Popular Post petemoss Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 Just now, sanemax said: No one has claimed that the Gibraltar secret service were the main players in this story Try telling that to Basil. 555 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Dumbastheycome Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Basil B said: Who else could have done it? even the Iranians have not come up with a plausible explanation as to who else would atack oil tankers off their coast. The MEK ? It would suit the agenda of all but Iran Govt. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpoint Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 (edited) There's one easy way to settle the arguing over whether the ship was seized for violating the sanction on Iranian oil exports imposed by, and at the request of, the US, or, as the Gibraltan's claim, because it may have been about to violate EU sanctions on supplying oil to Syria (Thought crime, anyone?) Allow the ship to sail to a non EU sanctioned Mediterranean port, or to another location away from the Mediterranean, and sell its oil there. Edited July 5, 2019 by ballpoint 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ozman52 Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 12 minutes ago, petemoss said: The video of the removal of the mine from the ship's hull showed a boat with several crew. There was no indication that the crew or the boat were Iranian other than the US administration claimed it whilst offering zero evidence of their claim. In fact the crew were dressed in garb that you would normally associate with Arabs (as in Saudis) rather than Iranians. Also, why remove a mine? Because they wanted to cause relatively minimum damage to one of their own vessels. Would the Iranians have done this? The crew were rescued by Iranians, the White House claimed that they had been taken hostage as a rescue by Iranians didn't fit their narrative. This was proved to be completely false. Just more White House propaganda, which many claim was the root of the whole incident. doh! Why remove a mine? Because the POS didn't go bang and was easily identifiable as being Iranian, right down to its lack of reliability and the 'Made in Iran' printed on it. The patrol boat was easily identified as Iranian, and I don't care what colour headrags were worn, Iranian patrol boats are usually manned by bloody Iranians. 3 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ballpoint Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, Basil B said: Yes... Nether seen how easy it is to track a ship? https://www.myshiptracking.com/ Someone should show that to the US navy. I'm surprised this tanker managed to sail so far without one of their boats blundering into it. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelseafan Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Basil B said: Who else could have done it? even the Iranians have not come up with a plausible explanation as to who else would atack oil tankers off their coast. Have you never seen Tomorrow never Dies ? ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post petemoss Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 4 minutes ago, Ozman52 said: doh! Why remove a mine? Because the POS didn't go bang and was easily identifiable as being Iranian, right down to its lack of reliability and the 'Made in Iran' printed on it. The patrol boat was easily identified as Iranian, and I don't care what colour headrags were worn, Iranian patrol boats are usually manned by bloody Iranians. Based on exactly zero facts or evidence other than the White House says so. What is Trump's lies/day ratio? 4 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenl Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 18 minutes ago, sanemax said: No one has claimed that the Gibraltar secret service were the main players in this story Guess you missed post #8 and his contention that the Gibraltar Secret Service tracked the ship from Teheran. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 2 hours ago, Basil B said: Who else could have done it? even the Iranians have not come up with a plausible explanation as to who else would atack oil tankers off their coast. There are plenty of plausible explanations. Not saying they're true but plausible. We know that the UAW manufactured an incident to justify the break in relations with Qatar. And ya think MbS is too principled to manufacture an incident? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 What some overenthusiastic posters have lost sight of is that this was an Iranian tanker taking it cargo to Syria. It was not a foreign tanker taking Iranian oil to, say China. And there are lots of Chinese tankers doing just that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post khunken Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 3 hours ago, petemoss said: The video of the removal of the mine from the ship's hull showed a boat with several crew. There was no indication that the crew or the boat were Iranian other than the US administration claimed it whilst offering zero evidence of their claim. In fact the crew were dressed in garb that you would normally associate with Arabs (as in Saudis) rather than Iranians. Also, why remove a mine? Because they wanted to cause relatively minimum damage to one of their own vessels. Would the Iranians have done this? The crew were rescued by Iranians, the White House claimed that they had been taken hostage as a rescue by Iranians didn't fit their narrative. This was proved to be completely false. Just more White House propaganda, which many claim was the root of the whole incident. Totally agree. I would add that the attack on a Japanese oil tanker occurred on the very day that the Japanese PM was visiting Iran. 4 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krataiboy Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 5 hours ago, petemoss said: Well in the sense that Britain's action was taken at the request of the US, not the EU, it has. Here we go again, the UK doing the US's dirty work for it. Expect much more when Boris becomes PM. Boris Johnson = Trump's lapdog. Call me cynical if you like, but some would regard a tanker of somebody else's oil as a cheap price to pay for the promise of a lucrative post-Brexit trade deal with the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petemoss Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 6 minutes ago, Krataiboy said: Call me cynical if you like, but some would regard a tanker of somebody else's oil as a cheap price to pay for the promise of a lucrative post-Brexit trade deal with the US. True if trump could be Trusted to keep his word. Unfortunately, he regularly proves that he can't. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 27 minutes ago, Krataiboy said: Call me cynical if you like, but some would regard a tanker of somebody else's oil as a cheap price to pay for the promise of a lucrative post-Brexit trade deal with the US. Except that the UK is working quite openly with France & Germany to create a payment system that won't be subject to US sanctions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmicbkktxl Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 5 hours ago, Basil B said: Who else could have done it? even the Iranians have not come up with a plausible explanation as to who else would atack oil tankers off their coast. Saudi or UAE 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post habanero Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 5 hours ago, Basil B said: But Gibraltar has no refinery... Syria does! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 8 hours ago, huangnon said: Regime Change #178 now underway Did they make the Captain walk the plank? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Morch Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 7 hours ago, petemoss said: Well in the sense that Britain's action was taken at the request of the US, not the EU, it has. Here we go again, the UK doing the US's dirty work for it. Expect much more when Boris becomes PM. Boris Johnson = Trump's lapdog. What you're relating it Spain's version. Even the OP notes Spain's issues regarding Gibraltar. That you cite it as fact doesn't make it so. 6 hours ago, petemoss said: It was the Royal Navy not the "Gibraltar Navy" that acted. Although the Brits used the excuse of EU sanctions on Syria, it was never about that. In reality, it was US sanctions on the export of Iranian oil which was the issue. The intel and request to stop the ship came from the US. The EU had no idea that it was happening, hence the noises from Spain. As I said, expect much more of this when Boris is PM. Boris likey licky big orange botty! Somehow doubt you've got the inside track as to what it was or wasn't about. More like your opinion. So, "in reality" doesn't apply much. The same goes for the bits about "intel and request" coming from the USA, and the EU having "no idea that it was happening". The OP notes that the ship was known to be involved in Iranian sanction-breaking efforts. I believe various European intelligence services have enough assets and interest to follow such things. 6 hours ago, petemoss said: Although I belive that it probably was Iran, there is some evidence that it was a false flag attack. Saudi forces acting on the instructions of the CIA/Mossad. It certainly gave strength to the US desire to launch a military attack on Iran. Not familiar with any "evidence" that it was a false flag operation. There are claims it was. Again, not the same thing. Citing "Saudi forces acting on the instructions of the CIA/Mossad" is supported by nothing. 6 hours ago, petemoss said: The video of the removal of the mine from the ship's hull showed a boat with several crew. There was no indication that the crew or the boat were Iranian other than the US administration claimed it whilst offering zero evidence of their claim. In fact the crew were dressed in garb that you would normally associate with Arabs (as in Saudis) rather than Iranians. Also, why remove a mine? Because they wanted to cause relatively minimum damage to one of their own vessels. Would the Iranians have done this? The crew were rescued by Iranians, the White House claimed that they had been taken hostage as a rescue by Iranians didn't fit their narrative. This was proved to be completely false. Just more White House propaganda, which many claim was the root of the whole incident. The video in question is indeed no conclusive evidence of Iran's involvement. That said, as far as I'm aware Iran did not deny the vessel or crew being Iranian. Nor did it offer any strong counter-evidence. Being dressed as this or that would mean less than nothing, if it was a covert operation. Could just as well be Iranians masquerading as Arabs or whatnot. Why remove the mine? One obvious explanation would be to removing evidence from the scene, assuming it failed to blow. 5 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BestB Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 As i mentioned earlier, and so it starts Major General Mohsen Rezaee of Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, who is also the secretary of the influential Expediency Discernment Council, tweeted that Iran should be ready for counter measures. Should Britain refuse to release the ship, it is the authorities’ “duty to seize a British oil tanker,” he argued. https://twitter.com/ir_rezaee/status/1147022253718003712 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post rott Posted July 5, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2019 7 hours ago, petemoss said: Based on exactly zero facts or evidence other than the White House says so. What is Trump's lies/day ratio? Speaking of ratios, 221 posts in 15 days - welcome aboard new blood is welcome. But what the hell did you do with yourself before? 3 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil B Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 1 minute ago, sanemax said: No one has claimed that the Gibraltar secret service were the main players in this story No and they probably would not have got involved without the Americans requesting their action, probably the Americans asked the British Government first who had to tell them that Gibraltar was actually a self governing Crown Dependency... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 Off-topic, conspiracy post reported and removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratcatcher Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 (edited) Anyone want to speculate on the destination of the GRACE 1 ? It seems that she has departed Gibraltar and is underway heading east. Maybe someone with maritime knowledge can add some info. She is registered in Panama, no mention of Iran. Can anyone confirm whether the ship is still detained despite the report I posted? https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/details/ships/shipid:416354/mmsi:355271000/imo:9116412/vessel:GRACE_1 https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/shipid:416354/zoom:14 https://edition.cnn.com/2019/07/04/uk/tanker-syria-gibraltar-intl-gbr/index.html Edited July 5, 2019 by ratcatcher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jerry787 Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 britain a losing US puppet on its way to brexit with a boris that will bring the economy on its knees. definitely britain after the mess made in Iraq and Libya now trying to mess also Iran so if they may succeed (almost improbable) the middle east will be a huge war zone with millions slaughtered and much more on the way to europe as refugee. that is the so called democracy ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BestB Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 13 minutes ago, Jerry787 said: britain a losing US puppet on its way to brexit with a boris that will bring the economy on its knees. definitely britain after the mess made in Iraq and Libya now trying to mess also Iran so if they may succeed (almost improbable) the middle east will be a huge war zone with millions slaughtered and much more on the way to europe as refugee. that is the so called democracy ! Highly unlikely for a full scale war, no one can afford one . If I had to guess , most likely some skirmish and then either willingly will sit down or crawl to Putin for help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 9 hours ago, ratcatcher said: Anyone want to speculate on the destination of the GRACE 1 ? It seems that she has departed Gibraltar and is underway heading east. Maybe someone with maritime knowledge can add some info. She is registered in Panama, no mention of Iran. Can anyone confirm whether the ship is still detained despite the report I posted? https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/details/ships/shipid:416354/mmsi:355271000/imo:9116412/vessel:GRACE_1 https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/shipid:416354/zoom:14 https://edition.cnn.com/2019/07/04/uk/tanker-syria-gibraltar-intl-gbr/index.html According to the tracker seems like the Grace 1 is still "anchored off the coast of Gibraltar", as the CNN reports says. As for "no mention of Iran" - that's hardly correct. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozman52 Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 9 hours ago, ratcatcher said: Anyone want to speculate on the destination of the GRACE 1 ? It seems that she has departed Gibraltar and is underway heading east. Maybe someone with maritime knowledge can add some info. She is registered in Panama, no mention of Iran. Can anyone confirm whether the ship is still detained despite the report I posted? https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/details/ships/shipid:416354/mmsi:355271000/imo:9116412/vessel:GRACE_1 https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/shipid:416354/zoom:14 https://edition.cnn.com/2019/07/04/uk/tanker-syria-gibraltar-intl-gbr/index.html Panama now has the largest registry in the world, followed by Liberia, the Marshall Islands, Hong Kong and Singapore. By last year, almost three quarters of the world's fleet was registered under a flag of a country other than its own. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-28558480 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelseafan Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 12 hours ago, Jerry787 said: britain a losing US puppet on its way to brexit with a boris that will bring the economy on its knees. definitely britain after the mess made in Iraq and Libya now trying to mess also Iran so if they may succeed (almost improbable) the middle east will be a huge war zone with millions slaughtered and much more on the way to europe as refugee. that is the so called democracy ! As Churchill said, The best argument against Democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPI Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 23 hours ago, stevenl said: "everybody know they were behind it... " Why does everybody know that? Because US and SA say so? They got the photo's that prove it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post stevenl Posted July 6, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 6, 2019 15 minutes ago, TPI said: They got the photo's that prove it! No, they don't. They have some very unclear video that shows some people remove a mine. Nowhere is it proven that those people removing it were Iranians, and it is not proven that the people removing it were the same ones responsible for attaching it in the first place. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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