Do you believe in God and why

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, Tagged said:

I aggree, nature have the power to destroy us, but even nature have to follow rules and laws the nature created. Nature do not have free will to do what it want. So the god you talking about do not have free will to do what he want when he want. 

Errrrrrrr, if God created life the universe and everything then God created nature. Ergo the "rules" of nature were created by God.

[xylophone]

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The God I expect to join after I die would know everything about me and my life

 

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Why would God even be concerned about our little lives?

A contradiction mayhap!!

[Fat is a type of crazy]

2 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

A contradiction mayhap!!

His god knows everything .. but ..

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

A contradiction mayhap!!

Not at all, I believe God knows all so, ergo God knows all about me . I also believe that we come from God and to God we return, so God would care ( if God even cares, which is a human emotion ) as much about me as I do about my spleen ( unless it started to cause me a problem ). Ie I know about my spleen, but I don't spend any time thinking about it.

[Surelynot]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Not at all, I believe God knows all so, ergo God knows all about me . I also believe that we come from God and to God we return, so God would care ( if God even cares, which is a human emotion ) as much about me as I do about my spleen ( unless it started to cause me a problem ). Ie I know about my spleen, but I don't spend any time thinking about it.

This is fascinating.......whatever happened in your life to come to these beliefs? 

 

What do feel/think about all those poor unfortunates not born into a society/country that believe in the right God?

 

Or is there just one God and he/she/it presents themselves in different formats.

 

Hinduism has 330 million gods......is that just really one god?

[thaibeachlovers]

Just now, Surelynot said:

This is fascinating.......whatever happened in your life to come to these beliefs? 

 

What do feel/think about all those poor unfortunates not born into a society/country that believe in the right God?

 

Or is there just one God and he/she/it presents themselves in different formats.

 

Hinduism has 330 million gods......is that just really one god?

Like someone said on a post, using "God" is probably using the wrong term as people think it's referring to all the different gods of different religions. I should say " the creator of life the universe and everything", but it's a bit long to use, so "God" must suffice.

 

To answer the question, there is only one "God", though "God" may come in different guises. "God" appears to me in the sunset, in clouds, in rain, in forests, in the endless ocean etc. ie nature. "God" may appear to others as a triple headed elephant statue. Many paths, one destination.

[thaibeachlovers]

8 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

This is fascinating.......whatever happened in your life to come to these beliefs? 

It's the only thing that makes sense to me. I started as very religious at school, then rejected the Church for many years till I had a "road to Damascus" moment. Because of that unique experience I know God exists. Those that had no such experience can, IMO, be forgiven for their scepticism.

Now I believe in God, but not religion.

BTW, if God didn't know everything, surely God could not create life the universe and everything.

[Surelynot]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's the only thing that makes sense to me. I started as very religious at school, then rejected the Church for many years till I had a "road to Damascus" moment. Because of that unique experience I know God exists. Those that had no such experience can, IMO, be forgiven for their scepticism.

Now I believe in God, but not religion.

BTW, if God didn't know everything, surely God could not create life the universe and everything.

As an aside I think/hope religious schools will eventually be banned.......and we will look back on them in the same way as we now view slavery, apartheid, racism and think........how (in god's name) did we every allow children to be indoctrinated in this fashion. 

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

As an aside I think/hope religious schools will eventually be banned.......and we will look back on them in the same way as we now view slavery, apartheid, racism and think........how (in god's name) did we every allow children to be indoctrinated in this fashion. 

I don't know what sort of Sunday school you went to, but mine wasn't some sort of indoctrination camp. I don't remember much about it but I enjoyed the time there. Depends on the instructor, I guess.

[xylophone]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

BTW, if God didn't know everything, surely God could not create life the universe and everything.

But then again who said this god entity did create the universe and everything, it's just a belief held by people who need to believe in something.

 

It was a philosopher who once said that man created god because he needed someone/something to believe in, or words to that effect.

 

As many of us know, it's pointless trying to discuss whether there is a god or not, because that discussion is about as useful as trying to guess how many fairies you can fit on the head of a pin – – all a nonsense.

 

I tie god and religion in together, and people believing in reincarnation, virgin births, resurrection, floating up to the sky, parting of the seas and the ridiculous notion of this god assembling all of the animals on earth and putting them in a large wooden boat – – pity the poor penguins who had to walk from the Antarctic.

 

No, I can't believe in this rubbish, but you are entitled to, so I will take my leave from this thread, as I've got things to do other than following nonsense.

[thaibeachlovers]

Just now, xylophone said:

But then again who said this god entity did create the universe and everything, it's just a belief held by people who need to believe in something.

 

It was a philosopher who once said that man created god because he needed someone/something to believe in, or words to that effect.

 

As many of us know, it's pointless trying to discuss whether there is a god or not, because that discussion is about as useful as trying to guess how many fairies you can fit on the head of a pin – – all a nonsense.

 

I tie god and religion in together, and people believing in reincarnation, virgin births, resurrection, floating up to the sky, parting of the seas and the ridiculous notion of this god assembling all of the animals on earth and putting them in a large wooden boat – – pity the poor penguins who had to walk from the Antarctic.

 

No, I can't believe in this rubbish, but you are entitled to, so I will take my leave from this thread, as I've got things to do other than following nonsense.

Bye.

[xylophone]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Bye.

Ah, you beat me to it, I didn't get chance to press the "unfollow button", but here goes, and so sad that people believe in this rubbish.

[Surelynot]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't know what sort of Sunday school you went to, but mine wasn't some sort of indoctrination camp. I don't remember much about it but I enjoyed the time there. Depends on the instructor, I guess.

I find the notion that a school should have any association with a religion totally abhorrent.........and parental indoctrination is even worse.

[Tagged]

22 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Like someone said on a post, using "God" is probably using the wrong term as people think it's referring to all the different gods of different religions. I should say " the creator of life the universe and everything", but it's a bit long to use, so "God" must suffice.

 

To answer the question, there is only one "God", though "God" may come in different guises. "God" appears to me in the sunset, in clouds, in rain, in forests, in the endless ocean etc. ie nature. "God" may appear to others as a triple headed elephant statue. Many paths, one destination.

And why only one god? Why couldnt it be more gods? 

 

21 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Errrrrrrr, if God created life the universe and everything then God created nature. Ergo the "rules" of nature were created by God.

My best guess, I believe also a force, energy will have to work with the rules creator or not! Im still amused how much energy put in to something that you can only asume, or create/see/experience inside you after long long training, and where I believe we are the creators of the god(s) Thats why I say it is all inside you

[Sunmaster]

13 minutes ago, xylophone said:

But then again who said this god entity did create the universe and everything, it's just a belief held by people who need to believe in something.

 

It was a philosopher who once said that man created god because he needed someone/something to believe in, or words to that effect.

 

As many of us know, it's pointless trying to discuss whether there is a god or not, because that discussion is about as useful as trying to guess how many fairies you can fit on the head of a pin – – all a nonsense.

 

I tie god and religion in together, and people believing in reincarnation, virgin births, resurrection, floating up to the sky, parting of the seas and the ridiculous notion of this god assembling all of the animals on earth and putting them in a large wooden boat – – pity the poor penguins who had to walk from the Antarctic.

 

No, I can't believe in this rubbish, but you are entitled to, so I will take my leave from this thread, as I've got things to do other than following nonsense.

You sir, are very confused about it all and obviously are not interested in improving your condition.
Bye then

[Fat is a type of crazy]

1 hour ago, Surelynot said:

This is fascinating.......whatever happened in your life to come to these beliefs? 

 

What do feel/think about all those poor unfortunates not born into a society/country that believe in the right God?

 

Or is there just one God and he/she/it presents themselves in different formats.

 

Hinduism has 330 million gods......is that just really one god?

My first post on this topic was about asking my Thai girlfriend how she believes in buddha, hindu gods, snake gods and other things - how does it work, who's in charge etc? I got a good answer on this post about how it works here.

I suppose sometimes the details may not be thought through, in some ways, but the outcome of my girlfriend happily going to a beautiful temple, meditating, eating vegetarian food, no alcohol, is a pretty good one. 

[Surelynot]

4 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

My first post on this topic was about asking my Thai girlfriend how she believes in buddha, hindu gods, snake gods and other things - how does it work, who's in charge etc? I got a good answer on this post about how it works here.

I suppose sometimes the details may not be thought through, in some ways, but the outcome of my girlfriend happily going to a beautiful temple, meditating, eating vegetarian food, no alcohol, is a pretty good one. 

That I guess is the frightening thing.......it shows you how easily humans are manipulated......in the case of your girlfriend all for the good.......not always the case in every religion/sect.

 

I just find it horrifying that we, as a race, are totally comfortable indoctrinating the most vulnerable, children, into whatever we so called adults find acceptable........Islam, Judaism , Scientology......you name it.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 hours ago, Tagged said:

And why only one god? Why couldnt it be more gods? 

 

My best guess, I believe also a force, energy will have to work with the rules creator or not! Im still amused how much energy put in to something that you can only asume, or create/see/experience inside you after long long training, and where I believe we are the creators of the god(s) Thats why I say it is all inside you

I put no "energy" into my belief. I don't have to go anywhere or do anything to practice my belief and looking at nature is hardly energetic.

I contribute on this thread because it's interesting and I've learned a lot, including how judgemental and closed minded some people are.

It's like they think that just saying there is no proof that God exists is going to make me abandon my profound belief in the Creator. Fat chance.

 

create/see/experience inside you after long long training,

What? I required no "long training" It just happened. One minute I never thought about God and the next I knew.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, Surelynot said:

That I guess is the frightening thing.......it shows you how easily humans are manipulated......in the case of your girlfriend all for the good.......not always the case in every religion/sect.

 

I just find it horrifying that we, as a race, are totally comfortable indoctrinating the most vulnerable, children, into whatever we so called adults find acceptable........Islam, Judaism , Scientology......you name it.

I hope you feel the same about the new "religion" of man made climate change. Kids seem totally indoctrinated, to the extent of some worrying about everyone dying soon ( as reported on the radio ). They are even taking days off school to march around and make ludicrous demands for "change" despite apparently not knowing what should actually change.

Compared to that, learning to be a good person and love one's neighbour, forgive sins etc is quite innocuous.

[Surelynot]

12 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I hope you feel the same about the new "religion" of man made climate change. Kids seem totally indoctrinated, to the extent of some worrying about everyone dying soon ( as reported on the radio ). They are even taking days off school to march around and make ludicrous demands for "change" despite apparently not knowing what should actually change.

Compared to that, learning to be a good person and love one's neighbour, forgive sins etc is quite innocuous.

Any form of indoctrination is abhorrent....until they are 18 (say?)

[thaibeachlovers]

Just now, Surelynot said:

Any form of indoctrination is abhorrent....until they are 18 (say?)

I agree, but isn't school indoctrination?

I pretty much avoided most of it by not even trying to learn anything and just doing stuff that interested me outside school hours. I failed all my exams except English ( the only subject I had any interest in ). Everything I learned, I learned after I left school.

Unfortunately, one can't do that any more, so to get a good job one has to pass exams. That sucks, IMO.

[Surelynot]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I agree, but isn't school indoctrination?

I pretty much avoided most of it by not even trying to learn anything and just doing stuff that interested me outside school hours. I failed all my exams except English ( the only subject I had any interest in ). Everything I learned, I learned after I left school.

Unfortunately, one can't do that any more, so to get a good job one has to pass exams. That sucks, IMO.

Education up to 18 should focus a combination of skills and knowledge required to gain useful employment (no need to be too prescriptive 3R's) how to manage personal health and finances and knowledge and skills required to be a 'good' citizen.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 4/30/2021 at 9:39 PM, Surelynot said:

Education up to 18 should focus a combination of skills and knowledge required to gain useful employment (no need to be too prescriptive 3R's) how to manage personal health and finances and knowledge and skills required to be a 'good' citizen.

Do schools teach any of that?

I know it was long ago but even had I paid attention in class I'd have learned nothing about personal health and finances and knowledge and skills required to be a 'good' citizen.

We didn't even have sex education, and certainly nothing to do with cooking or suchlike.

[Surelynot]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Do schools teach any of that?

I know it was long ago but even had I paid attention in class I'd have learned nothing about personal health and finances and knowledge and skills required to be a 'good' citizen.

We didn't even have sex education, and certainly nothing to do with cooking or suchlike.

They skirt around it.....but the pressure of "results" is all consuming.........when your livelihood and career depends on the next set of results it does focus the mind, English and Mathematics are everything.......almost to the exclusion of everything else.

[yodsak]

10 hours ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I  thought what Spinoza said was really interesting especially since he had been born in the 1600's.  

During his life he was widely attacked for his 'blasphemous' and 'heretical' opinions on God, the bible, and religion, even suffering one of the most vitriolic cherem (excommunication) ever issued by the Amsterdam Portuguese-Jewish community.    Spinoza says that God is 'immanent' in nature, not some supernatural entity beyond the world. But does this mean that we can describe him as a pantheist, as someone who believes that God is revealed in every aspect of the natural world that lies around us? This was certainly a popular interpretation……..The philosopher John Toland, in the early 18th century, insisted that the terms 'Spinozism' and 'pantheism' are synonymous.     > spinoza-the-atheist

 

The chief objection I have to Pantheism is that it says nothing. To call the world "God" is not to explain it; it is only to enrich our language with a superfluous synonym for the word "world." It comes to the same thing whether you say "the world is God," or "God is the world.”  –Schopenhauer.

[Elad]

On 4/28/2021 at 2:17 PM, Sunmaster said:

Is God a person, able to "enjoy" something and "dislike" something else?

If God is everything there is, which is my definition of God, wouldn't that make "him" both predator and prey? And observer...i.e. you. 

The Divine Force (sorry, I have a problem calling it God) is not something/someone that is separated from us and the world around us, remotely observing us from a safe distance somewhere. 
The DF is the consciousness that created everything and is holding everything together....from the subatomic level to the macrocosmos. Our consciousness is a drop of that divine consciousness, temporarily unable to see that ultimately the drop and the ocean it comes from are made from the same thing. 

 

Since there's no evidence for this divine force or cosmic consciousness, you also should consider consciousness as being an emergent property that comes with life, and was not present at the origin of the universe. If this is the case then even if we understand how consciousness works, then it won't give us any answers to how the universe began, it will just give us a better understanding of life or how the living brain works. 

[Elad]

On 4/29/2021 at 1:46 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

God created the universe and science tells us that black holes consume everything around them, ergo, God made black holes that can consume solar systems.

 

There's a massive black hole at the centre of our Galaxy and it doesn't seem to feeding on any solar systems at the moment. In fact pretty much all of the star systems in the Galaxy (including ours) are in stable orbits around the black hole.

 

Black holes are not holes in space swallowing things, they have mass at their centre but that mass is very, very dense. The most dense objects we know of that can be observed are neutron stars. The escape velocity at the surface of a neutron star is about 0.5 c (speed of light), the escape velocity at the surface of a black hole is more than the speed of light, so light cannot escape, thus we can't observe them directly and that's why we call them black holes.

[mauGR1]

4 hours ago, Elad said:

 

Since there's no evidence for this divine force or cosmic consciousness, you also should consider consciousness as being an emergent property that comes with life, and was not present at the origin of the universe. If this is the case then even if we understand how consciousness works, then it won't give us any answers to how the universe began, it will just give us a better understanding of life or how the living brain works. 

The evidence of cosmic consciousness is in the order of the universe. 

One can speculate endlessly if consciousness has its origin from life, or one may say that life is created by consciousness, but they are different aspects of the same "thing".. some call it God. 

It's definitely more interesting,  imho, comparing different levels of consciousness among living creatures, if we want to learn something about it. 

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, Elad said:

 

Since there's no evidence for this divine force or cosmic consciousness, you also should consider consciousness as being an emergent property that comes with life, and was not present at the origin of the universe. If this is the case then even if we understand how consciousness works, then it won't give us any answers to how the universe began, it will just give us a better understanding of life or how the living brain works. 

There is also no "evidence" that romantic love exists, yet most believe in it.

Seems strange to me that people think that something that IMO at basis is a means of getting laid is something pure and noble, yet deny the existence of a creator, when there is plenty of evidence for those that choose to look at it. It's not like it's hidden.

[Tagged]

11 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

There is also no "evidence" that romantic love exists, yet most believe in it.

Seems strange to me that people think that something that IMO at basis is a means of getting laid is something pure and noble, yet deny the existence of a creator, when there is plenty of evidence for those that choose to look at it. It's not like it's hidden.

Tell us what love is? People look at love exactly the same way as they look at god or not? Chemical reaction, a hallucination, what is love? Is love something you creat yourself inside you, or is it an outside in experience? The answer is within yourself, and not anything other can answer for you. You can be told, you can be teached, and you can choose to listen, but it is completely up to you how you decide to make your truth, and make your answers based on your experiences. I can not answer you, but I can tell you what I believe, and i can tell you my experiences, and that is what the whole discussion in this thread have been about. Nothing more nothing else and nothing less

Edited May 4, 2021 by Tagged