Trump visits Kenosha, not to urge racial healing but to back police

[Mama Noodle]

15 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Definitely, says poster. Like a couple of shots wouldn't have sufficed at this range. Should have thought a few armed policeman could settle this with a couple of shots and punch, but hey, if you say Definitely, then it must be so. One thing for sure, truth it ain't, uncomfortable or otherwise.

Going by your post here, it seems you agree it was a justified shot, and that it wasn’t because “racism” but that he was shot “too many times” 

 

You have the right to that opinion, but I’m not gonna hold it against the cops. 

[Pattaya Spotter]

13 hours ago, stevenl said:

You think there is any chance Trump's statement after a visit to Blake would have been true? In Blake's position, I would have wanted a lawyer present.

Why...to swear in the president so their meeting can be held under oath? I'll tell you why they were advised to have a lawyer present...so Blake and his family members wouldn't accidentally say anything that would undercut their future civil case against Kenosha police. There's lots of money to be made here (it's like winning the lottery) and they don't want to blow-it.

[polpott]

10 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Floyd was the main ingredient. But BLM and ANTIFA were the cooks.

Even though the FBI investigated and found no evidence of Antifa involvement. Also BLM is now a global movement with people of all colours, creeds and walks of life involved. Not a Marxist movement. Are you saying that Louis Hamilton and the English footballer Marcus Rashford are Marxists? Its about people of colour from all over the world being unwilling to tolerate the racism that they continue to face every day of their lives.

Enough of your conspiracy nonsense fuelled by Qanon and its paedophile leader currently hiding in the Philippines.

Edited September 2, 2020 by polpott

[RoadWarrior371]

27 minutes ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

Why...to swear in the president so their meeting can be held under oath? I'll tell you why they were advised to have a lawyer present...so Blake and his family members wouldn't accidentally say anything that would undercut their future civil case against Kenosha police. There's lots of money to be made here (it's like winning the lottery) and they don't want to blow-it.

I would not attend a 'consolation visit' with a lawyer either.  I think some of the liberal advocates on this topic may not have much real experience in the professional world.

[Logosone]

1 hour ago, polpott said:

Also BLM is now a global movement with people of all colours, creeds and walks of life involved. Not a Marxist movement.

BLM happily self-identifies as a neo-Marxist movement with various far left objectives, including defunding the police (an evolution of the Panther position of public open-carry to control the police), to dismantling capitalism and the patriarchal system, disrupting the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure, seeking reparations from slavery to redistribute wealth and via various offshoot appeals, to raise money to bail black prisoners awaiting trial. The notion of seizing control of the apportionment of capital, dismantling the frameworks of society and neutralising and undermining law enforcement are not just Marxist, but anarchic.

 

An FBI report released in 2017 found that attacks on police in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and Dallas, Texas were influenced by the Black Lives Matter movement, with 28 pe rcent of those who used deadly force against police officers motivated by a hatred of police. An unclassified FBI study following the Dallas cop-killing spree of 2016 that left 5 officers shot dead reported departments and individual officers increasingly taking the decision to stop proactive policing amid concerns that anti-police defiance fueled in part by movements like Black Lives Matter had become the “new norm.”

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/06/12/make-no-mistake-blm-radical-neo-marxist-political-movement/

 

[CorpusChristie]

1 hour ago, polpott said:

Are you saying that Louis Hamilton and the English footballer Marcus Rashford are Marxists? Its about people of colour from all over the world being unwilling to tolerate the racism that they continue to face every day of their lives.

What racism have those two faced ?

[polpott]

6 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

What racism have those two faced ?

Both are regularly subjected to vile abuse on social media. Rashford regularly receives racial abuse on the field. The "Kick Racism out of Football" campaign has been running for several years in Europe now.

[Logosone]

2 minutes ago, polpott said:

Both are regularly subjected to vile abuse on social media. Rashford regularly receives racial abuse on the field. The "Kick Racism out of Football" campaign has been running for several years in Europe now.

Also Lewis Hamilton is only paid 40 million Pounds by Mercedes. 

 

Schuhmacher was paid 60 million by Ferrari. 

 

Terrible discrimination.

 

 

[Morch]

1 hour ago, Mama Noodle said:

Going by your post here, it seems you agree it was a justified shot, and that it wasn’t because “racism” but that he was shot “too many times” 

 

You have the right to that opinion, but I’m not gonna hold it against the cops. 

 

No. That would be you trying to co-opt my words and bend them to your agenda. I have no idea if the a shot was merited or justified, that's for investigations and courts to determine. Same goes for whether racism played a part in the decision making process.

 

I do think, that it a group (2-3 of them, wasn't it?) or even one policeman ought to have been able to stop a suspect with much less force (7 shots, in this case). At the range we're talking about, that many shots were excessive, and to me, indicate lack of professionalism and training, at the very least. That's also why I'm not a fan of the "de-fund the police" tag line. Give them more money, for better training.

[RoadWarrior371]

16 minutes ago, polpott said:

Both are regularly subjected to vile abuse on social media.

Well, that is hard to dispute evidence.  Social media is a safe, lovely space, for all races.  LMAO ????

[Logosone]

13 minutes ago, RoadWarrior371 said:

Well, that is hard to dispute evidence.  Social media is a safe, lovely space, for all races.  LMAO ????

Someone said mean things about Lewis Hamilton.

 

Let's burn down London.

[CorpusChristie]

28 minutes ago, polpott said:

Both are regularly subjected to vile abuse on social media. Rashford regularly receives racial abuse on the field. The "Kick Racism out of Football" campaign has been running for several years in Europe now.

Complete rubbish , Rashford does NOT regularly receive racial abuse on the field , any racial abuse would be investigated by the law and the authorities 

[Nout]

2 hours ago, polpott said:

Even though the FBI investigated and found no evidence of Antifa involvement. Also BLM is now a global movement with people of all colours, creeds and walks of life involved. Not a Marxist movement. Are you saying that Louis Hamilton and the English footballer Marcus Rashford are Marxists? Its about people of colour from all over the world being unwilling to tolerate the racism that they continue to face every day of their lives.

Enough of your conspiracy nonsense fuelled by Qanon and its paedophile leader currently hiding in the Philippines.

If anybody supports rioters and arsonists they have no moral compass. The peaceful demonstrators should go home until the situation is more settled. Right now they are playing into Trump's hands. 

[Morch]

18 minutes ago, Nout said:

If anybody supports rioters and arsonists they have no moral compass. The peaceful demonstrators should go home until the situation is more settled. Right now they are playing into Trump's hands. 

 

What support for rioters and arsonists are you on about? Peaceful protestors going home would also play to Trump's hands - on one level, he could claim that he pacified the situation, on another level, the momentum of the movement would be lost.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts removed.

 

[simple1]

7 hours ago, Logosone said:

<SNIP>

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/06/12/make-no-mistake-blm-radical-neo-marxist-political-movement/

 

Rather than relying on a biased news outlet, go to the source...

 

https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/

[simple1]

7 hours ago, Morch said:

 

No. That would be you trying to co-opt my words and bend them to your agenda. I have no idea if the a shot was merited or justified, that's for investigations and courts to determine. Same goes for whether racism played a part in the decision making process.

 

I do think, that it a group (2-3 of them, wasn't it?) or even one policeman ought to have been able to stop a suspect with much less force (7 shots, in this case). At the range we're talking about, that many shots were excessive, and to me, indicate lack of professionalism and training, at the very least. That's also why I'm not a fan of the "de-fund the police" tag line. Give them more money, for better training.

My understand on the 'defund the police' is actually to enable police to focus on core policing matters and not to be detracted by essentially social services roles. Yes, overall funding would be reduced, but one would expect funding to remain for better training and so on. I do think 'defunding the police' sends the wrong brand messaging, which is manipulated to create further divisiveness in the political dialogue.

[bodga]

On 9/2/2020 at 5:05 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

He wouldn't because they wanted a lawyer present. Wonder why the article doesn't point that out ( no, I can guess )?

 

Someone has to support them.

And I  guess many do a fine job on the whole, often dealing with the dregs  of society.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, polpott said:

Its about people of colour from all over the world being unwilling to tolerate the racism that they continue to face every day of their lives.

What about the racism of people that are not white?

If the American cops are so racist, why are Asians not also the target of unjustified police killings in the same number?

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, polpott said:

Both are regularly subjected to vile abuse on social media. Rashford regularly receives racial abuse on the field. The "Kick Racism out of Football" campaign has been running for several years in Europe now.

LOL. "Social media" IMO is a refuge for vile cowards to attack others from the safety of their basements. I never go on it and if the two above are attacked on it the simple answer is to also not go on it. Up to them.

[stevenl]

26 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. "Social media" ..... I never go on it<snip>

Rofl, where are you posting now?

 

Agree with your 'vile cowards' comment.

Edited September 3, 2020 by stevenl

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

Rofl, where are you posting now?

 

Agree with your 'vile cowards' comment.

I don't put TVF in the "social media" camp as anything too bad can be reported and hopefully deleted. Most of TVF is an information forum, and only a few subforums are for debate/ opinion. I'm sure most that use TVF never read or post on World news.

I went through a long spell where I never bothered with world news myself, but still enjoyed using the forum.

Edited September 3, 2020 by thaibeachlovers

[Morch]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't put TVF in the "social media" camp as anything too bad can be reported and hopefully deleted. Most of TVF is an information forum, and only a few subforums are for debate/ opinion. I'm sure most that use TVF never read or post on World news.

I went through a long spell where I never bothered with world news myself, but still enjoyed using the forum.

 

Not much of a deflection, considering how many times you do post on this section.

[Morch]

4 hours ago, simple1 said:

My understand on the 'defund the police' is actually to enable police to focus on core policing matters and not to be detracted by essentially social services roles. Yes, overall funding would be reduced, but one would expect funding to remain for better training and so on. I do think 'defunding the police' sends the wrong brand messaging, which is manipulated to create further divisiveness in the political dialogue.

 

I understand the concept, but not very trusting of both proper implementation of cuts/budget diverted and that the new ventures into social projects would be well utilized, effective and an apt compensation vs. the current situation. My guess is that if this happens, there will be problems down the line associated with depleted units, even worse cop training and social projects all over the place, without proper tools to assess their efficacy. Obviously, I could very well be wrong, and things will come together in a better way. Finding it hard to muster the optimism in this case.

 

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

What about the racism of people that are not white?

If the American cops are so racist, why are Asians not also the target of unjustified police killings in the same number?

AFAIK Asians were not previously slaves in America, nor are they as physically imposing as some African-Americans.

Having said that, the real problem in America is that everyone is potentially armed with a gun. So Americans get trigger-happy cops, but hey the Second Amendment preserves freedom against tyranny. It's not a virtuous circle.

[spidermike007]

Trump is betting the house on "law and order". That is a big gamble. He appears to be light years beyond tone deaf, and a dinosaur.

 

I think it will backfire on him. At least I am hoping! 

[Sujo]

18 hours ago, Logosone said:

Also Lewis Hamilton is only paid 40 million Pounds by Mercedes. 

 

Schuhmacher was paid 60 million by Ferrari. 

 

Terrible discrimination.

 

 

Because rich people just cannot be discriminated against or be subject to racial abuse.

????

[Logosone]

5 hours ago, Sujo said:

Because rich people just cannot be discriminated against or be subject to racial abuse.

????

I got news for you.

 

Everyone discriminates. Let that dissolve and sink in.

 

Even wonderful black lives matter people discriminate against whom they do not like. Gays and lesbians discriminate. Old people discriminate. Young people discriminate. Feminists discriminate. It's a fact of life. Everyone does it. People best get used to it because it will never disappear.

 

And people like BLM and Lewis Hamilton are only using the discrimination card to gain attention and moral high ground for themselves. It's a non-issue, unless you decide to make a big deal about it. Personally I wouldn't burn a city down because some German guy got whacked by police. But hey, you can support the lunatics if you want. Don't claim to have any moral high ground though. You don't. And neither does Hamilton as he pontificates about lack of privilege in his 28 room mansion.

 

 

[Credo]

15 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

What about the racism of people that are not white?

If the American cops are so racist, why are Asians not also the target of unjustified police killings in the same number?

I think the question is why aren't whites shot and killed at the same rate as Blacks.   Because one race, Asians, isn't represented in the statistics means little.   Now take a look at the rate of the shooting of Hispanics in the SW US.   It is disproportionately high.   As a matter of fact, a little over a year ago, there was a 12 year old Latino boy on his way home from school at 2:30 p.m. shot in the back and killed.   He was, of course, unarmed and he was doing nothing.   He had been looking in car windows.  He never stepped on private property.   But he was shot and killed.   

 

[candide]

2 hours ago, Logosone said:

I got news for you.

 

Everyone discriminates. Let that dissolve and sink in.

 

Even wonderful black lives matter people discriminate against whom they do not like. Gays and lesbians discriminate. Old people discriminate. Young people discriminate. Feminists discriminate. It's a fact of life. Everyone does it. People best get used to it because it will never disappear.

 

And people like BLM and Lewis Hamilton are only using the discrimination card to gain attention and moral high ground for themselves. It's a non-issue, unless you decide to make a big deal about it. Personally I wouldn't burn a city down because some German guy got whacked by police. But hey, you can support the lunatics if you want. Don't claim to have any moral high ground though. You don't. And neither does Hamilton as he pontificates about lack of privilege in his 28 room mansion.

 

 

The historical context should not be ignored. The Civil Rights Act was voted only in 1964 and racism did not stop after that. It's not that long ago.

On the one hand, racism is still noticeable in the US, in particular in the social and geographical strata where police officers have been recruited.

On the other hand, it is quite understandable that black people may be oversensitive due the historical and current context.

It's quite different from your false equivalence about German people.