Trump: Nothing wrong with accepting dirt from foreign governments on opponents

[soalbundy]

On 6/13/2019 at 8:52 AM, TopDeadSenter said:

Trump is right, again. In light of the extreme and unending( some would argue unhinged)resistance to his legitimate rule, he needs to use every arrow in his quiver. These are not normal times.

 

 Also good to see Trump riding roughshod over the FBI. I had expected after they lost all credibility in the last few years with their partisan politics games that Trump would replace the agency lock, stock and barrel. Maybe in his 2nd term there will be time for this?

So would it be OK to get the dirt on him from a foreign government, or would that be fake news and witch hunting?

[usviphotography]

6 hours ago, heybruce said:

 

So Steele knew what he was doing and had an excellent inside source.  I'm not surprised.  I don't see how that bolsters your argument.

Steele was a foreign spy. His source was a foreign politician (who btw, never met Trump and would be better classified as a very bad and highly biased source). Veselnitskaya was a top lawyer in Russia. Unlike the Ukrainian MP she would actually be a very good source for the alleged information being provided but would obviously have the same massive bias problem. But their biases and merit as sources are really besides the point.

 

Clinton took info from: Former Foreign Spy, Sitting Foreign Politician 

Trump Jr took it from: Foreign Lawyer

 

How is the latter worse than the former? Only argument I've heard from your side is that what Clinton did is ok because Clinton laundered the information through the third party entity fusion GPS. 

[Sujo]

3 hours ago, riclag said:

He was gathering info from a hostile gov(Russia).It was leaked to news agencies.That infoe was payed for by FBI,FusionGPS,DNC and HC as I stated in my previous post.

If Mr. Trumps campaign were accused of this they would be all guilty or at least investigated by a Special Counsel! How ironic

Which part of PAID for dont you understand?

[Sujo]

48 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

No, silly, he'd have to hire a law firm  or consulting group to pay the foreign government for the information and then have them hand it over to him. You see, as long as you launder it through a third party, everything is fine and dandy! 

What foreign govt did they pay?

 

they paid a consultancy firm to investigate. Who then hired a UK citizen, not a foreign power.

 

this is like trying to talk to 5 year olds that cannot grasp the most basics of a basic law.

 

even trumps own sycophant lawyers say what he wants to do is illegal.

[mtls2005]

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/52/30121

 

[bristolboy]

17 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

Steele was a foreign spy. His source was a foreign politician (who btw, never met Trump and would be better classified as a very bad and highly biased source). Veselnitskaya was a top lawyer in Russia. Unlike the Ukrainian MP she would actually be a very good source for the alleged information being provided but would obviously have the same massive bias problem. But their biases and merit as sources are really besides the point.

 

Clinton took info from: Former Foreign Spy, Sitting Foreign Politician 

Trump Jr took it from: Foreign Lawyer

 

How is the latter worse than the former? Only argument I've heard from your side is that what Clinton did is ok because Clinton laundered the information through the third party entity fusion GPS. 

Because he was a former spy and openly acknowledged as such. He was not working as an agent for any foreign government. He was working for Fusion GPS.

[bristolboy]

30 minutes ago, riclag said:

Stephanoppolis Included "foreigner " "hostile countries" and other countries in his ridiculous question that back fired on the liberals! The Fisa didn't include Clinton and the DNC sponsored  the new opo research There was a GOP(never Trumper) oppo version that was dropped  and the second one with the DNC   and the newly hired C. Steele who according to the FBI ,Mr. OHR was bias(dossier) in Mr. Trump being elected

I kinda wish I knew what you trying to say here so I could shred it into tiny little pieces. I guess incomprehensibility is a damned good defense. But not so useful for making a point.

[Sujo]

17 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

Steele was a foreign spy. His source was a foreign politician (who btw, never met Trump and would be better classified as a very bad and highly biased source). Veselnitskaya was a top lawyer in Russia. Unlike the Ukrainian MP she would actually be a very good source for the alleged information being provided but would obviously have the same massive bias problem. But their biases and merit as sources are really besides the point.

 

Clinton took info from: Former Foreign Spy, Sitting Foreign Politician 

Trump Jr took it from: Foreign Lawyer

 

How is the latter worse than the former? Only argument I've heard from your side is that what Clinton did is ok because Clinton laundered the information through the third party entity fusion GPS. 

What Clinton did was perfectly legal which has been explained.

The reason the FBI should be notified is so they can, amongst other things, test the veracity of the claims in the dossier. To which they found many claims true and not one claim was found to be false.

 

what trump is suggesting is illegal.

[riclag]

27 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Fusion GPS (who later employed  Steele) was initially engaged by a rightwing online publication, The Washington Free Beacon - Oh you forgot to mention that!

 

The Washington Free Beacon is an American, Washington DC Private business largely funded by Republican Donar Paul Singer - Oh you forgot to mention that!

 

The Contract between the Washington Free Beacon and Fusion GPS was to conduct campaign research for several Republican candidates into Trump, Singer and these Republican candidates were part of the 'Never Trump' movement within the Republican Party - Oh you forgot to mention that! 

 

The Washington Free Beacon dropped the contract with Fusion (for unexplained reasons) and Fusion then took a second contract with Clinton's campaign - Oh you forgot to mention that!

 

Fusion GPS is an American, Washington DC based private organisation - Oh you forgot to mention that. 

 

Research was fine when the GOP were paying for it, but became a problem when the Clinton's campaign were paying for it. Or did it become a problem when Steele started turning up extremely concerning evidence of Russian interference in he election to benefit Trump - a point that has since been proven. 

 

 

The timeline is here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2018/politics/steele-timeline/?utm_term=.4199e6de49dc

 

Post #155

[Sujo]

2 minutes ago, riclag said:

Post #155

Perhaps you could instead explain what trump say is legal.

[usviphotography]

11 minutes ago, Sujo said:

What foreign govt did they pay?

 

they paid a consultancy firm to investigate. Who then hired a UK citizen, not a foreign power.

 

this is like trying to talk to 5 year olds that cannot grasp the most basics of a basic law.

 

even trumps own sycophant lawyers say what he wants to do is illegal.

The law you are trying to wrongly apply is about "foreign nationals" not "foreign governments". Steeele was a foreign national. And the Ukrainian MP was a member of the Ukrainian Government. So tell me who the 5 year old is now? 

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

The law you are trying to wrongly apply is about "foreign nationals" not "foreign governments". Steeele was a foreign national. And the Ukrainian MP was a member of the Ukrainian Government. So tell me who the 5 year old is now? 

Steele was employed by an American business, headquartered in Washington DC, he was in all respects and private citizen employed by an American based and registered business. 

 

[bristolboy]

10 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

The law you are trying to wrongly apply is about "foreign nationals" not "foreign governments". Steeele was a foreign national. And the Ukrainian MP was a member of the Ukrainian Government. So tell me who the 5 year old is now? 

You've got it wrong. It's about donations and such. Not someone working on a contract basis and being paid for it. Steele wasn't donating anything.

Here's the relevant statute:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/52/30121

[usviphotography]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Steele was employed by an American business, headquartered in Washington DC, he was in all respects and private citizen employed by an American based and registered business. 

 

So what? He's a foreign national. Clinton Campaign got a report from him. Worse, the report was largely compiled by a sitting member of the Ukrainian Government. By your own logic, Clinton committed a far greater crime than Trump. 

 

Now obviously, Trump is correct and none of this stuff is actually illegal, but if you want to play these games, and you want people to take you seriously, then you better be consistent. Hell, Barack Obama met with Merkel in Germany as a candidate in 2008 for a photo op. Held a huge rally in Berlin. Yet you are bitching about Trump Jr meeting with a foreign lawyer? Get real!

[Rimmer]

A ridiculous troll JPG has been removed

[Sujo]

3 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

So what? He's a foreign national. Clinton Campaign got a report from him. Worse, the report was largely compiled by a sitting member of the Ukrainian Government. By your own logic, Clinton committed a far greater crime than Trump. 

 

Now obviously, Trump is correct and none of this stuff is actually illegal, but if you want to play these games, and you want people to take you seriously, then you better be consistent. Hell, Barack Obama met with Merkel in Germany as a candidate in 2008 for a photo op. Held a huge rally in Berlin. Yet you are bitching about Trump Jr meeting with a foreign lawyer? Get real!

The report was compiled by Steele. Thats why its called the Steele dossier.

 

Trump is correct. His own appointed AG, his own appointed FBI director,  electoral commission and others are all wrong. Where did Trump get his law degree?

 

if i ever get arrested i sure hope you are on the jury. I would never be convicted of anything.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

13 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

So what? He's a foreign national. Clinton Campaign got a report from him. Worse, the report was largely compiled by a sitting member of the Ukrainian Government. By your own logic, Clinton committed a far greater crime than Trump. 

 

Now obviously, Trump is correct and none of this stuff is actually illegal, but if you want to play these games, and you want people to take you seriously, then you better be consistent. Hell, Barack Obama met with Merkel in Germany as a candidate in 2008 for a photo op. Held a huge rally in Berlin. Yet you are bitching about Trump Jr meeting with a foreign lawyer? Get real!

Your second hand arguments are irrelevant. 

 

 

[Sujo]

I would laugh for a week if Kim and Putin gave information on private discussions with trump to the dems.

 

Trumps reaction would be hilarious.

[Sujo]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Your second hand arguments are irrelevant. 

 

 

I seem to recall a certain candidate visiting mexico.

[usviphotography]

2 minutes ago, Sujo said:

I seem to recall a certain candidate visiting mexico.

Yeah, but Trump isn't dope trying to say it is illegal. You are. When Barrack Obama visited Germany in July of 2008 and was feted by the President and held a huge photo op rally in front of tens of thousands of German nationals he was breaking the law. That is all you have to say and though you'd still be wrong, at least you wouldn't be a hypocritical shill. 

[Sujo]

5 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

Yeah, but Trump isn't dope trying to say it is illegal. You are. When Barrack Obama visited Germany in July of 2008 and was feted by the President and held a huge photo op rally in front of tens of thousands of German nationals he was breaking the law. That is all you have to say and though you'd still be wrong, at least you wouldn't be a hypocritical shill. 

I didnt say him visiting was illegal.

 

but what he says he wants to do is illegal. Even his own crony the AG says its illegal.

[JHolmesJr]

weird arguments from democrat supporters who are losing it by the day.

 

If I was a foreign intelligence agency wanting to slip the Don some information, I would also do it through 

a private citizen working for an american registered company...seems hassle-free and should be 

real easy to set up.

[simple1]

3 hours ago, rabas said:

AMERICAN COMPANIES OPERATING IN RUSSIA. In total there are almost 3,000 American companies in Russia, and the U.S. is also the leader in terms of foreign companies in Special Economic Zones, with 11 projects.[Dec 16, 2016]

 

From Harvard Kennedy School for International Affairs.

There is no endemic reason for Russian-U.S. relations to be as tense as they have [been]. This situation is largely due, on one side, to mishandling of Russian affairs by both the Clinton and Bush administrations, and on the other by the obvious manipulation of anti-Americanism for domestic gain by the Vladimir Putin and Dmitry Medvedev administrations in Russia. Unfortunately, this means that only unilateral U.S. action can undermine the cynical policies of the Russian leadership and restore dynamism to the Russian-U.S. relationship.

[2009]

 

Absolutely, Russian meddling in US elections and other aspects of US life must be investigated. They blew it and are still blowing it by focusing on Trump.  

 

The point is trump misled the American general public regards his attempts to have a 'trump tower' in Moscow when running for Office.

[Tug]

Well looks like Donald is trying to backpedal as fast as he can guess an adult had a talk with him lol the dude is just pathetic 

[attrayant]

58 minutes ago, Tug said:

Well looks like Donald is trying to backpedal as fast as he can guess an adult had a talk with him

 

 

Maybe he got an irate call from the Queen of Dolphins and the King of Porpoises.

[attrayant]

4 hours ago, JHolmesJr said:

If I was a foreign intelligence agency wanting to slip the Don some information, I would also do it through a private citizen working for an american registered company...seems hassle-free and should be real easy to set up.

 

You have just demonstrated why 52 USC 30121 exists and why it needs to be taken seriously.  But to get back to the OP, you wouldn't even need to do that because Trump just said he has no problem committing the crime of soliciting election interference from a foreign national.

[JHolmesJr]

17 minutes ago, attrayant said:

 

You have just demonstrated why 52 USC 30121 exists and why it needs to be taken seriously.  But to get back to the OP, you wouldn't even need to do that because Trump just said he has no problem committing the crime of soliciting election interference from a foreign national.

 

If a novice like me can figure this out, I imagine the real players are far more sophisticated.

Everyone traffics in opposition information during election time. Dems need to get off their sanctimonious high horse.

Even the US provides dirt to other countries....enough with the virtue signalling.

 

Once again Trump cuts through the BS with the truth.

[heybruce]

8 hours ago, rabas said:

AMERICAN COMPANIES OPERATING IN RUSSIA. In total there are almost 3,000 American companies in Russia, and the U.S. is also the leader in terms of foreign companies in Special Economic Zones, with 11 projects.[Dec 16, 2016]

 

From Harvard Kennedy School for International Affairs.

There is no endemic reason for Russian-U.S. relations to be as tense as they have [been]. This situation is largely due, on one side, to mishandling of Russian affairs by both the Clinton and Bush administrations, and on the other by the obvious manipulation of anti-Americanism for domestic gain by the Vladimir Putin and Dmitry Medvedev administrations in Russia. Unfortunately, this means that only unilateral U.S. action can undermine the cynical policies of the Russian leadership and restore dynamism to the Russian-U.S. relationship.

[2009]

 

Absolutely, Russian meddling in US elections and other aspects of US life must be investigated. They blew it and are still blowing it by focusing on Trump.  

 

Yes, there are a lot of US companies doing business with Russia.  How many have had their CEO's run for President while denying ongoing business negotiations with Russia.

 

Mueller did not focus solely on Trump, he investigated and documented a great deal about Russian interference.

 

What leadership is Trump providing in ending Russian meddling?  His latest comments sound like an open invitation for more.

[heybruce]

8 hours ago, usviphotography said:

No, silly, he'd have to hire a law firm  or consulting group to pay the foreign government for the information and then have them hand it over to him. You see, as long as you launder it through a third party, everything is fine and dandy! 

You would definitely tell your children it's OK to take candy from strangers, wouldn't you?

 

8 hours ago, usviphotography said:

How is it whataboutism is the other side did it too and has not once apologized? If you were bemoaning the fact that both Trump AND the Democrats admit they would gladly collude with a foreign power who had information on a political opponent then maybe people would take you seriously. Your selective outrage betrays your true feelings. You realize this is all one big nothing burger, which is why you don't care in the slightest that Hillary colluded with foreign powers. You just want to gin up fake outrage to slander Trump. 

Why do you have so much trouble with this concept? 

 

Paying for research from legitimate sources is legal.  Accepting anything of value from a foreign country (or its representative) for free is illegal.

 

How many times does this have to be explained?

[heybruce]

8 hours ago, usviphotography said:

No, silly, he'd have to hire a law firm  or consulting group to pay the foreign government for the information and then have them hand it over to him. You see, as long as you launder it through a third party, everything is fine and dandy! 

You would definitely tell your children it's OK to take candy from strangers, wouldn't you?

 

8 hours ago, usviphotography said:

How is it whataboutism is the other side did it too and has not once apologized? If you were bemoaning the fact that both Trump AND the Democrats admit they would gladly collude with a foreign power who had information on a political opponent then maybe people would take you seriously. Your selective outrage betrays your true feelings. You realize this is all one big nothing burger, which is why you don't care in the slightest that Hillary colluded with foreign powers. You just want to gin up fake outrage to slander Trump. 

Why do you have so much trouble with this concept? 

 

Paying for research from legitimate sources is legal.  Accepting anything of value from a foreign country (or its representative) for free is illegal.

 

How many times does this have to be explained?