Not clear about my child passport when travelling

[Jofefe]

First of all, hello everyone and many thanks for many helpful topics.

 

I am a spanish national who is living in Thailand with my Thai wife and our daughter who got both citizenships.

 

We plan to travel to Spain soon and I have an important question about the process when travelling for my daughter. My daughter was born in Thailand and has never been to Spain but she has got both passport.

 

The point is that we don't know under what name we have to reserve the flight ticket for her because the family name on passports are a bit different due to different laws. I have talked with an airline Emirates agent who told me that we have to book under her spanish name and use the spanish passport because when travelling she can use only 1 passport. But the issue here which makes no sense to me is that she will be getting a departure stamp on her spanish passport. Furthermore the agent told me that if I book with her Thai passport they will require her a Schengen visa and that her spanish passport is not a valid proof that she can travel to Spain with no visa (really???).

 

I have also read on other blogs that the best way in this situations is using both passport. Bookingvhe flight under her Thai name and depart Thailand with the Thai passport and once we arrive to Spain show her spanish passport there. 

 

Anyone with some experience in a situation like this?

 

Many thanks in advance

 

[Pilotman]

what you have been told by the airline  is correct.  if she has two names, one Spanish and one  Thai, although why she would have two names escapes me,  you can only book and travel under one name.  Either way causes you issues, either with having to have a Visa for Spain or getting back into Thailand with restrictions in place for none Thais.   The stories you have heard are people using a Thai passport to enter Thailand and a foreign passport to enter another country, but in that case the two passports show the same name. You cannot do as you suggest and leave Thailand on one passport, with one name, and enter Spain with another passport in another name, as the ticket shows as one name only.  Many of us have Thai wives and children with two passports and they do use both on journeys to and from Thailand , but one name only, matching the name on the flight tickets. 

Edited January 10, 2021 by Pilotman

[4MyEgo]

7 minutes ago, Jofefe said:

Bookingvhe flight under her Thai name and depart Thailand with the Thai passport and once we arrive to Spain show her spanish passport there. 

 

Anyone with some experience in a situation like this?

Both of our daughters have dual passports, Thai and Australian, when we depart Thailand, they depart on Thai passports, entering Australia on Australian Passports.

 

When departing Australia, they depart on Australian passports, and when entering Thailand they enter on their Thai passports.

 

As for their names, they are identical on both passports, suffice to say, you need to clear that one up, as airlines will only allow people to travel with matching names to those on their passports, the smallest spelling error can create problems.

[theoldgit]

She should use her Spanish name to book the tickets.

 

At check-in in Bangkok she should show that ticket with her Thail passport, along with her Spanish passport, to show that she doesn't need a visa to enter Spain.

 

On exiting Thailand she should show her Thai passport when she passes through Immigration.

 

On arrival in Spain she should enter using her Spanish passport, as a Spanish citizen she has an absolute right to enter the country so doesn't need a visa, in fact she shouldn't even be issued one.

 

On checking in for her return she should check-in using her Thai passport, that shoes the check-in staff that she doesn't need a return ticket to travel from Spain to Thailand,  but exit Schengen Immigration using her Spanish passport, as she entered using that, on arrival in Thailand use her Thai passport.

[Jofefe]

@Pilotman @4MyEgo @theoldgit

Many thanks you all.

 

Sorry I was not clear enough about her name. The first name is the same and the family name different due to different laws.

For example (I am imagining the names):

Thai passport: PEREZ TAKSIN, WARAPORN

Spanish passport: PEREZ RAMIREZ, WARAPORN

 

It happened because in spanish law you have to put both of the parents family name but for her thai passports they obligated me to put her my complete family name, so that's why.

 

Anyway, I have talked with my wife and we are gonna change her thai family name in order to match it with her spanish name so we will avoid any problem. I can't understand why thai law obligated me to put my complete family name for her when she was born and later allow people to change the name so easily...

Edited January 10, 2021 by Jofefe

[Pilotman]

1 hour ago, Jofefe said:

@Pilotman @4MyEgo @theoldgit

Many thanks you all.

 

Sorry I was not clear enough about her name. The first name is the same and the family name different due to different laws.

For example (I am imagining the names):

Thai passport: PEREZ TAKSIN, WARAPORN

Spanish passport: PEREZ RAMIREZ, WARAPORN

 

It happened because in spanish law you have to put both of the parents family name but for her thai passports they obligated me to put her my complete family name, so that's why.

 

Anyway, I have talked with my wife and we are gonna change her thai family name in order to match it with her spanish name so we will avoid any problem. I can't understand why thai law obligated me to put my complete family name for her when she was born and later allow people to change the name so easily...

well done, that is the right way to go about it.  Also make it far easier for her in later life. However, be aware, it is not that easy to get a child's name changed officially in Thailand.  You may need legal help to do it and a very understanding Ampur. 

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, Jofefe said:

Anyway, I have talked with my wife and we are gonna change her thai family name in order to match it with her spanish name so we will avoid any problem. I can't understand why thai law obligated me to put my complete family name for her when she was born and later allow people to change the name so easily...

 

I believe this to be the best possible solution for now and in the future, as for not understanding why Thai law obligated you to put your complete family name for her when she was born and later allows people to change the name so easily. Well all I can say from my experiences is, it depends on who you are talking too, today it's one story, tomorrow it's another, and if your wondering why they call it the land of smiles, I will let you work that one out.

[Pilotman]

4 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

 

I believe this to be the best possible solution for now and in the future, as for not understanding why Thai law obligated you to put your complete family name for her when she was born and later allows people to change the name so easily. Well all I can say from my experiences is, it depends on who you are talking too, today it's one story, tomorrow it's another, and if your wondering why they call it the land of smiles, I will let you work that one out.

oh so true. 

[soi3eddie]

 

I agree that getting names same in both passports will make things easier for future travel. I don't see at as essential though as my Thai ex had a Thai passport in her maiden name and British passport in her married name. After 10+ years of frequent travel to/from Thailand it was never an issue. We always booked tickets in married name and she simply used her Thai passport to enter depart Thailand. On check-in at BKK she would simply show both passports to the airline to satisfy them that she had the correct permission to enter the UK and would not be denied entry.

 

[Jofefe]

Many thanks you all for the help and kind advise.

 

I'll try to change her name to make things easier. If it's not possible I'll show her Thai passport when departing/arriving from/to Thailand and if I find some problem I'll try to explain the situation.

 

Again, many thanks!

[Upnotover]

4 hours ago, Jofefe said:

Many thanks you all for the help and kind advise.

 

I'll try to change her name to make things easier. If it's not possible I'll show her Thai passport when departing/arriving from/to Thailand and if I find some problem I'll try to explain the situation.

 

Again, many thanks!

 

Worth bearing in mind that on departure and arrival at BKK she can use the e-gates with her Thai passport.  I don't think those machines are checking boarding passes against passport names so should be nothing to explain.

[theoldgit]

12 hours ago, Jofefe said:

Many thanks you all for the help and kind advise.

 

I'll try to change her name to make things easier. If it's not possible I'll show her Thai passport when departing/arriving from/to Thailand and if I find some problem I'll try to explain the situation.

 

Again, many thanks!

 

Even if you change the names, and the passports, you should still do the process I outlined in my previous post to ensure that the carriers are satisfied that she meets the immigration requirements of the destination country, in both directions. 

[4MyEgo]

16 hours ago, Jofefe said:

Many thanks you all for the help and kind advise.

 

I'll try to change her name to make things easier. If it's not possible I'll show her Thai passport when departing/arriving from/to Thailand and if I find some problem I'll try to explain the situation.

 

Again, many thanks!

 

Yes, if you find changing names is an issue, show her Thai passport when exiting, and as long as the child looks the same in the passports to the date you are departing, shouldn't really be a problem, but then again, this is Thailand, check, check and check again because common sense, well, enough said, everyone has to follow policy and procedure.

 

Good luck 

[4MyEgo]

12 hours ago, Upnotover said:

 

Worth bearing in mind that on departure and arrival at BKK she can use the e-gates with her Thai passport.  I don't think those machines are checking boarding passes against passport names so should be nothing to explain.

 

As long as the child is over the age of 12 and accompanied by an adult, otherwise it's in the que.

[StevieAus]

On 1/10/2021 at 3:53 PM, Jofefe said:

@Pilotman @4MyEgo @theoldgit

Many thanks you all.

 

Sorry I was not clear enough about her name. The first name is the same and the family name different due to different laws.

For example (I am imagining the names):

Thai passport: PEREZ TAKSIN, WARAPORN

Spanish passport: PEREZ RAMIREZ, WARAPORN

 

It happened because in spanish law you have to put both of the parents family name but for her thai passports they obligated me to put her my complete family name, so that's why.

 

Anyway, I have talked with my wife and we are gonna change her thai family name in order to match it with her spanish name so we will avoid any problem. I can't understand why thai law obligated me to put my complete family name for her when she was born and later allow people to change the name so easily...

If I understand what you were saying you were required to use your family name ( what we call surname)
It might be because when my daughter was born in Thailand I wanted her to have my wife’s family name on her birth certificate so that she didn’t have a mixture of Thai/ Anglo names.

This was refused because my wife and I are legally married.( in Australia)

She therefore had to have my family name on her birth certificate and therefore passports
Different countries different rules.

[StevieAus]

5 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

 

As long as the child is over the age of 12 and accompanied by an adult, otherwise it's in the que.

Maybe not as good as the gates but when the three of us travel together we always Use the Thai queue never been refused.

[4MyEgo]

13 hours ago, StevieAus said:

Maybe not as good as the gates but when the three of us travel together we always Use the Thai queue never been refused.

 

Absolutely, wife always goes over to them with the kids (mostly no que's), and asks, can Farang husband come, (me standing all on my lonesome), always a big nod, approach, Wai, smile and the English conversation starts, and out within 5, me then turning to the Farangs in the distant long ques, wanting to shout "Cooee".

 

Moral of the story, pays to have people in high places (wife) ????

 

 

[GinBoy2]

On 1/10/2021 at 1:21 AM, Pilotman said:

what you have been told by the airline  is correct.  if she has two names, one Spanish and one  Thai, although why she would have two names escapes me,  you can only book and travel under one name.  Either way causes you issues, either with having to have a Visa for Spain or getting back into Thailand with restrictions in place for none Thais.   The stories you have heard are people using a Thai passport to enter Thailand and a foreign passport to enter another country, but in that case the two passports show the same name. You cannot do as you suggest and leave Thailand on one passport, with one name, and enter Spain with another passport in another name, as the ticket shows as one name only.  Many of us have Thai wives and children with two passports and they do use both on journeys to and from Thailand , but one name only, matching the name on the flight tickets. 

I'm also kinda perplexed about why two different names.

 

As you say many of us have dual kids, never heard about requirements for different names in passports.

 

My son has my surname and his full Thai first name in both his US & Thai passports.

 

I’m a dual US Mexican, my Mexican passport has my English name as well, never needed to provide a Spanish translation of my first name, my surname obviously is the same in both!

 

So no answers, just more curiosity, since if this is a thing in certain jurisdictions, probably the whole community needs to be aware of the details

Edited January 12, 2021 by GinBoy2

[AgMech Cowboy]

On 1/10/2021 at 3:14 PM, Jofefe said:

We plan to travel to Spain soon and I have an important question about the process when travelling for my daughter. My daughter was born in Thailand and has never been to Spain but she has got both passport.

@JofefeI see you received a lot of criticism and advice. I cannot read all the 3-6 paragraph instructions...

To be simple: 1. Check-In with her Spanish passport. All dealings with the airline will use it.

2. At Thai Immigration: leave the country on her Thai passport. Put it away until you start back to Thailand.

3. Use only her Spanish passport outside Thailand.

4. When you check-in to return to Thailand use her Spanish passport, but show the Check-In people the Thai Passport, if they ask about a Visa for her.

5. When you arrive in Thailand, use her Thai passport to enter the country.

That's it. The airline uses only the Spanish PP.

Edited January 13, 2021 by AgMech Cowboy

[Jofefe]

On 1/11/2021 at 4:48 PM, StevieAus said:

If I understand what you were saying you were required to use your family name ( what we call surname)
It might be because when my daughter was born in Thailand I wanted her to have my wife’s family name on her birth certificate so that she didn’t have a mixture of Thai/ Anglo names.

This was refused because my wife and I are legally married.( in Australia)

She therefore had to have my family name on her birth certificate and therefore passports
Different countries different rules.

 

Yes, you are right. Exactly the same happened to me.

 

For those who wonder why she has different surname I want to clarify that it was not our choice. It is because of different country laws. In Spain it is a bit confusing because all people get the family name from both parents. I will try to explain it with an example:

 

My father: 

SURNAME: FFFF GGGG
NAME: KKKK

 

My mother:

 

SURNAME: UUUU OOOO

NAME: PPPP

 

And then, as their son I got:

SURNAME: FFFF UUUU

NAME: JOFEFE

 

So in the case of my daughter she got FFFF UUUU for her thai passport becuase thai law understands both words as the surname but for spain my daughter got only FFFF + (surname of my wife) so that's why she has different surnames.

 

I know it may be a bit confusing but I hope everyone undestands it. I am sorry if I am not enough clear but I am non-native english speaker and it is not easy for me to explain these issues.

 

 

On 1/13/2021 at 3:44 PM, AgMech Cowboy said:

@JofefeI see you received a lot of criticism and advice. I cannot read all the 3-6 paragraph instructions...

To be simple: 1. Check-In with her Spanish passport. All dealings with the airline will use it.

2. At Thai Immigration: leave the country on her Thai passport. Put it away until you start back to Thailand.

3. Use only her Spanish passport outside Thailand.

4. When you check-in to return to Thailand use her Spanish passport, but show the Check-In people the Thai Passport, if they ask about a Visa for her.

5. When you arrive in Thailand, use her Thai passport to enter the country.

That's it. The airline uses only the Spanish PP.

 

Many thanks for your help. I'll do as you have explained me.

 

My only question is if I will find some problems with thai immigration when departing as her boarding pass will have her spanish surname. Anyway, she has the right to go to both countries without any problem.

 

By the way, I tried to changed her thai surname to match it with her spanish passport but it was refused with no reason. Well, in theory it was refused because she is not thai 100%... I wanted to tell to the public worker that my daughter is as thai as her.

 

Incredible, as a thai you can change your name to Homer Simpson if you want but you can't get your mother's suraname because your father is a "falang"...

 

 

 

[soi3eddie]

5 hours ago, Jofefe said:

Well, in theory it was refused because she is not thai 100%... I wanted to tell to the public worker that my daughter is as thai as her.

 

In 2003 we went to the Amphur in Nakhon Si Thammarat to get our son added to the Tabian Baan (blue house book) of his mother's family. Was told "Mai Dai" cannot. Asked why, they told us because he's not Thai. Despite the fact that he had a Thai Birth certificate, His mother was Thai and he had a Thai passport. Go figure. After about 3 hours they reluctantly did what they should have done and added him to the blue house book.

 

Edited January 15, 2021 by soi3eddie

[youreavinalaff]

7 hours ago, Jofefe said:

 

Yes, you are right. Exactly the same happened to me.

 

For those who wonder why she has different surname I want to clarify that it was not our choice. It is because of different country laws. In Spain it is a bit confusing because all people get the family name from both parents. I will try to explain it with an example:

 

My father: 

SURNAME: FFFF GGGG
NAME: KKKK

 

My mother:

 

SURNAME: UUUU OOOO

NAME: PPPP

 

And then, as their son I got:

SURNAME: FFFF UUUU

NAME: JOFEFE

 

So in the case of my daughter she got FFFF UUUU for her thai passport becuase thai law understands both words as the surname but for spain my daughter got only FFFF + (surname of my wife) so that's why she has different surnames.

 

I know it may be a bit confusing but I hope everyone undestands it. I am sorry if I am not enough clear but I am non-native english speaker and it is not easy for me to explain these issues.

 

 

 

Many thanks for your help. I'll do as you have explained me.

 

My only question is if I will find some problems with thai immigration when departing as her boarding pass will have her spanish surname. Anyway, she has the right to go to both countries without any problem.

 

By the way, I tried to changed her thai surname to match it with her spanish passport but it was refused with no reason. Well, in theory it was refused because she is not thai 100%... I wanted to tell to the public worker that my daughter is as thai as her.

 

Incredible, as a thai you can change your name to Homer Simpson if you want but you can't get your mother's suraname because your father is a "falang"...

 

 

 

There are ways to change the name but it will involve the ampher, your embassy and the family court. When the child reaches 20 they can do it themselves at Ampher.

[GinBoy2]

On 1/15/2021 at 12:48 AM, Jofefe said:

 

Yes, you are right. Exactly the same happened to me.

 

For those who wonder why she has different surname I want to clarify that it was not our choice. It is because of different country laws. In Spain it is a bit confusing because all people get the family name from both parents. I will try to explain it with an example:

 

My father: 

SURNAME: FFFF GGGG
NAME: KKKK

 

My mother:

 

SURNAME: UUUU OOOO

NAME: PPPP

 

And then, as their son I got:

SURNAME: FFFF UUUU

NAME: JOFEFE

 

So in the case of my daughter she got FFFF UUUU for her thai passport becuase thai law understands both words as the surname but for spain my daughter got only FFFF + (surname of my wife) so that's why she has different surnames.

 

I know it may be a bit confusing but I hope everyone undestands it. I am sorry if I am not enough clear but I am non-native english speaker and it is not easy for me to explain these issues.

 

 

 

Many thanks for your help. I'll do as you have explained me.

 

My only question is if I will find some problems with thai immigration when departing as her boarding pass will have her spanish surname. Anyway, she has the right to go to both countries without any problem.

 

By the way, I tried to changed her thai surname to match it with her spanish passport but it was refused with no reason. Well, in theory it was refused because she is not thai 100%... I wanted to tell to the public worker that my daughter is as thai as her.

 

Incredible, as a thai you can change your name to Homer Simpson if you want but you can't get your mother's suraname because your father is a "falang"...

 

 

 

Thanks for explaining that.

 

As you could tell several of us just couldn't grasp the difference in names, that explains it.

 

Although it took me a couple of times reading it through to totally understand it, since you are right it is a little confusing

[86Tiger]

On 1/15/2021 at 6:43 PM, youreavinalaff said:

There are ways to change the name but it will involve the ampher, your embassy and the family court. When the child reaches 20 they can do it themselves at Ampher.

 

 

For what its worth, my daughter's original birth certificate was screwed up when we picked it up from the hospital.  We went to home amphur and they issued an amendment document similar to when her mother changed to my last name.  That sufficed to get Thai and US passport with proper name.    I was nervous about US Consulate giving us problem but after explaining the lady just chuckled and said "we see it all the time."

 

The amendment document took about 20 minutes and 90 baht IIRC.

 

I know this is Thailand and "official" policy is different at any given amphure but that was our experience anyway........

[youreavinalaff]

6 minutes ago, 86Tiger said:

 

 

For what its worth, my daughter's original birth certificate was screwed up when we picked it up from the hospital.  We went to home amphur and they issued an amendment document similar to when her mother changed to my last name.  That sufficed to get Thai and US passport with proper name.    I was nervous about US Consulate giving us problem but after explaining the lady just chuckled and said "we see it all the time."

 

The amendment document took about 20 minutes and 90 baht IIRC.

 

I know this is Thailand and "official" policy is different at any given amphure but that was our experience anyway........

That's good news.

 

Slight difference, I feel. You say that the hospital "screwed up". Likely easier to get their mistake rectified than to change something that was done correctly.