How much money is required for 30 years retirement?

[Tagged]

Been very quiet about bit coins these days!

[Trujillo]

"30 years total = 13.6MB"

 

Double that at least for minimum lifestyle. 

More if you plan on ever getting sick or want to take holidays. 

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Am I only allowed one end of the world as I know it?

My first world ended when my Brit wife divorced me, suddenly my life was no longer walking the dog on the beach in the rain, and drinking wine in front of a log fire.

 

Now my second world (or should that be 3rd world) of hiking in the steamy jungle, and entertaining gogo girls in themed short time hotels is looking a bit wobbly, but lucky for me I'm old and probably don't have enough time left for it to be that much of a loss.

 

I've got to say I enjoyed both of my worlds (although the change from one to the other was traumatic), I regret very little of my wife life, it's been a blast, and I've needed a lot less money than most of the spendthrifts on this thread have suggested.

Life is but a journey, I was raised in a poor family as was my Thai wife, I worked my butt off all of my life till 55, one divorce later with a 50/50 split, survived a heart attack in 2008, and have kept swimming since, even after retiring 5 years ago, I still look at ways of making a coin, not because I am greedy, but because I want my money to work for me, as it took me a long time to earn it, and I remember those hard years of work and the stress. The kids will get a good start in life, and I know they won't p-i-s-s it up the wall, because my finance minister who it is willed to, has shown me through her actions over the last 13.5 years that she is more than capable of staying as humble as the village girl that she is. 

[ChaiyaTH]

It is hard to tell as there are many factors that come along with it. You might have a certain amount guaranteed from age X trough social welfare pension or general pension. The latter could cause trouble during a crisis and affect you total wealth. That same could be the case if your home currency plummeted like what happened to many existing reirees and specially Brits and Australians. Lucky that seems to change now or soon.

 

Then if it comes to cash amounts, you have to consider the capital amount and returns on it. That depends on you mostly but can be a lot with a few hundred K.

Last but not least lifestyle and home choices. If you have the 800K visa costs are virtually zero and a owned condo in the right location could also save tons of money.

 

If your visa is nothing, you got no rent and even cook home sometimes life is doable with much less money and that changes your short and mid term interests on big capital again. I always use the free available Excel sheets and via Google there is a 'Compound interest calculator', you can easily see what money does over X years and X%.

 

I mean, if you did near 5% annually, which at least has been doable for the past decades, certainly if you are a bit pro active, 10M baht gets you a long way already. They always say its not how much you earn but how much you keep. For this it is not how much you have but how much you yield and spend.

My wife makes at least 15k a month, even during Covid, with less than 35k capital. Just saying, small money can go a long way too.

Edited July 26, 2020 by ChaiyaTH

[Rimmer]

Multiple off topic posts removed also some flames

[NightSky]

On 7/24/2020 at 9:35 AM, BritManToo said:

You've not noticed the western governments saying people don't have to pay their rent, and you can't evict them then?

Of course there is risk with anything.

 

although all my own tenants have paid on time without a problem. 

 

I’m open to better suggestions of reliable income?

 

pension fund? - by the time I get to retire there will be no state pension fund and private pensions are simply poorly managed funds.

 

im open to other suggestions

[BritManToo]

9 hours ago, Trujillo said:

"30 years total = 13.6MB"

Double that at least for minimum lifestyle. 

More if you plan on ever getting sick or want to take holidays. 

I've managed 4 holidays a year on under 50k/month.

And I've been seriously ill twice, and smashed my face in on the road once.

[marvin1950]

I don't want to live in a no air conditioned room and  eating sticky rice with moo on a stick for 50 baht .

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, checkered flag said:

I commend you for living a happy life so cheaply. I personally need more and don't want to have to watch the prices of everything.  

Sorry you had to go home, but don't know how you could make it in the UK for the same.

I don't live in the UK, but I could have a better life there than here- social housing in the UK, not enough for the demand here; free Drs and prescriptions, have to pay large here to see a Dr; free public transport ( over 60 ), no free transport here and hardly any buses anyway; don't need a car, have to have a car here.

Perhaps I should have gone there instead, but my family here.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, NightSky said:

Of course there is risk with anything.

 

although all my own tenants have paid on time without a problem. 

 

I’m open to better suggestions of reliable income?

 

pension fund? - by the time I get to retire there will be no state pension fund and private pensions are simply poorly managed funds.

 

im open to other suggestions

You'd better pray there isn't 80's style inflation.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 minutes ago, marvin1950 said:

I don't want to live in a no air conditioned room and  eating sticky rice with moo on a stick for 50 baht .

Who are you talking to?

I lived in a marvellous hotel with AC, fan, hot water shower, cable tv, weekly clean and linen change all for 15,000 a month, and food needn't cost more than 5,000 a month to eat well.

 

If anyone can't afford 20,000 a month to live on they probably can't afford to live in LOS.

[Tagged]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't live in the UK, but I could have a better life there than here- social housing in the UK, not enough for the demand here; free Drs and prescriptions, have to pay large here to see a Dr; free public transport ( over 60 ), no free transport here and hardly any buses anyway; don't need a car, have to have a car here.

Perhaps I should have gone there instead, but my family here.

I really do not see myself here in Thailand after 70, however depends on health, but so far I have said 65 ready to relocate from Thailand, if not before of other reasons. It might be I stay here to I die, but as someone said, my passport I hold is not Thai, se we should always be ready to leave the country at any time. 

[checkered flag]

11 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't live in the UK, but I could have a better life there than here- social housing in the UK, not enough for the demand here; free Drs and prescriptions, have to pay large here to see a Dr; free public transport ( over 60 ), no free transport here and hardly any buses anyway; don't need a car, have to have a car here.

Perhaps I should have gone there instead, but my family here.

Good go back to the UK where everything is free and bring your family with you. That is unless there is an income requirement for there visa. 

Drs here are very good and not expensive. The best part is that you don't wait long for service.

[thaibeachlovers]

19 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Life is but a journey, I was raised in a poor family as was my Thai wife, I worked my butt off all of my life till 55, one divorce later with a 50/50 split, survived a heart attack in 2008, and have kept swimming since, even after retiring 5 years ago, I still look at ways of making a coin, not because I am greedy, but because I want my money to work for me, as it took me a long time to earn it, and I remember those hard years of work and the stress. The kids will get a good start in life, and I know they won't p-i-s-s it up the wall, because my finance minister who it is willed to, has shown me through her actions over the last 13.5 years that she is more than capable of staying as humble as the village girl that she is. 

I also worked my butt off since age 17, and retired at 60 because I didn't want to work till I dropped. I chose to go without some of the luxuries of life so I could afford to do so if I was careful, and didn't spend like I was still working. Apart from making the expensive mistake of getting married I've enjoyed my life far more than if I were still subject to the tyranny of working for someone else. If I can't afford it I don't buy it.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, checkered flag said:

Good go back to the UK where everything is free and bring your family with you. That is unless there is an income requirement for there visa. 

Drs here are very good and not expensive. The best part is that you don't wait long for service.

My "family" refers to my sibling, and I'm sure she doesn't want to move. I stopped having a Thai family the moment I signed my escape document ( divorce papers ).

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I also worked my butt off since age 17, and retired at 60 because I didn't want to work till I dropped. I chose to go without some of the luxuries of life so I could afford to do so if I was careful, and didn't spend like I was still working.

Part of the slave process, you wised up earlier than most, e.g. life over money and so called luxuries which you cannot take with you, so keep enjoying the stressless environs of your non slave working environment ????

 

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Apart from making the expensive mistake of getting married I've enjoyed my life far more than if I were still subject to the tyranny of working for someone else.

Look it at it another way, if you didn't go through this process, you most likely wouldn't be here today ?

 

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

If I can't afford it I don't buy it.

Again, wise, unfortunately most want everything today, because they deserve it, even if they didn't work and save for it, they deserve it and borrow or put it on credit, depending on the purchase. I'm very much like you, I only buy things that I feel are a necessity, albeit I can afford to buy a lot of things, but would prefer to take the kids on family trips as I enjoy watching them enjoy the treat, and I hope they will have fonder memories than I did when growing up ?

[checkered flag]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

My "family" refers to my sibling, and I'm sure she doesn't want to move. I stopped having a Thai family the moment I signed my escape document ( divorce papers ).

Sorry about your failed marriage. It might explain you bitterness. Some Thais do not want to go overseas, because they hear many stories.My father in law made me promise she could return if not happy before he gave permission for our marriage. That was 45 years ago. In fact she had said she wouldn't go until my friend who was a Thai Airline pilot shamed her into it. He told her she was a college graduate and was afraid of flying. She quickly said she would go. She's now a dual citizen.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, 4MyEgo said:

Part of the slave process, you wised up earlier than most, e.g. life over money and so called luxuries which you cannot take with you, so keep enjoying the stressless environs of your non slave working environment ????

 

Look it at it another way, if you didn't go through this process, you most likely wouldn't be here today ?

 

Again, wise, unfortunately most want everything today, because they deserve it, even if they didn't work and save for it, they deserve it and borrow or put it on credit, depending on the purchase. I'm very much like you, I only buy things that I feel are a necessity, albeit I can afford to buy a lot of things, but would prefer to take the kids on family trips as I enjoy watching them enjoy the treat, and I hope they will have fonder memories than I did when growing up ?

Since I retired I'm a lot less angry than I used to be. Impossible to live completely without stress though. I got very stressed every time I went near Thai immigration.

 

Something to be said about that. Unfortunately I thought Thai women were different. Stupid fool that I was!

 

I cut my credit card up over 30 years ago, and never been in debt since. When I came back after leaving LOS I had to buy a car- paid cash. My rent is paid automatically from my pension. If I can't live on the rest I'm an idiot. If I had to eat dog food to avoid going into debt I would.

 

 

[4MyEgo]

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Since I retired I'm a lot less angry than I used to be. Impossible to live completely without stress though. I got very stressed every time I went near Thai immigration.

Agree, and yes none of us can go completely without stress, albeit it not working reduces it considerably. Immigration is a process, and now that no TM30 is no longer required for going out of our province, its a plus for us, e.g. 5 times last year including a re-entry permit. The 90 day online reporting which I have recently done after avoiding it for almost 5 years also reduces my stress level as it just didn't work when I would try before, now it does, so only have to see immigration once a year, so where there have been negatives that stress us, there are now positives, so we have to look at the balance of it all currently and forget about the past negatives, i.e. out the window they go as we try to move forward with clearer more positive thoughts, i.e. until some dipstick cuts in front of me ????

 

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Something to be said about that. Unfortunately I thought Thai women were different. Stupid fool that I was!

I wouldn't paint all Thai women with the same brush, as you know there are good and there are bad in ALL woman, and men to be fair, human nature, hopefully you find a good one as you sift through the shear volume on offer, being alone has it's advantages and its disadvantages, just depends on how you want to be, with one or without a partner or have one occasionally, that said, I have been pretty lucky with women, that success I put down to only investing as much as I am prepared to lose, and keeping love and finances separate.

 

I have read a lot on various forums of men losing it all because they put all their chips in, for me, the wife would get to keep the house and the car, while I retain the remaining 90% until I part to the so called afterlife, that investment for her works out to be around 20,000 baht per month tax free for the 13.5 years she has been with me, she has also eats well, has gone on scores of holidays, is clothed, has managed to buy land parcels, and gold and also help out her family and has never worked in that time, sounds like a pretty good deal to me, that said, some would say that's not fair, and my reply would be, well if she worked could she achieve all of what she has in that time, and my reply would be no, is she content, hell yeh, and she knows the big pay day is probably a decade away, add to that a nice insurance policy when I depart which has her as the beneficiary makes it just that sweeter. I also have a prenuptial agreement back in the old country where my investments are, so as I said, love is one thing, finances are another, so why risk putting finances into a relationship when you have nothing to fall back on and expose yourself to sharing your wealth, because the law has structured it that way. 

       

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I cut my credit card up over 30 years ago, and never been in debt since. When I came back after leaving LOS I had to buy a car- paid cash. My rent is paid automatically from my pension. If I can't live on the rest I'm an idiot. If I had to eat dog food to avoid going into debt I would.

Yes credit cards are a trap, many will argue, and that's fine, frequent flyer points or this and that, the problem is, not everyone has the discipline to use a credit card and pay back the amount borrowed at the end of the time frame, and I too don't have one which most people find strange, suffice to say, the debit card works fine for me, like you say, if you haven't the cash to pay for it, you don't buy it, simple really. Debt is a good thing if your working and building up your investments over time, e.g. property, shares, but when retired, you want to be able to cash in and or allow those investments to work for you depending on the tax implications of your homeland, shares suit me as there is no tax payable, and yes there is a risk, however if they drop, they also come back, whereas in a failed marriage, they don't, so you have a better chance of investing in shares I say, less risk ????

 

[J Town]

4 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Yes credit cards are a trap, many will argue, and that's fine, frequent flyer points or this and that, the problem is, not everyone has the discipline to use a credit card and pay back the amount borrowed at the end of the time frame.

The original concept of credit was to go to the local grocery store where you knew the store owner by name (he knew yours as well), buy on credit, and pay the balance at the end of each month. Then banks got involved and the whole thing went to hell.

[4MyEgo]

5 minutes ago, J Town said:

The original concept of credit was to go to the local grocery store where you knew the store owner by name (he knew yours as well), buy on credit, and pay the balance at the end of each month. Then banks got involved and the whole thing went to hell.

Yes, I remember those days very well as a kid, mum used to send me to the Italian local store owner on the corner about 100 metres up the hill from our place, hello Sinoria, mum wants this and that and she would put it in the book and mum would pay her at the end of the month when she would get paid.

 

Mum stopped me buying there when she found out that her cigarette packet intake increased twofold for the month, and boy did I get a wollopping ????

 

[thaibeachlovers]

21 minutes ago, J Town said:

The original concept of credit was to go to the local grocery store where you knew the store owner by name (he knew yours as well), buy on credit, and pay the balance at the end of each month. Then banks got involved and the whole thing went to hell.

Don't know if they still do it, but when I stayed at Mai Pen Rai on Than Sadet in the early years of the century when we ate at the restaurant or wanted something from the resort shop we wrote it in the book and paid it off when we left. Didn't even have anyone in the shop.

Never found such trust since. Good to know that it did exist once though.

Those were happy days then.

[thaibeachlovers]

35 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

I wouldn't paint all Thai women with the same brush, as you know there are good and there are bad in ALL woman, and men to be fair, human nature, hopefully you find a good one as you sift through the shear volume on offer,

I don't. I just never met a woman that it worked out for longer than 5 years with, so stopped looking after my divorce. I'm sure my soul mate is out there, but I didn't meet her yet.

 

I don't see "shear" (sic) volume in my life. Once deducted single women with children there are not many left.

[checkered flag]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't. I just never met a woman that it worked out for longer than 5 years with, so stopped looking after my divorce. I'm sure my soul mate is out there, but I didn't meet her yet.

 

I don't see "shear" (sic) volume in my life. Once deducted single women with children there are not many left.

With his negative attitude and resources he's in deep trouble. Maybe someone in the council flats would be better.

[Tagged]

Gold reaches new heights today.

 

29 200,- 

 

No time to sell yet, and if the plan is to keep it another 15 years, no need to sell!

[checkered flag]

8 minutes ago, Tagged said:

Gold reaches new heights today.

 

29 200,- 

 

No time to sell yet, and if the plan is to keep it another 15 years, no need to sell!

Sounds like my wife. This will be a good investment so we should buy now, but never wanted to sell even with a better price. Need to set the term and sell even if the price is down. We bought several houses in the US. Each bigger and better and a great investment, but with bigger payments. The payments on the last house were US $3000/mo.  Finally we pulled the plug and moved to Thailand. We now have a nice home and car. They're paid for. 

[bodga]

On 7/26/2020 at 6:35 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

Never heard Thais living on 9,000 baht a month complaining about their life.

You need  bigger  ears then????

[Tagged]

7 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

Sounds like my wife. This will be a good investment so we should buy now, but never wanted to sell even with a better price. 

I have gold all the way back from 2001 and today, latest bought in february. Not going to sell and not going to buy now for sure. Maybe after all this corona tone away, Prices goes down I will buy a bit more. Never buy large quantum, little bit by little bit. And not even a pention fond either, since Im saving a bit in stocks as well. What gold went up, the pention fond stocks went down ????

 

But it is healing and both goes up now, and the stocks only down 7 % compare to when the fall started 22% down.

 

And I made some back on buy and selling stocks, so the loss is almost brake even now.

[micmichd]

1 hour ago, J Town said:

The original concept of credit was to go to the local grocery store where you knew the store owner by name (he knew yours as well), buy on credit, and pay the balance at the end of each month. Then banks got involved and the whole thing went to hell.

Correct. I do that in Thailand sometimes with the locals, and it always worked out fine so far. 

[ballpoint]

This thread once again shows the folly of asking a wide range of people a question on spending money.  Everyone has the same needs, but we all have different wants.  Before the two way pissing contest - some bragging how much they spend a month, some bragging how little they spend, continues, here's my thoughts.  (I won't say advice, because, like I said, everyone is different.  What I want will not be what others do, but this works for me).  Getting by with just enough money to pay for food and shelter is not living, it is existing.  In fact, it's not even that if an unexpected medical event comes up. 

 

You should look at why you are retiring - because of age, for family, out of laziness (nothing wrong with that), to engage in a hobby full time, to travel, ... whatever.  Then look at how you would be happy doing whatever you want to be doing, and what that would cost you now.  Also look at what makes you happy now, and how much that currently costs you.  (I know someone will come on and argue that there are many things that can make you happy without spending money, but I'm talking about the ones that do).  Then factor in food and shelter and an emergency stash.  That gives a minimum amount that you need to have.  Personally, if I had have had to give up any of the things I enjoyed, or looked forward to doing, when I retired, then I would be as miserable as many of the other posters on here.  Which I think explains a lot.