15 minutes ago, tropo said:

Yes, indeed... yet you made the suggestion that I don't help, when in fact I'm doing a lot more than you are. In fact I sent money I can't really afford for a food package today.

 

You were the first who brought up the suffering of people and specifically elderly people, and now you choose to be facetious when I explain that I am helping people.

 

The disadvantaged I'm speaking of are people suffering specifically under draconian measures the government of the Philippines has implemented. The people lost their jobs. We are discussing the coronavirus pandemic and situations pertaining to it, not poverty in general.

 

 

Maybe you could be more specific and rather than calling them people in the Philippines, call them your family or at least your wife’s family that you are helping as many other people on TV do also??  I am sure all over the world people will be helping their families during this period?

1 minute ago, amykat said:

Maybe you could be more specific and rather than calling them people in the Philippines, call them your family or at least your wife’s family that you are helping as many other people on TV do also??  I am sure all over the world people will be helping their families during this period?

Thank you for your concern.

 

FYI, it was mentioned in a number of posts above the one you quoted that I was helping my wife's family. If I'm helping a large family that is my wife's family, does that not count as help? Saying I'm helping my wife's family does not mean I don't help others too. There's no need to make assumptions. After a major typhoon I sent help for hundreds of people, so I don't always restrict my aid to family members... and I don't normally talk about it either, but another member suggested that I should get out and help people.

 

Who and how are you helping out Amy?

 

18 minutes ago, tropo said:

Thank you for your concern.

 

FYI, it was mentioned in a number of posts above the one you quoted that I was helping my wife's family. If I'm helping a large family that is my wife's family, does that not count as help? Saying I'm helping my wife's family does not mean I don't help others too. There's no need to make assumptions. After a major typhoon I sent help for hundreds of people, so I don't always restrict my aid to family members... and I don't normally talk about it either, but another member suggested that I should get out and help people.

 

Who and how are you helping out Amy?

 

If she's anything like my Aunt Amy she's probably more than doing her bit.

13 hours ago, AndyAndyAndy said:

Who is like me going about his normal everyday life?

Not possible in NZ. Government dictated lockdown for 4 weeks means "normal" life is impossible.

 

13 hours ago, AndyAndyAndy said:

Is there anybody left who is not having a complete mental breakdown because of corona?

I'm not concerned about it if that's what you mean. Either I get it and probably die, or I don't. What I am concerned about is that the economy is probably going to be ruined, and everyone is probably going to suffer for a very long time, not because of the virus per se, but because of what they are doing because of it.

 

Lots of "news" about how many are ill, and how many dead ( a few thousand out of 7 billion ), but they don't say how many would die of illness ( eg flue ) anyway during the same time. It apparently attacks old people most, which means that I'd probably die if I get it but none of us get out alive anyway, so it's just another way for me to die to include in the list.

 

I don't know how many will die of Corona before it's over, but I do know that millions will have no jobs to go back to, entire industries will be bankrupt ( tourism related ), many people ill from other diseases and physical problems will either die because the hospitals are full of Corona patients, or suffer because they can't get physical ailments fixed. It's not a good time to fall off a ladder at home doing DIY and break a leg as if the hospitals are full of Corona infected patients they are likely to become infected themselves when going to A + E for treatment.

 

It's not looking good for the common man in the months to come.

PS. Before I'm accused of being too negative without proposing a solution, my solution would be to isolate the infected and everyone else carry on as "normal". By all means practice social distancing and avoid large gatherings; wear masks and eye covers, if they can develop a mask that is practical, affordable and actually stops viruses.

The infected would be isolated in special facilities, NOT hospitals, so hospitals can carry on doing what they do.

With locking everyone down, what happens when the lockdown is over and the second wave ( third wave etc ) starts? Keep having lockdowns? That'd really stuff the economy.

 

This too will pass, and life will resume, but the question is, what sort of life will be possible?

3 hours ago, tropo said:

Thank you for your concern.

 

FYI, it was mentioned in a number of posts above the one you quoted that I was helping my wife's family. If I'm helping a large family that is my wife's family, does that not count as help? Saying I'm helping my wife's family does not mean I don't help others too. There's no need to make assumptions. After a major typhoon I sent help for hundreds of people, so I don't always restrict my aid to family members... and I don't normally talk about it either, but another member suggested that I should get out and help people.

 

Who and how are you helping out Amy?

 

Well I would love to list it all for you tropo, but since I just recently got laid off from my healthcare related job, I am too busy right now packing for my new assignment with Doctors Without Borders, so I will leave that for another time!!

8 minutes ago, amykat said:

Well I would love to list it all for you tropo, but since I just recently got laid off from my healthcare related job, I am too busy right now packing for my new assignment with Doctors Without Borders, so I will leave that for another time!!

I hope they are providing hazmat suits for you to use!

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I hope they are providing hazmat suits for you to use!

I have quite a lot of old diving gear I am working on repurposing!!

 

11 hours ago, JimmyTheMook said:

First it was only the elderly dying

nonsense,  they  are  "more  likely " to  die  doesnt  mean  others wont

 

1 hour ago, Chazar said:

nonsense,  they  are  "more  likely " to  die  doesnt  mean  others wont

I think "more likely" doesn't quite describe the proportion of older people dying. In Italy nearly 1000 of the victims were over 90, which was around 10% of the total death count of Italy at the time this article was written.

 

http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/03/italian-doctors-note-high-covid-19-death-rate-urge-action

 

Now let's take Australia as the ultimate guide to the absurdity of destroying a whole country's economy over this virus:

 

 

There we have today's figures. 14 deaths from 3809 confirmed cases.

 

The Guardian lists 16 deaths as of today, March 29.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/28/australias-coronavirus-toll-covid-19-related-deaths-across-the-country

 

Most of the victims have names.

 

To save the trouble of reading it, I will list the ages of all 16 victims:

 

78, 73, 68, 75, 95, 82, 90, 91, 70+ (exact age not given), 86, 81, 77, 3 x 70+ (exact ages not given) and 36 (died in Iceland, probably from the cold).

 

Surely any thinking person would conclude that the measures taken (in Australia) to shut down the entire country's economy and guarantee a depression is absurd in the extreme.

 

It's the politicians who are responsible because they are making the decisions and the decisions are based on following the rest of the world and the popular narrative (like lambs to the slaughter), as at the end of the day all these politicians care about is their popularity. Scott Morrison already took a lashing over his handling of the bush fires, so he wants to make good now. It's not easy to stay PM for long in Australia as party wrangling soon puts them out of office.

 

The Chinese government must be pissing themselves with laughter right now, seeing the start of a global economic collapse and their subsequent rise to the world domination.

 

Yes, everyone should be very worried right now, but not about contracting the virus.

 

 

 

 

Its waay to political, the important stuff gets buried in seas of stupid noise. Cant wait till its over. 

2 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Its waay to political, the important stuff gets buried in seas of stupid noise. Cant wait till its over. 

It's never going to be over, IMO. After this one will be more.

Bankrupcy, unemployment, domestic violence- what will be left to pick up when the lockdown is over, and if the second, third waves come will they lockdown again and again  and again, till there is literally nothing left for society?

The NZ lockdown happened very quickly without much notice. I feel for those that were living in cars off takeaways- no takeaways now, so are they eating cold food out of cans in their carpark of lockdown? Many public toilets closed- great news for truck drivers, not. Highways are going to be polluted end to end at this rate. Seems to me the government has not thought this through, but most politicians probably never had a real job, and no idea what it's like to be poor.

15 minutes ago, tropo said:

Surely any thinking person would conclude that the measures taken (in Australia) to shut down the entire country's economy and guarantee a depression is absurd in the extreme.

Can't be worse than in NZ.

Apparently tourism is one of the country's biggest overseas income earners. IMO that's gone, for a long time at least.

2 hours ago, Chazar said:

nonsense,  they  are  "more  likely " to  die  doesnt  mean  others wont

Yes others will die, but probably not the fit and those with good immune systems, which would be most, surely?

10 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Can't be worse than in NZ.

Apparently tourism is one of the country's biggest overseas income earners. IMO that's gone, for a long time at least.

Yes, most countries are now in a very bad way economically and the collapse has only just begun. 

 

I used Australia as an example of how the death rate is being misrepresented as I had a complete list of all the deaths and their ages. I remember hearing about the very first death attributed to covid19. A 95 years old women in NSW on March 3.

 

I was in shock when I heard of this. I was in shock because of how they used a 95 old woman's death as evidence of the spread of a new deadly virus.  

23 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I'm just taking precautions, shopping almost normally. Can still play golf, can't have a swim. Being an introvert, not particularly concerned about staying in my condo. Plenty of music, reading, TV series and films at my fingertips.

I guess the only way I could have a complete mental breakdown would be by taking on board the opinions of some TV posters.

Agree about the TV posters.....I don't ignore any of the fake news....I embrace it and carry on.....with a face mask on....????????????????

23 hours ago, steven100 said:

sounds like fun ... but what about your homework

That is his homework

45 minutes ago, tropo said:

Yes, most countries are now in a very bad way economically and the collapse has only just begun. 

 

I used Australia as an example of how the death rate is being misrepresented as I had a complete list of all the deaths and their ages. I remember hearing about the very first death attributed to covid19. A 95 years old women in NSW on March 3.

 

I was in shock when I heard of this. I was in shock because of how they used a 95 old woman's death as evidence of the spread of a new deadly virus.  

Before all this her death would not even have been reported.

Ignore is too strong a word, I will go along with convention but without the hysterior. No masks in my village so I don't wear one, going to the market town most will wear one so I do. Do I think about covid-19? no, do I think I could get it? unlikely in a village, if so then it is as it is.

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

Before all this her death would not even have been reported.

You'll have to admit she died unexpectedly at 95

23 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Can still play golf,

Your fortunate. Chonburi, Bangkok and Hua Hin golf is closed completely.

So much hysteria, hindsight will prove how badly the world over reacted to this pandemic. The cure will undoubtedly cause so much more suffering than the disease.

 

This quote helps put the current crisis in Italy into some context:

 

In recent years, Italy has been registering peaks in death rates, particularly among the elderly during the winter season. A mortality rate of 10.7 per 1,000 inhabitants was observed in the winter season 2014/2015 (more than 375,000 deaths in absolute terms), corresponding to an estimated 54,000 excess deaths (+9.1%) as compared to 2014 (Signorelli and Odone, 2016), representing the highest reported mortality rate since the Second World War in Italy (UN, 2019). Although the above-described excess mortality created concern among researchers, health authorities and public health experts, it has been challenging to identify its determinants (Signorelli and Odone, 2016).

 

 

Country Thailand (in the sticks) seem to be taking it very casually but what is known is that the 

mass exodus of workers must have carried the virus up there. Another 10 days will be the 

melting point for the villages. I hope they get lucky because from what I have seen that will be all it is,,,, just luck

Yes I am business as usual on my end, no fear no paranoia.  This whole thing is overdone to create fear, the governments around the world are going to take advantage of this to track you and reduce your liberties from here on out.  Herders are getting their sheep in order, What flock are you going to be in?

30 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Can't be worse than in NZ.

Apparently tourism is one of the country's biggest overseas income earners. IMO that's gone, for a long time at least.

I used Australia as my first example, but I want to make a more detailed analysis from another country, that if examined closely, should be enough evidence for people to start questioning the common narrative. 

 

Country: Philippines

Population: 109.2 million (12th highest in the world)

Death rate: 654,000 per year, or 1,791 per day, or 75 per hour

Life expectancy at birth: (male and female average): 70 years

Population living below poverty line: 21.6% or 23.54 million

 

ref: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/resources/the-world-factbook/geos/rp.html

 

Health care system: status: very poor

 

I have been following the Philippines very closely since first news of this new virus as my wife is from there.

 

Here are the current figures as of today, March 29:

 

 

In a country with an extremely poor health care system, with 23.5 million living below the poverty line (not able to eat properly), and a daily death rate of 1,791 people, we are told that a total of 68 people have died from a covid-19 infection, since January 30, when the first case was reported.

 

Here's a news update from yesterday, March 28:

 

https://www.cnnphilippines.com/news/2020/3/28/philippines-covid-19-cases-death-toll-recoveries.html

 

To save you having to read it, here is the most significant message. This is from CNN Philippines:

======================================================================================================

Elderly patients succumb to COVID-19

 

Most of the new fatalities are elderly patients from Metro Manila, although the residence of one of them – a 71-year-old man, remains unknown.

 

Five of the deceased are from Quezon City, two from Manila, one each from the cities of Pasig, San Juan, Caloocan, Parañaque, Taguig, and one from Bulacan province.

 

Almost all of them have no recent travel history abroad, except for three whose travel details are unknown.

 

Their ages ranged from 60 to 86. They all had underlying medical conditions such as hypertension, diabetes mellitus, asthma, heart disease, and kidney disease, among others.

=======================================================================================================

When I first heard about this new virus in the Philippines, I expected to see the population decimated, considering how poor the country is and the poor state of the nation's health care system. The first case was reported 2 months ago, yet only 68 have died and all had underlying medical conditions. This is no surprise, as most people over 60 living in the Philippines are in poor health. The average age expectancy of a male is only 66.5 years. Over the same period that 68 people were reported to have succumb to covid-19, 107,460 Filipinos have died from all other causes. Clearly the death rate from covid-19 is a drop in the ocean. There has been no exponential spread.

 

As a result of the worldwide narrative, the Philippines is now gripped with fear for this virus. People are starting to believe it spreads in the air at night, and all sorts of other crazy ideas. It was suggested by one relative for me not to go out at night as I might breathe it in.

 

As a result of this fear, the country is in an extreme state of lockdown, and when I say extreme, it's incredibly strict with full night time curfew throughout the whole nation. There is no more public transport allowed by land, sea or air. All roads are barricaded. Grocery stores in my wife's home town restrict 5 items per customer. They need to queue up outside. Markets don't allow food purchase unless you're wearing a mask (nevermind that masks are hard to find and many residents don't have money to buy them). All residents in every barangay are monitored (health check) and listed on a chart that must be submitted everyday. This is a town on an island with ZERO confirmed cases.

 

Most people have lost their jobs and rely on food handouts from their local municipalities. A lot of people who were already very poor will likely die of starvation. "Draconian" does not adequately describe the extreme measures the Philippine government has gone to in an effort stop the spread of covid-19, which has killed 68 elderly and already sick individuals in 60 days.

 

OK, so all this is going on right now... Duterte, who has been cosying up to the China since he became president in 2016, was sent a personal letter from Xi Jinping, not to worry - we have your back. We are ready to help - just ask. China will gladly spend billions to help the Philippines.

 

So draw your own conclusions. Call me a "whack job conspiracist" if you wish, but start digging deeper. Start questioning what is going on - your life and future may depend on it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 3/28/2020 at 1:01 PM, Berkshire said:

Hmmm....it's impossible to just live a "normal everyday life."  Many of the things that I normally do is just not available due to closure.  I have no fear of the COVID and I'm definitely not having a mental breakdown.  But my quality of life is suffering for sure.  And it sounds like this will go on until at least the end of April.  I may become an alcoholic by the time this thing runs its course.

Spot on , my view too.  Already a 'Virus over let's party' on the way .  Looking forward to normal service will be resumed .....   day after tomorrow.

I live my life as normal as possible.  Some places you can't get into without a facemask on.  And I will wear one in public just to make others feel better.

#&$#!!! It's people like you who make this situation last Sooo much longer than it needs too.  I hope when your normal life possibly end you up in the hospital for ANY REASON,BY The hospital turns you away cuz there outta space!

Andy, would love to leave but you can't just get up and go now. Almost total travel ban, no flights and a bit difficult to leave your family behind when you hold one nationality and your wife holds another. Visas aren't being processed for foreigners in almost all countries and the prospect of being forcibly quarantined at a government facility after landing home doesn't appeal very much.

 

With all the intrusive checkpoints, face mask wearing laws and thermo scanners everywhere, I'm not going out unless absolutely necessary (other than within my local community) until at least May or whenever these measures are loosened. It's scary to be living under martial law. The 'virus' is nothing, but the control system...now that's frightening. Plus the way locals are being suspicious of each other and foreigners to boot. Doesn't make a good mix. We'll just have to ride it out until things start looking better.