Do you believe in God and why

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, teatime101 said:

I'm talking about religion in my last few posts. I thought that was pretty obvious. Private, ie subjective, experiences, 'spiritual' or otherwise, are just that. "I feel x and I believe y".

The OP isn't about religion. Unfortunately most unbelievers only know about religion and little about God.

[teatime101]

6 hours ago, Sunmaster said:

You confuse causation with consequence.

It's a proposition. I'm not confused about the connection, because I don't see it. The claim was that our capacity to get high must have been 'designed' by a creator.  Do you agree with the claim?

[VincentRJ]

On 6/16/2020 at 1:27 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL.

Have you read so few posts that you don't see how many times God is mentioned in connection with spirituality?

I've read many posts, and I see great confusion here, which is why I've commented on the issue.

 

How can anyone even try to make a distinction between God and spirituality- there is none. God and spirit are one and the same. Even the Christian religion recognizes that- father son and Holy Ghost ( spirit ), three parts of one whole.

 

If you want to find the answer to that question, read about Buddhism.
Buddhism is a major religion in the world with possibly half a billion followers, or more. It tends to appeal to certain rational people in the West because it does not promote the belief in a Creator Deity, or God, or any eternal Being, or any eternal soul.

 

Buddhism teaches the doctrine of 'dependent origination' whereby all phenomena arise in dependence on other phenomena, and that nothing is permanent. The origin of the universe was considered by the Buddha to be an imponderable. He knew that he didn't know and that he couldn't know, so it was a waste of time speculating on such issues.

 

I agree with this view because I'm sensible, rational, compassionate and insightful. ????
 

[teatime101]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The OP isn't about religion. Unfortunately most unbelievers only know about religion and little about God.

 

re·li·gion

 

1. the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.

   "ideas about the relationship between science and religion"

    

   https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/religion

    

   I'm fine with that definition.

    

   3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

   Unfortunately most unbelievers only know about religion and little about God.

   That may well be. How can you 'know' anything about God if you're not religious?

    

    

    

    

[teatime101]

9 minutes ago, VincentRJ said:

The origin of the universe was considered by the Buddha to be an imponderable. He knew that he didn't know and that he couldn't know, so it was a waste of time speculating on such issues.

An agnostic, in other words. The only logical position one can have.

 

I wonder if Buddha ever crossed paths with Lao Tzu. 

[Sujo]

There certainly are a couple of odd characters on here that maybe smoked a bit too much green stuff.

[Tagged]

16 minutes ago, Sujo said:

There certainly are a couple of odd characters on here that maybe smoked a bit too much green stuff.

And To much shroooms as well. I have met to many people in my life that is very spiritual, and they have something common most of them, Psycedelics is that thing that connects them, and some stay connecte more than others even they did not touch it for decades. 

 

Anyway, you should not underestimate some feel, and i reality is more connected of different reasons to this world, and other worlds or call it forces. We all had some sense of it during our lives more or less if we have been searching for it. It is just we choose to cultivate it, or go on and count it as a good time and experience (im not talking about drugs now!) Some even discover it when they are depressed, to high on life, lost or near death experiences. 

 

 

[Tagged]

8 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You overlook the fact that our biological machines function due to chemical reactions, and how it is possible that humans have the ability to get high due to thought processes causing the release of certain chemicals. Perhaps you think it was just an accident, but I think it was designed into us by the creator to allow us to find a higher plane of existence.

 

I just have to accept you believe that, and if that works for you, then fine. For me it is chemicals that is necessery to survive in harsh clima and challenging inviroments, that for most people is not necessery today, but we still need to cultivate them, maintain them for later purposes in future when we will need them again. Our inner self will always look for some meaning in life when we are not on constant watch out for whats next to kill us. There is a reason newspapers and social media cultivate tragedies, war, murders, etc, it is like flypaper to human brains. 

 

But most people feel safe, little life treathning challenges, and that makes us feel miserable, or at least some of us. I have done my share of X-sports, facing many death and lethal accidents of friends every eyar, made us more connected to life and "The Moment", and you could also many times feel some higher power connecting us. Fear is also a important drive and release chemicals for the worse or the better. Dependes what type you are, as sex drugs and rockn roll. 

[Sunmaster]

2 hours ago, teatime101 said:

It's a proposition. I'm not confused about the connection, because I don't see it. The claim was that our capacity to get high must have been 'designed' by a creator.  Do you agree with the claim?

If you mean the receptors in our brains being placed there "by design", so that we can experience the effects of psilocybin, mescaline, THC etc.....then yes, I believe that everything is there for a reason. 
I said it before, I also believe that the earliest contacts with the Divine were through psychedelics and that shamans were those in the tribe with the most knowledge on how to use them and what they could do with them. Religions came much later. Today, there's at least one recognized religion in the US, where Peyote is used as a sacrament. It's certainly more effective than the Christian hostie. ????

LSD has also been used very in psychological therapy, showing promising success with depression, addiction and generally with lack of direction in life. Unfortunately, research was halted due to ignorance and shortsightedness, but I've read somewhere that a comeback is imminent.

All psychedelic substances do, are to (temporarily) break down the Ego, which is what keeps us separated from the Divine. Constant meditation does the same, but is more permanent. Some people are lucky and experience the same in a moment of clarity, without doing anything particular or even expecting it. Some other will go through life without ever feeling anything like that. Such is life.

Edited June 17, 2020 by Sunmaster

[Sunmaster]

1 hour ago, Sujo said:

There certainly are a couple of odd characters on here that maybe smoked a bit too much green stuff.

How much is too much?

[fredwiggy]

https://images.app.goo.gl/BiUaDdxcUiuEX9bq5

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, Tagged said:

For me it is chemicals that is necessery to survive in harsh clima and challenging inviroments, that for most people is not necessery today, but we still need to cultivate them, maintain them for later purposes in future when we will need them again.

????????????????????/

Our bodies function on the release of chemicals from certain organs IN OUR BODIES. If they didn't produce those chemicals we'd have major problems staying alive.

I have no idea why you think we store some chemicals in our bodies, unless you consider fat to be a chemical.

[thaibeachlovers]

My reference to getting high was related to reaching a higher spiritual plane, not a drug high. The subject was spirituality, and not about being a druggie.

[faraday]

Re: #8439

 

Great post, thank you.

 

@Sunmaster

[Tagged]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

????????????????????/

Our bodies function on the release of chemicals from certain organs IN OUR BODIES. If they didn't produce those chemicals we'd have major problems staying alive.

I have no idea why you think we store some chemicals in our bodies, unless you consider fat to be a chemical.

Im sorry im not clear, and as you know I am aware of the release of chemicals during surten circumstances. Chemicals that is essential in critical situatins, and also a trigger for good when we need reward. No we do not store chemicals for survival in our bodies. God sake

[luckyluke]

12 hours ago, Sunmaster said:

Such is life.????

As mentioned a few times before (in specific contexts) I had an "Experience" at the age of 13, which determined my way of thinking for the rest of my life (Well at least till now, at 71 +).

 

I believe it was something which happened in my brains, maybe something I imagined for one or another reason, as I don't have any other explanation for it. 

 

Others seems to have something similar, mostly they catalogue this  as a "revelation", and believe, and proclame regularly it is a sign of a god, a creator, God... and even claim they have now and then a spiritual "contact" with "it". something they may call "divinity" or what else, but certainly something superior.

 

That's their conviction.

 

Practically none of them will declare it is maybe just something which happened in their brains, something they imagined. 

 

As a non believer (so far), I am of course rather sceptic. 

 

Not that they hadn't , or don't feel these "events", but that they claim they are  "divine". 

 

[Sunmaster]

1 hour ago, luckyluke said:

As mentioned a few times before (in specific contexts) I had an "Experience" at the age of 13, which determined my way of thinking for the rest of my life (Well at least till now, at 71 +).

 

I believe it was something which happened in my brains, maybe something I imagined for one or another reason, as I don't have any other explanation for it. 

 

Others seems to have something similar, mostly they catalogue this  as a "revelation", and believe, and proclame regularly it is a sign of a god, a creator, God... and even claim they have now and then a spiritual "contact" with "it". something they may call "divinity" or what else, but certainly something superior.

 

That's their conviction.

 

Practically none of them will declare it is maybe just something which happened in their brains, something they imagined. 

 

As a non believer (so far), I am of course rather sceptic. 

 

Not that they hadn't , or don't feel these "events", but that they claim they are  "divine". 

 

And another one of your passive aggressive comments that basically says the same thing that all your other 999 previous comments said. 
So you had an experience where you didn't experience anything. Well done. 

Then you take that "non-experience" as a measuring staff for the experiences of anyone else. "Hey, if I didn't experience anything, it must be the same for others too". Great logic.
If you actually had a revelation during your "experience", you wouldn't be questioning whether it was just a product of your brain, your foot or an indigestion...that's why it's called a revelation! You would simply know, just like you know what water feels like when you first come in contact with it. Did you imagine it? Was it just a hallucination? Was it chemicals in your brain? Duh

As for being "special" you keep accusing me. I always said that what I've experienced is there for anyone to experience. It's a natural faculty we all have. It's as if you were accusing me of being special because I have 2 eyes. Look, you too have 2 eyes, you should just open them from time to time.

Edited June 18, 2020 by Sunmaster

[luckyluke]

All the ones who post here regularly says continuously the same thing. 

 

What you mean I didn't experienced anything!

 

It was a very intense moment, I don't know exactly how long, but it determined my life for the next 58 years, and will maybe more. 

 

I just don't know how, what, who, contribute to it. 

 

My opinion is that he was something which happened in my brain. 

 

You pretend to know what it is, what yourself concern, fine for you if you think so, however don't expect all others to believe it is "divine". 

 

Also fine to pretend that everyone has the "natural faculties",

but that's your opinion, you are of course entitled to have. 

 

Now you claim that you'r not special at all,

 

glad to read this. 

 

[Sunmaster]

2 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

Also fine to pretend that everyone has the "natural faculties",

but that's your opinion, you are of course entitled to have. 

 

Now you claim that you'r not special at all,

 

glad to read this. 

Not my opinion. Go read up on it...search for "kundalini" and be amazed.

You should have read my previous posts more carefully then, because that's what I said from the very beginning. I never said I was any more "special" than anyone else, it was you who accused me of being somehow superior to others.

[luckyluke]

3 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

it was you who accused me of being somehow superior to others.

I did,

based on the fact that I thought you were claiming that every path to reach happiness and serenety are not the same,

 

neither that every opinion, in not measurable matters, are equal. 

 

Which, for me, is having a superior attitude to others. 

 

Now if this isn't the case, I totaly misunderstood you, and present you my apologies. 

 

What "kundalini" concern, I just google it and found that :

"Kundalini, in Hinduism is a form of divine feminine energy believed to be located at the base of the spine, in the muladhara. It is an important concept in Śhaiva Tantra, where it is believed to be a force or power associated with the divine feminine. Wikipedia"

 

So it is in first instance a "belief". 

 

Which may be good for many, as ever belief is, but not necessarily for everyone. 

 

I won't know if  this particilar belief will be good for me, it may or may not. 

I should have known it a long time ago, 

but at my age I am pleased with my own way, and don't want to experience others anymore. 

 

 

 

[Tagged]

27 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

Not my opinion. Go read up on it...search for "kundalini" and be amazed.

You should have read my previous posts more carefully then, because that's what I said from the very beginning. I never said I was any more "special" than anyone else, it was you who accused me of being somehow superior to others.

Do not worry, we all say something, and someone else reads in to it something different, or bend it somehow. And thats even your language is orign english, then think about us who do not have english as first language ????

 

it is a mystery but one day some will get right, and some will be wrong, but it will not matter, because we will be dead ???? 

 

Someone said once

"If I aggree with you, we will both be wrong" 

[Tagged]

13 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

I did,

based on the fact that I thought you were claiming that every path to reach happiness and serenety are not the same,

 

neither that every opinion, in not measurable matters, are equal. 

 

Which, for me, is having a superior attitude to others. 

 

Now if this isn't the case, I totaly misunderstood you, and present you my apologies. 

 

What "kundalini" concern, I just google it and found that :

"Kundalini, in Hinduism is a form of divine feminine energy believed to be located at the base of the spine, in the muladhara. It is an important concept in Śhaiva Tantra, where it is believed to be a force or power associated with the divine feminine. Wikipedia"

 

So it is in first instance a "belief". 

 

Which may be good for many, as ever belief is, but not necessarily for everyone. 

 

I won't know if  this particilar belief will be good for me, it may or may not. 

I should have known it a long time ago, 

but at my age I am pleased with my own way, and don't want to experience others anymore. 

 

 

 

And the answer is still 42 right? So simple but we insist on making it complicated once said by Confucious, and he also stated Simplicity is beautiful ????

 

 

 

"Is your life simple? Or is it complicated? Simple is often understood synonymous to boring, stagnant or nothing new. Whereas, simplicity can sometimes be beautiful too."

 

I searched for Confucious about something I read long time ago, and found this "blog", simple but worth reading. Short and simple. 

 

https://medium.com/@feeljoy.in/life-is-simple-but-we-insist-on-making-it-complicated-c1e910a13431

 

Konfutse eller Confucius er navneformer som i dag blir brukt på norsk for en kinesisk lærer og filosof, angivelig født 551 f.Kr. nær Qufu, provinsen Shandong, Kina, død 479 f.Kr. nær fødebyen

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confucius

[Sunmaster]

1 hour ago, Tagged said:

And thats even your language is orign english, then think about us who do not have english as first language ????

English is my 3rd language, but I get what you're saying. ???? 

[Peter Denis]

8 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

English is my 3rd language, but I get what you're saying. ???? 

Personal question > What are your 1st, 2nd and possibly 4th languages?

Mine are > dutch, english, french, german (last two knowledgeable to read/understand, but with limited vocabulary to write/speak).

[Sunmaster]

2 hours ago, luckyluke said:

I did,

based on the fact that I thought you were claiming that every path to reach happiness and serenety are not the same,

 

neither that every opinion, in not measurable matters, are equal. 

 

Which, for me, is having a superior attitude to others. 

 

Now if this isn't the case, I totaly misunderstood you, and present you my apologies. 

 

What "kundalini" concern, I just google it and found that :

"Kundalini, in Hinduism is a form of divine feminine energy believed to be located at the base of the spine, in the muladhara. It is an important concept in Śhaiva Tantra, where it is believed to be a force or power associated with the divine feminine. Wikipedia"

 

So it is in first instance a "belief". 

 

Which may be good for many, as ever belief is, but not necessarily for everyone. 

 

I won't know if  this particilar belief will be good for me, it may or may not. 

I should have known it a long time ago, 

but at my age I am pleased with my own way, and don't want to experience others anymore. 

 

 

 

I appreciate your explanation.

Like in many other areas in life, there are more effective or faster ways to get somewhere, and there are paths with more detours that are slower. Both will eventually get there, but it depends on you, your choices and your commitment how fast you get there. So, I still don't think all paths (or opinions) are equal, especially when it comes to spiritual matters.
 

The Kundalini energy is well described in Hinduism, but it's not confined to a religion. People from all parts of the world have experienced it, so it's not a matter of belief. I was atheist when I experienced it and had no idea what it was until I read about it. It doesn't make me special or superior, but I do feel extremely lucky.

 

[Sunmaster]

16 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Personal question > What are your 1st, 2nd and possibly 4th languages?

Mine are > dutch, english, french, german (last two knowledgeable to read/understand, but with limited vocabulary to write/speak).

German, Italian, English, some Thai, trying to learn Spanish now.

[Sunmaster]

2 hours ago, Tagged said:

Someone said once

"If I aggree with you, we will both be wrong" 

LOL I like that! ???? 

[luckyluke]

1 minute ago, Sunmaster said:

So, I still don't think all paths (or opinions) are equal, especially when it comes to spiritual matters.

I don't think my path to find happiness and serenety, as my opinions are superior to yours. 

Do you think yours are superior? 

Just to know if I was right or wrong about you. 9

[Sunmaster]

2 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

I don't think my path to find happiness and serenety, as my opinions are superior to yours. 

Do you think yours are superior? 

Just to know if I was right or wrong about you. 9

My distinction is based on efficiency, you brought the "superiority" into the discussion.

Some people will try to find happiness and serenity in material possessions. I think that that path is not efficient, simply because material possessions are not the source for true happiness. A happiness that is dependent on exterior things is necessarily limited.

On the other hand, a path that has recognized that limitation and seeks the true source of happiness, is in my opinion more efficient, because it has also recognized the sources of pain. 

 

[OneMoreFarang]

3 hours ago, Sunmaster said:

I always said that what I've experienced is there for anyone to experience.

How do you know it's for anyone?

Maybe you are special and you are the only one with that experience.