Popular Post Neeranam Posted October 1, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 1, 2021 I am really interested in DeFi and wondering if the banks are actually worrying about it, or not. There has been a huge surge of Chinese into Decentralized exchanges like Uniswap since their government banned crypto(for the 10th+ time). personally, I think many Commercial Banks will disappear/go out of business. Any thoughts? 3 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post MrJ2U Posted October 1, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 1, 2021 Decentralized finance: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decentralized_finance Way to complicated for Thailand. To many important people running the traditional banks and raking in the dough. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post GrandPapillon Posted October 1, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 1, 2021 here we go again ???? what are you going to promote this time? ???? 6 3 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HenryfromMalaysia Posted October 1, 2021 Share Posted October 1, 2021 Maybe he is promoting UniSwap or the Chinese Government? ???? Speaking of Chinese, had this spam third time on the Asian crypto chat today 上周中国对所有现有加密货币的禁令是真实且正式的。中国打算在 2021 年 10 月 1 日国庆日推出自己的加密货币 ChinaCoinCC Google translate is China's ban on all existing cryptocurrencies last week was real and official. China intends to launch its own cryptocurrency ChinaCoinCC on National Day, October 1, 2021 Got to love China and the Chinese. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted October 2, 2021 Author Share Posted October 2, 2021 ^^ that was the reason China banned crypto. All the other companies they blocked in the past became very successful, Facebook, Google etc. Some banks are welcoming DeFi, what else can they do, interesting space. https://cointelegraph.com/news/societe-generale-proposes-historic-20m-dai-loan-in-exchange-for-bond-tokens 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPapillon Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 nothing like a good headline for good PR for old banks :) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HenryfromMalaysia Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 What are all your thoughts on Ethereum 2.0 staking? Once stake cannot unstake until Ethereum is fully functional in 2022 till 2024 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwill Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) Yeah, I think they will increase the amount foreigners have to deposit in Thai banks. I missed out on this Defi bonus... https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/defi-system-compound-mistakenly-gives-2490m-crypto-to-users/ar-AAP2Ths#:~:text=A popular decentralized finance system called Compound has,allow users to transact with each other directly. Edited October 3, 2021 by rwill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QPRFC Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 On 10/1/2021 at 11:36 PM, GrandPapillon said: here we go again ???? what are you going to promote this time? ???? ICP Crypto is the future coin....believe me. However, this is not financial advice and you should seek professional advice as always ???? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lkn Posted October 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 3, 2021 On 10/1/2021 at 5:37 PM, Neeranam said: I am really interested in DeFi and wondering if the banks are actually worrying about it, or not. They might be worried about how it will impact the economy when the music stops, as many people have invested more than they can afford to lose in crypto, but nothing of value has been generated, their money has just made someone else richer, or contributed to covering the cost of the enormous amount of energy wasted by the miners. It’s effectively a giant spreadsheet with numbers assigned to people, that people think can be converted to real money, and through hype, complex interactions, and downright manipulation, the numbers go up, but eventually people will learn that the fiat money is not there. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 22 hours ago, HenryfromMalaysia said: What are all your thoughts on Ethereum 2.0 staking? Once stake cannot unstake until Ethereum is fully functional in 2022 till 2024 I prefer to stake DOT, up to 18% pa. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, lkn said: They might be worried about how it will impact the economy when the music stops, as many people have invested more than they can afford to lose in crypto, but nothing of value has been generated, their money has just made someone else richer, or contributed to covering the cost of the enormous amount of energy wasted by the miners. What makes you think the music will stop? I think that crypto is like the internet was in 1995, did it stop? Did you know that El Salvador's currency is now Bitcoin and they use volcanoes to mine it? They are also talking about using nuclear power. I don't think we can post Youtube but I suggest you search "Michael Saylor & Max Keiser DESTROY Bitcoin Energy Consumption Criticism" Anyways, DeFi doesn't use large amounts of energy like Bitcoin. Edited October 3, 2021 by Neeranam 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lkn Posted October 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 3, 2021 45 minutes ago, Neeranam said: What makes you think the music will stop? Because it is a negative sum game. I am familiar with both MicroStrategy, El Salvador (and the dumpster fire from their bitcoin law), and most other things happening in this space. I have been following it since the beginning. Initially based on interest in the concepts, but these days all the fraud is far more interesting, all the problems that happen in an unregulated space, all the mistakes made costing double digit millions in accidentally entered gas fees, or bugs in smart contracts paying out millions, hacks, all the libertarians that haven’t gotten a clue about how the real monetary system works, Tether printing $70 billion worth of stable coins, and repeatedly caught lying about how this is backed, refusing to do any audits, yet the peg continues to hold, Etherium keep saying they will retire proof of work in 18 months, the lightning network which require solving the Canadian traveller problem to work, etc. The only actual use of this “technology” seems to be avoiding regulation on money transfers (in a highly inefficient way) and various forms of frauds (ponzi/pyramid schemes, pump & dumps, etc.). And the energy waste is very real! 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SportRider Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 If you want something leading edge and a game changer, check out Pendle (available on crypto.com app).. this protocol tokenises future yield! Pendle is ranked something like 700th in terms of market cap, but could be huge once it goes main stream (it's not on any of the major exchanges yet)... It's about $0.44 but would go to $X00.00 if that happens. A whale-maker... Disclaimers - I hold Pendle. This is not financial advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThailandRyan Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Interesting read from the Motley Fool Here's a Top Cryptocurrency Stock to Buy Now (msn.com) Whenever there's a high risk, there's almost always a chance for a high reward. In a time when regulators around the world are cracking down on the burgeoning cryptocurrency space, there's one company that's not only undeterred by setbacks but is thriving. Of course, I'm talking about Silvergate Capital (NYSE: SI), whose stock has returned 603.8% in the past year. A very unique bank Silvergate is a waypoint into the mysterious cryptocurrency realm. The company has four major areas of operations: The Silvergate Exchange Network (SEN) that facilitates USD transfer between cryptocurrency exchanges and institutional investors Conversion of fiat money-backed crypto (stablecoins) to USD Access to low-interest USD asset loans, with borrowers depositing their Bitcoin as collateral Safe storage of cryptocurrencies The company currently provides such services to 93 cryptocurrency exchanges and 771 institutional investors such as hedge funds. Notable clients include Binance.us, Coinbase, Fidelity Digital Assets, PayPal, and CME Group. It also has 360 customers engaged in activities such as crypto mining or building decentralized finance services. During the second quarter of 2021, Silvergate facilitated a whopping $239.6 billion worth of transfers on its network, recognizing $11.3 million in revenue. Both represent significant increases over the $22.4 billion in SEN transactions and $2.4 million in revenue it brought in Q2 2020. Like any other bank, the company lends out money while only using a portion of its deposit as collateral in a process called fractional reserve banking. Total leverage increased more than tenfold in the past year to $258.5 million worth of loans in Q2. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billd766 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 5 hours ago, QPRFC said: ICP Crypto is the future coin....believe me. However, this is not financial advice and you should seek professional advice as always ???? Why should we believe you? The majority of people in Thailand deal in cash, so how would you spend any crypto currency in the majority of Thailand? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 1 hour ago, lkn said: Because it is a negative sum game. I am familiar with both MicroStrategy, El Salvador (and the dumpster fire from their bitcoin law), and most other things happening in this space. I have been following it since the beginning. Initially based on interest in the concepts, but these days all the fraud is far more interesting, all the problems that happen in an unregulated space, all the mistakes made costing double digit millions in accidentally entered gas fees, or bugs in smart contracts paying out millions, hacks, all the libertarians that haven’t gotten a clue about how the real monetary system works, Tether printing $70 billion worth of stable coins, and repeatedly caught lying about how this is backed, refusing to do any audits, yet the peg continues to hold, Etherium keep saying they will retire proof of work in 18 months, the lightning network which require solving the Canadian traveller problem to work, etc. The only actual use of this “technology” seems to be avoiding regulation on money transfers (in a highly inefficient way) and various forms of frauds (ponzi/pyramid schemes, pump & dumps, etc.). And the energy waste is very real! Interesting, I guess the following investors are all wrong then? Justa few off the top of my head. Michael Saylor Max keiser Jim Cramer Kevin O Leary Robert Kiyosaki Raol Pal Mike Novagratz Mark Cuban Elon Musk Cathy Wood Chamat Palihapatiya Tyler Winklevoss Marc Andreesen Paul Tudor Jones Brian Brooks Gary Gensler(taught about blockchain tech) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 3 minutes ago, billd766 said: Why should we believe you? The majority of people in Thailand deal in cash, so how would you spend any crypto currency in the majority of Thailand? Everyone in my family prefer to get their allowance from me digitally. Even my mother in law has bought Bitcoin, and my old mum in the UK. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lkn Posted October 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Neeranam said: Interesting, I guess the following investors are all wrong then? This is appeal to authority, but none of these people are really authorities about this, and if you dig into these people, for some you will find skeletons in the closet, some already got scammed in the crypto space and are now calling for regulation, some are just riding the hype, etc. Twenty years ago, when people were skeptical about Madoff, you could also argue with A-list celebrities who had fallen for his con, that doesn’t change the fundamentals. What benefit is DeFi / crypto providing? Edited October 3, 2021 by lkn 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarrySR Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) Disruptive tech will make traditional banks go extinct, just like many other business... book stores, record stores, retail shopping, etc. Invest in Financial Tech stocks like: SQ SOFI PYPL ARKF COIN V Edited October 3, 2021 by LarrySR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassosa Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 21 minutes ago, lkn said: This is appeal to authority, but none of these people are really authorities about this, and if you dig into these people, for some you will find skeletons in the closet, some already got scammed in the crypto space and are now calling for regulation, some are just riding the hype, etc. Twenty years ago, when people were skeptical about Madoff, you could also argue with A-list celebrities who had fallen for his con, that doesn’t change the fundamentals. What benefit is DeFi / crypto providing? https://www.wsj.com/articles/citadel-securities-faces-new-pressure-over-gamestop-frenzy-11632863151 Read this and you'll know why finance without a middleman is a great idea, in theory anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ThailandRyan Posted October 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 3, 2021 Another interesting article which lays out the benefit of using Crypto to solve an issue of where and how to spend your crypto. https://www.pymnts.com/news/retail/2021/bitpay-verifone-crypto-store-payments/ To broaden cryptocurrency’s appeal — beyond the speculative frenzy — broaden its acceptance. The consumer clamor to use cryptos in everyday retail is certainly there. As PYMNTS’ own research with BitPay has shown, as many as 18% of the U.S. population — 46 million consumers — would be likely to make a purchase. Read more: How Consumers Want to Use Crypto to Shop and Pay in 2021 and After And they want to use cryptos to buy everyday items — not just Tesla cars, but groceries and subscriptions, clothes and other smaller transactions. But you cannot spend what you have if there’s nowhere to spend it. At a high level, bringing crypto payments more fully to the brick-and-mortar realm would broaden cryptocurrency’s visibility, beyond the exchanges and the headlines trumpeting bitcoin bans (in China) and Elon Musk’s tweets. A newly announced pact by BitPay, which provides crypto related services, and Verifone, which offers payments technology, would allow merchants to sidestep the price volatility and downside risk that is a hallmark of those digital holdings. BitPay CEO Stephen Pair, Verifone CEO Mike Pulli and Verifone Head of Alternative Payment Models (APMs) Jeremy Belostock told Karen Webster that the partnership will help consumers embrace cryptos more fully, while letting merchants broaden their customer base by serving those crypto-wielding individuals eager to transact. In terms of the mechanics, the companies said in their Tuesday (Sept. 28) announcement, merchants can accept the crypto payments directly from Verifone without needing to set up an account with BitPay. The payments are done with native crypto wallets. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkn Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 4 minutes ago, Bassosa said: Read this and you'll know why finance without a middleman is a great idea, in theory anyway. I am glad you added the “in theory”. A lot of crypto proponents will point out some problem/nuisance with regular finance, and then say “see, that is why we need crypto” without actually explaining how crypto solves the problem. And as for finance without a middleman, that means without regulation and laws? So back to wildcat banking (like Tether), bucket shops (like Binance), no consumer protection/insurance (like when Mark Cuban got “rug pulled” and lost all that he had put into TITAN after hyping it via his twitter feed) etc.? The reason we have so much regulation around finance is because if there is a way to scam other people, someone will do it, and there are unfortunately no lack of potential victims. Also, unregulated markets tend to favor the incumbents. Imagine owner’s of the New York Stock Exchange were allowed to use customer trading data for their own trades, front run their customers, do wash trades, etc.? Or that companies could trade their own stock without the current SEC oversight controls, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThailandRyan Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 7 minutes ago, lkn said: I am glad you added the “in theory”. A lot of crypto proponents will point out some problem/nuisance with regular finance, and then say “see, that is why we need crypto” without actually explaining how crypto solves the problem. And as for finance without a middleman, that means without regulation and laws? So back to wildcat banking (like Tether), bucket shops (like Binance), no consumer protection/insurance (like when Mark Cuban got “rug pulled” and lost all that he had put into TITAN after hyping it via his twitter feed) etc.? The reason we have so much regulation around finance is because if there is a way to scam other people, someone will do it, and there are unfortunately no lack of potential victims. Also, unregulated markets tend to favor the incumbents. Imagine owner’s of the New York Stock Exchange were allowed to use customer trading data for their own trades, front run their customers, do wash trades, etc.? Or that companies could trade their own stock without the current SEC oversight controls, etc. You might want to peruse the two articles I posted above, so you have a better idea of the needs and current ways crypto is being utilized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lkn Posted October 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 3, 2021 1 minute ago, ThailandRyan said: You might want to peruse the two articles I posted above, so you have a better idea of the needs and current ways crypto is being utilized. Those are just hypotheticals. Asking 8,000 people if they would use crypto if it was widely accepted, and 18% says yes. But do these people know about the price volatility? The variable fees? The 7 transactions pr. second limitation of bitcoin? The frequent chain splits that necessitates waiting at least an hour before a transaction is considered reasonably secure (i.e. permanent)? The inability to do chargebacks or even get back your money, if you send them to the wrong address? That if you lose your key, you lose your money, no customer service, no recourse? That the wallet on your phone has access to all your money, and if it gets hacked, or you install a wrong wallet, it can transfer all your money to another address, and again, no way to get these funds back, etc. Crypto has so many problems, it is an extremely inefficient solution to a problem that majority of people just don’t have, and it introduces so many new problems, that traditional payment systems and banking doesn’t have. But please give me the short pitch: Why should I switch from paying with my iPhone (Apple Pay) and instead use crypto? 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassosa Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Defi is still in its infancy. Don't judge it too harshly. Also, regulations and oversight is coming to defi as well. Nothing wrong with that and the notion that some regulation is needed is broadly supported in the crypto community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassosa Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 1 hour ago, lkn said: This is appeal to authority, but none of these people are really authorities about this, and if you dig into these people, for some you will find skeletons in the closet, some already got scammed in the crypto space and are now calling for regulation, some are just riding the hype, etc. Twenty years ago, when people were skeptical about Madoff, you could also argue with A-list celebrities who had fallen for his con, that doesn’t change the fundamentals. What benefit is DeFi / crypto providing? Gensler is chairman of the SEC. His lectures at MIT are on Youtube. You should look into it. He is definitely an authority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lkn Posted October 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 3, 2021 7 minutes ago, Bassosa said: Gensler is chairman of the SEC. His lectures at MIT are on Youtube. You should look into it. He is definitely an authority. If you google his name you will find quotes from him saying “we just don’t have enough investor protection in crypto finance” and “Frankly, at this time, it’s more like the Wild West or the old world of ‘buyer beware’ that existed before the securities laws were enacted.”. So I am not really sure how this guy’s statements or lectures are going to convince me that I should ditch traditional finance and jump on the crypto bandwagon. Basically he is just echoing what I have already argued above. What I was asking for, was an actual use case that would appeal to the common consumer, and a use-case that is actually possible today, not in 18 months when Etherium have implemented proof of stake (as they have been promising us for four years), or the Lightning network developers have solved the Canadian traveller problem (a computer science problem which solution would revolutionize the field), or secured the protocol against the obvious denial of service attacks (that currently have the few proof of concept networks be centralized because they cannot handle malicious actors, making the entire thing pointless). 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassosa Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) I can give you my user case? I bought some Bitcoin using my savings and that Bitcoin is now yielding approx 7-8% interest. Also, no one is trying to convince you to drop traditional finance. Edited October 3, 2021 by Bassosa 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncc1701d Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 11 minutes ago, lkn said: If you google his name you will find quotes from him saying “we just don’t have enough investor protection in crypto finance” and “Frankly, at this time, it’s more like the Wild West or the old world of ‘buyer beware’ that existed before the securities laws were enacted.”. So I am not really sure how this guy’s statements or lectures are going to convince me that I should ditch traditional finance and jump on the crypto bandwagon. Basically he is just echoing what I have already argued above. What I was asking for, was an actual use case that would appeal to the common consumer, and a use-case that is actually possible today, not in 18 months when Etherium have implemented proof of stake (as they have been promising us for four years), or the Lightning network developers have solved the Canadian traveller problem (a computer science problem which solution would revolutionize the field), or secured the protocol against the obvious denial of service attacks (that currently have the few proof of concept networks be centralized because they cannot handle malicious actors, making the entire thing pointless). I don’t have many coins and mostly encouraged by friends that are “all in”. I’m in a group chat with them and they talk like the above proponents. I am skeptical like you. They start talking about defi and god only knows what else and I’m lost. My opinion is the technology will first benefit bigger organizations for storage and transfer of digital tech and many more applications that non tech or in the industry people like myself just wouldn’t have a clue about. The end consumer use will be a long way off. But I’m not putting any more cash in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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