What are expats really saying when they say they don't feel welcome anymore in the LOS

[luckyluke]

10 minutes ago, billd766 said:

I don't think that the IO at Khampaeng Phet was too worried over much about the funds coming from TW as long as there was enough coming in per month.

Great for you, but the problem is, it isn't everywhere like that. 

 

In fact nothing is for sure nowhere, except at the very moment one is confronted with it. 

 

 

[billd766]

Just now, luckyluke said:

Great for you, but the problem is, it isn't everywhere like that. 

 

In fact nothing is for sure nowhere, except at the very moment one is confronted with it. 

 

 

Sometimes it differs between regions, provinces and even between IO officers at the same office.

[luckyluke]

2 minutes ago, billd766 said:

even between IO officers at the same office.

Or even the same officer, according the way he woke up, or other circumstances. 

[wwest5829]

22 hours ago, from the home of CC said:

IMO what's really being said is " I can't afford to live here anymore" end of story..

Might come to be as one reason to seek a lower cost country was to be able to have a comfortable (no Mercedes nor swimming pool) working middle class retirement. If I understand from my exposure to many coming to retire in C. Mai, a great number of the some projected 40 K living here were simularly motivated.

[malibukid]

22 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

he is being considerate by not making you and him lose and face and taking the path of least resistance.

i don't expect anything, but many times the red carpet has been rolled out just because I'm a  white farang. Getting my drivers license is one example.

the last thing I will every be is home sick, and I have a lot of money and can go back to the USA any time I want. I could live in a ski resort or beach town or own my own farm or small ranch. no thanks.

 

op you did not say how old you are.

 

F*****g lift lines at Mammoth

[yogi100]

Perhaps if someone in the Thai govt with a bit of authority reads some of these posts in Thai Visa and other forums and also listens to the Thai families who benefit financially from the presence of falangs in the LOS they might consider adjusting their attitude towards us.

 

But I won't hold my breath because it's obvious that those Thais with any clout don't like Westerners and would be more than happy to see the back of every single one of us especially the single men.

 

I have heard several Thai bar girls bitching about the reduction in the number of falangs spending money in the bars of Pattaya.  

 

But it's also doubtful if respectable hard working Thais care two hoots about the welfare of bar girls, their families and those in the licensing trade. "Go and get a proper job" they'll probably tell 'em.

 

It must stick in their craw when they see Isaan village girls who've only ever worked in the sex business living in big swanky houses and driving around in fancy cars that they can only dream of ever owning.

 

Jealousy and envy are very strong emotions.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 1, 2019 by yogi100

[timendres]

17 hours ago, Jingthing said:

17 hours ago, JaiLai said:

I've only highlighted something, changed nothing.

 

Relax....

Again, you never have my permission to change the emphasis on my posts. 

It would be nice if TVF provided a means of "identifying" a portion of a post that a reply is addressing specifically, without potentially changing the context or meaning of the original post. Many of us have used underlining or bolding or italics to accomplish this, but clearly the OP can argue that this has the potential to change the meaning of their post (and that is a perfectly valid argument).

[NCC1701A]

Just now, malibukid said:

F*****g lift lines at Mammoth

yes horrible but i can remember when a lift ticket was $12. i would head out from LA in my Jeep in a middle of a storm. Great fun.

later in life i was lucky i skied at Sun Valley and Aspen.  

i would park at county line beach on PCH for free. now it is $8 to park off the highway. not that it really matters.

laguna beach, they "tore" my beach down and put up a hotel. i can only stand there now and watch the tourist who have not a clue how great this was before.   

i rented an apartment in Laguna when I was 20. that is how cheap it was.

but big party in Thailand now. Just as soon as I finish working on my taxes.

 

 

[Nip]

21 hours ago, CMNightRider said:

Maybe what expats who have lived in Thailand for years but are now leaving are saying is "enough is enough."  Thai Immigration has taken their moronic rules and regulations for foreigners to live in Thailand, to some sort of stellar height.  

 

In the long run, Thailand will pay a price for purging their country of westerners.  If these people want a dictatorship, then I hope it works out for them.  According to world history, leaders who have gone down this road before didn't fair too well.    

I'm in total agreement. I abandoned Thailand two years ago after living there for 17 years. I never felt entirely welcome for those 17 years but by 2017 I felt decidedly unwelcome. I was a model immigrant in that I gave all and received nothing in return and all the annoying  traits I grew to dislike about Thai people were beginning to manifest in my own kids. I can't say any one thing caused me to leave but one that irked me was Thai prostitutes within 3 years of landing on our shores were clutching passports and after 17 years in Thailand every time I went to renew my annual visa I felt like a criminal. I had become the irritated and angry old man I swore I would never become.

 

Last year in 2018 I returned to Thailand for two months and embraced the good but was assailed by everything that is bad. That said i had to return this year in July and have just left and shall not return any time soon. 

 

Why? Because from my arrival in Swampy the dislike for the White Man was now in my face. I speak Thai fluently and am a genial good natured individual and accept there are millions of similar Thais but the welcoming I once received is long gone. Anybody notice that the once common Thai wai is now a rarity?  And for me that sums it up. 

 

When I approached the Emirates ground staff member in arrivals to report that my suitcase had been badly damaged and wished to report it she turned and walked away saying complain online. I exit arrivals and when I asked a young woman playing on her phone at the first car rental desk was there a problem with the airport Wi-Fi she dismissed me mumbling it was not her job foreigner. Not a great start and sadly this attitude continued throughout my stay.

 

The TM30? I discovered after 30 days that the woman or company where I was staying despite taking a copy of my passport did not register me and flatly refused to do so. So immigration simmarily refused to stamp the 30 day extension. It took 5 hours to sort it out. The entire operation took me 7 hours.

 

I moved to Pattaya for a few days to visit friends all of whome are making plans to move elsewhere and despite the city being overrun by the people once abhorred by Thais for being smelly it was deserted and they were being embraced to the extent one bar was showing Bollywood movies. But that did not stop the receptionist at a hotel I previously visited at least twice a year for the last 7 years screaming angrily at me as I approached reception; " Foreigner you not pay your bill!" As she lay across her Thai boyfriend on the sofa in reception. She was referring to the advance payment for the following day. Later that night in 7/11 when I innocently queried of the ladybug serving me was the microwaved food in the bag that he had just handed me he screamed 'yes you annoying foreigner' The American guy standing next to me said is that the Thai welcome I've read so much about? Just about summed it all up.

 

While before Thais 

tolerated us now they don't because they have other fish to fry but their overfishing is coming back to boot them in the ass. Im of course not talking about all Thais because while I met hundreds who were pleasant and accommodating the 5 or 6 who needlessly abused me tipped the scales massively. In future I will go where I'm appreciated and welcomed.

 

 

[Dnyy]

22 hours ago, JaiLai said:

If you can afford to live here then you can pay people to take away the hassles of visa system, end of.

If you are not married to a Thai or too young for retirement visa, tell me how to pay people to make visa hassles go away (not talking about Elite Visa). I am not affected by any of the visa issues but I think a lot of people not affected making it sound so simple. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by Dnyy

[tabarin]

I do notice a big change towards foreigners personally, but not in Chiang Mai (where I also live). 
Other than that, I left for a year in between of all the years here, nobody cared or even noticed that I have been gone that time, just a few said; o didn't see you a while. Since I figured that out, I also care much less about many people that I thought to care about (and they about me).

So yeah, I guess they would not care much if one leaves, they will just temporary feel some pain of missed turn-over perhaps, which they will also forget soon enough.

Edited September 1, 2019 by tabarin

[Dnyy]

6 minutes ago, Nip said:

Anybody notice that the once common Thai wai is now a rarity?

YES! Always seeing foreigners doing the wai but in most cases not receiving it back

[malibukid]

3 hours ago, Jimbo2014 said:

There are just simply less good reasons to stay here period - certainly in Bangkok.  Its now overpriced, horrendously polluted.  Traffic is insane.  Immigration continues to make it more difficult for foreigners.  Roads are the most dangerous in the world.  Private schools are outrageously priced.  Smiles are few and far between whether your Thai or not, most people are overworked and seem miserable and are not in control of their destiny or their country. 

 

However the weather remains good and if you have cash you can live in a happy bubble :).

but they do have Ben and Jerry's at Siam Paragon

[ThaiBunny]

2 minutes ago, Dnyy said:

YES! Always seeing foreigners doing the wai but in most cases not receiving it back

NO! But seeing foreigners wai each other just makes me laugh

[tabarin]

8 minutes ago, Dnyy said:

YES! Always seeing foreigners doing the wai but in most cases not receiving it back

Seeing it happen, not to receive back, more than before for sure too. Not talking about the misplaced wais, but legit ones as well.
I stopped to wai most times because of that.

Edited September 1, 2019 by tabarin

[jingjai9]

I think the sentiment concerning farangs not feeling welcomed here in Thailand anymore comes from those who have been here a long time (20+ years ago). Back in the day, farangs were somewhat of a novelty in many parts of the country. If you went into a restaurant or store or whatever, people would look, smile, point, etc. I can even remember a time or two not having to wait in queues at the bank or a store as tellers or clerks would motion to you to come on up and they would take you right away. In some ways being a farang in rural parts of Thailand was like being a minor celebrity.

 

Sometimes little children would cry at the sight of a farang as they had never been near a non-Asian person. You would still be overcharged at markets and for services so it was not all rosey, but it was not at all unusaual to feel special.

 

Over the years the novelty of course wore off, the Internet came along and with it Youtube, the number of foreign tourists and residents in Thailand increased exponentially and the next thing you knew farangs are a dime a dozen.

 

Time marched on and of course problems ensued. Thailand modernized and it became necessary to manage the quantity and quality of people coming into the country. Laws and regulations were enacted, mistakes were made, toes stepped on, misunderstandings became evident, and mixed feelings lurked on the sidelines.

 

So welcome to 2019,  I think there are still many lovely people around in Thailand, but maybe not quite as many as in the old days, but you know what old days are - the past.

[khunPer]

I've been regular visitor since 2001 and resident since 2005, and I don't have any problems. Thais were very polite and friendly to me when i first came here, and they still are. They gladly sawadee me with a smile – lots of local folks even mention my name: »Sawadee ka/krap khun Per« – and the ongoing small changes in demand for paperwork to be resident for another year I won't let spoil my happiness; I simply try to be organized in advance, and Thaivisa forum is a great help for local shared knowledge.

 

Buddha said that what you send out, is what you get back – or something pretty close to that – so smile to- and greet the locals, accept their culture, and remember that you are a guest in their village, and their country, seemed to work extremely well for me; I have more Thai friends than alien ditto.

 

Yes, currency exchange rates made me make cut a few corners, and bit of changes, but I won't let it spoil my life here. Currency exchange rate has been low before, and it might gain again, just like before; and my corners will recover their sharpness. However, I fully understand, and fell sincere sorry for those originally coming with just funds enough, and no reserves, and therefore already, or almost already, balanced of the edge back then; they have a hard time now.

 

Yes, as other have said it, it's about that "you create your own reality", and "I can't afford to live here anymore".

????

 

 

[55Jay]

Just now, Dnyy said:

YES! Always seeing foreigners doing the wai but in most cases not receiving it back

Yes, similar at my office after a 100% purge during the Big Joke era.

 

Dare I say our visits to Immigration used to be enjoyable.   No more.  I dread it now.  Our wai was sniffed at and dismissed by the stone faced drone we pulled for my last annual extension.  A real piece of work that one. 

[cyril sneer]

23 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

the last thing I will every be is home sick, and I have a lot of money and can go back to the USA any time I want. I could live in a ski resort or beach town or own my own farm or small ranch. no thanks.

did you join this thread simply to make everyone aware of this?

 

typical yank 

[Benmart]

23 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Sometimes, but not always. Also dealing with the recent onerous visa rule changes is totally separate from affording to live here. You need to be able to navigate that visa system AND afford to live here. I detest efforts to over simplify these issues. 

I detest those that detest, which in itself make no difference, as much as I may detest that fact.

[TheFarangGuy]

Honestly, during my short stay I've never witnessed anything you say here. I had people smile and nod at me from cars and bikes when crossing the freaking road. I had people move to make me room so I can pass first in crowded streets. Friends of my thai friend, which I meet for the first time that day, took me to breakfast next day. Another friend took me to shopping mall so I can buy clothes, and showed me around town. I had people doing me favors every day just because they genuinely wanted to help me. It was a very comfortable experience. I guess we all see what we want to see. If we focus on negatives, we're gonna notice them more often than positives. Farangs often expect to be treated like gods just because they are from the west. Honestly I don't see how can someone have this as a realistic expectations. 

 

Again, this is just my experience. I'm sure people who lived in Thailand for the last 20 years can see the difference, but we can't reasonably expect any country to be stuck in time and never change. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by TheFarangGuy

[yogi100]

2 hours ago, Nip said:

I'm in total agreement. I abandoned Thailand two years ago after living there for 17 years. I never felt entirely welcome for those 17 years but by 2017 I felt decidedly unwelcome. I was a model immigrant in that I gave all and received nothing in return and all the annoying  traits I grew to dislike about Thai people were beginning to manifest in my own kids. I can't say any one thing caused me to leave but one that irked me was Thai prostitutes within 3 years of landing on our shores were clutching passports and after 17 years in Thailand every time I went to renew my annual visa I felt like a criminal. I had become the irritated and angry old man I swore I would never become.

 

Last year in 2018 I returned to Thailand for two months and embraced the good but was assailed by everything that is bad. That said i had to return this year in July and have just left and shall not return any time soon. 

 

Why? Because from my arrival in Swampy the dislike for the White Man was now in my face. I speak Thai fluently and am a genial good natured individual and accept there are millions of similar Thais but the welcoming I once received is long gone. Anybody notice that the once common Thai wai is now a rarity?  And for me that sums it up. 

 

When I approached the Emirates ground staff member in arrivals to report that my suitcase had been badly damaged and wished to report it she turned and walked away saying complain online. I exit arrivals and when I asked a young woman playing on her phone at the first car rental desk was there a problem with the airport Wi-Fi she dismissed me mumbling it was not her job foreigner. Not a great start and sadly this attitude continued throughout my stay.

 

The TM30? I discovered after 30 days that the woman or company where I was staying despite taking a copy of my passport did not register me and flatly refused to do so. So immigration simmarily refused to stamp the 30 day extension. It took 5 hours to sort it out. The entire operation took me 7 hours.

 

I moved to Pattaya for a few days to visit friends all of whome are making plans to move elsewhere and despite the city being overrun by the people once abhorred by Thais for being smelly it was deserted and they were being embraced to the extent one bar was showing Bollywood movies. But that did not stop the receptionist at a hotel I previously visited at least twice a year for the last 7 years screaming angrily at me as I approached reception; " Foreigner you not pay your bill!" As she lay across her Thai boyfriend on the sofa in reception. She was referring to the advance payment for the following day. Later that night in 7/11 when I innocently queried of the ladybug serving me was the microwaved food in the bag that he had just handed me he screamed 'yes you annoying foreigner' The American guy standing next to me said is that the Thai welcome I've read so much about? Just about summed it all up.

 

While before Thais 

tolerated us now they don't because they have other fish to fry but their overfishing is coming back to boot them in the ass. Im of course not talking about all Thais because while I met hundreds who were pleasant and accommodating the 5 or 6 who needlessly abused me tipped the scales massively. In future I will go where I'm appreciated and welcomed.

 

 

Blimey Nip, what a depressing post. But I don't doubt a single word of it especially the bit about Pattaya. Probably because it's the haunt of sex tourists.

 

I find that unless the Thais are in a situation in which it's expected that you tip them they are inclined to be sullen, abrupt and even downright rude. 

 

You notice it in the shops and supermarkets more than anywhere else. I sometimes need to buy things from upstairs in the Friendship Supermarket in Pattaya and never look forward to it. You never get a 'thank you' nor a smile just a scowl and silence. I now make a point of not thanking them for their 'service' either. Those downstairs are a bit more helpful and pleasant though.

 

I first visited Pattaya 35 years ago but today you'd think you were in a different country as far as the general attitude of the people are concerned. I honestly sometimes find the attitude of some Thai people to be a bit of a shock and they make no attempt to conceal their contempt and sometimes even hatred for us.

[Nyezhov]

4 hours ago, 55Jay said:

 

 

Sounds like the same I/O I got at Swampy 2 weeks ago, nearing midnight.  Younger than usual, cute as a button in her too-tight uniform, colorful campaign ribbons and spit-shined bunny rabbit house slippers.   

Dude there's a bunch of those out of Chang Wattana..... that makes me absolutely nuts

 

Don't forget the perfectly coiifed hair in the ribbon snood.

 

I look for uniforms on tinder

[Nyezhov]

2 hours ago, cyril sneer said:

did you join this thread simply to make everyone aware of this?

 

typical yank 

I have a lot of money too mate, are you jealous of us Yanks then? No giro day for us....

[malibukid]

4 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

yes horrible but i can remember when a lift ticket was $12. i would head out from LA in my Jeep in a middle of a storm. Great fun.

later in life i was lucky i skied at Sun Valley and Aspen.  

i would park at county line beach on PCH for free. now it is $8 to park off the highway. not that it really matters.

laguna beach, they "tore" my beach down and put up a hotel. i can only stand there now and watch the tourist who have not a clue how great this was before.   

i rented an apartment in Laguna when I was 20. that is how cheap it was.

but big party in Thailand now. Just as soon as I finish working on my taxes.

 

 

 Neptunes Net at county line. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by malibukid

[NCC1701A]

wow mention you got some money and the class warfare comes out so fast on TV it makes your head spin.

 

next time I will say "I have plenty of options" to keep everybody in their safe space.

 

and I apologize in advance for having a great time in Thailand.

 

another unpopular theme.     

[JaiLai]

YES! Always seeing foreigners doing the wai but in most cases not receiving it back

I think farangs look stupid doing it.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[thaicurious]

8 hours ago, thaicurious said:

On 8/31/2019 at 4:41 AM, NCC1701A said:

you create your own reality.  

Would you say that's more true while working for money to spend at the mall or while bleeding out during a mass shooting while shopping at the mall?

 2

Nyezhov and allenberg reacted to this

•  
•  

Just to hopefully clarify for the two confused emoticon'd reactions.

 

My point is that we can exercise some control over our destiny but not complete control over fate.

 

Even in working for money, some might be born with aspects preventing their making much, be that by IQ or physical handicap or luck of where born (Somalia as opposed to America) etc. Someone born in America who made riches might not have had skills to survive Somalia. So a lot of that is luck of the draw. Within that, you can bring skills to bear or not, seek to improve yourself or not, etc., so then there is measure of being in control of your fate within certain bounds.

 

But even beyond that, even if you've been born into a lucky position, even if you worked within that to improve yourself, even if you've applied what you've learned all with good intent there's still this little aspect to life: deleted happens, because, news flash: Life is bigger than we are.

 

Karma isn't just a matter of what you put in is what you get out; though there is that aspect to it, It is not to say that you entirely are creating your own world. Because deleted happens, Karma is less about what happens and more about what we do with what happens. Being in control of your life is less about controlling what happens to you, more about controlling how you perceive what happens and thereby about how you deal with what happens.

 

Thus another saying: "We do not see things as they are, we see them as we are." For that is what we can gain some control over, our own perceptions, whereby we can control our reactions, whereby we can take action.

Edited September 1, 2019 by thaicurious
a few typos

[Deerculler]

Whenever I go into Big C.

No problem getting smiles from Thai.

It is the sour faced farang that I see.

 

[simon43]

2 minutes ago, Deerculler said:

Whenever I go into Big C.

No problem getting smiles from Thai.

It is the sour faced farang that I see.

 

I have to admit that in the small Issan town where I temporarily stayed for a few months, I have never seen so many miserable-looking western guys, all wearing ill-fitting shorts - showing off knobbly knees ????and sandals.  I never figured out why they didn't smile.

 

A very strange-looking bunch...