34 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Batteries don't have to be 20 yrs old to be tested how long they last.

 

They test how many cycles they have, what the average use / yearly kms will be, and make a practical calculation.

 

If my DECO SUSU battery gets 1500 cycles, and is rated at 120 kms per cycle, then theoretically, I should get 180k kms.  1 year owning, and I drove 3500 kms.  That's my daily driving, say 200+ days a year.

 

Gives my 51+ years of use.  Do I expect, 1500 cycles, maybe, as I do baby it.  Do I get 120 kms per charge, NO.  51 years ... doubtful, but I'd be more than pleased with just half that.

 

Do the same for my solar system & EV, and both will probably out last myself for sure, and probably the wife.  That's about 30 yrs, and might still have some juice left.

 

 

You may be right. Having said that, there is a difference between testing under laboratory conditions, and actual field performance. I've seen it many times.

I guess it depends on how many bean counters are involved in the design of EV's, and whether the engineers can tell them to get lost.

It's probably irrelevant in my case, my Vios may well outlast me. If not, plenty of time to climb on board without being a lab rat.

17 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You may be right. Having said that, there is a difference between testing under laboratory conditions, and actual field performance. I've seen it many times.

I guess it depends on how many bean counters are involved in the design of EV's, and whether the engineers can tell them to get lost.

It's probably irrelevant in my case, my Vios may well outlast me. If not, plenty of time to climb on board without being a lab rat.

You don't even need lab tests, many EV batteries are based on tech that's been around for quite a while in standard Li-Ion cells and we know how they degrade. And manufacturers who actually are confident in their tech give 10 year warranties which imho is the exact right thing to do in order to help with consumer confidence. I wouldn't buy an EV without such warranty.

 

That being said, I don't see warranties like that from small not well known manufacturers and even if they did I'm not sure I'd trust them to be around in 10 years and to honor it. Deco says the batteries need replacing every 3-5 years which is not great.

5 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Finally

Although the one I have, SUSU, is now ฿9,000 (82.9k vs 73.9k) ????

SUSU ... no gov't incentive, or missing from photo.

 

Others, price increase, more to do with the market, as most other e-scooters are more expensive, so up 7-8-9k, then about 9-11k less off 'original/last year's price' with the govt incentive, so still nice pricing.

 

AND ... they are registered / tagged.

 

1000w for less than 29k ... nice

And 1000w models have removable batteries for condo/apartment dwellers.

 

A few new prices, and couple new models.

Last year's prices, w/new ones noted:

The Susu does have a rebate from the government, list price now 63640 according to the Deco website.

 

I took the punt and bought a G-3. Will report back later with my impressions once I get a few km's on the clock.

 

The Susu would have been my preferred option with the bigger engine (3000w) and large single battery, but the battery isn't removable, unfortunately. As other posters have mentioned, a removable battery is the only way most condo folks would be able to go electric

22 minutes ago, NumbNut said:

I took the punt and bought a G-3. Will report back later with my impressions once I get a few km's on the clock.

I really enjoy riding mine.  2000w should be nice and peppy.  Top end nothing special, but more than ample for Thai roads and a relaxing drive.  

 

I'm on the search for better rear shocks, as Thai roads are brutally pot holed, and bounce you around no matter what scooter you're on.  My Honda Wave 125i wasn't much better in that aspect.   

 

Aside from that, love the smooth, non shifting ride.  With the 3000w, I'm usually in mode 1 till about 40 kph, or 50 if not paying attention, then mode 2.   Rarely needing 3, as rare to exceed 60 kph.

 

You'll be switching 1 to 2 at about 25-30 kph.   Distance per charge, with good 20-30% reserve will be a bit less than their estimates, since test done as such slow speeds.  I only put on about 12 kms a day, so can almost make 5 days without charging.  Which I do at the low end of 3 bars and try not to go to 2 bars, if battery 'meter' hasn't changed.

 

I've never needed or used the 'power' button, as has more than enough torque for quick starts.  Just make sure you're in mode 1.

 

ENJOY

So far so good with the G-5. This is my first scooter, and it is a much nicer experience then I thought it would be.

 

Got a few hundreds kays up now and all in all I'm pretty happy. Power delivery strangely enough reminds me of my old Ducati 900S2, there is very little bottom end, then a large, linear mid-range with no top end to speak of, just like an old bevel drive Ducati. Everything happens in the mid-range.

 

Ist gear ~55 km/h, 2nd gear ~65 km/h, 3rd gear ~80 km/h according to the speedo. The 'S' button will temporarily boost speed up in all gears by about 15 km/h or so for about 30 seconds before coming back down to the speed of the gear you are currently in. 

 

I rode to Hua Hin yesterday and back, a round journey of about 75 kays or so and there was about 35% left on one battery and <10% on the other. The batteries drew down equally until about 60% left on both, then the load increased on one battery and reduced on the other. This could cause problems in the future if one battery is constantly being drained while the other battery has less load placed on it. Maybe the engine/battery management system needs to be looked at. 

 

Haven't got a good feeling for the handling yet, but this is a scooter and I'm not going to be doing my Mick Doohan impersonation on Thai roads. Two hydraulic disc brakes front and rear pull it up well, impressed with the braking.

 

Battery management issues aside, I'm very happy so far with the G-5    

Well i just took delivery of a Deko Sofia the blue bike in the youtube vid, didnt start well.....half a Km after delivery strong rubber burnt smell no more move.

 

They replaced with a completely new bike the next day, delivered etc, TGF took it for a short spin on accepting then in the evening we jump on for a small trip down the road, flat tire in the same position the break down the previous night, less than half a km.

 

Contacted the shop about the flat they just said go pump it up, not on as the tire is off the rim air will just pee out the sides without a seal and tube, still waiting to find out what there going to do about it so this could be the problem, the after sales and service of these bikes, my point is the slack preparation to make sure the bike is functioning like it should, ok the motor or clutch or what ever the issue  first time is just bad luck but seriously delivering a bike with low pressure in the tires and i felt it right away when i got on the back is purly poor by the seller, if they didnt bother to check tire pressure what else didnt they check?

 

Anyway they claim its Chinese parts assembled in Thailand, think i seen its mainly Taiwanese parts but not sure, motor has a 3 year warranty, battery 2 ys and electrical wiring 1y, there is a light and usb in the battery/storage compartment, i know the light is not working.....build or assemble quality is begging to look shoddy.....

 

On 9/19/2020 at 7:41 AM, canthai55 said:

555

Why would anyone want a electric motorcycle? They make no noise, hang on I have some old baseball cards I could put on the spokes, they do have spokes? To each their own, I just don't like them.

On 12/14/2022 at 2:12 PM, KhunLA said:

 

Ist gear ~55 km/h, 2nd gear ~65 km/h, 3rd gear ~80 km/h according to the speedo. The 'S' button will temporarily boost speed up in all gears by about 15 km/h or so for about 30 seconds before coming back down to the speed of the gear you are currently in. 

 

I have to say I don't get the point of the mode/gears.

There is no difference in acceleration, it seems to work only a speed limiter.

 

1 hour ago, Elik said:

 

I have to say I don't get the point of the mode/gears.

There is no difference in acceleration, it seems to work only a speed limiter.

 

That's about it, and no different than a manual transmission, as can only go so fast in any one gear.  

 

Guess it something to do with amount of volts/amps needed to go at higher speed.  Just like a ICE manual transmission, the torque/take off speed, is less, if in a higher gear/mode, when starting from a stop.  Top speed limited, if not in 'top mode'

 

Unlike our EV car, no progressive modes 'while' driving, just mode to 'drive in' (eco, normal, sport).

Took note of the range, of our DECO SUSU model, older version, 3000w motor/72v50Ah LFP battery.  New version, battery slightly updated.

 

Took it down to 1 bar (no % meter), though photo show 2, but any acceleration, and the second bar quickly disappears.  So a solid 1 bar, and 80 kms traveled over 7 days.   Could probably squeeze 15-20 more kms, from 1 bar, but 80 kms is far enough, and I probably wouldn't take 10 more kms, as a bit of battery abuse.   I rarely go below 3 bars before recharging.

 

So 90-100 km range, if needing, much less than the 140-150 kms in 'old' promo.  Although, 100 kg load, and not driving 35 kph, steady, w/no head wind.  Actually more than the manual states, but much less than DECO's promo.

 

Happy with 80 kms, as no desire to be on a scooter for anywhere near an hour.  Dog & myself, rarely drive more than 50 kph.  Wife was also on the scooter with me this past week also, 1 day, out for a munch.  That's rare, as we usually take the car, which was charging for the past 3 days.  So the scooter does come in handy, besides my morning dog run to the park & surf.

Topped back at 100% and took about 2.5 hrs.

Wish I'd gone with the Susu model instead on the G-5 now. That extra range is worth it I reckon. A Hua Hin - Cha-am round trip needs a complete 100% charge.

Admittedly that's doing ~60km/h in 3rd gear and a 95-110 kg load depending on how much shopping I've done.

Still, I would have hoped for a longer range.

there's a chinese outfit called Luyuan.....they've got together with some Thais and are selling the S30 plus over here for 81k baht....the outfit is called Lyva

AND you could have had it for 51k baht at the motor show

https://motortrivia.com/2023/03/lyva-ev-motorcycles-launches-in-bims-2023/

I think I might have even been tempted off my push bike at that price ????

 

Lyva: A small fraction of the power of a Honda Click at higher price with only 2 year warranty on battery (bad sign) and under 100km range with long charging times and no dealer network. They still have ways to go before many people will make the switch to electric scooters, especially from new unknown brands. While we've seen a lot of improvements with electric cars the past years I feel like not the same has happened with scooters. Seen them for sale in many places but so far I've seen only 3 in the real world, one being a Grab delivery driver, a usecase which I think is actually a pretty decent fit.

47 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Lyva: A small fraction of the power of a Honda Click at higher price with only 2 year warranty on battery (bad sign) and under 100km range with long charging times and no dealer network. They still have ways to go before many people will make the switch to electric scooters, especially from new unknown brands. While we've seen a lot of improvements with electric cars the past years I feel like not the same has happened with scooters. Seen them for sale in many places but so far I've seen only 3 in the real world, one being a Grab delivery driver, a usecase which I think is actually a pretty decent fit.

Unless spending a lot of money, you're not going far or fast (top end) on electric MB/MC in TH, or anywhere.

 

They're offered elsewhere for same or more than the price of a car.  (# 8, 12, 13 ???)

https://luxe.digital/lifestyle/cars/best-electric-motorcycles-2022/

DECO SUSU model, and shy of 2 yrs owning, I'm bored, so early report.  Maybe a month early, as have photo of, Sept 2021.

 

Motor warranty will expire shortly, and have 1 yr left on the battery, which from above post, if lost anything, not noticeable.

 

Have about 5500 kms on it, which means I drive that about half the time, on my daily, morning park/surfside cruise.  5500÷730 days, so rain & brutally hot keeps me & dog off it, half the days.

 

Me & wife have taken some local cruises on it, and <1 hr probably.  

 

Only 1 oops, turning signal relay crapped out, and they sent it straight away, overnight.  Swapped it out myself, as easier and quicker than dealer doing, since 70 kms away.   Wife told me, that we now have a local dealer @ Yamaha/Honda & other, scooter shop.

 

Very happy with it, performance, fun to ride & cost to operate, with no maintenance.  Registered/tagged & insured (basic).

Recommend the brand, and E-MBs themselves, as long as you don't plan on going too fast (top end) or too far.   They also qualify for govt incentives. 

https://decogreenenergy.com/index.php/th/

Four years ago, I bought a cheap (B12,000) Thai E-Bike.  It was kind of a parts-bin special, all generic Chinese components assembled by a short-lived Thai distributor: Empire E-Bike.  It had 16" wheels and looked more like a kids bicycle.  It folded for transport and storage but it folded awkwardly, was 35kg and was very difficult to move around.   The battery was removable for charging. 

Wheel rims were garbage and tires were constantly flat. It rode ok, went up hills without effort but I could not go more than 1km without a flat tire.   It was stored outside and the weather got to the control unit pretty quickly.  I was unable to find a matching replacement and I ended-up giving it away to my condo security guard.

A couple of take-aways:

-Lot's of places selling E-Bikes, very few places skilled at fixing them.  Sourcing specific parts very difficult.

-My E-Bike looked like a bicycle and I never drew any notice from police even though no registration.

A neighbor in my condo had one that looked like a motorbike and he did draw the attention of police several times who noted the lack of registration plate.  Always cost him to get out of it.

-I originally rode mine in Bangkok traffic and found it very scary and dangerous.  It was too slow when I had to turn right out of my soi, across 2 lanes of traffic and it was difficult to keep up with traffic flow.  It was not as bad when I moved to Jomtien but I was never comfortable with it's slow response.

51 minutes ago, dddave said:

Four years ago, I bought a cheap (B12,000) Thai E-Bike.  It was kind of a parts-bin special, all generic Chinese components assembled by a short-lived Thai distributor: Empire E-Bike.  It had 16" wheels and looked more like a kids bicycle.  It folded for transport and storage but it folded awkwardly, was 35kg and was very difficult to move around.   The battery was removable for charging. 

Wheel rims were garbage and tires were constantly flat. It rode ok, went up hills without effort but I could not go more than 1km without a flat tire.   It was stored outside and the weather got to the control unit pretty quickly.  I was unable to find a matching replacement and I ended-up giving it away to my condo security guard.

A couple of take-aways:

-Lot's of places selling E-Bikes, very few places skilled at fixing them.  Sourcing specific parts very difficult.

-My E-Bike looked like a bicycle and I never drew any notice from police even though no registration.

A neighbor in my condo had one that looked like a motorbike and he did draw the attention of police several times who noted the lack of registration plate.  Always cost him to get out of it.

-I originally rode mine in Bangkok traffic and found it very scary and dangerous.  It was too slow when I had to turn right out of my soi, across 2 lanes of traffic and it was difficult to keep up with traffic flow.  It was not as bad when I moved to Jomtien but I was never comfortable with it's slow response.

A lot has changed, for the good in four years, but also, a lot hasn't, as market is flooded with E-scooters (stand up), ebikes, and ebikes (in name only), and more like mini MBs, just happen to have pedals.  With different battery chemistries. 

 

Really have read the specs, and know what you are buying.  Some of the specs are silly & deceptive.  Range ratings are always at a low speed. As are speed ratings, with low load, or even without load ????

 

Need to know battery size for motor.  I see a lot that advertise way over their capabilities with the specs.  Battery v/Ah has to match or exceed your motor size at least or you're not going very fast or far.  V X Ah = W.

 

Mine for example, has upgrade battery now, a wee bit.

Motor	3000w
Battery Type	LITHIUM
Battery/Battery Capacity	73v/58Ah

 

73v X 58Ah = 4234w ????

A very simplistic guide, with other factors, weight/load, controller.

It wasn't until after I had posted that I realized that the topic was 3 years old so my info was indeed a bit dated.   

I'll let it stand as it does at least reinforce the reality that you get what you pay for.

My ICE Honda is very fast, reliable and does 150 mpg, with no danger of being burnt alive. Why would anyone even consider an electric bike.

13 minutes ago, Henryford said:

My ICE Honda is very fast, reliable and does 150 mpg, with no danger of being burnt alive. Why would anyone even consider an electric bike.

After having the E-MB, would never consider one with ICE.  Performance, ease of automatic and smooth ride vs top end or range, both I don't need in a MB. 

 

No real complaints about my Honda Wave, but I didn't enjoy riding it, or maintaining it, or putting petrol in it to ride.

 

Plus I get that warm and fuzzy feeling, from not adding to the local air & noise pollution with EV.  Which disgust me when I'm in traffic with the ICEVs.

 

That's just arrogant & rude ... ????  After the light changes, thankfully, they are all behind me ????  Did I mention performance ?

 

 

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Battery v/Ah has to match or exceed your motor size at least or you're not going very fast or far.  V X Ah = W.

 

Mine for example, has upgrade battery now, a wee bit.

Motor	3000w
Battery Type	LITHIUM
Battery/Battery Capacity	73v/58Ah

 

73v X 58Ah = 4234w ????

V * Ah = Wh. That's the capacity of the battery. 4.23 kWh. We'd need to know if the battery can deliver more than 41A (3000W / 73V) to know if the motor can actually be fully utilized.

6 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

V * Ah = Wh. That's the capacity of the battery. 4.23 kWh. We'd need to know if the battery can deliver more than 41A (3000W / 73V) to know if the motor can actually be fully utilized.

 

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

A very simplistic guide, with other factors, weight/load, controller.

 

On 8/19/2023 at 12:58 PM, KhunLA said:

DECO SUSU model, and shy of 2 yrs owning, I'm bored, so early report.  Maybe a month early, as have photo of, Sept 2021.

 

Motor warranty will expire shortly, and have 1 yr left on the battery, which from above post, if lost anything, not noticeable.

 

Have about 5500 kms on it, which means I drive that about half the time, on my daily, morning park/surfside cruise.  5500÷730 days, so rain & brutally hot keeps me & dog off it, half the days.

 

Me & wife have taken some local cruises on it, and <1 hr probably.  

 

Only 1 oops, turning signal relay crapped out, and they sent it straight away, overnight.  Swapped it out myself, as easier and quicker than dealer doing, since 70 kms away.   Wife told me, that we now have a local dealer @ Yamaha/Honda & other, scooter shop.

 

Very happy with it, performance, fun to ride & cost to operate, with no maintenance.  Registered/tagged & insured (basic).

Recommend the brand, and E-MBs themselves, as long as you don't plan on going too fast (top end) or too far.   They also qualify for govt incentives. 

https://decogreenenergy.com/index.php/th/

2 years owning our DECO SUSU and (nothing changed from earlier post, a few posts above, and one after, with info) except motor warranty now expired ????

 

Another year on the battery warranty, and don't expect any surprises.  

 

More accurate kms on the clock, as we did an O&A, so didn't drive as much as I thought in earlier post.  Since the scooter is used more for my morning local cruise to park & surf.  Not exactly racking up the kms on it.

 

 

Just a heads up, for all scooters owners, not just E-MBs.

 

Rolled the DECO SUSU model out of the carport as usual, slight incline, squeeze  hand brake ...

... and nothing, keeps rolling.

 

Other hand brake working as usual.   Notice the discoloration of brake fluid reservoir isn't just dirt.  Obvious leaking.   Do our morning cruise, a bit slower than usual.   Stop at 2 PTT station, one tells me DOT 3 not for motorbikes, no have DOT 4, (I'm ignorant), and the other has no stock of anything, including oils ... WTF

 

So order DOT 3 online after quick web search for info and can of.   Seems DOT 4 is for higher performing, hard braking bikes (higher boiling point).    So order, it arrives, and pop off the reservoir top' metal plate, with phasic plate below that, with rubber gasket, misaligned below that, hence the leak due to improper seating.

 

The plastic plate, fits 'into' the rubber gasket to ensure proper seating.  refill, tighten down plates.   Too easy.   Check the other brake reservoir.  Plates & gasket seated properly, and still full up.

 

Now have about 490ml of brake fluid on hand from the 500ml can of.   Also good for the car, if ever needed, though that may be a few 100k kms, since we rarely use the brakes.   EV having regen slowing down  to a crawl, before brakes needing to be applied.

 

So check your brake reservoir on your scooter, if not see through.   QC isn't always 100%, as someone obviously wasn't paying attention on the line that day.

 

BE SAFE

Here's an E-MC worth a peek, if need top end & range

2M5 U0-U8 HP STL

My Deco Super Ace is now 5 years old, at 6275 km.

I'm still happy with it, no drop in power and the only mechanical issue is a minute leak in the break fluid box. It needs a 20 thb top up every 6 months.

But range is down to 35 km from 50. When the meter reads 73 V you have 7 km left, not 21.

I charged it for 15 mins at the temple, so I could make it home.

I don't need more range right now, but will keep an eye out for a battery.

Deco dealer quotes 28000 for a new battery, but compare that to 43,640 for a new bike I'm not tempted.
Sadly they wont take the old one as a trade in, instead recommend to sell on Deco club thailand page.

 

51 minutes ago, Elik said:

2M5 U0-U8 HP STL

My Deco Super Ace is now 5 years old, at 6275 km.

I'm still happy with it, no drop in power and the only mechanical issue is a minute leak in the break fluid box. It needs a 20 thb top up every 6 months.

But range is down to 35 km from 50. When the meter reads 73 V you have 7 km left, not 21.

I charged it for 15 mins at the temple, so I could make it home.

I don't need more range right now, but will keep an eye out for a battery.

Deco dealer quotes 28000 for a new battery, but compare that to 43,640 for a new bike I'm not tempted.
Sadly they wont take the old one as a trade in, instead recommend to sell on Deco club thailand page.

 

Also have a DECO, SUSU model, coming up on 4 years now.   Haven't paid attention to any range decline.  will make a note next time I charge, as curious myself now.

 

Also had a brake fluid 'leak', and simply reseated the brake reservoir cover, so not really a leak.  Only issue was a turning signal relay, which we swapped out, under warranty and DECO sent out right away EMS.   Since dealer was 65 kms away, we simply swapped it out and easy enough. 

 

Now have a local dealer, well, Yamaha dealer has a DECO sign, so guess they could order parts if needed, though I'd go direct to DECO.

 

Definitely silly price for replacement battery.  

Batteries for 1000w DECO scooters go for <18k on LAZ.

@Elik  

Kept track after charging up to 100%, and can't say I've lost much in range, at worst, 5%.   Think I've guessed range at 90 kms in the past.  So reality, 75 kms with 1 bar remaining.

 

Just past 4 years owning, and coming back home, it was nipping on 2 bars when accelerating, so means there is at least 30 kms left.   As I tracked each bar (6) in the past and average about 15 kms+ per bar.

 

So minimal loss of range.   I do baby the battery, since not LFP.

 

Rarely go below 3 bars, and only charge up to 100%, when I know I'm going to use it that day or next day.   Never sits at 100% when we go out of town, usually around 80%.   Always let it rest for hour or so, before charging.

 

Rarely drive over 60 kph, since the dog is in the front basket most of the time, and don't want to dry her eyes out.   Dog and myself, weight 90 kg or less, (80+10).

 

 

Their promo at the time of purchase, and I think the Owner's Manual stated range was 90 kms, so just a bit more accurate 🙄

 

 

New Promo .... 👍

Still pushing that 140 kms range   

 

 

https://decogreenenergy.com/index.php/th/products/3000w-2/susu

I was looking at buying a Deco for my wife but looking at the savings it seems her Yamaha Filano from 9 years ago is way cheaper to run.
I noticed a post saying after 6275 km that the battery needed replacing (28000 baht)

Compared to the Yamaha thats only about 4000 baht in fuel

She has managed to clock up 91k in 9 years although i use it quite a bit to nip around 
Total spent around 56k in fuel in those 91k and it does use a bit of oil now but still think i might hold off on changing to a EV bike for now.

 

I expect many would not need a battery replaced with such low milage and wonder if other owners have got high milage like 80-100k out of one as probably will do around 10k a year on one.