrupt group of fanatical jobsworths who fully intend to achieve jean monnets wishes ie..a united states of europe ran by beaurocrats DICTATE TO THE BRITISH PEOPLE.
Me..I would send in a special forces team or a " black ops " team to '' retire " them if they ever tried to do such a thing.
Let foreigners dictate to you..NO CHANCE!!!!!!
 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

That is an interesting concept you have that you considered the EU to be fanatical and unelected yet you are proposing, by inference, given the opportunity, you would condone special forces to assasinate them.  A novel approach to your understanding of democracy I must admit.  Love to see how your proposal ganders support on TV, If sufficient perhaps you would consider standing as an MEP

[welovesundaysatspace]

 

24 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Would think that the EU would be only too glad to get rid of those far right morons like Rees-Mogg who now publicaly suggest that British MEPs should be obstructive  at the EU parliament.

I agree there is a risk, and I generally would like to see the UK agreeing to giving up their voting rights until the situation has been solved. That would only be fair given the fact that you’re leaving.

 

However, it is great to see Europe taking the moral high ground, and exposing the true colors of Jacob and his bully boys. By showing our British friends our patience, politeness and partnership, standing by their side even while they’re going through this difficult time, giving them time to figure things out themselves rather than forcing them into anything, we are exercising true European values and statesmanship. The whole world and our friends in the UK can see now who the real bullies are, and this will go a long way. I’ve said it before, the majority of the people is decent men of the middle. Lies, insults and threats of arson does not go down well with them. It only works with the Tommy Robinson type of losers of society. Everyone else is disgusted by such behavior; it will further alienate them.

 

Whatever the technical end state will be, a customs union, a hard Brexit, no Brexit at all — this is already the death of Brexit as an idea. Having been built on lies and insults in the first place, by turning to threats of arson it has lost it last bit of credibility and respect. 

[malagateddy]

Junker..tusk..the putty faced belguim guy etc etc..all these commissioners..NONE ELECTED BY THE CITIZENS OF EUROPE VOTING FOR THEM.
That's what I mean.
Google..BREXIT THE MOVIE "..it's a insight into hiw things work in brussels.
No mep can propose a bill to be discussed/debated/voted on!!
NOT ALLOWED YOU SEE!!

That is an interesting concept you have that you considered the EU to be fanatical and unelected yet you are proposing, by inference, given the opportunity, you would condone special forces to assasinate them.  A novel approach to your understanding of democracy I must admit.  Love to see how your proposal ganders support on TV, If sufficient perhaps you would consider standing as an MEP

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ballpoint]

So, Brexit turns to Flexit.  Britain is like the last elderly guest at a dinner party, repeatedly saying "well, I really must be going", but, instead, staying for one last drink, knowing she's heading back to a cold, empty house where she'll sit and look at her old photo album, trying to relive the good times she had in her youth, with a glass of gin in her hand and a tear in her eye.

[geoffbezoz]

4 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

So, Brexit turns to Flexit.  Britain is like the last elderly guest at a dinner party, repeatedly saying "well, I really must be going", but, instead, staying for one last drink, knowing she's heading back to a cold, empty house where she'll sit and look at her old photo album, trying to relive the good times she had in her youth, with a glass of gin in her hand and a tear in her eye.

What a perfect analogy.

[baboon]

3 hours ago, JAG said:

What will amount to an indefinite extension, without any effective presence or powers at the decision making table. The UK will be reduced more or less to "Brussels' bitch".

 

Talking of which May, why don't you just go, heavens, even the risk of ending up with Sinn Fein's bagman Corbyn would probably be preferable to your mealy mouthed, deceitful, devious, pathetic incompetence. You have utterly, spectacularly <deleted> it up beyond anyone's wildest dreams. Just go for heavens sake.!

All well and good, but which Tory MP would want to inherit the whole shitshow when they can simply carp from the safety of the sidelines and throw May under the bus later on? I mean, sod the country, political careers are at stake, here!

[sammieuk1]

Who now cares a flying where this shambles ends up the rich will survive intact but just more stupid looking whilst the poor form an orderly queue at the food bank????

[Thingamabob]

Let's be clear. There is no way to leave the EU. Just ask the French, the Danes, the Irish, and now the British. 

[malagateddy]

Can I take it that perhaps you are a citizen of one of the subsidy junkie eu member states..and rather pi££ed off at the thought of one of your paymasters bailing out into the wider world.
Also..please understand that I have some spanish..italian ..and german friends.
I am against the corrupt fascist like eu..NOT THE PEOPLE IF EUROPE.

Ps..tomorrow I'll be spending coupla hours with my german mate who dislikes merkel..hopes the afD runs amok in next month's mep elections..wants no more islamic immigrants stepping on german soil..as he obviously keeps in touch with family and friends over in germany.

Completely shambolic situation. Would think that the EU would be only too glad to get rid of those far right morons like Rees-Mogg who now publicaly suggest that British MEPs should be obstructive  at the EU parliament.
 
Guess it won't happen but the EU should act very clearly and agree today and instruct the UK that they either leave on Friday or they revoke article 50. No other options and that is something the EU could legally instruct the UK to do. Then we will see a decisive vote in the UK parliament Thursday to revoke Article 50, followed by a General Election that will rid the country of many of current loathsome MPs and eventually see a new referendum where the public would be far better informed of the consequences of stay or leave in order to make their decision.
 
In the meantime hopefully the EU will pass legislation so that no country can leave the EU in future without 2/3 rds majority of the EU members to ensure the Euro and other country's currencies are not hammered again, as has happened now, through the actions of far right despots in any country.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app