Thai Tourism Minister visits Pattaya to discuss “Move On” reopening plan, plan to be presented to CCSA this Friday

[jacko45k]

10 minutes ago, JohnHans said:

Also I don't know any Thai people in the Pattaya area who have been vaccinated and people around me say they cant get it and if they can its only Sinovac which they don't want of course

I assure you a large numbers are attending the indoor stadium to get vaccinated.... so surprising you do not know any.... my Mrs, was unchained from the sink to go get hers and same for #2 in a few days. First one, yes is Sino.... but if they reject it that is up to them. The second is AZ, and to be honest my Mrs seems to fear this more. Thai gossip has the Sino down as not much use, but AZ as having side effects!

Edited September 13, 2021 by jacko45k

[JohnHans]

My sister would like to visit me from the UK but won't if she has to quarantine and pay outrageous amounts to a monopoly hotel and be "banged up abroad" for two weeks. She has been double vaccinated but her travel agent does not have any info to give her, even though they are offering package deals with no mention of quarantine!!!!

[pepi2005]

1 hour ago, Cake Monster said:

And all the time you could be a potential spreader because you have selfishly decided not to get Vaxxed

 

the most dangerous people (if we seriously decide to be scared of a virus that has about 99.9% survival rate for all infected < 75y) are the vaccinated - because they feel confident about being 'safe' and do stupid things not even considerate unvaccinated, very healthy people would ever do.

 

It might be new to you, but latest studies even confirmed by the CDC have showed that vaccinated can carry a MULTIPLE of the viral load compared to unvaccinated people. If anyone is risky, it's the 'vaccinated'.

[CygnusX1]

15 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Your numbers are meaningless without context and that is a throwaway post.

Context is the % of people who’ve died from the virus. What do you mean by “‘throwaway post”? I’m trying to show how a number can look very different depending on how it’s presented.

Edited September 13, 2021 by CygnusX1

[2ndhomepattaya]

6 minutes ago, pepi2005 said:

Reality, however, doesn't agree with your hope.

 

A look at Israel, Island, the UK, and now starting in the US (look at what's going on in West Virginia: 26% increase of positive cases with 'fully' vaccinated) illustrates that pretty much all the vaccine does is to help creating new mutations (exactly like the Influenza vaccines did) and make the vaccinated more vulnerable for them.

I would rather catch Covid fully vaccinated then un-vacced, thank you

[JohnHans]

3 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I assure you a large number are attending the indoor stadium to get vaccinated.... so surprising you do not know any.... my Mrs, was unchained from the sink to go get hers and same for #2 in a few days. First one, yes is Sino.... but if they reject it that is up to them. The second is AZ, and to be honest my Mrs seems to fear this more. Thai gossip has the Sino down as not much use, but AZ as having side effects!

Yes I know Thais who have been offered Sinovac and walked away, I don't blame them, Not until the Government offers the good stuff Thais will be at risk.

[mokwit]

3 hours ago, at15 said:

You have this amazing thing called an immune system. It will protect you from cold and flu viruses. Turn off the news please.

....and how well a vaccine protects you depends in part on how strong your immune response is. I really think people should be tested for the level of immune response as you could be "fully vaccinated" but have insufficient immunity due to a poor immune response. The same restrictions being applied/suggested for the unvaccinated should also be applied to the vaccinated with poor immune response if this is about controlling the pandemic.

[jacko45k]

3 minutes ago, CygnusX1 said:

Context is the % of people who’ve died from the virus. What do you mean by “‘throwaway post”?

Do you actually and seriously mean the % of the global population? For a percentage to mean anything you have to clarify 'percentage of what'. Deaths have been between 1% and 10% of total infections for various countries. 

Edited September 13, 2021 by jacko45k

[pepi2005]

1 minute ago, 2ndhomepattaya said:

I would rather catch Covid fully vaccinated then un-vacced, thank you

Yeah, [but as long as Covid hysteria continues to dominate our lives and our rational thinking], you should not be allowed to leave your house, let alone enter a bar. ???? It's 'for the good of society', ya know? ????

[CygnusX1]

1 minute ago, jacko45k said:

Do you actually and seriously mean the % of the global population?

I would have thought that was obvious, it’s not a difficult calculation.

[pepi2005]

3 minutes ago, JohnHans said:

Yes I know Thais who have been offered Sinovac and walked away, I don't blame them, Not until the Government offers the good stuff Thais will be at risk.

to be specific: Thais older than 75 years.

But of course, you are free to continue to be scared if you want.

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, CygnusX1 said:

I would have thought that was obvious, it’s not a difficult calculation.

No it is not obvious unless you state it. Why have you chosen this metric if only to minimize the seriousness of over 4 million deaths? 

Global deaths/1million population are 595.8.... , and yes that equates to 0.059%. but I would like to equate it to say some food manufacturer's target for the acceptable level of rat droppings in my coco-pops.... 0.1% sounds good to them, 0,000% sounds better to me. 

[eastlight]

27 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I assure you a large numbers are attending the indoor stadium to get vaccinated.... so surprising you do not know any.... my Mrs, was unchained from the sink to go get hers and same for #2 in a few days. First one, yes is Sino.... but if they reject it that is up to them. The second is AZ, and to be honest my Mrs seems to fear this more. Thai gossip has the Sino down as not much use, but AZ as having side effects!

I like that - unchained from the sink!

[Midwit]

4 hours ago, hotchilli said:

I was watching a popular American youtuber the other day in the Jupitor area of Florida.

He's just got over a bout of Covid which knocked him for six, he also gave it to his wife and two daughters.

Previous to getting infected he would post videos of himself going around, mixing with all sorts of people, no mask, no social distancing nothing, and eventually got nailed.

After being fully quarantined at home he eventually got better.

Now he's out and about again, guess what.... same as before, no mask, no distancing never learned a damned thing.

His latest video was at a national drag race circuit, thousands of people there.. none protecting themselves, ridiculous.

 

 

So what should he learn?  That viruses spread and with a healthy immune system you will recover?  She he learn that he needs to be afraid, bunker down at home and see people as disease ridden beasts to be feared?  Maybe he should think that a paper mask will protect him. If medieval Europe would’ve had paper masks the Black Death would’ve never happened. 

[jacko45k]

3 minutes ago, Midwit said:

If medieval Europe would’ve had paper masks the Black Death would’ve never happened. 

I thought that came from flea bites so I doubt it!

[CygnusX1]

17 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

No it is not obvious unless you state it. Why have you chosen this metric if only to minimize the seriousness of over 4 million deaths? 

Global deaths/1million population are 595.8.... , and yes that equates to 0.059%. but I would like to equate it to say some food manufacturer's target for the acceptable level of rat droppings in my coco-pops.... 0.1% sounds good to them, 0,000% sounds better to me. 

 

You’ve chosen an absolute number to maximise the seriousness of the virus, I’ve pointed out that the relative number shows that the risk is low. A bit like people who think that air travel’s suddenly become extremely dangerous after a single crash, without looking at the huge number of planes that have landed safely. I think we just have a fundamentally different outlook on life. It’s an unfortunate fact of the human condition that life is short for even the most health and safety conscious among us. There’s a 100% chance that I’ll soon succumb to one of the many diseases of old age, but I would far prefer to have lived an interesting life, rather than being obsessed with minimising risk to try to eke out as many years as possible.

 

If you want the level of rat droppings to be zero, you might be out of luck, I’ve read that a surprisingly high level of contamination’s permitted in some common foods.

[cjinchiangrai]

5 minutes ago, Midwit said:

So what should he learn?  That viruses spread and with a healthy immune system you will recover?  She he learn that he needs to be afraid, bunker down at home and see people as disease ridden beasts to be feared?  Maybe he should think that a paper mask will protect him. If medieval Europe would’ve had paper masks the Black Death would’ve never happened. 

Wrong, the Bubonic Plague vector was fleas. Masks would not have affected it at all.

[CygnusX1]

2 minutes ago, cjinchiangrai said:

Wrong, the Bubonic Plague vector was fleas.

Saw a TV doco which advanced the theory that the main transmission route was human to human via lice, claimed that flea infested rats should be absolved.

[jacko45k]

6 minutes ago, CygnusX1 said:

You’ve chosen an absolute number to maximise the seriousness of the virus, I’ve pointed out that the relative number shows that the risk is low.

I  should not have to explain this to you.... but you are effectively comparing a moving number to one that is fixed (sort of). The % of deaths relative to global population is a number that is still increasing, and you have no idea where it is going. (Until there are no more Covid deaths). You are also bringing birth rate into the calculation which has no relevance. I  feel it is only useful when comparing between countries.

[Dart12]

1 hour ago, pepi2005 said:

Yeah, [but as long as Covid hysteria continues to dominate our lives and our rational thinking], you should not be allowed to leave your house, let alone enter a bar. ???? It's 'for the good of society', ya know? ????

The whole set up is to now have you always have to ask permission to have your basic freedoms, which can be revoked instantly...if we, as citizens, allow them to gain that control.

Edited September 13, 2021 by Dart12

[CygnusX1]

7 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I  should not have to explain this to you.... but you are effectively comparing a moving number to one that is fixed (sort of). The % of deaths relative to global population is a number that is still increasing, and you have no idea where it is going. (Until there are no more Covid deaths). You are also bringing birth rate into the calculation which has no relevance.

True, I didn’t say that I wasn’t. I never said anything about birth rate, although now you mention it, 140 million new babies each year shows that the virus is certainly no threat to humanity!

[samtam]

1 hour ago, mokwit said:

....and how well a vaccine protects you depends in part on how strong your immune response is. I really think people should be tested for the level of immune response as you could be "fully vaccinated" but have insufficient immunity due to a poor immune response. The same restrictions being applied/suggested for the unvaccinated should also be applied to the vaccinated with poor immune response if this is about controlling the pandemic.

How do you test the "level of immune response"? Serology tests? The thought of another round of testing is mind boggling.

Edited September 13, 2021 by samtam

[mokwit]

5 minutes ago, samtam said:

How do you test the "level of immune response"? Serology tests? The thought of another round of testing is mind boggling.

Level of antibodies would be a simple way and I think that is what is used.

[Phoenix Rising]

4 hours ago, at15 said:

that is your opinion. for me i believe the best thing i can do is not get vaccinated and live my life as healthy as possible.

So not any vaccine for any disease??

 

BTW, if you get Covid and they reject you access into the ICU I, for one, will give you a big fat "som nam naa".

Edited September 13, 2021 by Phoenix Rising

[ChrisKC]

It isn't a plan - it is just an idea!

[mokwit]

7 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

So not any vaccine for any disease??

 

BTW, if you get Covid and they reject you access into the ICU I, for one, will give you a big fat "som nam naa".

Shouldn't that also apply to people who are obese through lifestyle choices? We hear a lot about the 'Covid infected because they weren't vaccinated' taking up hospital beds, but not about other 'through choice' illness.

Edited September 13, 2021 by mokwit

[Phoenix Rising]

9 minutes ago, mokwit said:

Shouldn't that also apply to people who are obese through lifestyle choices? We hear a lot about the 'Covid infected because they weren't vaccinated' taking up hospital beds, but not about other 'through choice' illness.

If there was a vaccine against obesity I'd agree.

[VBF]

3 hours ago, Cake Monster said:

And all the time you could be a potential spreader because you have selfishly decided not to get Vaxxed

 

Well you can be vaxxed and still spread it although apparently not as severely.

However, if the people around our unvaxxed friend ARE vaxxed, let him get on with it.

 

I'm sure some of the people here in UK with whom I've been in contact since May (when I got vax #2) aren't vaxxed - I am so why worry?

THAT....IMO....is where life returns to normal as it increasingly is in UK

[VBF]

2 hours ago, pepi2005 said:

Reality, however, doesn't agree with your hope.

 

A look at Israel, Island, the UK, and now starting in the US (look at what's going on in West Virginia: 26% increase of positive cases with 'fully' vaccinated) illustrates that pretty much all the vaccine does is to help creating new mutations (exactly like the Influenza vaccines did) and make the vaccinated more vulnerable for them.

Yes but AGAIN I'll point out that, in UK at least, these so-called "positive cases" are mainly asymptomatic, are not actually sick and therefore are certainly not in hospital or dying.

As I've said for the last year, these "cases" should be referred to as "Covid-positive people" - the word "cases" should be reserved for the unfortunates who are truly sick.

Edited September 13, 2021 by VBF

[Tonypandy]

5 hours ago, hotchilli said:

I was watching a popular American youtuber the other day in the Jupitor area of Florida.

He's just got over a bout of Covid which knocked him for six, he also gave it to his wife and two daughters.

Previous to getting infected he would post videos of himself going around, mixing with all sorts of people, no mask, no social distancing nothing, and eventually got nailed.

After being fully quarantined at home he eventually got better.

Now he's out and about again, guess what.... same as before, no mask, no distancing never learned a damned thing.

His latest video was at a national drag race circuit, thousands of people there.. none protecting themselves, ridiculous.

 

 

Get used to it, or hibernate