Thailand to demand proof of health insurance for 'risky' long-term visitors

[Huckenfell]

On 10/10/2019 at 6:30 PM, Russell17au said:

If you read "Order of the Royal Thai Police no. 548/2562" you will see printed at the bottom, "This order is effective as of October 31, 2019

Only affects new visas issued after this date, i confirmed this yesterday. My O-A visa expires on 9th Dec 2019 and they told me that provided i  leave the country before that date and return i will be stamped in for another 1 year with NO health insurance requirements.

Edited October 16, 2019 by Huckenfell

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, Huckenfell said:

Only affects new visas issued after this date, i confirmed this yesterday. My O-A visa expires on 9th Dec 2019 and they told me that provided i  leave the country before that date and return i will be stamped in for another 1 year with NO health insurance requirements.

Good luck with that. I'm sure every officers understands all the specific details about this these recent changes which is funny considering there is so much debate among those potentially impacted about what this all will mean. Confirmed? Do you have it in writing and guaranteed to be followed later?

[Huckenfell]

On 10/10/2019 at 6:52 PM, Mark mark said:

This post should be blown up and put on every page of this Blog I think !!! - Thanks !

It has been said over and over, but certain people do not read what is before them.  Only O-A visas are involved.

[thequietman]

13 minutes ago, Huckenfell said:

Depends on which visa you have. It only includes those on the O-A  retirement visa.

That is true, yes.

 

However, remember where you are and see what IO do with simple things like the rules regarding seasoning of money - is it 2 months or 3 - the rules are clearly stated and yet, IO's still get it wrong!

 

Now, think about how they can mess this information up in the pursuit of the coveted kickback. ????

[Sheryl]

11 minutes ago, Huckenfell said:

Only affects new visas issued after this date, i confirmed this yesterday. My O-A visa expires on 9th Dec 2019 and they told me that provided i  leave the country before that date and return i will be stamped in for another 1 year with NO health insurance requirements.

 

May I ask which office this was? As I am hearing different reports from different places.

 

(though of course what will matter is the IO at the airport or border crossing... We should get a sense of that pretty soon once the 31st arrives)

[Huckenfell]

On 10/12/2019 at 7:11 AM, Chazar said:

No I dont forget but there are an awful lot of Americans Brits etc thats it  does  affect, feel sorry for their families who will be split  up, I for  one see no future here for me in Thailand despite  owning 7 condos 2 pick ups 3  motorbikes 1  car  2  houses etc  all that will be cleared out and sold and Thailand loses.......in an economy thats already struggling.

Married  to a  Thai 15   years, make s no difference.

The new stupid insurance  will probably tip it for me if expanded ( likely to all non o), i can afford it but its useless in a real emergency, I keep way more than that aside for "what if."

Dont see any reason we cant pay into the Thai system happily  pay more ( but theyd  do that anyway)

Its become a very tiring game they are playing.

Pay into the Thai system at reasonable rates (no private hospitals) sounds a very good idea. If one wants luxury then go the expensive way.

 

[Sheryl]

6 hours ago, ourdon said:

 

Being in close to the same boat I sympathize.    I went to the insurance website of the government approved companies.  Two won't insure you after 65, one won't insure you after 70.  One doesn't handle incoming foreigners, just Thai residents outbound. One wouldn't say other than "we have no product available to match your requirements".

 

I found a North American vendor that I'm pondering on.  It will end up costing about 87,000 baht if I take a 22.700 baht deductible. 

 

This isn't an annual price, it is for a five month visit.  I snowbird here for four to five months then about six to nine weeks in Europe and then about five months in Canada.  This is a somewhat unexpected expense and does call for some thought.  

 

it is not clear at this point that foreign policies will be accepted for visa purposes. Still awaiting clarifcation.

 

re the  the "approved" companies in addition to often not covering people past say age 65, most do not guarantee lifetime renewal. So important for people to look at that.

 

One insurer boasts them will insure up to age 80, and apparently they will (if no serious pre-existing conditions) but they will not renew past age 80. in other words they would sell an 80 year old a policy and then refuse to let them renew it. Caveat emptor, be sure to look at provisions on renewals.

[Huckenfell]

On 10/13/2019 at 8:32 AM, randy723 said:

what is the % of expats here that are over 65 years old? at 65 the premium would be 180,000 per year for the insurance. How many expat would have to leave the country because they are to old to get Insurance?

It would be interesting if someone could answer this question.

[zydeco]

5 hours ago, Skallywag said:

Our bodies have many "systems",  Circulatory (Heart disease/high blood pressure) is only one.

Even if cardiac related diseases are not covered (pre-existing) you may still need medical care for :  

• Digestive system and Excretory system: ...
• Endocrine system: ...
• Integumentary system / Exocrine system: ...
• Immune system and lymphatic system: ...
• Muscular system: ...
• Nervous system: ...
• Renal system and Urinary system.

It seems to be the output of the excretory system that the Thai insurance companies want to make mandatory for over 50 expats.

[Huckenfell]

45 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

So some say. We'll know more starting the beginning of next month. 

If you have doubts, read the police document on the matter.

 

[Huckenfell]

40 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Good luck with that. I'm sure every officers understands all the specific details about this these recent changes which is funny considering there is so much debate among those potentially impacted about what this all will mean. Confirmed? Do you have it in writing and guaranteed to be followed later?

Yawnnn .

[Huckenfell]

40 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

May I ask which office this was? As I am hearing different reports from different places.

 

(though of course what will matter is the IO at the airport or border crossing... We should get a sense of that pretty soon once the 31st arrives)

It was at he main Immigration office on Koh Samui. And the IO in charge was standing behind the lady officer, nodding his head,, adding that i should do it early as if i came back on 10th i would have to have insurance, so he is probably getting all his officers ready for the final date.

Edited October 16, 2019 by Huckenfell

[nrasmussen]

Only affects new visas issued after this date, i confirmed this yesterday. My O-A visa expires on 9th Dec 2019 and they told me that provided i  leave the country before that date and return i will be stamped in for another 1 year with NO health insurance requirements.

Yes, of course it does only affect newly issued visas. How else could there be an annotation regarding insurance from the embassy that issued the visa?

[kingofthemountain]

1 hour ago, nrasmussen said:

7 hours ago, Huckenfell said:

Only affects new visas issued after this date, i confirmed this yesterday. My O-A visa expires on 9th Dec 2019 and they told me that provided i  leave the country before that date and return i will be stamped in for another 1 year with NO health insurance requirements.

Yes, of course it does only affect newly issued visas. How else could there be an annotation regarding insurance from the embassy that issued the visa?

Of course.....Or not! Depend where you are.

Confirmed today by 2 immigration officers at the counter 8 retirement extensions in Jomtiem

if you ask a 1 year extension of stay based on retirement and if you have had initialy an OA visa

included 3, 4 or 6 years ago, you need to provide the health insurance. It's the way they understand 

the new rule.

[Jingthing]

If you have doubts, read the police document on the matter.
 

I have. Still have doubts. Nice try though.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Jingthing]

Yawnnn .

Ditto.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Bournville]

I checked a couple of the insurance companies... 90.000 baht per year. HOWEVER.... "excludes age related illness and accidents". Seriously? So basically... I would have zero insurance 55555. 

 

This whole thing is a <deleted> mess 

[kingofthemountain]

12 minutes ago, Bournville said:

I checked a couple of the insurance companies... 90.000 baht per year. HOWEVER.... "excludes age related illness and accidents". Seriously? So basically... I would have zero insurance 55555. 

 

This whole thing is a f'ing mess 

Yes in the actual form it's a scam.

The message is ''pay more or leave''

plus the sneaky approach to introduce this

first they say don't worry  just the future OA are concerned

and finally it's on the way to affect sooner or later all the extensions

not to mention the unfair retroactive aspect on the extensions linked to an OA visa granted years ago.

 

All of this because they are unable (Or shameful) to ask to others asian countries the

payment of the hospitals debts left by the laos, cambos, myanmar and chineses immigrants and tourists.

[tgeezer]

It would appear that it is not only Thai women who believe that we are all rich! 

[luckyluke]

13 hours ago, Huckenfell said:

If you have doubts, read the police document on the matter.

 

No doubts for me, and many many others. 

 

However not so sure that every I.O. will read/interpret it the way we do / the way it is supposed to be. 

 

Speculation of course,

but based on previous other own interpretations of written rules by some I. O'S. 

 

Places like Chiang Mai & Samui seems even to often only apply their own vision of every regulation, and seems to be allowed to.

 

[Assurancetourix]

18 hours ago, Huckenfell said:

Only affects new visas issued after this date, i confirmed this yesterday. My O-A visa expires on 9th Dec 2019 and they told me that provided i  leave the country before that date and return i will be stamped in for another 1 year with NO health insurance requirements.

It's a stopgap ; it's backwards to better jump ..

 

On the other hand, some members asked the question:
does it only concern O-A visas?
and if we change the type of visa will we also be obliged to subscribe to a health insurance?

 

( visa B, student visa   )

[d4291797]

Frankly, the ‘big picture’, over the long term, is asking the question, how long do I expect to live , and just how expensive is this insurance going to get ,when I get to 70 plus!
Then factor in pre existing conditions, with no cover for!

I feel worth a look at the Elite Visa, basic 20 yr visa.
No health insurance, this will be a financial killer, plus keep funds invested overseas.
There Is no need to keep an average of 600,000 baht locked in the local bank at next to no interest.

Not meaning to be smart, but I have ‘crunched the numbers for my situation’.
There would be about a net 3 million saving , including the 1 mill cost of Elite after 20 years.

This gives peace of mind and one can self fund your health needs.
Remember good managed funds can ,and are returning 5 to 20%, the effect of this with compounding interest is huge!


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[Sheryl]

It's a stopgap ; it's backwards to better jump ..
 
On the other hand, some members asked the question:
does it only concern O-A visas?
and if we change the type of visa will we also be obliged to subscribe to a health insurance?
 
( visa B, student visa   )

It only concerns O-A visas. That much is very clear

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[Jingthing]

It only concerns O-A visas. That much is very clear

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

And possibly extensions after October 31 based on various reports here.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[deej]

15 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

And possibly extensions after October 31 based on various reports here.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

And those reports are very misleading. to say the least

No official Immgr Police order so far 

Status Quao remains

Edited October 17, 2019 by deej

[ourdon]

19 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

it is not clear at this point that foreign policies will be accepted for visa purposes. Still awaiting clarifcation.

 

re the  the "approved" companies in addition to often not covering people past say age 65, most do not guarantee lifetime renewal. So important for people to look at that.

 

One insurer boasts them will insure up to age 80, and apparently they will (if no serious pre-existing conditions) but they will not renew past age 80. in other words they would sell an 80 year old a policy and then refuse to let them renew it. Caveat emptor, be sure to look at provisions on renewals.

Since this visa can only be obtained in a person's country of origin it would be nearly impossible to restrict policies to thai only for the original OA visa.  BUT  If one stays .... then they can insist you patronize one of their pet companies.

 

Understand I have a new OA visa stamped and approved but I will not be able to get to the kingdom until December 1.  I fear the IO's interpretation of the new regulations.  I am quite legal, it's just that when you've been arrested and you're getting kicked out of the country. neither the Ambassador or the Minister of Foreign Affairs is on hand to explain the error of his ways to the IO.  Getting rejected in Bangkok would cost me much more than the 80, 000 baht for the insurance.

I may try to change my visa to a six month METV.  Tis an option, but it would mean that I've given up and am looking for another country to winter in.

[Sheryl]

19 minutes ago, ourdon said:

Since this visa can only be obtained in a person's country of origin it would be nearly impossible to restrict policies to thai only for the original OA visa.  BUT  If one stays .... then they can insist you patronize one of their pet companies.

 

Understand I have a new OA visa stamped and approved but I will not be able to get to the kingdom until December 1.  I fear the IO's interpretation of the new regulations.  I am quite legal, it's just that when you've been arrested and you're getting kicked out of the country. neither the Ambassador or the Minister of Foreign Affairs is on hand to explain the error of his ways to the IO.  Getting rejected in Bangkok would cost me much more than the 80, 000 baht for the insurance.

I may try to change my visa to a six month METV.  Tis an option, but it would mean that I've given up and am looking for another country to winter in.

 

Do you already have health insurance that would cover you in Thailand for the duration of your stay? As you do legitimately  need that anyway (though admittedly not 40k of OPD).

 

You can certainly use a foreign policy -- including if applicable a travel policy -- for initial entry and by the time you need to do a second year entry the situation re foreign policies should be clearer. I have a feeling there are going to be many O-A holders who cannot get policies from any of them,   all the more so now that I have researched them.  Others will face serious exclusions if they are given policies, which would nto be the case if they were allowed to use their existing policies.

 

Even limiting to the companies on the website there are more options than is initially apparent because at least  some of those companies underwrite policies for other companies (including foreign ones) and will issue the needed certificate for those as well. For example, April-Thailand's My Health policy, managed by April, is underwritten by LMG and LMG will provide certificate for it; it's a good policy if you are not over 65. There are probably others as well.

[Sheryl]

20 minutes ago, Arso Martinera said:

Little bit tricky, getting medical insurange for long term visitors is very expensive actually

 

It is rendered unnecessarily expensive - and poor value for money - by the insistence on including OPD coverage.

[bigginhill]

3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

It is rendered unnecessarily expensive - and poor value for money - by the insistence on including OPD coverage.

It,s shame there isn.t the option of putting the Opd sum on a locked debit card. No annual costs, and refundable when expat leaves Thailand, and allows this opd to complete maybe an existing insurance already held.  

[Mark mark]

On 10/16/2019 at 1:04 PM, thequietman said:

That is true, yes.

 

However, remember where you are and see what IO do with simple things like the rules regarding seasoning of money - is it 2 months or 3 - the rules are clearly stated and yet, IO's still get it wrong!

 

Now, think about how they can mess this information up in the pursuit of the coveted kickback. ????

I think that for Retirement Visas at least, .... it is 2 moths for the initial applications, so the good Immigration woman said Re the Retirement Visa's 800,000 in the bank requirement, .... and 3 months for the Extension of an existing visa ... which would be logical, the extension already being on a visa in play. So you should know by them ? ...