Money in bank vanished

[StevieAus]

On 10/12/2021 at 8:38 PM, Jingthing said:

Sounds very concerning. Good luck in sorting it out. I have accounts in three banks here. I would recommend that people sign up for activity notification SMSs from their accounts with larger balances. That costs 200 baht per year at Siam Commercial Bank for example. 

As I said in my earlier post I have also been affected with about forty withdrawals of same amount from BB account 

I have notification system from bank but didn’t happen when the withdrawals occurred

[NoshowJones]

On 10/12/2021 at 9:32 PM, Moonlover said:

Well it quite obvious that no one can draw 34.15 THB from an ATM! And a repetitive action like that clearly points to computing error within the banks own or an associated system.

 

As long as the bank has sorted out the problem and your card's function has been restored, I wouldn't be too concerned.

 

One thing's for sure. The bank will never explain what the problem was.

Another reason to keep your savings in a bank in your own country, and only keep enough for living expenses, it is easy enough and very cheap to transfer your money here as you require it.

Also, another reason to use an agent instead of keeping your money in a Thai bank.

[DrPhibes]

Sounds like some kind of autodraw/software gone wrong or the payouts were not in cash but transfers to another account.  Given the strange amount I'd say the former.

[KannikaP]

10 hours ago, Alex2554 said:

"Don't use a debit card

Want to avoid identity theft? Never, ever use a debit card. I don't own one. I never have and I never will. I don't recommend them to anyone — not my family, not my friends, not you.

As I said at the Google talk, a debit card is certainly and truly the worst financial tool ever given to the American consumer. Why? It's simple: Every time you use one, you put your money and your bank account at risk.

Instead, use a credit card. I use one for practically all of my purchases, even when I'm traveling abroad. With credit cards, federal law limits my liability if there's an unauthorized use of my card."

Frank Abagnale is a former professional impostor and the author of the best-selling memoir, "Catch Me If You Can." He is one of the world's most respected authorities on the subjects of fraud, forgery and cyber security.

That's OK if you are in USA. But if you are here, you get charged a substantial fee for using a foreign credit card in an ATM, and it is difficult to get a Credit Card with a Thai Bank without depositing an equivalent amount up to the card's limit, which makes it the same as a Debit Card. Secret is to keep only a small amount in the account to which your Debit/ATM card is connected. Keep your pot in another account and transfer only when you need to make a withdrawal.

[NoshowJones]

On 10/13/2021 at 3:25 AM, Chad3000 said:

This is essentially what I do as well.

 

Visa

Savings

Spending

 

I don't even keep cards on the large accounts so that if there's any issue it's clearly bank employee theft. Use sms as well.

 

I'm no longer happy with SCB for a few reasons. K bank was a disaster for me.

Funny that, I also done away with SCB and K bank, for unsatisfactory service.

[NoshowJones]

On 10/13/2021 at 9:36 AM, Mac Mickmanus said:

You wasnt really forced into having an Elite Visa , there were other options available , like tourist visas, retirement visas and a few other options . 

Agents?

[userabcd]

 

Double posted?

Edited October 15, 2021 by userabcd

[NoshowJones]

18 hours ago, CMBob said:

I also have a SCB account and get the SMS notifications of seemingly any activity (withdrawals, login events, etc.) but I'm not being charged for any of that.  I do pay annually 200 baht for use of the ATM card.

I agree with your notion to somewhat have a Plan B and have money in a couple of banks.  Plus, if one happens to have more than 1 million baht in accounts here, wise to have that spread around to supposedly maintain government deposit protection (although the likelihood of any of the major Thai banks failing or  being allowed to fail is likely near zero).

There's more than just the banks to worry about with your money in this Banana Republic of Thailand. Think about it.

[userabcd]

27 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

That's OK if you are in USA. But if you are here, you get charged a substantial fee for using a foreign credit card in an ATM, and it is difficult to get a Credit Card with a Thai Bank without depositing an equivalent amount up to the card's limit, which makes it the same as a Debit Card. Secret is to keep only a small amount in the account to which your Debit/ATM card is connected. Keep your pot in another account and transfer only when you need to make a withdrawal.

Having fixed deposit money in a seperate bank account in ones name earning interest does not make the credit card the same as a debit card.

 

Basically it would be ludicrous for a bank to issue credit cards without some kind of security to temporary residents on non immigrant visas or on an extension of stay without some form of guarantee that the credit card debt will be covered and paid.

Edited October 15, 2021 by userabcd

[NoshowJones]

14 hours ago, bbabythai said:

as if you cant name the bank.....Is this a troll post

I think he is worried about unnecessary about the Thai defamation law.

[KannikaP]

8 minutes ago, userabcd said:

Having fixed deposit money in a seperate bank account in ones name earning interest does not make the credit card the same as a debit card.

You do not get any card with a fixed deposit account as that money should stay there until the account matures.

[NoshowJones]

14 hours ago, Kelsall said:

Of course he can't name it.

Why not? Come on, tell us.

[Berkshire]

15 hours ago, musicscene said:

My partner suffered like you. 55 withdrawals in less than 24 hours and Bangkok bank told her the same when she cancelled her card. She never uses ATM but did use it online to buy an item in the game Hayday 

 

2 hours ago, tonray said:

Girlfriend's SCB account hit this month with 10K in charges from 'SteamGames" an online game company. She does not have any account or never went there. Apparently this is a global thing happening now...many accounts being hit with these game charges.

This appears to be the answer to the OP's issues. 

[bbabythai]

24 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

I think he is worried about unnecessary about the Thai defamation law.

come on. this is an anonymous forum... ha ha.

[bbabythai]

14 hours ago, Kelsall said:

Of course he can't name it.

complete BS. Why not

 

Do you think the bank is going to persue a costly court case against an anonymous guy due to 1 post on a forum. Get real

[Beck1976]

17 hours ago, Sophon said:

I had exactly the same thing happen Monday night/Tuesday morning, almost 80 debet transactions of Baht 34.15 each on my Bangkok Bank debit card. I have never used the card online or to pay for anything in the shops, the only time the card have been used is in Bangkok Bank ATMs to withdraw money. The only way anyone would have been able to get my card details is if they worked in the bank or in the company producing the cards or have hacked into the bank/card company's systems. 

 

The officer at the bank informed me that the transactions was from Google's payment systems and originated in a game named Garena.

Garena is a company that makes games. One of their very popular games is called Freefire ( a clone of Fortnite) and is all the rage among Thai youth. 

[MJCM]

On 10/12/2021 at 9:45 PM, bert bloggs said:

As has been posted just sign up for a notification for any withdrawl.

Sound advice, but unfortunately that only works for larger withdrawals, not the ones as small as the OP is posting about.

 

I believe the minimum is 500 THB (but that can depend on which bank you use)

Edited October 15, 2021 by MJCM

[NoshowJones]

13 hours ago, OJAS said:

The "usual reasons" the OP refers to relate to the fact that defamation is treated as a criminal matter here in LOS, rather than as a civil matter as in most other countries. So, had the OP named the bank in question and they had taken exception to this, criminal proceedings against him might have resulted. Had he been found guilty, he might well have found himself banged up for a lengthy stretch in the Bangkok Hilton by way of punishment!

What exactly is defamation? If you accuse or insinuate someone is ie, cheating you, true or not then yes, they will say that is defamation.

If you do not say or print anything negative that could do harm to anyone's business etc, that is not defamation.

So if someone tells you anything about their policies, and you name whoever said it, or what these policies are, it is not defamation, as long as you don't add anything negative to it.

[Henryford]

On 10/12/2021 at 8:59 PM, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

i never use my card for anything ,besides ATM sometimes and even this i am doing only

with the bank's big branches.

Thailand, like most of the world, is not safe for card use, but much safer for cash carrying. so

why not use cash?

 

and i lovedthe way you wrote "...my bank and i..." as if the bank is some king a lover you have

to put first...

Me too, i use cash for everything. Would never use a card in Thailand. BTW can they withdraw 34.15 from an ATM, thought the minimum for 100 baht.

[MJCM]

On 10/12/2021 at 10:10 PM, Jingthing said:

My strategy is to have three Thai bank accounts.

 

One with lots of money for visa purposes. I use the card for ATM but nothing else.

 

Another one only for automatic withdrawals for utilities. I cash it up manually. Usually under 10k.

 

Another one for heavy use of debit card, online shopping, etc. Usually under 30k in it.

I also have separate Banks

 

My Bangkok Bank has the money for Visa Purposes in a fixed account. and also have a Savings account. And both DON'T have an ATM card, I never went to renew my ATM card because of that UnionPay fiasco. How do I withdraw money? Easy at an ATM via the Bank app and select Cardless Withdrawal.

 

My SCB has a Savings account and has an ATM card, but in the SCB APP you can LOCK this card, so whenever you don't need it, you can LOCK it in the APP. Also for ATM withdrawals I use the Cardless Withdrawal option in the SCB app. So seldom use the ATM Card.

 

Online Payments, I do via a Wise Virtual Card, which again immediately after use, I FREEZE the card in the Wise App!

 

Edit: Forgot to add, how do mainly I pay for shopping, easy SCAN QR Code in the Bank App, works in BIG-C, Tops, Robinson, Makro, Pizza Hut etc etc

Edited October 15, 2021 by MJCM

[JimGant]

1 hour ago, MJCM said:

Also for ATM withdrawals I use the Cardless Withdrawal option in the SCB app. So seldom use the ATM Card.

Sounds a lot less secure than a chipped debit/atm card, whose chip (so far) cannot be cloned. Not sure I would want an ersatz debit/atm card residing as a bank app on my phone.....

 

Quote

Banking malware is a profitable sector for cybercrime, the experts observed a constant growth on a global scale, especially in the EU and Asia Pacific.

https://securityaffairs.co/wordpress/26134/cyber-crime/phishing-goes-mobile-cloned-banking-app-google-play.html

 

 

[MJCM]

2 hours ago, JimGant said:

Sounds a lot less secure than a chipped debit/atm card, whose chip (so far) cannot be cloned. Not sure I would want an ersatz debit/atm card residing as a bank app on my phone.....

 

 

 

To use the Banking App in your phone to withdraw money, the bad guy first needs

 

1- Need to load an app on your own phone that steals your banking info

2- Needs to bypass the 6 digit code to access the Banking App (or bypass Face / Touch ID)

3- Needs to have (your own) phone to scan the QR code and withdraw from your account.

 

So how did you think this is going to play out and do you think it's that easy?

 

Oke you got a point with the Chipped ATM Card, but how many times have you seen they are still using the Scanning strip in the Store  to read your Card, and that can easily get Copied!

 

Ps: if you go the Banking App route, make sure the OS on your iPhone is up to date and also the App of your Bank, I also (every 2-3 months or so)  change the Pin Code (6 digits) in the APP.

 

 

And finally are you 100% sure that the Chipped ATM Card is that secure?

(Just some reading material)

 

Article 1:

https://krebsonsecurity.com/2020/07/is-your-chip-card-secure-much-depends-on-where-you-bank/

 

Article 2:

https://www.csoonline.com/article/3104393/black-hat-atm-spits-out-cash-after-chip-and-pin-hack.html

 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2021 by MJCM

[MJCM]

F

2 hours ago, JimGant said:

Sounds a lot less secure than a chipped debit/atm card, whose chip (so far) cannot be cloned. Not sure I would want an ersatz debit/atm card residing as a bank app on my phone.....

 

 

From that Article

 

https://securityaffairs.co/wordpress/26134/cyber-crime/phishing-goes-mobile-cloned-banking-app-google-play.html

 

Wow

 

Quote

The authors put a wrapper around the bank’s legitimate app and redistributed it on the Google Play store pretending to be the financial institution.”

Very weird that Google Play Store allowed this IMHO

 

[Heng]

A lot of folks kind of forget about their bank balances and are a bit vulnerable to this kind of skimming (either by debit/credit card skimming scams or sometimes folks in the bank themselves).   I'd suggest old school bookkeeping (even as just shorthand... maybe cut off a zero or more so it doesn't interest anyone) on a whiteboard or notepad in addition to SMS notifications so you kind of have it on your mind and will be more likely to notice when something is off.      

[orchidfan]

7 hours ago, tonray said:

Girlfriend's SCB account hit this month with 10K in charges from 'SteamGames" an online game company. She does not have any account or never went there. Apparently this is a global thing happening now...many accounts being hit with these game charges. SCB investigating...I just turned all the limits on my Immigration 800K account to zero and lowered all my limits on my working account to 5000 baht. Raise them before major purchase if needed and then set them back to low limits...only way to try and be safe.

As quoted earlier (or above somewhere ) my "loss" of nearly B12,000 included 2 withdrawals/transfers to the very same "STEAMGAMES.COM". 

Luckily, due to the BB,sending SMS alerts,  I was able to identify the transactions and immediately cancel the card. 

[MJCM]

14 minutes ago, orchidfan said:

As quoted earlier (or above somewhere ) my "loss" of nearly B12,000 included 2 withdrawals/transfers to the very same "STEAMGAMES.COM". 

Luckily, due to the BB,sending SMS alerts,  I was able to identify the transactions and immediately cancel the card. 

Did you get your money Back?

 

Have a look here, maybe it helps

 

https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/5E79-EA37-6D29-8CE9

[orchidfan]

2 minutes ago, MJCM said:

Did you get your money Back?

 

Have a look here, maybe it helps

 

https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/5E79-EA37-6D29-8CE9

Thanks. The short answer is "not yet", but it was only 10 days ago now.

All reports, including police report, have been submitted to BB Fraud branch. 

I guess that they're working on it.

[MJCM]

1 minute ago, orchidfan said:

Thanks. The short answer is "not yet", but it was only 10 days ago now.

All reports, including police report, have been submitted to BB Fraud branch. 

I guess that they're working on it.

Oke, but also contact Steam, because they will ban the persons who did the fraudulent charges and that will hurt!!

 

Here is what it says in that link (a bit late but it will maybe help someone else)

 

Quote

We strongly suggest that you contact us before filing a dispute with your bank or with PayPal as we can return the funds to you without any paperwork or claim forms. We will also ban your payment account from our system so that it cannot be used again. As part of this process, we can also investigate the fraudulent individual's Steam account(s) and take appropriate action against them.

 

[JimGant]

4 hours ago, MJCM said:

And finally are you 100% sure that the Chipped ATM Card is that secure?

(Just some reading material)

Good articles. Thanx. For chip reading machines, where the fallback position can be to the magnetic strip, yes, fraudsters can program the strip to be successfully read. How it works? When you insert a chipped card in the machine, the machine first reads the strip to see if this is a chipped card. If so, it goes to the chip for further verification. If it can't read the chip (which is the case with fraudsters, since they can't successfully clone a chip), it does one of two things, based on how the owner of the card reading machine has set the software: It says "sorry," can't verify chip data, process thus terminated. Or, it says "ok," will revert to the magnetic strip for verification. Merchants used this latter option for many years, until it became obvious that cloners were taking advantage of it. So, not so common today. Mainly used with POS machines, but the concept can be used with ATM machines, although I'm not sure if Thai ATM machines have such a fallback mechanism, or if they do, which banks are included.

 

In any event, interesting discussion. However, my phone is used for talking, no apps (I'm a 76 year old codger); and at the beginning of the month, the wife goes to the bank with passbook and withdrawal slip, and brings back a pile of baht for the ensuing month's expenses. Simplicity has its merits.

[MJCM]

13 hours ago, JimGant said:

Good articles. Thanx. For chip reading machines, where the fallback position can be to the magnetic strip, yes, fraudsters can program the strip to be successfully read. How it works? When you insert a chipped card in the machine, the machine first reads the strip to see if this is a chipped card. If so, it goes to the chip for further verification. If it can't read the chip (which is the case with fraudsters, since they can't successfully clone a chip), it does one of two things, based on how the owner of the card reading machine has set the software: It says "sorry," can't verify chip data, process thus terminated. Or, it says "ok," will revert to the magnetic strip for verification. Merchants used this latter option for many years, until it became obvious that cloners were taking advantage of it. So, not so common today. Mainly used with POS machines, but the concept can be used with ATM machines, although I'm not sure if Thai ATM machines have such a fallback mechanism, or if they do, which banks are included.

 

In any event, interesting discussion. However, my phone is used for talking, no apps (I'm a 76 year old codger); and at the beginning of the month, the wife goes to the bank with passbook and withdrawal slip, and brings back a pile of baht for the ensuing month's expenses. Simplicity has its merits.

Of course, you are correct, simplicity has it's merits.

 

But maybe one word of caution, I have no idea if it's true because a friend of friend told me this but there must be some truth in there.

(Ps: This did not happen in Thailand but in another SE-Asian Country)

 

This Friend flew from Europe with his Brand new (never used) Credit Card. Arrived at his destination, went in to a Bank to get a Cash Advance on his Credit Card. Approx 1 week later his Home bank in Europe called him and said, are you buying goods in the US of A? He said "No I am still in SE-Asia never left the country."

 

So he came to the conclusion the only place where the copied his Card was within the Bank where he got his cash advance!!

 

The card was cancelled and that was a pain in the .... for him!

 

Ps: Another Interesting article

 

Quote

Bank Robbers Used Deepfake Voice for $35 Million Heist | AI-Enhanced Voice Simulation Used

https://www.techtimes.com/articles/266679/20211014/bank-robbers-used-deepfake-voice-for-35-million-heist-ai-enhanced-voice-simulation-used.htm