Why don't you all get your heads out of your bums and call them what they are:

Prostitutes.

The questiion is: Does a relationship have more chance of success with a prostitute on a non prostitute.

But considering that all of you are the kind of men who have to pay for it, it is not even a question.

Polly sounds like a female impersonator ... some gent masquerading as a woman

and a troll to boot

Why do you think, POLLY sounds like a female impersonator ?

It is not so easy to post as a woman, if you are a man.

As I had plenty of disputes with women, who were true hardliners, I should notice something - or feel it somehow, if such posting is a fake.

Unfortunately the administrator deleted some of her (?) postings.

This quoted statement does not contain anything, which might indicate, it was not written by a woman.

It sounds me more like written from a non-Asian non-American woman, not so young...50 or so... maybe British....like a school-teacher.....Protestant (?)by religion....somehow religious...

All these postings are anonymous.....such people are critical about the others, but are afraid to introduce themselves and to stay openly to their opinion.

Johann

Women who take money for sex are prostitutes. Give it a euphenism if it makes you feel better, but the fact remains!

Did I miss something?

Yes, this is a very female statement.

Newcomers usually feel sorry for the BG, look a little bit down, patronizingly.

Offer to help.

Later the feeling is changing and in the last stage it's prostitutes followed by envy or hate.

What starts each section?

No, I do not go intop details, just now. Everybody has er/his own experience.

Here a few search results I got for 'prostitute':

a person who performs a sexual act for a client involving the genitals of at least one of them

Definition: [n] a woman who engages in sexual intercourse for money

a person who has sex with someone for money

So, most bargirls are prostitutes, some girlfriends and wives also fall within these definitions.

So, back on topic:

When entering longterm relationships with bargirls, they will not be bargirls anymore, it then remains to be seen whether they will continue to be prostitutes or not, i.e. whether their main motivation in the relationship is to give you sex (and a lot of bs) in order to get your money.

One might argue that because bargirls are used to doing this in their working life, chances are against them dropping this approach in a relationship. Furthermore, many longterm prostites are psychologically damaged by their working conditions and don't make the best candidates for 'normal' partnerships.

(You can take the woman out of the bar, but not the bar out of the woman)

One could reply to this that bargirls are human beings and equally interested in and capable of forming long term relationships with other people, because of their life experience they have a more realistic attitude and therefore the relationship is more likely to last.

And then again, when a large difference in income enters the equation, many of the prostitute type women who do not work as such ostensibly, need to be considered. Let's face it, money, although maybe not a big issue in one's home country, does come into play in Thailand.

So one could conclude that bar girl or decent woman is not the important issue here, just one component of many that contribute to a relationship working out or not.

This is the long version of my first post here.

A couple of new posts appeared while typing the above.

"Newcomers usually feel sorry for the BG, look a little bit down, patronizingly.

Offer to help.

Later the feeling is changing and in the last stage it's prostitutes followed by envy or hate.

What starts each section?

No, I do not go intop details, just now. Everybody has er/his own experience."

Interesting thoughts, Axel. Worthy a new topic!

As I have said in other postings, I'm married to an ex BG for 12 happy years, I can't complain, she's perfect.

Are farangs who have long term relationships with Bar Girls (or similar) more likely to have unstable or failed relationships than those who have long-term relationships with other (non Bar Girl) Thai women?

the biggest threat to any kind is the Thai boyfriend who keeps turning up like a bad penny !

It seems many gals have a thai bloke lurking in the background who just will not go away , especially if he knows a farang is around and likely cash payouts are possible.

They come and go , wont take no for an answer and are a nuisance .

things can quickly go pearshaped if a persistant & beligerant thai exboyfriend wont go away and keeps lurking around .

Polly sounds like a female impersonator ... some gent masquerading as a woman

and a troll to boot

Why do you think, POLLY sounds like a female impersonator ?

It is not so easy to post as a woman, if you are a man.

As I had plenty of disputes with women, who were true

Because so called "Polly" is noticably absent from threads that attract other female posters on thaivisa , such as finding a boyfriend etc

threads where you would expect Polly to post she(he) is not there

Polly sounds like a woman to me. I think she is entitled to her opinion like everyone else, so long as it doesn’t get offensive.

Many Thai and farang women dislike (or even hate) bar girls. Thai women dislike them because they come from the lowest class of Thai society and it irritates them when they someone blatantly ignore the social norms of politeness and become rich in the process.

Many farang women dislike bar girls because, unlike in the west, men in Thailand are surrounded by attractive ladies who want to be their 'girlfriends'. This takes away much of the power women have over men in the west and leaves them feeling 2nd class.

Bar girls (or prostitutes) are real people with feelings. Many of them have to take care of young children and other family members and having little education or career prospects are doing the best they can. Treating all these people like black-hearted villains is a little unfair.

Polly sounds like a woman to me. I think she is entitled to her opinion like everyone else, so long as it doesn’t get offensive.

Many Thai and farang women dislike (or even hate) bar girls. Thai women dislike them because they come from the lowest class of Thai society and it irritates them when they someone blatantly ignore the social norms of politeness and become rich in the process.

Many farang women dislike bar girls because, unlike in the west, men in Thailand are surrounded by attractive ladies who want to be their 'girlfriends'. This takes away much of the power women have over men in the west and leaves them feeling 2nd class.

Bar girls (or prostitutes) are real people with feelings. Many of them have to take care of young children and other family members and having little education or career prospects are doing the best they can. Treating all these people like black-hearted villains is a little unfair.

exactly, its a shame that some people overlook this fact.

Bar girls (or prostitutes) are real people with feelings. Many of them have to take care of young children and other family members and having little education or career prospects are doing the best they can. Treating all these people like black-hearted villains is a little unfair.

Very true comment, Ghengis.

The social pressure on girls is tremendous in the poor parts of Thailand (most of Thailand).

You just have to take care of everybody in your family not able (willing?) to do so.

Even if it means prostituting yourself,...

Yes Eric.....the ex-thai boyfriend.....or the ex-thai husband that mama and papa made her marry when she was 16 in the village....they keep hanging around...

can make it hard for her...

.... and much harder still for YOU!!!

.... and much harder still for YOU!!!

another stupid response , i have already stated that , you sure like wasting bandwidth

I'd say stay away from bar girls

But a marrying a bar girl is better than marrying a lady falang

maybe one problem is this accusatory labelling or permanent branding of someone by what they did for a (sometimes) short period of time...to refer to someone as a bar girl after she has stopped working in a bar and is living with someone is like sewing the historical scarlet letter on a woman's clothes...most of the women start working in bars out of utter financial desperation...this is not who they are but what they did...i've worked in dozens of jobs but i would not expect anyone to refer to me as a teacher, a scuba instructor or short order cook...we are all what we are not what we do to survive...how about a little compassion?

Morality is fine, provided you can afford it.

A friend of ours in the UK used to work as a bar girl in Hua Hin. She comes from a poor family in Issan. She got pregnant aged 15 and was left looking after the baby by herself. Aged 18 she went to work in a bar and left her baby with her mother. About a year later she met an english bloke, stopped being a bar girl and became a cashier at the same bar. She married the english man and after a year was in the UK on a Settlement Visa.

When I was last in Phuket I went every day for a traditional Thai massage with the wife. She spoke in Thai to the ladies who massaged us. Many had similar stories to the bar girl from Hua Hin. Most came from Issan. Many had failed marriages with children looked after by their mothers, and they were all just surviving financially.

When one of these poor ladies marries a farang their lives are transformed from subsistence to security. Many of these women have suffered at the hands of Thai men who are not faithful and don't take care of their responsibilities. Many of these women swear they will never marry a Thai man.

A farang man is often seen as someone who will take care of them and (unlike many Thai men) will be a good husband/father. In return these women are very happy to take good care of their farang husbands.

Interesting

Bar girl Falang

Works if..

You remain the same person you were in Thailand when you get back to your home country with her.

You made undertakings up front on what you send the family back home and stick to it

You treat her like the queen you treated her like when you were in thailand for the duration.

You explained to her carefuly your financial situation at home and didnt lie to her.

Remember they all think we falang are very rich ,because we spend so much money in thailand.

My lady has many girlfriends here in Sydney who are ex BGS or freelancers.

Some are still with their husbands

Those that arent together fall into

the alcoholic camp

the broke camp

both camps

These girls invariably end up staffing the many small thai parlours here.

Most are well into their thirties still marginally atttractive and deparate to find a new man before they are too old and ugly.

All this talk of bar girls or Non Bar Girls ......................

If you hang around in a Library, you will meet girls that like to go to libraries, if you go to Church and meet someone, you would have met someone that likes to go to Church, if you hang out in Bars in Thailand you will meet women in those bars, if you go to Bars in UK, you will meet women in those bars...............

What is all the fuss about, we are all human beings just doing the best we can, and as for Bargirls, i think in many cases they should be awarded medals for doing a service to Mankind, cos by the state of some of the 'Sexy men' that i have seen in Thailand it is plain to see that the men in question would never ever get any relationship at all in their own countries.

Please do not slate Bargirls. You would have noticed the lack of Thai Chinese girls in the bars, and the majority of the girls are from poor rural areas, it is easy for a westerner to look down on poorer people, its a human trait that all races have......but it does not stop westerners exploiting these people that they look down on.

If a rich girl has many lovers and parties a lot, she is a good time girl, a socialite even. If a poor girl does similar but needs money from people she is a prostitute and tainted. People are people, we all do what we can to get on with our lives.

If Mick jagger has yet another 21 year old model Girlfriend on his 60 year old arm, The lables are "Good old Mick, Lucky bastard" and " She is only after Mick Jagger to get the publicity to further her career, its a good move for her"................ If a 60 year old guy in Thailand has a 21 year old girl that is from a poor rural area, they are also labled, but in an entirely different way, this 60 year old man becomes, " An aging pervert that should be locked up" and she is labled " A devious little whore, that will end up taking all this guy has got". I am certain that the Thai girl would like to be in the situation where she could meet Mick Jagger at some social gathering, but she isn't in that situation.

After the second world war, Germany was in Ruins and Allied soldiers could exploit the fact that German women would do many things to get food for their families, and they did exploit that situation. It does not make all German women whores, it was just that they where in that situation at that time, and they did what they could do, with what they had to offer.

My Mother used to give me Sixpence not to tell my Dad that she had a Boyfriend in the house while he was at work, i guess that makes me a son of a bitch, but i still took the sixpence.

All this talk of bar girls or Non Bar Girls ......................

If you hang around in a Library, you will meet girls that like to go to libraries, if you go to Church and meet someone, you would have met someone that likes to go to Church, if you hang out in Bars in Thailand you will meet women in those bars, if you go to Bars in UK, you will meet women in those bars...............

i'm with you 100%...all this protracted discussion of the "virtues", "honesty" etc or lack therof of bar girls is just the pathetic rantings of farang men who need unfortunate women to ridicule so they can forget what social failures they were in their own country...most of them live here because they are social outcasts who cant get laid at home...

All this talk of bar girls or Non Bar Girls ......................

If you hang around in a Library, you will meet girls that like to go to libraries, if you go to Church and meet someone, you would have met someone that likes to go to Church, if you hang out in Bars in Thailand you will meet women in those bars, if you go to Bars in UK, you will meet women in those bars...............

i'm with you 100%...all this protracted discussion of the "virtues", "honesty" etc or lack therof of bar girls is just the pathetic rantings of farang men who need unfortunate women to ridicule so they can forget what social failures they were in their own country...most of them live here because they are social outcasts who cant get laid at home...

You rest your case.

All this talk of bar girls or Non Bar Girls ......................

If you hang around in a Library, you will meet girls that like to go to libraries, if you go to Church and meet someone, you would have met someone that likes to go to Church, if you hang out in Bars in Thailand you will meet women in those bars, if you go to Bars in UK, you will meet women in those bars...............

i'm with you 100%...all this protracted discussion of the "virtues", "honesty" etc or lack therof of bar girls is just the pathetic rantings of farang men who need unfortunate women to ridicule so they can forget what social failures they were in their own country...most of them live here because they are social outcasts who cant get laid at home...

Which country do you live in, Elliot? No need to wack us Thai residents!

I suggest that there is so much talk about bargirls, because as a newcomer Who doesn't know much about Thailand and cannot speak the language, they are the easiest to mix with, and I dare say it is common for farangs to pick their first Thai gf from that scene.

I am talking from experience, but had I known then what I do now, I would have looked somewhere else, simply because I now speak some Thai and have Thaifriends to mix with socially.

All this talk of bar girls or Non Bar Girls ......................

If you hang around in a Library, you will meet girls that like to go to libraries, if you go to Church and meet someone, you would have met someone that likes to go to Church, if you hang out in Bars in Thailand you will meet women in those bars, if you go to Bars in UK, you will meet women in those bars...............

i'm with you 100%...all this protracted discussion of the "virtues", "honesty" etc or lack therof of bar girls is just the pathetic rantings of farang men who need unfortunate women to ridicule so they can forget what social failures they were in their own country...most of them live here because they are social outcasts who cant get laid at home...

not another one

I am talking from experience, but had I known then what I do now........................

It is too late....never mind, take it easy...

This was not in 1970, Johann, I am talking about more recent experiences.

This was not in 1970, Johann, I am talking about more recent experiences.

I know, you are still collecting experiences....I have them already.....

Life does continue, things change, some for the better, some for the worse. Am I talking news to you now?

This was not in 1970, Johann, I am talking about more recent experiences.

I know, you are still collecting experiences....I have them already.....

Experience is like a light hooked on your back, only lighting up the way you went through,...

Experience is like a light hooked on your back, only lighting up the way you went through,...

And an expert is someone who has made every concievable mistake in his profession.

"And an expert is someone who has made every concievable mistake in his profession."

So Yohan really is an expert on judging farang women after all...!!

"And an expert is someone who has made every concievable mistake in his profession."

So Yohan really is an expert on judging farang women after all...!!

I think so, Lady Stroll.