Are retirees welcome in Thailand?

[Jingthing]

In any case we're not guests. Guests are invited. We invite ourselves upon application for time conditional stays generally based on money. Yes there are visas but retirement in Thailand is not actively promoted as it is for some other nations such as the Philippines.

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[Percy P]

34 minutes ago, reargunnerph3 said:

The price for living in what I consider to be a Third World Country. All the visits to Immigration and BS paperwork is a pain in the butt however if you can put up with all the crap it's still a pretty good place to live IMHO.

Lived here for 25 year never had any hassle as I depart T/Land every  90 days and Look forwards to it. Out 13th May will meet up with my friend from Australia in Penang stay 2-3 weeks come back..There's a luxury train (Sleeper) going down to Hat Hai from their Parang Basar( boarder) then on to Butterworth-Penang.

Meet up with old faces all for about 1200 Baht from Bkk.There is cheaper priced beds .Top bunk 1105B ,Bottom bunk 1105B. 1 metre wide.. Travel enjoy yourself next month Bali Indonesia. And I am a senior citizen. No problem.

Edited April 28, 2019 by Percy P

[Chrisswe]

Yes if you can maintain the retirement requirements !!

[Nielsk]

I'm sure retires are welcome by the Thai people.  But not so sure when it comes to the government, which seemed to put more and more obstacles in the way. ????????

[marcusarelus]

I lived in Florida.  Florida welcomes retirees.  No state income tax.  Homestead exemption.  You can drive and get a license till you drop. Old friendly laws and lots of restaurant discounts for eating spoiled food early.  When you say you are dating a younger woman it means 50 years of age. 

[NightSky]

There is bureaucracy and red tape in most countries which clogs the system with paperwork for everyone more so likely for those having to process all the paperwork.

 

The requirements to stay here long term don't seem that difficult to me its just a minor inconvenience and the additional need to plan a little in advance. It could be a lot worse. Maintaining some money in case of emergency is a must anyhow. 

Edited April 28, 2019 by NightSky

[owenm]

It would appear that there are many expat retirees here who maybe asset rich ie: invested in a house for 4-6 mill Bht, cars and bikes.. 

 

But I'm sure many don't have access to put 800k in the bank and have been relying solely on their OAP.. If they happened to be from one of the four countries that have withdrawn income declarations, how many are receiving a minimum of 65k paid per month?

 

With the continued strength of the Thb over the past few years, it has seen the deminished value of the €, $, £ etc which is rapidly losing pace against the strength of the baht.. 

 

If in the ever changing rules from IO, they decided to not accept any stat Dec or income letters through any of their respective embassies where proof had to be in their monthly deposit of minimum 65k..So no more declarations of income but proof of 65k minimum deposits into their Thai bank account.. 

 

How many retirees relying solely on the Old Age Pension (OAP) actually get minimum of 65k Thb monthly from their respective governments?

 

I know Australia falls well short at about 45k pm. Kiwis usually cannot access OAP if living in Thailand.. UK pensions frozen without any CPI increases if living in Thailand.. US pensions depending on age of access can also fall short, unless extra for military service etc. 

 

It would be interesting to know how many retirees relying solely on income affidavits from their embassies, would be detrimentally affected if these were to suddenly cease.. 

 

It would be interesting to know how much your OAP is monthly without tapping into additional funds as a top up. I don't find it possible to spend 65k monthly when basically forced to.. 45-50k is more than adequate for a comfortable lifestyle in LOS.. I'm sure there are many others who can't keep 800k in their bank account for trouble free future extensions, and maybe thrown under the bus in the future, particularly if the minimum monthly increases to 80k or 1 Mill. Bht in the bank method.. 

 

How much is your countries government pension paying you monthly in Thb?? Is it under the current 65k Thb monthly?? Would be interesting to know.. If the minimum monthly deposit was increased would your possibly be stuffed? 

[malibukid]

i follow Frank Sinatra's advice and keep the cash in circulation amongst the locals.  

[jimn]

On 4/26/2019 at 2:23 PM, madmen said:

On 4/26/2019 at 1:40 PM, Orton Rd said:

Give them time and they will

It's only recent they stopped. I filled mine out as I was reporting away from Bangkok and the girl at reception said no need and IO never asked

Its been like it for at least a year. I wouldnt call that recent.

[TigerandDog]

On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 11:38 AM, Yeahbutwhytho said:

You can be fined for TM30 when doing the extension, or if they rock up at your condo to ask

Yes - there are no reports of getting fined during 90 day reporting however, I meant in general you must do a tm30 everytime you leave/arrive

"I meant in general you must do a tm30 everytime you leave/arrive".

 

I'm surprised Ubonjoe hasn't corrected you on this point. We as farangs do not have to submit TM30 reports, they are the responsibility of the owner of the premises in which we reside. However, we are required to submit a TM28 form everytime we arrive back in the country & also for the property owner to submit a TM30 when we arrive back in the country. There is no requirement to complete and submit these forms when leaving the country. As far as I'm aware these forms are not required to be completed and submitted when travel has just been within Thailand.

[TigerandDog]

20 minutes ago, owenm said:

It would appear that there are many expat retirees here who maybe asset rich ie: invested in a house for 4-6 mill Bht, cars and bikes.. 

 

But I'm sure many don't have access to put 800k in the bank and have been relying solely on their OAP.. If they happened to be from one of the four countries that have withdrawn income declarations, how many are receiving a minimum of 65k paid per month?

 

With the continued strength of the Thb over the past few years, it has seen the deminished value of the €, $, £ etc which is rapidly losing pace against the strength of the baht.. 

 

If in the ever changing rules from IO, they decided to not accept any stat Dec or income letters through any of their respective embassies where proof had to be in their monthly deposit of minimum 65k..So no more declarations of income but proof of 65k minimum deposits into their Thai bank account.. 

 

How many retirees relying solely on the Old Age Pension (OAP) actually get minimum of 65k Thb monthly from their respective governments?

 

I know Australia falls well short at about 45k pm. Kiwis usually cannot access OAP if living in Thailand.. UK pensions frozen without any CPI increases if living in Thailand.. US pensions depending on age of access can also fall short, unless extra for military service etc. 

 

It would be interesting to know how many retirees relying solely on income affidavits from their embassies, would be detrimentally affected if these were to suddenly cease.. 

 

It would be interesting to know how much your OAP is monthly without tapping into additional funds as a top up. I don't find it possible to spend 65k monthly when basically forced to.. 45-50k is more than adequate for a comfortable lifestyle in LOS.. I'm sure there are many others who can't keep 800k in their bank account for trouble free future extensions, and maybe thrown under the bus in the future, particularly if the minimum monthly increases to 80k or 1 Mill. Bht in the bank method.. 

 

How much is your countries government pension paying you monthly in Thb?? Is it under the current 65k Thb monthly?? Would be interesting to know.. If the minimum monthly deposit was increased would your possibly be stuffed? 

"I know Australia falls well short at about 45k pm."

 

Not even close. The aussie OAP this month was 38781 baht.

[4MyEgo]

On 4/26/2019 at 2:59 PM, NCC1701A said:

i travel extensively all over Thailand and leave the country every other year and i have never reported my address in five years except the very first time I moved here. Renting the same house five years. I have never had a bad experience with Thai immigration. 

I do the same, however upon my last trip to immigration where I applied for a re-entry visa the guy at immigration asked me where I was departing from to go to Australia, I said Phuket, (I live in Issan), he said will you be returning via Phuket, I said yes, I will be spending a week there to unload a few things, he said, make sure you go to the police station within 24 hours of your arrival to report your return, they will hand you a paper and you will be required to bring this to us as soon as you get back to your village.

 

I said I have never done this before, he said, you must always do this, or you will be fined, he has always been a friendly IO over the years, smiled, and again said, please make sure, go to police station, tell them you are back and they will give you a paper to give to us, bring the paper to us when you get back to the village, or you will be fined.

 

I said sure thing, ok, will do, thanks for the heads up.

 

Now I don't know if the rules have changed, but gotta do as the man says, like I said, never done this before, have returned via BKK and Phuket a few times over the years, just went home, but apparently we have to go to immigration as soon as we return to the village/home, or if we are staying in BKK or elsewhere before we return, we must go to the cops for this paper which states that we have advised them we have returned then we have to take that to the IMO.

 

So rules are rules, roger that, will follow....

[RobMuir]

1 hour ago, helloagain said:

Cheek. You are decendents from thieves and whores. 

Correct. 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, connda said:

If you rephrase the question from "Are retirees welcome in Thailand?" to "Is money welcome in Thailand?" then it's easier to answer.  Yes.  Money is welcome in Thailand.  Leave the money as fast as you can then get the heck out.  Foreigners are not 'welcome' here.  Their money is 'welcome.'  The foreigner is just barely tolerated.  That's why Thai authorities track foreigners with more scrutiny than a Thai murderer on parole.   That's how you are looked upon - potential criminal simply waiting to commit a crime.  
If I had to do it over again, I would never have married a Thai and I would have been spending my retirement is a country which is friendly toward expat retirees.  Thailand is not one of those countries.

Agree with most of that. They are certainly making it harder to stay. Back in the good old days one could stay on back to back visa exempt entries. No longer.

If I could change anything, I'd never ever have married my Thai lady, but I loved living in LOS, so if I hadn't got married I'd still be living there.

[Dania2019]

Good questions

[thaibeachlovers]

6 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

I do the same, however upon my last trip to immigration where I applied for a re-entry visa the guy at immigration asked me where I was departing from to go to Australia, I said Phuket, (I live in Issan), he said will you be returning via Phuket, I said yes, I will be spending a week there to unload a few things, he said, make sure you go to the police station within 24 hours of your arrival to report your return, they will hand you a paper and you will be required to bring this to us as soon as you get back to your village.

 

I said I have never done this before, he said, you must always do this, or you will be fined, he has always been a friendly IO over the years, smiled, and again said, please make sure, go to police station, tell them you are back and they will give you a paper to give to us, bring the paper to us when you get back to the village, or you will be fined.

 

I said sure thing, ok, will do, thanks for the heads up.

 

Now I don't know if the rules have changed, but gotta do as the man says, like I said, never done this before, have returned via BKK and Phuket a few times over the years, just went home, but apparently we have to go to immigration as soon as we return to the village/home, or if we are staying in BKK or elsewhere before we return, we must go to the cops for this paper which states that we have advised them we have returned then we have to take that to the IMO.

 

So rules are rules, roger that, will follow....

Times change. 

[gunderhill]

On 4/26/2019 at 11:14 AM, Yeahbutwhytho said:

You will be fined and risk your future stay if you don't keep up with 24 hours

as  they say "only at selected  outfits"

[MeePeeMai]

On 4/25/2019 at 6:35 PM, ubonjoe said:

What office is asking for a TM30 report when doing a 90 day report.

I have never been asked for TM30 form in all the years I have been here.

No problem to do the 90 day reports.

I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

Chiang Khan for one.

 

You will not be allowed to complete your 90 day report unless you have a "current" TM30 stapled in your passport. 

 

As an "expert" here on TVF, you seem to be very lucky (as you say have never needed to file a TM30) while still in complete denial that they are very strict about filing them in other Immigration Offices.

 

On one of my recent 90 day reports I was called on a missing TM30 (after staying in a hotel) and forced to file my "missing" TM30 before I could file my 90 day report.  I was not fined but warned not to let it happen again.

 

It is not fantasy, it is a reality for some of us here in LOS.

Edited April 28, 2019 by MeePeeMai

[owenm]

30 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

"I know Australia falls well short at about 45k pm."

 

Not even close. The aussie OAP this month was 38781 baht.

And what of OAP from UK, Germany, Belgium, Netherlands etc.. 

How much are their standard government pensions per month in baht?? I'm sure that many fall well under the 65k thb monthly minimum.. 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong.. If income affidavits were no longer acceptable for anybody from your countries embassy, would you still qualify under min. monthly deposit of 65k Thb? And if increased to min. 85k pm could you still afford to stay in Thailand or would you be stuffed??

Taking into account that the 800k wasn't feasible due to being asset rich but cash poor.. 

[mngmn]

On 4/26/2019 at 1:21 PM, RJRS1301 said:

At a great cost to even apply for a Visa, sometimes more than 20,000AUD 

They are very welcoming especially if you are not from a Commonwealth WHITE country (not)

Rubbish! The partner visa is around AUD 7.5k.  Cheaper than depositing AUD 20k on permanent loan to a Thai bank for the rest of your life.  Free lifetime health care for you and your partner more than compensates for this cost.  Last time I looked my partner was very 'tanned' but still eligible for a visa.  In fact this whole 'white Australia' thing is a load of crap. Today alone I had Somali Uber driver,  Chinese real estate agent, Vietnamese pharmacist, Burmese barista who made my coffee at an Indian owned Cafe.  Oh yes did have an Irish waitress.

[thaibeachlovers]

20 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

Chiang Khan for one.

 

You will not be allowed to complete your 90 day report unless you have a "current" TM30 stapled in your passport. 

 

As an "expert" here on TVF, you seem to be very lucky (as you say have never needed to file a TM30) while still in complete denial that they are very strict about filing them in other Immigration Offices.

 

On one of my recent 90 day reports I was called on a missing TM30 (after staying in a hotel) and forced to file my "missing" TM30 before I could file my 90 day report.  I was not fined but warned not to let it happen again.

 

It is not fantasy, it is a reality for some of us here in LOS.

I'm confused. I've never been given a receipt for a TM 30 when staying at an hotel overnight, so how could I file one in my passport? It's not even our responsibility for doing them, unless it's our own property. Seems like some IOs are trying to make farangs leave LOS by making things up.

[Tom89]

On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 1:28 PM, Dmaxdan said:

They have to have rules in order to keep out the undesirables....or is it the desirables, I'm never really sure. 

They have to have rules in order to justify their jobs and pensions.

[MeePeeMai]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'm confused. I've never been given a receipt for a TM 30 when staying at an hotel overnight, so how could I file one in my passport? It's not even our responsibility for doing them, unless it's our own property. Seems like some IOs are trying to make farangs leave LOS by making things up.

You will not get a receipt for staying in a hotel.  They can see it on their computer at Immigration if you stayed in a hotel and they filed the TM30.

 

You will get a receipt if you rent a house and you follow the rules and file a TM30.

Edited April 28, 2019 by MeePeeMai

[thaibeachlovers]

Just now, MeePeeMai said:

You will not get a receipt for staying in a hotel.

 

You will get a receipt if you rent a house and you follow the rules and file a TM30.

The poster I quoted referenced an hotel stay, so as I agree with you, how could he file one for that hotel stay?

[Peterw42]

.

Edited April 28, 2019 by Peterw42

[MeePeeMai]

I

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

The poster I quoted referenced an hotel stay, so as I agree with you, how could he file one for that hotel stay?

It is the hotel's responsibility to file the TM30.  That is the reason that you must provide a passport to check into a hotel here (if they are following the rules).  The information on your passport is required to file a TM30.  If the hotel does not file a TM30 for your stay then they are in violation and they could be fined.  

 

If the hotel files a TM30 for you within 24 hours after check-in (or on the next Monday if you check-in on a Friday/Sat/Sun) then your TM30 is in their system.  You will never get a receipt for a TM30 if staying in a hotel (unless you are living there and request one - maybe).

[Sydebolle]

Some 20+ friends have moved on to other places as they just had it with all that ever increasing government crap.

They moved to Bali, Sihanoukville, Luang Prabang and Mandalay. Three moved onto Malaysia and reported "found houses without imminent minarets, could buy a house in our name, two cars (first one duty free, the second one at half the duty) and got a five year visa with multiple re-entry. No TM 1 to 200 forms, no photocopies and no 90-days reporting nor TM30. I feel more than welcome here and certainly much more freedom with less Thai lacking-common-sense- bureaucracy breathing down our necks."

I assume that the net balance of retirees is shrinking as fewer come than go .......... 

[MeePeeMai]

1 minute ago, Peterw42 said:

On one of my recent 90 day reports I was called on a missing TM30 (after staying in a hotel) and forced to file my "missing" TM30 before I could file my 90 day report.  I was not fined but warned not to let it happen again.

Sorry, let me clear up the confusion.

 

I stayed in a hotel in Bangkok for a few days.  The hotel filed a TM30 while I was there.  Immigration new that I had stayed there.

 

When I returned home to my rented house (in Loei), my landlord was required to file a TM30 for me stating that I was back in his rental property again (I know it is absolutely crazy that it should be reported when a person goes home).  This TM30 was not done and this is where the problem arose.

 

On my next trip to Immigration to do my next 90 day report, I was questioned why I did not have a TM30 submitted when I had returned to my home after staying in Bangkok for a few days.  There was no receipt in my passport for this missing TM30.  Here if filing a TM30 for a rented house, a receipt of the TM30 is stapled in your passport.

 

I hope this makes it clearer.

[aussieinphuket]

again and i will just say this is one of the reasons why i decided to take the Thai Elite card for 5 years

as sick and tired of all the paper work and the constant chopping and changing of their so called rules we farangs must jump through hoops for... i know its expensive but for peace of mind for 5 yrs i will happily take it again when mine and my wife expire.....  no paper work, no going to immigration, no bank records and letter form banks, no deposit of thb800k or 1.600.000 thb for married couple..... thank you

 

now the 90 day reporting is even different how many times will it change a few years ago we just had to go to immigration given them our passport with our tm30 arrival card and they would print a slip of paper out and staple into the back of your passport, now all changed need various copies of pages etc then you use to be able to take wife passport and just hand it over and do for her no now they want to see her in person also.

 

one good thing i tried the drive through at phuket immigration for 90 days reporting with all the new paperwork required and it worked wonderful, lady was very helpful, my wife was not with me and when she asked where she was i quickly said in hospital and she said thats ok i will do for you. 

 

what will be next, the one that got me pissed off was the photo required of both standing outside your villa with address showing on the wall between you, we arrived with all paper work (this when had the retirement visa) immigration guy looked at it and said where are your hands in the photo we were sitting in front of him and said here they are, no go all the way home, take a photo again with hands also showing in photo.... small things amuse small minds....... another wasted day back and forth to immigration... what's next......

[mike787]

On 4/26/2019 at 11:14 AM, Yeahbutwhytho said:

800k in a bank policy. Has now been extended to 6 months kept in the bank, do not touch it. You will risk the opportunity of staying another year if you do.
Every year you need to do the same process if you plan to 'continue your retirement break another year
90 day reporting on your every move or get fined/risk your future stay
TM30 - You will be fined and risk your future stay if you don't keep up with 24 hours notice when you arrive/leave your premises, condo owners are not responsible anymore

Like water boarding...absolute idiots here...but no problem letting crime and Russian mafia carry on, business as usual for their visas and big brown envelopes...

 

On 4/26/2019 at 11:20 AM, Johnny Rotten said:

It's a Joke. Where else in the world would you have to fill in all these forms and go though all the hoops?

In developed countries you need to be committed of a crime, placed on probation, and get to wear a GPS Ankle Bracelet. In Thailand enjoy the paper work and hoops...it's a circus.  Enjoy your lovely stay in LOS  

Edited April 28, 2019 by mike787