5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 

 

https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/role/parliament-government/

 

In a democracy a Government is held accountable for its failings.

 

Like letting plane loads of UNCHECKED fruit pickers into the country?

11 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

Arm chair quarterbacking, Chomper?  Hindsight is always 20/20.  You speak as though you would have made all the correct decisions if you were you the one in command.  I would hardly think so.  Best you show some respect for those who did the best they could.  I have no respect for know-it-alls, especially those speaking after the fact.

 

The problem with this is that it works as an all-purpose excuse for anyone who has ever screwed things up.

6 minutes ago, kingdong said:

 

Like letting plane loads of UNCHECKED fruit pickers into the country?

Given the fact the virus is already widely spread within the community adding a few hundreds more people (most of whom are probably not infected) isn’t going noticeably to change the total infection/death rates, if at all.

 

And anyway who is going to pick your turnips?

 

Being distracted by pointing at a few foreigners doesn’t change the tragedy that has resulted from the Government’s mishandling of this health crisis.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Given the fact the virus is already widely spread within the community adding a few hundreds more people (most of whom are probably not infected) isn’t going noticeably to change the total infection/death rates, if at all.

 

And anyway who is going to pick your turnips?

 

Being distracted by pointing at a few foreigners doesn’t change the tragedy that has resulted from the Government’s mishandling of this health crisis.

 

 

Most of whom are PROBABLY not infected how do you know?and I don,t eat turnips so personally couldn,t give a tinkers cuss.wondered how long it would be till the race card was played.

4 minutes ago, kingdong said:

Most of whom are PROBABLY not infected how do you know?and I don,t eat turnips so personally couldn,t give a tinkers cuss.wondered how long it would be till the race card was played.

1. Simple probability.

2. The UK’s farm industry is heavily reliant on seasonal immigrant farm workers, hence the UK’s food security is heavily reliant on seasonal immigrant farm workers.

3. I’m not at all sure what you are on about  with the ‘race card’ you just introduced into the discussion.

 

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

1. Simple probability.

2. The UK’s farm industry is heavily reliant on seasonal immigrant farm workers, hence the UK’s food security is heavily reliant on seasonal immigrant farm workers.

3. I’m not at all sure what you are on about  with the ‘race card’ you just introduced into the discussion.

 

Try reading your last paragraph, "foreigners" with over 3 million unemployed in the uk shouldn,t we be getting the able bodied among them to pick turnips? "Simple probability" in other words you haven,t got a clue,

2 minutes ago, kingdong said:

Try reading your last paragraph, "foreigners" with over 3 million unemployed in the uk shouldn,t we be getting the able bodied among them to pick turnips? "Simple probability" in other words you haven,t got a clue,

Yes, that would be good. So maybe Johnson is not handling as well as you claim?

13 hours ago, 7by7 said:

I see the BoJo apologists are out and about. 

 

Let them answer this: if Johnson's initial response was the best he could do at the time, why did he deliberately not attend five Cobra meetings on the virus? 

 

That's not a mistake, that's not even incompetence. That's ignoring his responsibility as Prime Minister. 

I can't understand why people support this useless irresponsible buffoon and his team of second rate liars. His party laid the foundations by neglecting the NHS and abandoning plans and resources to deal with pandemics - which are known to happen from time to time. Stupid brexit and xenophobic migration rules weakened us further - we lost valuable NHS staff inter alia. Then failure to act quickly to deal with the virus has caused 1000s of unnecessary deaths. Blood on their hands! How are still in government? 

1 minute ago, kingdong said:

Try reading your last paragraph, "foreigners" with over 3 million unemployed in the uk shouldn,t we be getting the able bodied among them to pick turnips? "Simple probability" in other words you haven,t got a clue,

I’m sure it would be a good idea to get British people doing their own harvesting, but there’s a problem with doing so.

 

While the ‘Dunkirk Spirit’ thing plays well from the comfort of an armchair, few are keen on the ‘Dig for victory’ bit.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/17/british-workers-reject-fruit-picking-jobs-as-romanians-flown-in-coronavirus

On 4/22/2020 at 8:05 AM, Rookiescot said:

Johnson and his apologists keep claiming they listened  to experts.

 

Yes, always a mistake to listen to experts when expats are on hand. We know it all. We would have made no mistakes.

 

Experts said there was no evidence to suggest masks were useful. 

They also said that if everybody rushed to buy masks there would be none for the doctors and nurses.

But if the masks were useless why would doctors and nurses need them ? Illogical.

 

Now they have done a volte face and say masks should be worn to prevent the spread of the virus.

 

With people like this giving out advice any government was likely to make mistakes. I doubt if Corbyn would have done any better.

12 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

Johnson was following the advice of SAGE and NERVTAG. At the time when he didn't attend the COBRA meetings, SAGE and NERVTAG advised that the Covid 19 threat level was only 'moderate'. All the relevant experts and department heads were at those meetings. 

The Times article you are referring to is riddled with contradictions and inconsistencies. It is sensationalising for the sake of it. Articles like this bank on people not reading thoroughly enough, or researching, and falling for the sound bites. 

maybe he was discussing tactics with ''The liar from the Whitehouse'' as i heard he had time to contact him, That showed where and who was important to him ''Cobra'' who is ''Cobra'' and now here we get it was everyone else's fault, only needs a bit of orange makeup and they could be twins.he has a lot of his mates moves already.

an absolute B**LS UP and i wont mention the health minister Hancock's Idiotic requests, another clown.

any bets against The USA and UK end up 1st and 2nd for Deaths in the world, but it will be not their fault ,  that is if we ever get the correct figures, as it needs a public inquiry.  

 

9 minutes ago, Denim said:

 

Yes, always a mistake to listen to experts when expats are on hand. We know it all. We would have made no mistakes.

 

Experts said there was no evidence to suggest masks were useful. 

They also said that if everybody rushed to buy masks there would be none for the doctors and nurses.

But if the masks were useless why would doctors and nurses need them ? Illogical.

 

Now they have done a volte face and say masks should be worn to prevent the spread of the virus.

 

With people like this giving out advice any government was likely to make mistakes. I doubt if Corbyn would have done any better.

Very few countries around the planet decided on a policy of herd immunity. The UK did. It then had to do a volte face and instigate a shutdown. If we had went with the shutdown earlier rather than losing weeks of precious time many lives would have been saved.

If the government had stockpiled PPE, ventilators and tests rather than sitting on its hands we would not be in a position where NHS staff and careworkers are going without.

If the UK government had joined the collective effort organised by the EU to bulk buy the above mentioned items we would not be short of them now. But apparently the UK government lost the email from the EU asking them to join with the collective purchase. Now that is pure incompetence at best. More likely a decision was made not to join the EU collective effort to access PPE because of political choice. 

This will have costs lives.

Everyone could see what was happening in other countries. We were well warned.

Johnsons handling of this crisis has been pathetic. It was always going to be. You can't beat a virus with slogans on a bus. He is out of his depth. He has always been workshy and has the attention span of a goldfish.

Not the kind of person you want running a country during a crisis. 

21 minutes ago, Denim said:

 

Yes, always a mistake to listen to experts when expats are on hand. We know it all. We would have made no mistakes.

 

Experts said there was no evidence to suggest masks were useful. 

They also said that if everybody rushed to buy masks there would be none for the doctors and nurses.

But if the masks were useless why would doctors and nurses need them ? Illogical.

 

Now they have done a volte face and say masks should be worn to prevent the spread of the virus.

 

With people like this giving out advice any government was likely to make mistakes. I doubt if Corbyn would have done any better.

The masks are worn so doctors dont give the virus to the patient. Not the other way around. It helps stop you spreading it. It doesnt stop you getting it.

 

doctors also wear masks because the virus isnt the only thing that can spread. Masks do help with those other things.

 

also the masks they use are not the run of the mill useless masks most wear.

 

What is expected is the govt listen to experts in their field and make the decisions based on those facts. Not make political decisions or to shop around until they get the advice they want to hear.

52 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Yes, that would be good. So maybe Johnson is not handling as well as you claim?

Where did I claim Johnson is not handling as well as I claim?

48 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I’m sure it would be a good idea to get British people doing their own harvesting, but there’s a problem with doing so.

 

While the ‘Dunkirk Spirit’ thing plays well from the comfort of an armchair, few are keen on the ‘Dig for victory’ bit.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/17/british-workers-reject-fruit-picking-jobs-as-romanians-flown-in-coronavirus

Then stop their benefits

14 hours ago, 7by7 said:

I see the BoJo apologists are out and about. 

 

Let them answer this: if Johnson's initial response was the best he could do at the time, why did he deliberately not attend five Cobra meetings on the virus? 

 

That's not a mistake, that's not even incompetence. That's ignoring his responsibility as Prime Minister. 

Also he is not taking his serious consideration over EU procurement scheme...

2 minutes ago, kingdong said:

Where did I claim Johnson is not handling as well as I claim?

English please.

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

English please.

???????

27 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Very few countries around the planet decided on a policy of herd immunity. The UK did. It then had to do a volte face and instigate a shutdown. If we had went with the shutdown earlier rather than losing weeks of precious time many lives would have been saved.

If the government had stockpiled PPE, ventilators and tests rather than sitting on its hands we would not be in a position where NHS staff and careworkers are going without.

If the UK government had joined the collective effort organised by the EU to bulk buy the above mentioned items we would not be short of them now. But apparently the UK government lost the email from the EU asking them to join with the collective purchase. Now that is pure incompetence at best. More likely a decision was made not to join the EU collective effort to access PPE because of political choice. 

This will have costs lives.

Everyone could see what was happening in other countries. We were well warned.

Johnsons handling of this crisis has been pathetic. It was always going to be. You can't beat a virus with slogans on a bus. He is out of his depth. He has always been workshy and has the attention span of a goldfish.

Not the kind of person you want running a country during a crisis. 

Stay on topic brexit occurred before the virus,at least when ( if ) this virus ends the uk will be able to make its own decisions and not be bound by the eu,checked out the body counts of Italy and spain?

31 minutes ago, kingdong said:

???????

Read your question again please. 

14 hours ago, darksidedog said:

Firstly I ask posters to keep things polite and on topic.

With the possible exception of South Korea pretty much everyone got their approach wrong.

There will be time to assess exactly what happened down the track.

This caught everyone by surprise and I for one am very happy I didn't have to make any of the calls that have been made.

Catch 22 if ever there was one.

All governments fumbled - some much worse than others, in particular the UK and the US. Others did much better eg the Federal Republic of Germany. And finally SE Asia has done pretty well, especially Viet Nam. And I feel far safer here in Chiang Mai (40 cases, 1 death) than in the UK where I fear for the life of my daughter who is a nurse.

Those sad clips where Johnson was visiting a Covid ward and shaking hand with patients in March. And then coming on tv to tell how he had been shaking hands with everyone. With a girlfriend, a kid on the way and a country to run. And then he nearly died. What an idiot. An incompetent at the head of government. Even if you agree with his politics and like his comedy. He is a bumbling incompetent at any job that requires organisation and planning. Always has been.

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Very few countries around the planet decided on a policy of herd immunity. The UK did. It then had to do a volte face and instigate a shutdown. If we had went with the shutdown earlier rather than losing weeks of precious time many lives would have been saved.

If the government had stockpiled PPE, ventilators and tests rather than sitting on its hands we would not be in a position where NHS staff and careworkers are going without.

If the UK government had joined the collective effort organised by the EU to bulk buy the above mentioned items we would not be short of them now. But apparently the UK government lost the email from the EU asking them to join with the collective purchase. Now that is pure incompetence at best. More likely a decision was made not to join the EU collective effort to access PPE because of political choice. 

This will have costs lives.

Everyone could see what was happening in other countries. We were well warned.

Johnsons handling of this crisis has been pathetic. It was always going to be. You can't beat a virus with slogans on a bus. He is out of his depth. He has always been workshy and has the attention span of a goldfish.

Not the kind of person you want running a country during a crisis. 

"Collective effort organised by the EU" - tell Italy that! 

Boris the Clown really makes the UK look like a failed state. Before he took office, I had assumed that it would be impossible to outperform TM in that regard.

 

18 minutes ago, nauseus said:

"Collective effort organised by the EU" - tell Italy that! 

Since the collective effort refers to PPE, was there a shortage of PPE in Italy?

2 hours ago, Sujo said:

The masks are worn so doctors dont give the virus to the patient. Not the other way around. It helps stop you spreading it. It doesnt stop you getting it.

 

doctors also wear masks because the virus isnt the only thing that can spread. Masks do help with those other things.

 

also the masks they use are not the run of the mill useless masks most wear.

 

What is expected is the govt listen to experts in their field and make the decisions based on those facts. Not make political decisions or to shop around until they get the advice they want to hear.

In my opinion, one great benefit of wearing a mask is that it acts as a physical barrier between peoples hands and their face. That alone is reason enough for wearing one. In that respect it also stops you from 'getting it'.

16 hours ago, smedly said:

Ed Davey (a complete nob) and Keir Starmer (not much better)

 

not much more to say than that 

No need to say anymore!
This is exact.
Pathetic response from opposition leaders. Just out to cause trouble.

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Since the collective effort refers to PPE, was there a shortage of PPE in Italy?

Yes. 

Actually, the shortage of PPE is pretty much global. As far as I know, only a handful of countries had a built up PPE supply for the purpose of a pandemic.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/isabeltogoh/2020/03/31/heres-how-some-of-the-countries-worst-hit-by-coronavirus-are-dealing-with-shortages-of-protective-equipment-for-healthcare-workers/#cc956f62c13b

 

 

3 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Since the collective effort refers to PPE, was there a shortage of PPE in Italy?

No it doesn't. This collective effort only emerged after the EU was embarrassed by Italy's call for help earlier this month:

 

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/MEX_20_631

 

https://www.france24.com/en/20200403-european-commission-italy-ursula-van-der-leyen-apology-coronavirus-covid19-giuseppe-conte

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Very few countries around the planet decided on a policy of herd immunity. The UK did. It then had to do a volte face and instigate a shutdown. If we had went with the shutdown earlier rather than losing weeks of precious time many lives would have been saved.

If the government had stockpiled PPE, ventilators and tests rather than sitting on its hands we would not be in a position where NHS staff and careworkers are going without.

If the UK government had joined the collective effort organised by the EU to bulk buy the above mentioned items we would not be short of them now. But apparently the UK government lost the email from the EU asking them to join with the collective purchase. Now that is pure incompetence at best. More likely a decision was made not to join the EU collective effort to access PPE because of political choice. 

This will have costs lives.

Everyone could see what was happening in other countries. We were well warned.

Johnsons handling of this crisis has been pathetic. It was always going to be. You can't beat a virus with slogans on a bus. He is out of his depth. He has always been workshy and has the attention span of a goldfish.

Not the kind of person you want running a country during a crisis. 

Article in a paper yesterday suggested EU "Coillective" had so far delivered abso;utely nothing...........................