Transfer money international using crypto

[ukrules]

3 hours ago, fdsa said:

unfortunately no, especially when dealing with stablecoins on Ethereum blockchain and small amounts - I've paid 80 USD fee (in ETH) for 1000 USD (USDT) transfer a few months ago.

Of course, if I was sending 1'000'000 USD I'd have paid the same 80 USD fee - that's the huge power of cryptocurrencies - same transfer fees regardless of the amount sent. You just need to use the crypto with low fees - i.e. NOT ETHEREUM lol

Else I've read reports that cryptocurrency exchanges do not convert USDT 1:1 to fiat USD but 1:0.97 so add these 3% to the exchange fee.

 

If you transact on the Baht/Bitcoin market and have the accounts ready at both ends then you can actually end up with more than you stated with

 

Why? Because Bitcoin in Thailand sells for more than it does on the open market when it's priced in Baht - it's always been like this. Same as everything else in Thailand - it's overpriced.

 

It trades at a premium in Baht but the markets are not as liquid (haven't checked recently though), I guess that's what accounts for the price difference or there would be people trading the arbitrage all day long.

 

If I were doing it I would have all accounts ready in advance and do the following.

 

Wait for deposit on Euro exchange to arrive.

 

Purchase Bitcoin

Withdraw it directly to the Thai exchange

Sell it for Baht

Withdraw the Baht to my bank account.

 

If considering using an alternate currency to Bitcoin I would look at the order book to see if there's enough immediate demand to sell such an amount.

 

Always sell for Baht, no need to use USDT if you're using a Thai exchange.

 

There is one caveat : When I did this before it was made very clear that trading any crypto currency for the purposes of foreign exchange is 100% prohibited on Thai exchanges.

 

Having said that I wouldn't use a Thai exchange unless there was zero alternative, I prefer to do everything offshore and away from where I live.

 

 

[mjnaus]

2 hours ago, fdsa said:

and this is the all time low price. The real average gas price is about 50 gwei which is about $10 USD for ERC20 transaction and $2 for Ethereum transaction. Also note that the final transaction fee is unpredictable in Ethereum network, you can't just set "use 0.0001 ETH as the fee".

Compare that to fees in Litecoin or Dash networks and you'll find out why I am very reluctant to use the largest ones - BTC or ETH.

The current gas prices are definitely not “all time low”. Couple of years ago I was paying less then a cent for a transaction. And there isn’t a “real” gas price; gas prices are determined by an auction mechanism and therefor depend on supply/demand of block space on the network.

 

Currently the final transaction cost is indeed unpredictable to a certain extend. Fortunately, the London hard fork is just around the corner (tentatively scheduled for late July) which includes EIP1559. This improvement brings a complete overhaul of the gas price situation: there will be a base fee, set by network consensus, which will guarantee inclusion in the next block (nice side note; the base fee gets burned, bringing deflationary pressure to ETH the asset). This will be a massive UX improvement, stabilize the transaction costs and make gas prices more predictable.

[GrandPapillon]

the 300K transfer using SWIFT, will be blocked and seized by the BoT and he will need to fill some AML form to prove the source of funds etc... this might be why the OP was looking for cryptos

 

that kind of money in this new "compliance" environment is going to be hard to move into "unregulated" markets without the right paperwork.

 

Why not make small transfers of 20K EUR instead to Thailand, that would go under the radar, and you can "manage" your THB rate risk with several transfers

[Susco]

14 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

the 300K transfer using SWIFT, will be blocked and seized by the BoT and he will need to fill some AML form to prove the source of funds etc... this might be why the OP was looking for cryptos

 

Where did you get that info from? A source would be appreciated.

 

I recall there is a limit, but I think it's much higher than that.

 

 

[GrandPapillon]

52 minutes ago, Susco said:

 

Where did you get that info from? A source would be appreciated.

 

I recall there is a limit, but I think it's much higher than that.

 

 

discussed here previously with a lot of shared experienced with others here, I think there was a link posted from the BoT

 

The official limit is 2M THB in FX, but I got blocked several times by the BoT for small transfers of 30K USD, so went to 20K instead and no problem. Others mentioned 50K USD which seems reasonable, it can be a bit hit and miss depending on the staff at the BoT, and the pattern of transfers. If too many 50K transfers over a few months, they could start blocking and seizing the money until justification are provided.

 

It's not unusual, it's part of global AML tracking regulations, actually the BoT is pretty flexible about it, the paperwork to fill then was easy, but that might have changed because I know everywhere else, they are starting to ask a lot of questions.

 

This is particularly true for some of us who work "offshore" and get paid "offshore" for our services.

[GrandPapillon]

doing one full 300K EUR Transfer to Thailand would definitely get the attention of the BoT and would be "blocked" until they have all the paperwork. If it's "legal" money or you can trace it with document from your country, not a problem. But again, this is Thailand so who knows what other requirements they ask or if they think this is income, not your savings.

 

One way to do it was to invest in the SET. Open a Thai brokerage account and wire 100K USD into it, the Thai broker will take care of the paperwork with the BoT. The money is under custody at the institutional brokerage house, so it's all good for the BoT. You might still have to fill some basic paperwork.

 

Doing large transfers these days is like running a big project ????

 

and if the money is "illegal" or "not traceable" then crypto is definitely the way to go. I know I would in that situation, and I don't trust cryptos ????

[Susco]

4 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

discussed here previously with a lot of shared experienced with others here, I think there was a link posted from the BoT

 

The official limit is 2M THB in FX, but I got blocked several times by the BoT for small transfers of 30K USD, so went to 20K instead and no problem. Others mentioned 50K USD which seems reasonable, it can be a bit hit and miss depending on the staff at the BoT, and the pattern of transfers. If too many 50K transfers over a few months, they could start blocking and seizing the money until justification are provided.

 

It's not unusual, it's part of global AML tracking regulations, actually the BoT is pretty flexible about it, the paperwork to fill then was easy, but that might have changed because I know everywhere else, they are starting to ask a lot of questions.

 

This is particularly true for some of us who work "offshore" and get paid "offshore" for our services.

 

I just called Kasikorn bank, and they said there is no limit, though amount above the equivalent of 50K USD, they will have to verify with the customer what the purpose of the transfer. Proof of retirement visa and address in Thailand would suffice. They also say that not all transfers get asked for extra documentation

[GrandPapillon]

1 minute ago, Susco said:

 

I just called Kasikorn bank, and they said there is no limit, though amount above the equivalent of 50K USD, they will have to verify with the customer what the purpose of the transfer. Proof of retirement visa and address in Thailand would suffice. They also say that not all transfers get asked for extra documentation

yeah, it's hit and miss. Got "blocked" for 30K USD. Don't bother asking banks, they don't know themselves. It's really at the "discretion" of the BoT. Still a few 50K transfers in a couple of months and you could expect a "block". It depends what paperwork they ask after that. They are just doing their AML job, so not unusual.

[Susco]

3 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

and if the money is "illegal" or "not traceable" then crypto is definitely the way to go. I know I would in that situation, and I don't trust cryptos

 

Please don't try to turn this thread in a discussion of illegal practices, I have from the start of the thread, and in a related thread as well, clearly explained where the money comes from and why I want to transfer.

 

Nothing illegal involved.

[GrandPapillon]

1 minute ago, Susco said:

 

Please don't try to turn this thread in a discussion of illegal practices, I have from the start of the thread, and in a related thread as well, clearly explained where the money comes from and why I want to transfer.

 

Nothing illegal involved.

maybe not in your case, but someone interested in "untraceable" fund transfer might consider crypto as a "safe" bet to evade regulations. For how long, that's another issue.

[fdsa]

5 hours ago, mjnaus said:

The current gas prices are definitely not “all time low”. Couple of years ago I was paying less then a cent for a transaction.

it actually is the all time low. Most transfers I had on Ethereum network the gas price was about 50 gwei, sometimes a bit less (30-40), sometimes much more (80-100). And I've just googled for "ethereum gas price history" and charts clearly show the median gas price of 50 gwei.

 

 

5 hours ago, ukrules said:

Purchase Bitcoin

Withdraw it directly to the Thai exchange

Sell it for Baht

Withdraw the Baht to my bank account.

. . .

There is one caveat : When I did this before it was made very clear that trading any crypto currency for the purposes of foreign exchange is 100% prohibited on Thai exchanges.

yes, as far as I know this behavior (buying crypto abroad and selling locally) is considered money laundering by Thai laws, that's why I suggested to use localbitcoins/localcryptos for exchanging crypto to THB. But for buying the crypto it will be better (safer & cheaper) to use a large cryptocurrency exchange.

 

4 hours ago, GrandPapillon said:

Why not make small transfers of 20K EUR instead to Thailand, that would go under the radar, and you can "manage" your THB rate risk with several transfers

I agree, it's always better to separate the eggs rather than shipping the whole basket in a single package.

3 hours ago, GrandPapillon said:

Don't bother asking banks, they don't know themselves.

and this is true too, the bank staff here don't know their s..t as you could have read in my previous post. Unless you've managed to call some high level officer in the main branch in Bangkok.

 

[ukrules]

3 hours ago, Susco said:

 

Please don't try to turn this thread in a discussion of illegal practices, I have from the start of the thread, and in a related thread as well, clearly explained where the money comes from and why I want to transfer.

 

Nothing illegal involved.

 

It can become illegal very quickly regardless of the source of the funds being 100% legitimate, it's all about any money laundering these days.

 

If you don't comply with the 100's of regulations which hardly anyone knows anything about then it's a crime and suddenly moving your own legitimate money can land you in prison.

 

Tread carefully.

Edited June 27, 2021 by ukrules

[GrandPapillon]

looks the UK FCA is starting to get a clue about those "dodgy" exchanges ????

 

Binance: Financial watchdog FCA bans crypto-currency exchange

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-57632831

[Heng]

2 hours ago, GrandPapillon said:

looks the UK FCA is starting to get a clue about those "dodgy" exchanges ????

 

Binance: Financial watchdog FCA bans crypto-currency exchange

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-57632831

 

Dramatic headline aside, the effect on UK folks trading crypto on Binance is near zero (as per the article and as per the understanding of anyone who uses Binance).   They have banned 'regulated activity' which does NOT include spot trading crypto (unregulated).   If you trade crypto futures (regulated), then yes, that is banned.    A local Thai ban would mean the same thing (just keep on trading).

 

A more resonant death knell would be a sudden similar announcement from Malta and the Cayman Islands at the same time.   

Edited June 28, 2021 by Heng

[Scott]

Inflammatory post reported and removed.   Keep it civil or face a suspension.  

[mvdf]

On 6/26/2021 at 11:38 AM, Susco said:

how easy and quick would that be for an amount of 300.000 Euro?

 

If you had quick access to crypto in Belgium and quick access to a buyer in Thailand, losses could be minimal.

 

The greater the time that passes between buy and sell, the more likely you will be exposed to the perils of volatility.

 

So say, for example, assuming you had access to something like mine, the more critical question would be how to liquidate them in Thailand and convert them to fiat (THB). Time to transfer the crypto to Thailand is irrelevant as it takes mere seconds. 

 

PS do not contact me for potential crypto transactions.. I am not keen. Holding on to my crypto until 2030... 2040 even. 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2021 by mvdf

[kingoak]

Be aware that every time you sell crypto you create a taxable event and need to pay capital gains taxes.

[Susco]

Oh my god, now I really need urgent help with Bitcoin ????

 

Greetings!

I have to share bad news with you.
Approximately few months ago I have gained access to your devices, which you use for internet browsing.
After that, I have started tracking your internet activities.

Here is the sequence of events:
Some time ago I have purchased access to email accounts from hackers (nowadays, it is quite simple to purchase such thing online).
Obviously, I have easily managed to log in to your email account

One week later, I have already installed Trojan virus to Operating Systems of all the devices that you use to access your email.
In fact, it was not really hard at all (since you were following the links from your inbox emails).
All ingenious is simple. ????

This software provides me with access to all the controllers of your devices (e.g., your microphone, video camera and keyboard).
I have downloaded all your information, data, photos, web browsing history to my servers.
I have access to all your messengers, social networks, emails, chat history and contacts list.
My virus continuously refreshes the signatures (it is driver-based), and hence remains invisible for antivirus software.

Likewise, I guess by now you understand why I have stayed undetected until this letter...

While gathering information about you, I have discovered that you are a big fan of adult websites.
You really love visiting porn websites and watching exciting videos, while enduring an enormous amount of pleasure.
Well, I have managed to record a number of your dirty scenes and montaged a few videos, which show the way you masturbate and reach orgasms.

If you have doubts, I can make a few clicks of my mouse and all your videos will be shared to your friends, colleagues and relatives.
I have also no issue at all to make them available for public access.
I guess, you really don't want that to happen, considering the specificity of the videos you like to watch, (you perfectly know what I mean) it will cause a true catastrophe for you.

Let's settle it this way:
You transfer $1650 USD to me (in bitcoin equivalent according to the exchange rate at the moment of funds transfer), and once the transfer is received, I will delete all this dirty stuff right away.
After that we will forget about each other. I also promise to deactivate and delete all the harmful software from your devices. Trust me, I keep my word.

This is a fair deal and the price is quite low, considering that I have been checking out your profile and traffic for some time by now.
In case, if you don't know how to purchase and transfer the bitcoins - you can use any modern search engine.

Here is my bitcoin wallet: 1KETRZDKH5UNdDiJ5UPm4c7ZqiEVQ5zMPb

You have less than 48 hours from the moment you opened this email (precisely 2 days).

Things you need to avoid from doing:
*Do not reply me (I have created this email inside your inbox and generated the return address).
*Do not try to contact police and other security services. In addition, forget about telling this to you friends. If I discover that (as you can see, it is really not so hard, considering that I control all your systems) - your video will be shared to public right away.
*Don't try to find me - it is absolutely pointless. All the cryptocurrency transactions are anonymous.
*Don't try to reinstall the OS on your devices or throw them away. It is pointless as well, since all the videos have already been saved at remote servers.

Things you don't need to worry about:
*That I won't be able to receive your funds transfer.
- Don't worry, I will see it right away, once you complete the transfer, since I continuously track all your activities (my trojan virus has got a remote-control feature, something like TeamViewer).
*That I will share your videos anyway after you complete the funds transfer.
- Trust me, I have no point to continue creating troubles in your life. If I really wanted that, I would do it long time ago!

Everything will be done in a fair manner!

One more thing... Don't get caught in similar kind of situations anymore in future!
My advice - keep changing all your passwords on a frequent basis

 

 

Edited June 29, 2021 by Susco

[wombat]

On 6/26/2021 at 4:38 PM, Susco said:

How easy would it be to exchange for cash in Thailand?

ask a Thai gold shop if they accept crypto

PS....good luck with that...lol

[fdsa]

1 hour ago, Susco said:

Oh my god, now I really need urgent help with Bitcoin ????

 

Greetings!

I have to share bad news with you.
Approximately few months ago I have gained access to your devices, which you use for internet browsing.
After that, I have started tracking your internet activities.

Here is the sequence of events:
Some time ago I have purchased access to email accounts from hackers (nowadays, it is quite simple to purchase such thing online).
Obviously, I have easily managed to log in to your email account

One week later, I have already installed Trojan virus to Operating Systems of all the devices that you use to access your email.
In fact, it was not really hard at all (since you were following the links from your inbox emails).
All ingenious is simple. ????

This software provides me with access to all the controllers of your devices (e.g., your microphone, video camera and keyboard).
I have downloaded all your information, data, photos, web browsing history to my servers.
I have access to all your messengers, social networks, emails, chat history and contacts list.
My virus continuously refreshes the signatures (it is driver-based), and hence remains invisible for antivirus software.

Likewise, I guess by now you understand why I have stayed undetected until this letter...

While gathering information about you, I have discovered that you are a big fan of adult websites.
You really love visiting porn websites and watching exciting videos, while enduring an enormous amount of pleasure.
Well, I have managed to record a number of your dirty scenes and montaged a few videos, which show the way you masturbate and reach orgasms.

If you have doubts, I can make a few clicks of my mouse and all your videos will be shared to your friends, colleagues and relatives.
I have also no issue at all to make them available for public access.
I guess, you really don't want that to happen, considering the specificity of the videos you like to watch, (you perfectly know what I mean) it will cause a true catastrophe for you.

Let's settle it this way:
You transfer $1650 USD to me (in bitcoin equivalent according to the exchange rate at the moment of funds transfer), and once the transfer is received, I will delete all this dirty stuff right away.
After that we will forget about each other. I also promise to deactivate and delete all the harmful software from your devices. Trust me, I keep my word.

This is a fair deal and the price is quite low, considering that I have been checking out your profile and traffic for some time by now.
In case, if you don't know how to purchase and transfer the bitcoins - you can use any modern search engine.

Here is my bitcoin wallet: 1KETRZDKH5UNdDiJ5UPm4c7ZqiEVQ5zMPb

You have less than 48 hours from the moment you opened this email (precisely 2 days).

Things you need to avoid from doing:
*Do not reply me (I have created this email inside your inbox and generated the return address).
*Do not try to contact police and other security services. In addition, forget about telling this to you friends. If I discover that (as you can see, it is really not so hard, considering that I control all your systems) - your video will be shared to public right away.
*Don't try to find me - it is absolutely pointless. All the cryptocurrency transactions are anonymous.
*Don't try to reinstall the OS on your devices or throw them away. It is pointless as well, since all the videos have already been saved at remote servers.

Things you don't need to worry about:
*That I won't be able to receive your funds transfer.
- Don't worry, I will see it right away, once you complete the transfer, since I continuously track all your activities (my trojan virus has got a remote-control feature, something like TeamViewer).
*That I will share your videos anyway after you complete the funds transfer.
- Trust me, I have no point to continue creating troubles in your life. If I really wanted that, I would do it long time ago!

Everything will be done in a fair manner!

One more thing... Don't get caught in similar kind of situations anymore in future!
My advice - keep changing all your passwords on a frequent basis

 

 

 

I get such emails quite often, and send them 0.00000546 BTC for trolling They can't withdraw such a small amount as it is a current limitation on the minimal transaction size and they can see my total amount of Bitcoins on the wallet I've sent this dust from.

[Tbone999]

Try one of these, obviously, the 1st thing is to get the money somewhere where you can access it online and then find ways to try and get it here. Forget crypto for sure. I've read that N26 is used quite a lot by digital nomads, so that might be an option?

https://www.goodbyebanks.com/fintech/sepa-account/

[Jenkins9039]

Be careful, specifically around capital controls, and 'money laundering' charges, they specifically ask whether you are moving money OUT of Thailand when doing enhanced due diligence after surpassing a specific internal THB value on your account, and all information is reported to SEC and AMOL.  

[ukrules]

On 6/29/2021 at 11:26 AM, fdsa said:

 

I get such emails quite often, and send them 0.00000546 BTC for trolling They can't withdraw such a small amount as it is a current limitation on the minimal transaction size and they can see my total amount of Bitcoins on the wallet I've sent this dust from.

 

Assuming they send a different BTC address in every email (which they probably don't) then all you're doing bu 'dusting' their address is confirming that your email is valid and you have BTC.

[fdsa]

2 hours ago, ukrules said:

 

Assuming they send a different BTC address in every email (which they probably don't) then all you're doing bu 'dusting' their address is confirming that your email is valid and you have BTC.

I doubt they use a different address, more likely it's a direct deposit to their Binance account, and even if they do - I don't care, because every hacker knows that my email is valid and I have BTC, as they got my address from BTC-e and bitcointalk leaks.

Edited June 30, 2021 by fdsa

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, fdsa said:

I doubt they use a different address, more likely it's a direct deposit to their Binance account, and even if they do - I don't care, because every hacker knows that my email is valid and I have BTC, as they got my address from BTC-e and bitcointalk leaks.

 

Yeah a few of mine leaked that way (a different email from each hack), and I've been getting loads of spams / scams for years now, 1000's of them in fact ????

[how241]

On 6/29/2021 at 11:26 AM, fdsa said:

 

I get such emails quite often, and send them 0.00000546 BTC for trolling They can't withdraw such a small amount as it is a current limitation on the minimal transaction size and they can see my total amount of Bitcoins on the wallet I've sent this dust from.

How can you send this small BTC  without paying fees yourself ??  I don't believe that there is any free BTC transfers expect from some sites, like Nexo,  that give you a limited amount of free transfers every month. 

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, how241 said:

How can you send this small BTC  without paying fees yourself ??  I don't believe that there is any free BTC transfers expect from some sites, like Nexo,  that give you a limited amount of free transfers every month. 

 

One way would be to include the transaction in a block which you mine yourself, an unlikely scenario these days but you never know....

 

[fdsa]

2 hours ago, how241 said:

How can you send this small BTC  without paying fees yourself ??  I don't believe that there is any free BTC transfers expect from some sites, like Nexo,  that give you a limited amount of free transfers every month. 

I never said that I don't pay fees. Usually it's about 0.0001 BTC for 0.00000546 but being one of proud whole-coiners I don't really care.

[Neeranam]

On 6/26/2021 at 5:21 PM, jumbo said:

he Thai exchange will have daily withdraw limits

Mine is 2 million a day. 

[how241]

On 7/1/2021 at 8:14 PM, ukrules said:

 

One way would be to include the transaction in a block which you mine yourself, an unlikely scenario these days but you never know....

 

I was reading that Bitcoin mining is now much easier and more profitable, as the Chinese miners are shut down and the difficulty setting on bitcoin has been automatically lowered by the BTC system.  Whoever designed such a system was a GENUIUS !!!