O/A visa and insurance experience today

[ThaiBob]

18 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I've not spoken to him but the only thing you can do is go for the O

Or see an agent. 

[LivinLOS]

3 hours ago, Thaidream said:

Those applicants on an O-A prior to the start date, especially long term O-A extensions had no idea this would be a requirement for the future and planned their affairs  with that in mind.

 

Any country I know of to include Thailand have always grandfthered people when a new regulation/law or change came out.  It is the only faair and mostly legal way to conduct business.

There is no grandfathering listed in any of the orders except the maintenance of the 200k from (IIRC ?) 98.. 

 

Assuming there is grandfathering when it is not explicitly stated, when in other cases is was.. Seems hopeful at best. 

[NewGuy]

Earlier I gave my story in post 161. I just noticed something was hand written on my new visa extension, dated Nov 5, 2019 (my previous date was Dec 5, changed to insurance date).

 

What does the note mean / does it affect me? Sorry for the large size. Next one will go through Image Size.

 

 

Edited November 20, 2019 by NewGuy

[Lovethailandelite]

17 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

There is no grandfathering listed in any of the orders except the maintenance of the 200k from (IIRC ?) 98.. 

 

Assuming there is grandfathering when it is not explicitly stated, when in other cases is was.. Seems hopeful at best. 

This lot are going to have a melt down when Operation Foreigner phase 2 go's in, sometime during the second quarter of 2020. They will either need to comply or leave.

[TaoNow]

For NewGuy:  The written portion in your PP page says, roughly, "approved for the period of policy coverage."

[Exploring Thailand]

2 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Some relevant tips when opting for the +65K monthly income method:

...

Thanks for that. I do have those items covered. The one thing it doesn't seem possible to anticipate is whether or not they will inquire into where the funds came from. As far as I know,  there is nothing on their websites about providing them with documentation about that, of course that doesn't mean that they won't require documentation.

[Thaidream]

1 hour ago, LivinLOS said:

There is no grandfathering listed in any of the orders except the maintenance of the 200k from (IIRC ?) 98.. 

 

Assuming there is grandfathering when it is not explicitly stated, when in other cases is was.. Seems hopeful at best.

Regarding O-A Visas and extensions there is no grandfathering either stated explicitly or explicitly denied.  

 

However, there is precedent for doing it and that is why they stated the 200K income level applies to some lonstayers .

 

Immigration, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Ministry of Health  are now on the 'hot seat since many  foreigners have posted on facebook; other social media' and made complaints to their Embassies and Consuls in Thailand.

 

These Embassies have come together in a united front and are asking the same questions we are asking.  In the World of  Country to country relationships there is reciprocity and Thailand at the moment is thinking very hard about what it has done and how to diplomatically  answer the foreign Embassies and its own internal structure.

 

The smart move is to  Grandfather everyone holding a O-A Visa and extension prior to 31 October 2019 as it will 'buy' plenty of good will.  In fact, they could care less about anyone- but they need to protect their status in the World.

 

If the powers to be hold firm and do not at least grandfather  on this issue- they will bear the consquences of almost universal condemnation which will transfer to  other  aspects of diplomacy not to mention the bad publicity of elderly foreigners losing their homes in Thailand and worse.

 

Thailand does not hold all the aces in this one- 

[Thaidream]

1 hour ago, Exploring Thailand said:

Thanks for that. I do have those items covered. The one thing it doesn't seem possible to anticipate is whether or not they will inquire into where the funds came from. As far as I know,  there is nothing on their websites about providing them with documentation about that, of course that doesn't mean that they won't require documentation.

There is no law that states the 800K for retirement or 400K for marriage has to be sent from abroad unless one converts  a VE or Tourist Visa to a Non O and then applies.

 

Regarding the income method- if they want to see source of funds, this should be easy to provide- since every financial transaction has some source- pension deposit; investment deposit;  rental income deposit etc .  Simple letterhead from these entities and amounts should suffice. Most people have to declare this on the yealy foreign income tax.

 

However, if someone is sending 65K per month from Thailand back to there home bank and recycling it then there is no real proof.

[brianj1964]

4 hours ago, Exploring Thailand said:

I am in the first month of the twelve, so I can transfer it wherever I need to. I've made one transfer to Bangkok, but I can make another to Kasikorn. I'm aware that the transfer must be marked as international.  From what I've read, using transferwise to transfer to Bangkok Bank,  the transfer is guaranteed to marked as international, providing that you select the correct option from the drop-down when making the transfer.

 

My query to OJAS was more concerned with Immigration wanting information about the provenance of the funds. I am transferring my own money. It is not a pension.

Are you from the UK?

i want to start transferring money from a Nationwide account using Transferwise, and at the final page it gives 3 options

1. Bank transfer

2. Debit card transfer

3. Swift transfer

obvioudly if I was going it alone I would use swift, do all 3 options show as international transfers once it hits my Krungsri account or do I still have to use Swift method?

[Thaidream]

2 hours ago, Lovethailandelite said:

his lot are going to have a melt down when Operation Foreigner phase 2 go's in, sometime during the second quarter of 2020. They will either need to comply or leave.

And of course us lot- should be  so very grateful to you for telling  us to bend over and comply or get out.  I'm packing my bags and have them ready- shaking in my boots.  The tears are rolling down my eyes. My wife and children are screaming.

 

Please help us- the sky is falling.

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Thaidream

[Tanoshi]

2 hours ago, brianj1964 said:

Are you from the UK?

i want to start transferring money from a Nationwide account using Transferwise, and at the final page it gives 3 options

1. Bank transfer

2. Debit card transfer

3. Swift transfer

obvioudly if I was going it alone I would use swift, do all 3 options show as international transfers once it hits my Krungsri account or do I still have to use Swift method?

If using Transferwise select Bank Transfer.

Your transferring from your account to TW's account in the UK.

There is no charge for transfer from your Nationwide account to TW's account. (Faster payments option).

 

It will not be coded as an International transfer when received at your Krungsri account.

You need to request a separate 'credit advice' receipt from Krungsri for every transaction as proof. 

 

[Tanoshi]

7 hours ago, Exploring Thailand said:

My query to OJAS was more concerned with Immigration wanting information about the provenance of the funds. I am transferring my own money. It is not a pension.

At Roi Et last week they were requesting a letter from your Pension provider or similar as proof of income origination, plus additional proof of transfers. Transferwise pdf receipts were accepted.

 

They claim they have been told to check additional documentation when using the monthly income method due to abuse of the system and the inability to provide a source of the income.

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, Thaidream said:

If the powers to be hold firm and do not at least grandfather  on this issue- they will bear the consquences of almost universal condemnation which will transfer to  other  aspects of diplomacy not to mention the bad publicity of elderly foreigners losing their homes in Thailand and worse.

chirp chirp.. *crickets*

Quote

Thailand does not hold all the aces in this one- 

They do tho dont they.. 

 

 

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, brianj1964 said:

Are you from the UK?

i want to start transferring money from a Nationwide account using Transferwise, and at the final page it gives 3 options

1. Bank transfer

2. Debit card transfer

3. Swift transfer

obvioudly if I was going it alone I would use swift, do all 3 options show as international transfers once it hits my Krungsri account or do I still have to use Swift method?

That is how you fund the transfer.. not the reception side.. 

 

You need to select the dropdown under 'reason for transfer' or purpose or similar.. 

[brianj1964]

1 minute ago, LivinLOS said:

That is how you fund the transfer.. not the reception side.. 

 

You need to select the dropdown under 'reason for transfer' or purpose or similar.. 

I did that bit, it said " long stay" or something similar

[brianj1964]

18 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

If using Transferwise select Bank Transfer.

Your transferring from your account to TW's account in the UK.

There is no charge for transfer from your Nationwide account to TW's account. (Faster payments option).

 

It will not be coded as an International transfer when received at your Krungsri account.

You need to request a separate 'credit advice' receipt from Krungsri for every transaction as proof. 

 

I made an initial small transfer today to ensure it went smoothly, TW took the money immediately though they did make a small deduction, I'm guessing their fee for doing it, though I was hoping it automatically credited as an international transfer, having to ask Krugsri every time I transfer money for proof, if I read you correctly could be a pain, I have a really bad memory and lose stuff easily

thanks for your advice, appreciated

[scubascuba3]

7 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

At Roi Et last week they were requesting a letter from your Pension provider or similar as proof of income origination, plus additional proof of transfers. Transferwise pdf receipts were accepted.

 

They claim they have been told to check additional documentation when using the monthly income method due to abuse of the system and the inability to provide a source of the income.

they can't seem to grasp that people can transfer money over which isn't pension money

[lamyai3]

9 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

At Roi Et last week they were requesting a letter from your Pension provider or similar as proof of income origination, plus additional proof of transfers. Transferwise pdf receipts were accepted.

 

They claim they have been told to check additional documentation when using the monthly income method due to abuse of the system and the inability to provide a source of the income.

Abuse of the system sure, but the abuse is being carried out by the local immigration office. 

[deej]

12 hours ago, Thaidream said:

Regarding O-A Visas and extensions there is no grandfathering either stated explicitly or explicitly denied.  

 

However, there is precedent for doing it and that is why they stated the 200K income level applies to some lonstayers .

 

Immigration, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Ministry of Health  are now on the 'hot seat since many  foreigners have posted on facebook; other social media' and made complaints to their Embassies and Consuls in Thailand.

 

These Embassies have come together in a united front and are asking the same questions we are asking.  In the World of  Country to country relationships there is reciprocity and Thailand at the moment is thinking very hard about what it has done and how to diplomatically  answer the foreign Embassies and its own internal structure.

 

The smart move is to  Grandfather everyone holding a O-A Visa and extension prior to 31 October 2019 as it will 'buy' plenty of good will.  In fact, they could care less about anyone- but they need to protect their status in the World.

 

If the powers to be hold firm and do not at least grandfather  on this issue- they will bear the consquences of almost universal condemnation which will transfer to  other  aspects of diplomacy not to mention the bad publicity of elderly foreigners losing their homes in Thailand and worse.

 

Thailand does not hold all the aces in this one- 

^^^^ 5555

In addition to the above.

 

According to the usual suspect posters on this thread.

Non O visa holders.

are next on the firing line to have medical insurance.

If this happens

All Hell will break loose .due to very obvious humanity reasons for starters

 

[jackdd]

6 minutes ago, deej said:

All Hell will break loose .due to very obvious humanity reasons for starters

Many other countries also require people to have health insurance, this is hardly ground breaking.

If you would ask people in Europe about their opinion that Thailand requires people to have health insurance, they would probably not say anything negative about it, and they might even be surprised that this wasn't required already.

 

Thailand doesn't care much about humanitarien reasons, you might want to read about stateless as well as refugee camps in Thailand. They might care about bad press, but by requiring health insurance they will hardly get any bad press in foreign countries, so this is not an issue.

[UncleMhee]

7 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Many other countries also require people to have health insurance, this is hardly ground breaking.

If you would ask people in Europe about their opinion that Thailand requires people to have health insurance, they would probably not say anything negative about it, and they might even be surprised that this wasn't required already.

It's not the requirement to have it that's at issue; it the manner in which it's being applied.

As an O-A holder I sourced insurance that would last me two years, every two years from my home country. When applying for my visa, prior to this <deleted> debacle, I always included my certificate with my application.

The changes in the last two year go around are just about the last straw. At least I won't have money tied up here that I'll have to fight tooth and nail for, to get back home.

The departments responsible are no more than a pack of over indulged, self entitled bunch of galoots. BTW....my $1200 two year insurance ran rings around their BS policies, and would also repatriate me dead or alive!

[Peterw42]

Is the OA insurance having a big impact ?

Judging by the amount of posts/threads, it would appear that its not having a broad impact.

 

Past issues like income letters, changes to seasoning, tm30, have all seen 1,000s of posts, a new thread every hour etc. I can only presume the changes dont effect many people, It would appear most people started with a Non-O and its business as usual.

[TheAppletons]

2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Is the OA insurance having a big impact ?

Judging by the amount of posts/threads, it would appear that its not having a broad impact.

 

Past issues like income letters, changes to seasoning, tm30, have all seen 1,000s of posts, a new thread every hour etc. I can only presume the changes dont effect many people, It would appear most people started with a Non-O and its business as usual.

  It's only been in effect for 21 days - a bit early to reach any conclusions regarding impact or lack thereof.

[mike787]

It's a brutal and unnecessary process.  Why can't it be as simple in so many countries, ie cambo, vietnam, USA, Canada, Australia, etc

[Momofarang]

42 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Many other countries also require people to have health insurance, this is hardly ground breaking.

If you would ask people in Europe about their opinion that Thailand requires people to have health insurance, they would probably not say anything negative about it, and they might even be surprised that this wasn't required already.

 

Thailand doesn't care much about humanitarien reasons, you might want to read about stateless as well as refugee camps in Thailand. They might care about bad press, but by requiring health insurance they will hardly get any bad press in foreign countries, so this is not an issue.

I can only agree, however I would wish our embassies stepped in to show, to the idiots who have implemented the current scheme, how unfair it is to request from people who have excellent health cover to buy one their useless Thai insurances.

[Peterw42]

1 minute ago, TheAppletons said:

  It's only been in effect for 21 days - a bit early to reach any conclusions regarding impact or lack thereof.

Yes, you are probably right but for other issues Thai-visa goes into meltdown. I just cant help but think not many started with an OA so not many are affected.

[Andrew Dwyer]

5 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Yes, you are probably right but for other issues Thai-visa goes into meltdown. I just cant help but think not many started with an OA so not many are affected.

Not sure of the actual numbers of people on valid OA’s or extensions thereof but I think many are planning their escape from insurance via an O visa or if have a long time left on their extension ( like myself, sept 2020 ) and are still letting the dust settle before making their decision.

[deej]

43 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Many other countries also require people to have health insurance, this is hardly ground breaking.

If you would ask people in Europe about their opinion that Thailand requires people to have health insurance, they would probably not say anything negative about it, and they might even be surprised that this wasn't required already.

 

Thailand doesn't care much about humanitarien reasons, you might want to read about stateless as well as refugee camps in Thailand. They might care about bad press, but by requiring health insurance they will hardly get any bad press in foreign countries, so this is not an issue.

Thank you for your reponse????

From my view 

The 800ks was put in place

to cover unforseen Medical costs etc etc

Please be free to correct me if i am mistaken????

They are in such a pickle presently implementing the OA visa medical cover etc etc

Image the mess introducing a Non O medical cover etc etc which is far larger in numbers.

Grand Fathering In. is the simple soloution 

And apply the Medical cover for any future applicants  .

just my 1 bahts worth

 

 

 

 

 

[Peterw42]

5 minutes ago, deej said:

Thank you for your reponse????

From my view 

The 800ks was put in place

to cover unforseen Medical costs etc etc

Please be free to correct me if i am mistaken????

They are in such a pickle presently implementing the OA visa medical cover etc etc

Image the mess introducing a Non O medical cover etc etc which is far larger in numbers.

Grand Fathering In. is the simple soloution 

And apply the Medical cover for any future applicants  .

just my 1 bahts worth

 

 

 

 

 

The 800k was never put on place to cover medical, its to show you have enough to live here. 

 

 

[Martyp]

34 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

The 800k was never put on place to cover medical, its to show you have enough to live here. 

 

 

One of the many mysteries considering you aren’t allowed to spend it.