Why is there such a disdain of foreigners

[Happy Grumpy]

On 4/2/2020 at 10:33 AM, Bangkok Barry said:

why Thailand has such a disdain of foreigners

 

Penis and wallet envy. 

 

Combined with indoctrination from birth about how they are the best. 

Edited April 4, 2020 by Happy Grumpy

[josephbloggs]

4 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

You didn't answer the question, only by asking other questions. A classic ploy when someone doesn't have an answer.

So you really need an answer to why a foreign retiree needs funds to get a visa when Thais don't need funds to live in their own country?  You really genuinely don't understand?

[EVENKEEL]

40 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

 

Penis and wallet envy. 

 

Combined with indoctrination from birth about how they are the best. 

Guess I have nothing to worry about.

[Bangkok Barry]

3 hours ago, josephbloggs said:

So you really need an answer to why a foreign retiree needs funds to get a visa when Thais don't need funds to live in their own country?  You really genuinely don't understand?

Not really, no. And it doesn't only apply to retirees. Same as only foreigners must have a minimum monthly income to qualify for a visa, when there is no minimum that Thais must have have. I'd appreciate your take on it, as long as it isn't along the lines of all foreigners are rich and need more than Thais who are all poor to live on. Once my car is paid off in a couple of months I'll be able to live perfectly comfortably on 15,000 a month, which includes electric, internet, IPTV, aircon, eating out once a week, eating foreign-style food most evenings, some of which comes from overseas and some not. One size does not fit all.

 

So go ahead please. I'm all ears. Educate me.

[vinny41]

7 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

It is difficult to respect people and a country in the form of its government who look for every way they can to make life difficult for you by making up rules as they go along, while also discriminating against non-Thais. Just one example - why do certain foreigners have to have 400,000 or 800,000 in the bank, but Thais do not? We all live in the same country.

 

Respect isn't a right. It has to be earned. RESPECT ISN'T A RIGHT. IT HAS TO BE EARNED.

Do you know of any country in the world that gives the same rights as their own nationals to foreigners from day 1 of their arrival into that country

[Bangkok Barry]

5 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Do you know of any country in the world that gives the same rights as their own nationals to foreigners from day 1 of their arrival into that country

Have you heard of the EU? Do you know of any country in the world that changes the rules foreigners must adhere to from one office to another, even one officer to another, rather than operating by the book? I'm sure there are quite a few, and Thailand is one of them. Only Thai apologists find that acceptable and regard it as normal and making up rules as they go along as deserving respect.

 

Just look next door to Laos, when the Thai embassy refuses to offer multi Os for marriage while the Thai consulate does. On what grounds, and with what justification does the embassy refuse to do so? People either qualify or they don't. Why do they qualify in Savannakhet and not in Vientiane. Same circumstances, same paper work, one says no and the other says no problem.

[vinny41]

6 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Have you heard of the EU? Do you know of any country in the world that changes the rules foreigners must adhere to from one office to another, even one officer to another, rather than operating by the book? I'm sure there are quite a few, and Thailand is one of them. Only Thai apologists find that acceptable and regard it as normal and making up rules as they go along as deserving respect.

 

Just look next door to Laos, when the Thai embassy refuses to offer multi Os for marriage while the Thai consulate does. On what grounds, and with what justification does the embassy refuse to do so? People either qualify or they don't. Why do they qualify in Savannakhet and not in Vientiane. Same circumstances, same paper work, one says no and the other says no problem.

There isn't a single country in the EU that gives the same rights to foreigners as their own nationals have from day 1 of arrival into a EU country

[Bangkok Barry]

3 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

13 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Have you heard of the EU? Do you know of any country in the world that changes the rules foreigners must adhere to from one office to another, even one officer to another, rather than operating by the book? I'm sure there are quite a few, and Thailand is one of them. Only Thai apologists find that acceptable and regard it as normal and making up rules as they go along as deserving respect.

 

Just look next door to Laos, when the Thai embassy refuses to offer multi Os for marriage while the Thai consulate does. On what grounds, and with what justification does the embassy refuse to do so? People either qualify or they don't. Why do they qualify in Savannakhet and not in Vientiane. Same circumstances, same paper work, one says no and the other says no problem.

There isn't a single country in the EU that gives the same rights to foreigners as their own nationals have from day 1 of arrival into a EU country

We'll have to agree to disagree on that. Many, not all but most things that count, relate equally to all, due to cross-(porous)border agreements. And now address the rest of my post. Thanks.

[drbeach]

On 4/3/2020 at 12:57 PM, Toosetinmyways said:

My wife's sister is a government officer. Her problem with foreigners is not disdain but the attitude from some, (mostly farang) that they seem to think laws and rules in Thailand do not apply to them. 

 

I personally lay the blame for the anti farang sentiment at the feet of the VLoggers. Especially the one that featured Pattaya Soi 6 in all his videos.

 

LOL.

 

For starters, most laws in Thailand don't seem to apply to Thais. Like burning fields and forests in violation of both common sense and anti-burning ordinances. The traffic, the quarantine dodgers (although they are finding it increasingly difficult to get out of that) and I could go on. So I'm not sure what your wife's sister is on about, because Thais aren't any better. Now if Thailand were like Japan, I'd take her seriously.

 

"Anti-farang sentiment because of Vloggers"? That's hilarious. No one other than prostitutes themselves would be offended by that. Everyone, Thais and farang alike know what goes on in soi 6.

 

So it can't be that.

 

if it's anything, it could be a disproportionate number of foreigners are disrespecting Thais in general. But outside of some areas with heavy tourist traffic, I don't think Thais are being exposed to foreigners enough to form an opinion on that.

I thus suspect any anti-farang sentiment for the average person is coming from government sources as a way of distracting the populace from their own incompetence. It's a tried and tested strategy of all autocratic governments in times of crisis. The Chinese have been using it successfully for years, to stir up tensions against the Japanese, which has resulted in riots and violence against Japanese interests.

[vinny41]

exercised

5 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on that. Many, not all but most things that count, relate equally to all, due to cross-(porous)border agreements. And now address the rest of my post. Thanks.

No they don't your totally incorrect

3 Brits all retired recently married

Brit A marrys German Lady

Brit B marrys Thiai Lady

Brit C marrys Thai Lady ( Brit C has worked in Germany for 1 year before he retired)

All 3 brits wish to bring their spouses to the UK and live the rest of the lives there

Only Brit B is required to show savings of £62,500 before they can enter the UK , Brit A that rule doesn't apply and Brit C that rule doesn't apply as they have exercised their right of free movement

Now I can suggest to you that you could back to the UK and resolved all the different rules and regulations that applie to both Brits and foreign nationals entering the UK

As a foreigner living in Thailand if you don't like the rules Leave I am not aware of any rule that prevents you from leaving and moving to another country with the execption of the current lockdown

[KhunFred]

In any western country, a Thai can be what they are. The reverse is not true for farangs. We are expected to be Thai.

[drbeach]

14 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on that. Many, not all but most things that count, relate equally to all, due to cross-(porous)border agreements. And now address the rest of my post. Thanks.

Yep. Don't know what that other guy was going on about. EU nationals have far more rights in any other EU country than say Burmese guest workers have in Thailand. They will also find seeking citizenship of the EU country they choose to reside in, is pretty much guaranteed after a few years of residency. Brining a foreign car in is a matter of driving across a border you may miss if you're not paying attention with no time limits - although you may be required to switch to local plates after a certain period of residency (like 1 year). It's not like in SE Asia where you have to go through tons of paperwork and then you only get 30 days for the car, or where you're rejected altogether unless you sign up for an expensive tour (Vietnam, Myanmar, China).

[vinny41]

6 minutes ago, drbeach said:

Yep. Don't know what that other guy was going on about. EU nationals have far more rights in any other EU country than say Burmese guest workers have in Thailand. They will also find seeking citizenship of the EU country they choose to reside in, is pretty much guaranteed after a few years of residency. Brining a foreign car in is a matter of driving across a border you may miss if you're not paying attention with no time limits - although you may be required to switch to local plates after a certain period of residency (like 1 year). It's not like in SE Asia where you have to go through tons of paperwork and then you only get 30 days for the car, or where you're rejected altogether unless you sign up for an expensive tour (Vietnam, Myanmar, China).

Its simple There isn't a single country in the EU that gives the same rights to foreigners as their own nationals have from day 1 of arrival into a EU country 

[Bangkok Barry]

4 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

exercised

No they don't your totally incorrect

3 Brits all retired recently married

Brit A marrys German Lady

Brit B marrys Thiai Lady

Brit C marrys Thai Lady ( Brit C has worked in Germany for 1 year before he retired)

All 3 brits wish to bring their spouses to the UK and live the rest of the lives there

Only Brit B is required to show savings of £62,500 before they can enter the UK , Brit A that rule doesn't apply and Brit C that rule doesn't apply as they have exercised their right of free movement

Now I can suggest to you that you could back to the UK and resolved all the different rules and regulations that applie to both Brits and foreign nationals entering the UK

As a foreigner living in Thailand if you don't like the rules Leave I am not aware of any rule that prevents you from leaving and moving to another country with the execption of the current lockdown

Ha ha. The old 'if you don't like then you are free to leave' line. How very original of you. Thanks. Is that really the best you can do? Suggest I abandon my family and leave? When I came here 26 years ago it was a good place to be, but any long-termer will tell you it has changed dramatically and continues to change. And you still haven't argued in support of the arbitrary way that rules and regulations regarding immigration are applied. Perhaps you can't. I can understand that.

[drbeach]

12 minutes ago, KhunFred said:

In any western country, a Thai can be what they are. The reverse is not true for farangs. We are expected to be Thai.

That's largely true, but Thais can't be "mak ngai" which roughly translates as uncaring and doing whatever you want, like they are in Thailand. It means simply they can be Thai as in retaining most of their cultural habits, but excluding habits like driving like suicidal morons, or lighting forest fires with impunity and such things.

 

I'm not sure whether we're expected to be Thai. I certainly don't try to be (anymore). The longer I live here, the more proud I am to be a westerner...individual rights and freedom are synonymous with western culture and that's what I'm most proud of, whether Thais care about it or not. I also prefer my own food, though I still enjoy most Thai food and when I tell my employees what to do, they do so based on my western cultural values. Cleaning up after yourself and not lighting fires to burn garbage is part of that.

[vinny41]

4 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Ha ha. The old 'if you don't like then you are free to leave' line. How very original of you. Thanks. Is that really the best you can do? Suggest I abandon my family and leave? When I came here 26 years ago it was a good place to be, but any long-termer will tell you it has changed dramatically and continues to change. And you still haven't argued in support of the arbitrary way that rules and regulations regarding immigration are applied. Perhaps you can't. I can understand that.

I don't recall any suggestion that you should abandon your family , there nothing stopping you from taking your family with you should you decide to leave because you don't like change, and yes I haven't argued in support of the arbitrary way that rules and regulations regarding immigration are applied. becuase they will always be differences applied to immigration rules between a country own nationals and foreigners Likewise you haven't provide information on a single country in the world where a foreigner entering that country on day 1 will be given the same rights as that country own nationals.

[drbeach]

13 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Ha ha. The old 'if you don't like then you are free to leave' line. How very original of you. Thanks. Is that really the best you can do? Suggest I abandon my family and leave? When I came here 26 years ago it was a good place to be, but any long-termer will tell you it has changed dramatically and continues to change. And you still haven't argued in support of the arbitrary way that rules and regulations regarding immigration are applied. Perhaps you can't. I can understand that.

Totally agree with you. Would like to hear about your views on how attitudes and rules have changed in that time.

 

I first came to Thailand on my own just over 20 years ago. Prior to that, I came with my family on short stopover holidays.

 

I remember visas were as easy as crossing the border and coming back at infinitum, until about 2005ish? Thaksin changed things. Still, that was no real way to live but wasn't relevant for me either, as I was mostly just visiting during university holidays and traveling around the region, never spending more than 2 months or so in the country at a time, except in 2004 when I spent 8 months teaching English and again in 2008 when I worked for a foreign chamber. Both times with a proper non-B visa.

 

On the positive side, children born to foreign fathers are no longer racially discriminated against by being denied Thai citizenship as they were until the law was changed back around the 90s? I think was. Around 2008 Thai women married to foreigners no longer gave up the right to own land.

 

So there's been both good and bad. I think I can summarize the changes as - previously, the government had many anti-foreigner policies in place, but everything was done with a smile; just that foreigners were forced to be perpetual tourists. As long as you were OK with that, not being allowed to own anything or your children even being granted the right to citizenship, that was the deal. You were left alone. Now, they are more accommodating to the Thai family members of foreigners and have removed the previously discriminatory clauses, and also have attractive policies for rich foreigners, but they have created a general anti-foreigner vibe. Something like that.

Edited April 4, 2020 by drbeach

[ravip]

Thank you. Your intimate feelings for Thailand you have shown very clearly, without leaving any room for doubt.

 

Just imagine though, if the British had come into Thailand.

 

The above sentence is enough to confirm your 'intimate' feelings about Thailand and also to make clear, you know nothing of what the British did to the countries they occupied (I would say ruined). Of course, with a certain type of mindset, even today some think they are masters and are ruling some people on this planet.

 

TBH, not ONLY Thailand, many countries are now wise to what their ancient rulers did to them and they hate the sight of them - occasionally, due to poverty and at times, due to politeness they hide their hatred.

 

Some, mostly females from 3rd world countries, when married or sponsored by a rich foreigner, they totally change their mentality to the Western way and look down on their country and it's people - this can be seen very often in their choice of dress, hairstyles and behaviour in public. The locals in any country, recognises this and are ashamed about it - they will try to avoid these people at all times, when possible.

Very rarely would you find this happening amongst people who are well educated and brought up in a good, sound family environment, regardless of their financial status; who at most times will prefer to live a normal 'local family life' with a local partner.

 

[drbeach]

On 4/2/2020 at 7:31 PM, shy coconut said:

There is a lot of merit in viewing the machinations and population of the country

diffently after living there for some time. If your initial thoughts were poor, you wouldn't

have moved in the 1st place. There's only one poster I can think of (kitten Kong)

who moved here for tax reasons and doesn't seem to have ever had any affection

for the country.

 

To say that the country may have been better had it been colonised by the UK is

often mooted. Singapore and Malaya are completely different to the colonial days.

India hasn't improved that much as far as education is concerned.

 

The wealth of these countries has increased as a result of the way the rest of the

world has changed in the last 50 years, not because the British rulers, they built the

railways to move soldiers around quickly to quell rebellion and extract minerals 

back home, not as an alturistic gift to the locals as the bade a fond farewell to 

The lucky folk we colonised for so long.

 

Maybe the perception of disdain is because some folk actually believe that they

are colonial masters rather than people merely living overseas in another country.

The lack of forelock tugging must really grate on these relics from another era.

You've summarized my points quite well.

 

Colonialism is just a footnote in history. As you say, even if legal systems and certain other aspects of society, including the development of a basic infrastructure was put in place by the colonial powers, it was mostly done to support their activities as opposed to being an altruistic action to help those countries.

 

I can't argue against some aspects of colonialism being beneficial to the recipient countries, but their impact is often greatly exaggerated. My own journeys into India, Malaysia, Singapore, Cambodia, Vietnam and all the other countries in the region (with the exception of the Philippines, which I have yet to visit) prove my point.

 

If anything, colonialism had relatively little impact in this part of the world - unlike in the Americas, where you have multicultural populations and European languages as the lingua franca (Spanish, English, French and Portuguese). The cultures of Latin America and the Caribbean are totally a mixture of European, imported African and local indigenous influences. Whereas, in Asia, the colonialists have only managed to introduce English as a lingua franca, alongside local languages in a few countries like the Philippines, India, Malaysia and Singapore, mostly for official and business communications. Migrant workers from India were brought to the Malay peninsula by the British, but their people never intermarried on masse with the locals, nor did the French in their Asian colonies. Or the Dutch for that matter. Otherwise, you'd expect to see a large swathe of the SE Asian population being of mixed European-Asian heritage, which is not the case at all. At most, 1% of the population was ever Eurasian in countries such as Malaysia and Burma, but many of these people have since migrated to the west. This compares to the 60% of the Mexican population who are of mixed Spanish/indigenous heritage ("Mestizo") and 10% pure European, with the remainder being pure indigenous. All other Latin American countries are similar; with different ethnic make-ups but only a couple being majority indigenous (Bolivia and Paraguay).

 

As some formerly colonized countries in Asia descended into turmoil and war due to various causes after the colonial powers left, whatever vestiges of colonialism that were left behind, were soon forgotten. Burma, now Myanmar, lost most aspects of it's colonial heritage, other than some examples of architecture after the military coup of 62. Consequently, English language instruction at schools was stopped for decades and only re-instituted a few years ago. Burma was actually a place where Malays and Singaporeans went to study in the 50s. It was one of the most developed countries in all of East Asia. Singapore's development into the powerhouse it is today was thanks to the governing structure that developed in the 50s that rules the country to the present day. 

 

Anyway, even Thailand was in a way "colonized" by foreign powers despite not having been an official colony of anyone. Japanese and later American developmental assistance was made possible due to Thailand's willingness to be in an alliance with these powers at the time. As a result, the country avoided being part of a wider war being waged in neighboring countries and largely escaped unscathed from both World War 2 and the Indochina wars.

[Bangkok Barry]

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

I think because Bangkokbarry attitude.

 

Thai not hate foreigner because is foreigner. Most foreigner nice, polite, friendly.

But hate some foreigner because attitude and behavior. Not every foreigner good people right? 

 

Think barry have bad experience. Lonely. 

Most foreigner enjoy live thailand, is very popular. (Not this thread)

 

If not like, can live another country right? Thai not make you stay, not want you stay if you not like. Up to you.

 

i think some foreigner believe thai care/think/talk about foreigner a lot. Not true. Imagine.

 

Some post this thread look like have male menopause mix with paranoia and Alzheimer’s. Imagine bad thing.

 

 

I have nothing against Thai people, only the attitude with which the government treats foreigners, as a potential criminal. National security is always used as an excuse, even now when every country around Thailand has given automatic visa extensions but Thailand is dragging its feet because of national security. What is the threat, exactly? All long-stayers have to report themselves to the authorities as if on probation from jail. And the 90-day exit nonsense, for what? Leave, come back five minutes later. It's just a form of control with no benefit to anyone.

I have been married for nearly 30 years to a Thai and lived in Thailand for 26. And I still have to get permission each year to live here. If I want to extend my 90 day permission to stay by another 60, my request is put 'under consideration'. Why should I not be given automatic permission to live with my wife? It's insane.

 

I don't expect you to agree with me, as I learned long ago that it is impossible to win an argument with a Thai.

[drbeach]

18 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I have nothing against Thai people, only the attitude with which the government treats foreigners, as a potential criminal. National security is always used as an excuse, even now when every country around Thailand has given automatic visa extensions but Thailand is dragging its feet because of national security. What is the threat, exactly? All long-stayers have to report themselves to the authorities as if on probation from jail. And the 90-day exit nonsense, for what? Leave, come back five minutes later. It's just a form of control with no benefit to anyone.

I have been married for nearly 30 years to a Thai and lived in Thailand for 26. And I still have to get permission each year to live here. If I want to extend my 90 day permission to stay by another 60, my request is put 'under consideration'. Why should I not be given automatic permission to live with my wife? It's insane.

 

I don't expect you to agree with me, as I learned long ago that it is impossible to win an argument with a Thai.

Thais are stubborn. Not all of them though. However, I win plenty of arguments with Thais, when it comes to topics like this one. You'll find that with military government apologists like Yinn, although they occasionally raise some good points, they usually attack you with ad hominems and straw man arguments because they obviously can't defend certain uncomfortable realities.

Simply because, you can't defend the indefensible, such as defending xenophobia and racism. In civilized societies, we rightfully look down on such attitudes, because they are backward and disgusting. No one likes a racist, and I'm sure that the more educated elements of Thai society agree.

 

You are right that there is simply zero justification for this kind of treatment toward us. We should be given automatic visa extensions. If neighboring countries, including those like Cambodia, whose leadership isn't exactly "farang friendly" either can do it, so can Thailand.

 

There are only two reasons why they can't: 1) Thai leaders have a lower IQ than Cambodian leaders (possible, though unlikely). 2) they hate us and want to make our lives as inconvenient as possible. I'm guessing the latter, though not ruling out the former!

[drbeach]

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

I think because Bangkokbarry attitude.

 

Thai not hate foreigner because is foreigner. Most foreigner nice, polite, friendly.

But hate some foreigner because attitude and behavior. Not every foreigner good people right? 

 

Think barry have bad experience. Lonely. 

Most foreigner enjoy live thailand, is very popular. (Not this thread)

 

If not like, can live another country right? Thai not make you stay, not want you stay if you not like. Up to you.

 

i think some foreigner believe thai care/think/talk about foreigner a lot. Not true. Imagine.

 

Some post this thread look like have male menopause mix with paranoia and Alzheimer’s. Imagine bad thing.

 

 

Your post reads like you are suffering from Alzheimer's or schizophrenia. You certainly aren't living in the same world as the rest of us!

[baansgr]

On 4/2/2020 at 10:57 AM, tonray said:

Yes...I can imagine them leaving it like India and parts of Africa, pillaged for her resources and left with some neat old colonial buildings for postcards

Strange you don't mention Singapore, Hong Kong, Malaysia, Australia, Bermuda to name but a few...maybe because the locals of the countries you mention are what they are...

[baansgr]

You only have to see what a whistle and high viz jacket do to a Thai....power crazy

[Odysseus123]

If you are stupid enough to be a "farang" in an Asian country (strange shade of pinko-grey) and expect to be treated as equal..

 

Why then..you are stupid enough to live in an Asian country.

[JAFO]

I read 1.5 pages and that was enough for me. I think the ones full of themselves are the foreigners who have some sort of inferiority complex.

The fact that posters sit around all day thinking and talking about this <deleted> is laughable.

 

You all carry on with your insecurities and do not worry, Thai people are sitting around plotting and planning on ways how to hate you...???? 

 

  

[ravip]

38 minutes ago, drbeach said:

Thais are stubborn. Not all of them though. However, I win plenty of arguments with Thais, when it comes to topics like this one. You'll find that with military government apologists like Yinn, although they occasionally raise some good points, they usually attack you with ad hominems and straw man arguments because they obviously can't defend certain uncomfortable realities.

Simply because, you can't defend the indefensible, such as defending xenophobia and racism. In civilized societies, we rightfully look down on such attitudes, because they are backward and disgusting. No one likes a racist, and I'm sure that the more educated elements of Thai society agree.

 

You are right that there is simply zero justification for this kind of treatment toward us. We should be given automatic visa extensions. If neighboring countries, including those like Cambodia, whose leadership isn't exactly "farang friendly" either can do it, so can Thailand.

 

There are only two reasons why they can't: 1) Thai leaders have a lower IQ than Cambodian leaders (possible, though unlikely). 2) they hate us and want to make our lives as inconvenient as possible. I'm guessing the latter, though not ruling out the former!

Simply because, you can't defend the indefensible, such as defending xenophobia and racism. In civilized societies, we rightfully look down on such attitudes, because they are backward and disgusting. No one likes a racist, and I'm sure that the more educated elements of Thai society agree.

 

Do you REALLY mean this? Yes, we 'see' some supposedly civilised societies saying that xenophobia and racism is unacceptable. Do you know that in those very same countries it exists in abundance. For example, have you not ever seen a xenophobic and racist post here at the TVF? Do they appear so very rarely that it can be disregarded? Yes, really and honestly... not for arguments sake, or as a face saving gesture.

[Yinn]

1 hour ago, drbeach said:

Thais are stubborn. Not all of them though. However, I win plenty of arguments with Thais, when it comes to topics like this one. You'll find that with military government apologists like Yinn, although they occasionally raise some good points, they usually attack you with ad hominems and straw man arguments because they obviously can't defend certain uncomfortable realities.

Simply because, you can't defend the indefensible, such as defending xenophobia and racism. In civilized societies, we rightfully look down on such attitudes, because they are backward and disgusting. No one likes a racist, and I'm sure that the more educated elements of Thai society agree.

 

You are right that there is simply zero justification for this kind of treatment toward us. We should be given automatic visa extensions. If neighboring countries, including those like Cambodia, whose leadership isn't exactly "farang friendly" either can do it, so can Thailand.

 

There are only two reasons why they can't: 1) Thai leaders have a lower IQ than Cambodian leaders (possible, though unlikely). 2) they hate us and want to make our lives as inconvenient as possible. I'm guessing the latter, though not ruling out the former!

And Australia tell the thai people to go back thailand.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8184065/Australia-tells-foreign-visitors-make-way-home-coronavirus-crisis-intensifies.html

[Yinn]

2 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I have nothing against Thai people, only the attitude with which the government treats foreigners, as a potential criminal. National security is always used as an excuse, even now when every country around Thailand has given automatic visa extensions but Thailand is dragging its feet because of national security. What is the threat, exactly? All long-stayers have to report themselves to the authorities as if on probation from jail. And the 90-day exit nonsense, for what? Leave, come back five minutes later. It's just a form of control with no benefit to anyone.

I have been married for nearly 30 years to a Thai and lived in Thailand for 26. And I still have to get permission each year to live here. If I want to extend my 90 day permission to stay by another 60, my request is put 'under consideration'. Why should I not be given automatic permission to live with my wife? It's insane.

 

I don't expect you to agree with me, as I learned long ago that it is impossible to win an argument with a Thai.

And 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8184065/Australia-tells-foreign-visitors-make-way-home-coronavirus-crisis-intensifies.html

[Bangkok Barry]

3 hours ago, drbeach said:

Totally agree with you. Would like to hear about your views on how attitudes and rules have changed in that time.

Briefly, things changed because there were a number of people abusing the system. But, instead of punishing the few, rules were introduced that made remaining in Thailand more difficult for many. The screws have been tightening ever since, as others have pointed out like boiling a frog. I think the view of foreigners by the average Thai has improved as they have got more used to us being around - I've been here long enough to remember kids calling out to me in the street as seeing a whitey was unusual. You won't find that nearly as much now, if at all. The governments though have become more and more paranoid, less and less welcoming. Can you imagine what life will be like if the health minister achieves his ambition to become PM? We might as well pack our bags. I foresee an Idi Amin situation (Google him if you aren't aware of what he did about foreigners in his country).