Rattan furniture

[rooster59]

China, U.S. to collect additional tariffs on each other's goods

 

FILE PHOTO: U.S. dollar and China yuan notes are seen in this picture illustration June 2, 2017. REUTERS/Thomas White/Illustration/File Photo

 

BEIJING (Reuters) - China and the United States will begin imposing additional tariffs on each other's goods on Sunday, the latest escalation in a bruising trade war despite signs talks would resume sometime this month.

 

A new round of U.S. tariffs on some Chinese goods and Chinese tariffs on U.S. goods is scheduled to take effect from 0401 GMT on Sunday.

 

The Trump administration will begin collecting 15% tariffs on more than $125 billion in Chinese imports, including smart speakers, Bluetooth headphones and many types of footwear.

 

As part of its retaliation, Beijing will begin imposing a 5% tariff on U.S. crude oil from Sept. 1, the first time U.S. oil has been targeted since the world's two largest economies started their trade war more than a year ago.

 

U.S. President Donald Trump last month said he was increasing existing and planned tariffs by 5% on about $550 billion worth of Chinese imports after Beijing announced its own retaliatory tariffs on U.S. goods.

 

Tariffs of 15% on cellphones, laptop computers, toys and clothing are to take effect on Dec. 15. The U.S. Trade Representative's Office said on Thursday it would collect public comments through Sept. 20 on a planned tariff increase to 30% on a $250 billion list of goods already hit with a 25% tariff.

 

Trade teams from China and the United States continue to talk and will meet in September, but tariff increases on Chinese goods set to go in place on Sunday will not be delayed, Trump said on Friday.

 

For two years, the Trump administration has sought to pressure China to make sweeping changes to its policies on intellectual property protection, forced transfers of technology to Chinese firms, industrial subsidies and market access.

 

China has consistently denied Washington's accusations that it engages in unfair trade practices, vowing to fight back in kind and criticizing U.S. measures as protectionist.

 

China has pressed the United States to cancel the tariff increase, but said last week that a September round of talks was being discussed between the two.

 

The trade war further strains Beijing-Washington ties, already overshadowed by U.S. freedom of navigation exercises near Chinese-occupied islands in the disputed South China Sea, and U.S. support for self-ruled and democratic Taiwan, which China claims as its own.

 

(Reporting by Ben Blanchard; Editing by Clarence Fernandez)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-09-01

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[Tug]

Are we tired of winning yet?

[grumbleweed]

Trump: "We're in a hole, pass me a bigger spade, we need to dig deeper"

[Mavideol]

I guess the art of the deal man is not making any deals lately..... Japan, NK, China, Canada, Mexico paying for border wall... 555

[neeray]

1 hour ago, Tug said:

Are we tired of winning yet?

"Trade wars are easy to win"

[Tug]

Donals doesent care he’s not paying the tarreffs we are

[neeray]

The uncertainty is killing investment worldwide.

In my view, there's no quick resolution in sight.

Best we all just learn how to stick handle our way through this.

[Pedrogaz]

Am I going crazy? Did I or did I not read that China had waived their additional tariffs? This caused a big upward reaction on Wall Street.

[Pedrogaz]

You know I see this suff about IP all the time.....but I have yet to see one single example cited. Not a single citation of a company that has had its IP stolen. Yet I read this week that stolen IP costs the US $600 billion a year. This number sounds like it was pulled out of someone's <deleted> but I suspect the narrative required a large number.

Still surprising isn't it, a total lack of evidence presented to the public for a key claim in the US rationale?

[keith101]

Trump is sending the world economy down the toilet which will include the US if he doesn't stop this stupid trade war with China . His Psychopathic ways are putting more strain on US citizens especially the farmers and blue collar workers which unfortunately he obviously doesn't really care about  only the 1% .  

November 2020 will come to late for a lot of farmers and small business owners who will close shop because the tariffs will make things to expensive for lower income people to buy goods .  

He believes he will go down in history as the greatest President ever (this is what he is already saying) when in fact it will show the complete opposite .

Edited September 1, 2019 by keith101

[Rimmer]

A troll post and a reply have been removed

[samran]

Tax increases left right and centre, and his fanboys cheer him on. 

[Morch]

57 minutes ago, Pedrogaz said:

You know I see this suff about IP all the time.....but I have yet to see one single example cited. Not a single citation of a company that has had its IP stolen. Yet I read this week that stolen IP costs the US $600 billion a year. This number sounds like it was pulled out of someone's <deleted> but I suspect the narrative required a large number.

Still surprising isn't it, a total lack of evidence presented to the public for a key claim in the US rationale?

 

Some examples in the links bellow, if such were actually needed. Notably, even the Chinese government isn't denying this is an issue. Also, not a solely USA complaint.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidvolodzko/2018/11/11/the-trade-war-with-china-and-the-problem-with-intellectual-property-rights/#61861cd2728e

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-05/what-s-intellectual-property-and-does-china-steal-it-quicktake

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/1-in-5-companies-say-china-stole-their-ip-within-the-last-year-cnbc.html

 

 

[Srikcir]

24 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Some examples in the links bellow, if such were actually needed. Notably, even the Chinese government isn't denying this is an issue. Also, not a solely USA complaint.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidvolodzko/2018/11/11/the-trade-war-with-china-and-the-problem-with-intellectual-property-rights/#61861cd2728e

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-05/what-s-intellectual-property-and-does-china-steal-it-quicktake

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/1-in-5-companies-say-china-stole-their-ip-within-the-last-year-cnbc.html

 

 

Yes, industrial spying takes place.

Yes, Americans are bribed for trade secrets.

While such is likely China-state sponsored activities, no less different from American private enterprise sponsored activities.

But on the whole from the Forbes article:

• These technology transfers arise from China's foreign-ownership restriction laws, which require foreign businesses to form joint ventures with domestic Chinese companies to sell their goods in China. These ventures often include some type of technology transfer, exposing foreign businesses to theft.

US businesses reluctantly give up IP in exchange for potential massive profits. Obviously they do.

As Trump once said, "There's good people on both sides" in reference to a social conflict.

US businesses are free to refuse the Chinese government to give up or expose their IP to abuse. There are international legal processes for unfair trade practices. There are also U.S. congressional actions that can be taken to level the market for U.S. businesses in China. Where is that legislation?

But Trump wants to be the personal savior for U.S. businesses operating in China. So he has created this trade war through Presidential Orders to promote his personal leadership rather than the ideals of American enterprise.

[Longcut]

3 hours ago, neeray said:

"Trade wars are easy to win"

Black & Decker is moving its operations from China to Fort Worth, Texas. So, something is working.

Stanley Black & Decker announced this week that it is moving production of Craftsman wrenches, ratchets, sockets and more back to the United States from China. The company will break ground on a 425,000-square-foot facility in Fort Worth, Texas, this summer, and the factory is set to be up and running by late 2020.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Longcut

[Morch]

5 hours ago, Srikcir said:

Yes, industrial spying takes place.

Yes, Americans are bribed for trade secrets.

While such is likely China-state sponsored activities, no less different from American private enterprise sponsored activities.

But on the whole from the Forbes article:

• These technology transfers arise from China's foreign-ownership restriction laws, which require foreign businesses to form joint ventures with domestic Chinese companies to sell their goods in China. These ventures often include some type of technology transfer, exposing foreign businesses to theft.

US businesses reluctantly give up IP in exchange for potential massive profits. Obviously they do.

As Trump once said, "There's good people on both sides" in reference to a social conflict.

US businesses are free to refuse the Chinese government to give up or expose their IP to abuse. There are international legal processes for unfair trade practices. There are also U.S. congressional actions that can be taken to level the market for U.S. businesses in China. Where is that legislation?

But Trump wants to be the personal savior for U.S. businesses operating in China. So he has created this trade war through Presidential Orders to promote his personal leadership rather than the ideals of American enterprise.

 

I think that there's a difference between private companies engaging in such activities, and government sponsored efforts. The latter is merely illegal, or unethical, the latter having to do with policy.

 

Not in the business of defending Trump, was just addressing the "I have yet to see one single example cited" bit of nonsense from another poster.

[Chomper Higgot]

6 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Some examples in the links bellow, if such were actually needed. Notably, even the Chinese government isn't denying this is an issue. Also, not a solely USA complaint.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidvolodzko/2018/11/11/the-trade-war-with-china-and-the-problem-with-intellectual-property-rights/#61861cd2728e

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-05/what-s-intellectual-property-and-does-china-steal-it-quicktake

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/1-in-5-companies-say-china-stole-their-ip-within-the-last-year-cnbc.html

 

 

The arguments made in the (US) Government v Charles Dickens case are instructive.

[phantomfiddler]

How does one deal with an entity who, whenever they wish to buy something, they just print the money to complete the purchase ? The end result is not going to be "How can they do this, it will devalue their currency ?" but who owns the property in the end game ? and it won,t be the people who are standing there wondering what happened !

[bushdoctor]

China knows that if prices get too high...consumers will buy elsewhere. China is letting their currency devalue to help lessen the sting of the tariffs, which means lower prices for overseas consumers. That helps to negate any increase to US consumers brought on by the tariffs, allowing the US government to gain millions of dollars in revenue while keeping prices relatively stable. Meanwhile Chinese imposed tariffs on US oil (paid for in strong, stable dollars) is a tax on it’s citizens. 

Trade wars take time to play out. Personally I look for final results. I was fortunate in shorting the S&P, I think I got out too quickly but I did well enough. Time will tell. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by bushdoctor

[Longcut]

10 hours ago, rhyddid said:

When you walk in a store in US, 90% of the products are made in China, done by US companies who produce there due low labour and overheads cost.
Initially the bigger looser will be the end consumers, all the people including who voted Trump, which are by majority the lower income earning, will find themselves with 15% less purchase power, than the retailers who will see their business decrease, it's a domino effect.

High earning small percentage US population won't feel the burning of increased cost fo such items.

China did a smart retaliation, 5% on oil, therefore all oil plants in China, will purchase from other countries and more from Venezuela, Iran and friendly country, Texas pumps will slow the output as China its the world bigger oil consumer.

Who is making a gain of such smart Trump move ? 
Easy to identify !

Good make America great again !

Not a problem. Oil on the open market is purchased in U.S.D.'s. The United States still makes money either way.

Bearing in mind, every single trade using $US dollars makes a transaction fee, buying & selling oil.

The US Government set up a franchise allowing it to have a relatively opaque stream of never-ending revenue pouring into their Government Treasury 24/7, 356 days per annum, indefinitely, as the negotiated spoils of war, post-WWII.

[Cryingdick]

21 hours ago, Tug said:

Donals doesent care he’s not paying the tarreffs we are

I thought you lived in Thailand? If so how are you paying the tariffs?

Edited September 2, 2019 by Cryingdick

[Tug]

23 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

I thought you lived in Thailand? If so how are you paying the tariffs?

I split my time I have a few projects in the USA and spend the majority of my time here and it’s inappropriate for you to ask imo I do pay donalds extra tax as do the majority of Americans I care about my countrymen 

[bristolboy]

4 hours ago, bushdoctor said:

China knows that if prices get too high...consumers will buy elsewhere. China is letting their currency devalue to help lessen the sting of the tariffs, which means lower prices for overseas consumers. That helps to negate any increase to US consumers brought on by the tariffs, allowing the US government to gain millions of dollars in revenue while keeping prices relatively stable. Meanwhile Chinese imposed tariffs on US oil (paid for in strong, stable dollars) is a tax on it’s citizens. 

Trade wars take time to play out. Personally I look for final results. I was fortunate in shorting the S&P, I think I got out too quickly but I did well enough. Time will tell. 

Sure. That's why Trump is delaying the imposition of some tariffs until after Xmas? Because tariffs aren't affecting prices?

As for not buying US oil... OIl right now is cheap and available from other sources. Iran comes to mind. 

And I'm still waiting for the day that some poster writes about how he or she got badly burned in the stock market. What bearing alleged successes in those transaction have upon the issue in question eludes me.

[bristolboy]

49 minutes ago, Longcut said:

Not a problem. Oil on the open market is purchased in U.S.D.'s. The United States still makes money either way.

Bearing in mind, every single trade using $US dollars makes a transaction fee, buying & selling oil.

The US Government set up a franchise allowing it to have a relatively opaque stream of never-ending revenue pouring into their Government Treasury 24/7, 356 days per annum, indefinitely, as the negotiated spoils of war, post-WWII.

What transaction fee would that be? Where did you get this info from? The US government isn't renting out its currency. 

[Morch]

5 hours ago, bushdoctor said:

China knows that if prices get too high...consumers will buy elsewhere. China is letting their currency devalue to help lessen the sting of the tariffs, which means lower prices for overseas consumers. That helps to negate any increase to US consumers brought on by the tariffs, allowing the US government to gain millions of dollars in revenue while keeping prices relatively stable. Meanwhile Chinese imposed tariffs on US oil (paid for in strong, stable dollars) is a tax on it’s citizens. 

Trade wars take time to play out. Personally I look for final results. I was fortunate in shorting the S&P, I think I got out too quickly but I did well enough. Time will tell. 

 

I thought I was fortunate having an S&P shortcake, I think I had too much.

Waiting for the final results. Time will tell.

[1FinickyOne]

22 hours ago, neeray said:

The uncertainty is killing investment worldwide.

buy gold... or a gold fund...

[Traubert]

On 9/1/2019 at 12:28 PM, Pedrogaz said:

You know I see this suff about IP all the time.....but I have yet to see one single example cited. Not a single citation of a company that has had its IP stolen. Yet I read this week that stolen IP costs the US $600 billion a year. This number sounds like it was pulled out of someone's <deleted> but I suspect the narrative required a large number.

Still surprising isn't it, a total lack of evidence presented to the public for a key claim in the US rationale?

You wont get any concrete facts. Same as the erosion of Hong Kongs freedoms  Airy accusations that become fact through repetition. Reuters is adept at it.

[Morch]

3 hours ago, Traubert said:

You wont get any concrete facts. Same as the erosion of Hong Kongs freedoms  Airy accusations that become fact through repetition. Reuters is adept at it.

 

Reality disagrees with your first comment. The second one is a mere talking point. Going on about Reuters is all very well, guess they don't match your "word on the street" sources.