A-frame cabin style building suitable for hot climate

[joseph88]

hey everyone,

 

i'm getting ready to build a cabin/bungalow out in mae taeng.

 

i've got a couple of ideas but the one that i'm really keen on is a A-Frame style cabin with a loft. it looks awesome, allows for room on the ground level and sleeping space up in the loft above, and its pretty cheap to build. example pic below 

 

only concern i have is that because there is no roof space in these A-Frames the heat from the roof will make things inside pretty damn hot.

 

i want to try and avoid using air conditioning

 

roof will be 6 meter high and to reduce the heat i am thinking

 - use blue scope metal roof with attached insulation. (photo below)

- allow 2 upstairs windows on both sides of the loft area to allow lots of air flow

- an exhaust fan in the roof itself.

 

keep in mind the upstairs loft will only be used at night for sleeping. not during the day. so just needs to be able to cool down a bit in the evening

 

anyone got any advice for me with this? is there a better material i could use for the roof to help reduce heat beside tiles? or anything else that worth thinking about?

 

or should i just throw in the towel with this A-frame idea because its not suitable to the climate here? 

 

thanks guys

 

 

 

 

[sometimewoodworker]

That design is perfect for areas that get heavy snow fall.

[Kwasaki]

1 hour ago, joseph88 said:

roof will be 6 meter high and to reduce the heat i am thinking

 - use blue scope metal roof with attached insulation. (photo below)

- allow 2 upstairs windows on both sides of the loft area to allow lots of air flow

- an exhaust fan in the roof itself.

Will still be hot in Thailand without air-con.

If you can cope with fans alone at night goodluck with that.

[joseph88]

1 minute ago, Kwasaki said:

Will still be hot in Thailand without air-con.

If you can cope with fans alone at night goodluck with that.

of course it will still be hot, that's a given.

what i'm trying to avoid is it being an oven!

[scoupeo]

I think if builders usually do not make this shape bungalow, there might be good reasons...

[CGW]

2 hours ago, joseph88 said:

i want to try and avoid using air conditioning

Throw in the towel, your trying to reinvent the wheel or your intent on designing a new style of sauna, it simply is not possible to stay cool in Thailand without AC during the hot season, if you enjoy perspiring and living in a hot, unhealthy & humid environment - go for it! 

[sometimewoodworker]

7 hours ago, joseph88 said:

of course it will still be hot, that's a given.

what i'm trying to avoid is it being an oven!

There is a really good reason why roofing shapes are used in different areas, in a tropical country you need to reduce heat gain, allow for good airflow from all directions, allow for good rain shedding from all directions, providing outdoor sun protection. This is not using AC.

 

Your design fails on most of these points. If you use excellent materials and good AC it can work for indoor living. As a passive reasonably priced design for the tropics it fails on almost every requirement. 

[Laza 45]

...nice oven.... 

[joseph88]

1 hour ago, Laza 45 said:

...nice oven.... 

lol

[ChipButty]

Last time I looked, Hot air rises

[Crossy]

Take a look at how the locals used to build their homes, there's a nice collection at Bang Sai Arts and Crafts Centre. If you don't like the Thai style look at old homes in Malaysia or Singapore.

 

These designs developed over millenia of people living in the local climate. Adapt to modern materials and you end up with a place that is habitable with minimal aircon.

 

[joseph88]

8 hours ago, scoupeo said:

I think if builders usually do not make this shape bungalow, there might be good reasons...

i've seen a few of them scattered around Thailand. they do exist here. ill send some photos over when i get time later

[GreasyFingers]

10 hours ago, joseph88 said:

use blue scope metal roof with attached insulation. (photo below)

That stuff works reasonably well. We have just used it on a low sloping roof for an extension. Admittedly we are in a cooler region but the heat from the roof is minimal.

Your main problem will be the orientation of the roofs away from the sun.

[joseph88]

2 minutes ago, Crossy said:

Take a look at how the locals used to build their homes, there's a nice collection at Bang Sai Arts and Crafts Centre. If you don't like the Thai style look at old homes in Malaysia or Singapore.

 

These designs developed over millenia of people living in the local climate. Adapt to modern materials and you end up with a place that is habitable with minimal aircon.

 

thanks crossy. i will check it out.

[ChipButty]

Loads of different designs I was looking at one company here in Thailand doing pre fab units I'll see if I can find it again later

[Crossy]

Does the land you want to build on have lots of shade trees (or space for them). Trees grow fast here so it wouldn't take too long to get a good shade cover going.

 

If you can reduce the heat gain from the sun your design could still work. 

[sometimewoodworker]

21 minutes ago, joseph88 said:

8 hours ago, scoupeo said:

I think if builders usually do not make this shape bungalow, there might be good reasons...

i've seen a few of them scattered around Thailand. they do exist here. ill send some photos over when i get time later

Sure you will find examples of almost any style.

Does that prove that they are good designs? No

 

Does that prove that they are good designs for the tropics? Absolutely no.

 

It’s your money, your choice, but don’t ask questions if you don’t want the sensible answers.

[Peterw42]

OP, if you look at traditional Thai buildings, they often incorporate a high A frame roof "on top" of the structure. Its acts as insulation and ventilation to keep the structure below cool, a large space for hot air to rise into and be extracted via flow through gable ventilation, midday heat falls on the roof at an angle and is reflected away, copes with heavy rain etc.  

All the reasons they put an A frame structure on top of a structure, are the reasons you dont live in an A frame.

Edited August 20, 2020 by Peterw42

[joseph88]

38 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

OP, if you look at traditional Thai buildings, they often incorporate a high A frame roof "on top" of the structure. Its acts as insulation and ventilation to keep the structure below cool, a large space for hot air to rise into and be extracted via flow through gable ventilation, midday heat falls on the roof at an angle and is reflected away, copes with heavy rain etc.  

All the reasons they put an A frame structure on top of a structure, are the reasons you dont live in an A frame.

thanks peter. good info. makes alot of sense. 

Edited August 20, 2020 by joseph88

[joseph88]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

Does the land you want to build on have lots of shade trees (or space for them). Trees grow fast here so it wouldn't take too long to get a good shade cover going.

 

If you can reduce the heat gain from the sun your design could still work. 

yes i have some large teak trees that could provide a good amount of shade

[joseph88]

1 hour ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Sure you will find examples of almost any style.

Does that prove that they are good designs? No

 

Does that prove that they are good designs for the tropics? Absolutely no.

 

It’s your money, your choice, but don’t ask questions if you don’t want the sensible answers.

no, but perhaps it shows that some people have found a way for it to work.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

3 hours ago, joseph88 said:

no, but perhaps it shows that some people have found a way for it to work.

 

The only one I know of that was remotely similar found that the rooms adjacent to the roof were unbearably hot. Looked pretty, was a disaster to live in even with AC permanently on.

 

So there’s no guarantee that they work.

[joseph88]

thanks for all the input guys, much appreciated.

 

here are a few of these designs i've seen around Thailand.

 

one thing i've noticed is that they all seem to be located in cooler areas of the country, perhaps that's why they work out ok

 

also what what do you guys think if i simply used the same design but made it single story and created a separate ventilated roof space? 

 

anyways posting them here for anyone who wants to take a look.

[canopy]

20 hours ago, joseph88 said:

i have some large teak trees that could provide a good amount of shade

Teak trees are deciduous. This fact will surely be noticed in the part of the year with no shade.

 

[joseph88]

1 hour ago, canopy said:

Teak trees are deciduous. This fact will surely be noticed in the part of the year with no shade.

 

yes good point. i have other trees also. and i hope to plant some more next month in areas where will grow to create shade

Edited August 21, 2020 by joseph88

[lopburi3]

On 8/19/2020 at 10:11 PM, sometimewoodworker said:

That design is perfect for areas that get heavy snow fall.

Very true - might also half work in desert where it gets cold at night (as dome homes work - making the upper air cool and drooping to lower area during the night).  Here temperature is high 24 hours a day so almost no night cooling.  There is a reason this is/was the normal Thai home.  Cool, open, view, flood free.

[NorthernRyland]

You have this backwards. You need a design which allows for a well insulated area during the day so you can keep the direct sun off of you and a well ventilated area which you can open up at night. I would prefer a concrete first floor for the day and a wooden upper floor for sleeping at night. If your property has any slopes I would look into how you could build into the side of the hill (and avoid water issues).

 

The A-frame is going to be a nightmare at night because of airflow and unless you really pad out the roof with insulation it is going to be an oven during the day.

[trucking]

Another thing wrong with the house in the OP is too much glass on the upper storey. That is a no no if you want it cool inside. Keep windows to a minimum and make sure the walls are insulated. 

 

Since heat rises it will get hot upstairs. To offset this you could have a couple of extractor fans at the apex either end to suck out the hot air.

 

As someone else mentioned, if you can have fast growing shade trees around the house to keep it in shadow it would help a lot.

[soi3eddie]

I have a similar idea potentially for the future however the design would not be a perfect "A" frame. Friends of mine (Thai/Brit) built a "cabin" in their coconut farm in Nakhon Si Thammarat. It's built out of concrete and raised a metre or so off the ground to avoid flooding and allow airflow underneath - this also stops some insect or termite damage and makes it easier to eradicate bugs. The walls go straight up to about 3 metres with a suspended ceiling and the "A" roof above that. Their provincial builder thought it wasteful and crazy to use cavity walls (double bricks with space between). They insulated it completely and installed double glazed windows. With the overhang of the roof and nearby trees it keeps the walls quite shaded. The result is that it remains very cool and they didn't need to install air conditioning.

 

 

Edited August 21, 2020 by soi3eddie

[NorthernRyland]

28 minutes ago, soi3eddie said:

Their provincial builder thought it wasteful and crazy to use cavity walls

As a general rule of thumb never listen to Thai builders. They simply have no perspective on what a good house is. Not to mention they'll happily live in squalor for the rest of their lives than spend a few thousand baht in investment on comfort.