UK minister surprised by Scottish independence referendum move

[kingdong]

9 minutes ago, Purdey said:

This means no large, global manufacturer would bother to set up a factory in Scotland after independence. So far from Europe, lack of skilled workers. Just would not happen. Dont forget, Scotland is technically out of the EU and there is little chance they could enter quickly later. Why would any major industrial giant choose Scotland? Eire is a better bet.

 

the only reason the eu might let scotland join ( highly unlikely while spain is still a member ) is to use it as a dumping ground for their failed experiment in social engineering,as that magnificent leader merkel said " the eu must shoulder the responsibility of migration"that was after she,d had a heavy night on the schnapps and thought it a good idea to invite 1.5 million goat herders into her fair country.

Edited September 7, 2020 by kingdong

[Rookiescot]

7 minutes ago, kingdong said:

the only reason the eu might tet scotland join ( highly unlikely while spain is still a member ) is to use it as a dumping ground for their failed experiment in social engineering,as that magnificent leader merkel said " the eu must shoulder the responsibility of migration"that was after she,d had a heavy night on the schnapps and thought it a good idea to invite 1.5 million goat herders into her fair country.

Ah Spain eh? That old chestnut. Spain has already said they would have no issue with an independent Scotland joining the EU. Things have changed since 2014. Back then the EU was happy to give mixed messages about Scotland at the behest of the UK government so you really need to bring yourself up to speed on developments. 

[kingdong]

26 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Did he? Give us all a link to where he said that.

give you a link?what did your last servant die of?,i remember it on the national news either itv or bbc at the time,should try keeping up with events using this channel rather than keep quoting suspect quotes someones put on the internet.

[kingdong]

6 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Ah Spain eh? That old chestnut. Spain has already said they would have no issue with an independent Scotland joining the EU. Things have changed since 2014. Back then the EU was happy to give mixed messages about Scotland at the behest of the UK government so you really need to bring yourself up to speed on developments. 

then best brace yourself for option 2 of my post.

[Rookiescot]

5 minutes ago, kingdong said:

give you a link?what did your last servant die of?,i remember it on the national news either itv or bbc at the time,should try keeping up with events using this channel rather than keep quoting suspect quotes someones put on the internet.

So you cannot provide a link then?

OK I will add your post to the unsubstantiated baseless assertions list.  

[kingdong]

3 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

So you cannot provide a link then?

OK I will add your post to the unsubstantiated baseless assertions list.  

did i say i couldn,t? i told you my source,should be a laugh if scotland gets independence,that,ll be the end of their " free education and prescriptions "

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, kingdong said:

did i say i couldn,t? i told you my source,should be a laugh if scotland gets independence,that,ll be the end of their " free education and prescriptions "

Still no link then?

Aye OK.

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

Some follower of the SNP has suggested that they just use credit/debit cards, thus having no need for money.

Some wonk in the nasty party said we'd have an oven ready brexit deal ages ago - moral of the story: don't trust idiots or tories (or both). 

[jayboy]

59 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-44256059

 

Thats from the BBC. The communications wing of the Conservative party. 

A measured and careful analysis is provide in this BBC article.You respond with an absurd slur. As regards the sterling option this could certainly be invoked by an independent Scotland.It would mean however that Scotland would have zero say in determining monetary policy.It would essentially be required to fall in line with whatever was required by London in terms of setting interest rates etc.Essentially Scotland would have less influence in this vital area than it does now.Looking on the bright side however, there are even worse choices and less independence if Scotland opted for the Euro.

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, Purdey said:

This means no large, global manufacturer would bother to set up a factory in Scotland after independence. So far from Europe, lack of skilled workers. Just would not happen. Dont forget, Scotland is technically out of the EU and there is little chance they could enter quickly later. Why would any major industrial giant choose Scotland? Eire is a better bet.

 

Scotland isn't included in this report, but if the factors above are true for Scotland, I suspect you'd better save your concern for the English.

 

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/02/which-countries-have-the-best-literacy-and-numeracy-rates/

 

"England’s teenagers have the worst levels of literacy coming in last place with more than 1 in 5 having a low level of literacy. The country doesn’t fare much better in numeracy, coming second to last with more than a quarter of 16-19 year olds lacking basic numeracy skills."

Edited September 7, 2020 by RuamRudy

[kingdong]

5 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

 

"England’s teenagers have the worst levels of literacy coming in last place with more than 1 in 5 having a low level of literacy. The country doesn’t fare much better in numeracy, coming second to last with more than a quarter of 16-19 year olds lacking basic numeracy skills."

a by product of unlimited immigration and the strain it puts on education service.

[RuamRudy]

7 minutes ago, kingdong said:

a by product of unlimited immigration and the strain it puts on education service.

Always the fault of the foreigners, yeah?

[jayboy]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

Scotland isn't included in this report, but if the factors above are true for Scotland, I suspect you'd better save your concern for the English.

 

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/02/which-countries-have-the-best-literacy-and-numeracy-rates/

 

"England’s teenagers have the worst levels of literacy coming in last place with more than 1 in 5 having a low level of literacy. The country doesn’t fare much better in numeracy, coming second to last with more than a quarter of 16-19 year olds lacking basic numeracy skills."

It's true that the Scots have an amazing educational heritage to build on - excellent universities, and schools and dare I say it the old Presbyterian virtues of diligence and hard work.A lot of this inheritance is being <deleted> away by the socialist SNP leadership.But I am convinced the old Scottish virtues will prevail again, whether within or outside the UK.

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, jayboy said:

A measured and careful analysis is provide in this BBC article.You respond with an absurd slur. As regards the sterling option this could certainly be invoked by an independent Scotland.It would mean however that Scotland would have zero say in determining monetary policy.It would essentially be required to fall in line with whatever was required by London in terms of setting interest rates etc.Essentially Scotland would have less influence in this vital area than it does now.Looking on the bright side however, there are even worse choices and less independence if Scotland opted for the Euro.

As it stands at the moment Scotland gets no say in monetary policy at Westminster anyway.

The BBC are notorious for their Conservative party bias. At least the news dept is. Just google it.

[Scott]

Baiting, bickering posts and replies removed.  

 

[kingdong]

11 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

Always the fault of the foreigners, yeah?

it would appear so with teachers having large numbers in their class who,s first language isn,t english.

[Rookiescot]

27 minutes ago, kingdong said:

it would appear so with teachers having large numbers in their class who,s first language isn,t english.

Like Nigel Farages kids?

[RuamRudy]

4 hours ago, kingdong said:

it would appear so with teachers having large numbers in their class who,s first language isn,t english.

That sort of overly reductionist thinking is exactly the reason the UK is on its last legs. 

[transam]

1 minute ago, RuamRudy said:

That sort of overly reductionist thinking is exactly the reason the UK is on its last legs. 

Are you anti-British..?

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, transam said:

Are you anti-British..?

I am anti dull-witted people making idiotic decisions based upon flawed logic which have a direct and significantly negative impact upon me and my loved ones. 

 

Even your question is ridiculous. Britain is a geographic entity. You may as well asked if I was anti mountains or anti sunsets. 

[vogie]

5 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

I am anti dull-witted people making idiotic decisions based upon flawed logic which have a direct and significantly negative impact upon me and my loved ones. 

 

Even your question is ridiculous. Britain is a geographic entity. You may as well asked if I was anti mountains or anti sunsets. 

Nationalists tend to think that they are superior to everyone else, and don't believe in democratic decisions, they also call people who don't vote/think the same as them as "anti dull-witted people" and much more.

 

[transam]

12 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

I am anti dull-witted people making idiotic decisions based upon flawed logic which have a direct and significantly negative impact upon me and my loved ones. 

 

Even your question is ridiculous. Britain is a geographic entity. You may as well asked if I was anti mountains or anti sunsets. 

I thought you wanted to leave the UK union umbrella, and you have the front to talk about loved ones.....Amazing stuff..????

[RuamRudy]

Just now, vogie said:

Nationalists tend to think that they are superior to everyone else, and don't believe in democratic decisions, they also call people who don't vote/think the same as them as "anti dull-witted people" and much more.

 

You still don't get it, do you (or maybe you do, but you just continue to misrepresent the facts)? It's nothing to do with democracy and everything to do with people willingly voting for an outcome that will negatively impact them and most people around them. 

 

KD's statement above is the perfect example. English literacy and numeracy figures are among the worst in the world so, according to him, it must be because of immigrants. That's it - that's his analysis. And it's that weak, lazy and hugely flawed thinking that has led to this. 

 

Our politics has become so poisoned that our leaders can stand at the dispatch box and openly lie to parliament and the country with no repercussions whatsoever, no challenge and not a whimper from the press.

 

They might have spent all last month telling us that the answer was left, this month they claim they always said the answer was right - and not a flicker of concern is raised. 

[RuamRudy]

I remember during all the brouhaha of the 2014 referendum, a lot was made of the Scottish share of the UK deficit and how, if Scotland defaulted on their obligations, they would struggle to gain credibility as a trustworthy country for borrowing etc. 

 

Now that Johnson has shown his willingness to welch on international agreements to which he has previously signed up, I guess the issue is no longer relevant. 

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

I remember during all the brouhaha of the 2014 referendum, a lot was made of the Scottish share of the UK deficit and how, if Scotland defaulted on their obligations, they would struggle to gain credibility as a trustworthy country for borrowing etc. 

 

Now that Johnson has shown his willingness to welch on international agreements to which he has previously signed up, I guess the issue is no longer relevant. 

Where-as the SNP didn't welch on the 2014 referendum decision made by the Scottish electorate, such hypocrisy. 

[RuamRudy]

9 minutes ago, vogie said:

Where-as the SNP didn't welch on the 2014 referendum decision made by the Scottish electorate, such hypocrisy. 

We are still in the UK. I see that as full compliance with the results. 

[vogie]

26 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

We are still in the UK. I see that as full compliance with the results. 

While you admit to be still in the UK, it is not of your own accord.

[crobe]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

Where-as the SNP didn't welch on the 2014 referendum decision made by the Scottish electorate, such hypocrisy. 

I think most of the hypocrisy is coming from your ilk

All talk about independence, sovereignty and self-determination when it comes to leaving the EU, but when it is Scotland wanting to leave the UK it is the exact opposite 

Remember "project fear" was not the remainers stoking anxiety about the cost of leaving the EU, before that it was the unionists arguing about the cost to Scotland of leaving the UK, and still ongoing today.

 

Personally I believe in self-determination - as in the UN General Assembly resolution 1541

 - UK votes to leave EU - Not my choice but I accept it 51.9% to leave

 - England voted to leave the EU - I accept it - 53.4% to leave

 - Wales voted to leave the EU - I accept it - 52.5% to leave

 - Scotland voted to remain in the EU - I accept it - 62.0% to remain

 - Northern Ireland voted to remain in the EU - I accept it - 55.8% to remain

 

As to the SNP "welching" on the 2014 referendum, this is not the official view of the UK government.

In the Northern Ireland protocol - part of the withdrawal agreement signed by Boris Johnson on behalf of the UK, they have agreed that 4 years after the end of the transition period - i.e. by 31st December 2024, the people of Northern Ireland get to have a vote on whether to continue the arrangements 

 

So if the people of Northern Ireland can have a vote on their new circumstances 4 years after the implementation of Brexit, I see no logical or moral reason why the same should not be afforded to Scotland

 

I am in favour of the second Scottish referendum in 2024 should they wish to have one.

 

Edited September 8, 2020 by crobe

[vogie]

13 minutes ago, crobe said:

I think most of the hypocrisy is coming from your ilk

All talk about independence, sovereignty and self-determination when it comes to leaving the EU, but when it is Scotland wanting to leave the UK it is the exact opposite 

Remember "project fear" was not the remainers stoking anxiety about the cost of leaving the EU, before that it was the unionists arguing about the cost to Scotland of leaving the UK, and still ongoing today.

 

Personally I believe in self-determination - as in the UN General Assembly resolution 1541

 - UK votes to leave EU - Not my choice but I accept it 51.9% to leave

 - England voted to leave the EU - I accept it - 53.4% to leave

 - Wales voted to leave the EU - I accept it - 52.5% to leave

 - Scotland voted to remain in the EU - I accept it - 62.0% to remain

 - Northern Ireland voted to remain in the EU - I accept it - 55.8% to remain

 

As to the SNP "welching" on the 2014 referendum, this is not the official view of the UK government.

In the Northern Ireland protocol - part of the withdrawal agreement signed by Boris Johnson on behalf of the UK, they have agreed that 4 years after the end of the transition period - i.e. by 31st December 2024, the people of Northern Ireland get to have a vote on whether to continue the arrangements 

 

So if the people of Northern Ireland can have a vote on their new circumstances 4 years after the implementation of Brexit, I see no logical or moral reason why the same should not be afforded to Scotland

 

I am in favour of the second Scottish referendum in 2024 should they wish to have one.

 

What is my ilk?

[crobe]

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

What is my ilk?

The ardent brexiteers who are totally hypocritical when it comes to the issue of Scottish independence

Have some consistency