WHO Recommends Canceling Holiday Activities Amid Omicron Spread

[James105]

11 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

My home is quite nice, I don't have that big a problem staying in it.

Me too!  I have a lovely big house and covid has been very easy for me.   Sadly I have a condition called "empathy", and this makes me feel sad when I think about all the businesses that are being destroyed and the lives lost as a direct result of lockdown measures.    Can I get a vaccine to cure me of empathy to make this easier on me?   Happy to take a booster shot if the first 2 do not work.

[ozimoron]

16 hours ago, Cherrytreeview said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-59769969

 

50% - 70% less likely to need hospital care.

Right next to that number is another number. Interesting that you chose that stat because it suited your agenda, The other stats was that 30% to 45% less likely to go to A&E. So, which is the more salient number. Likely to go to hospital or likely to go to A&E? I have also read that once in ICU, the outcomes for both delta and omicron are similar.

 

While on the subject of numbers, I think we all agree that omicron is far more infectious than delta. Let's just say for illustration that that number is 10 times more infectious. It may be less but the point will still be valid. Assuming that figure then more than 5 times as many people will wind up in A&E. That will totally overwhelm the hospital system and why we still must vaccinate and socially isolate where possible. Even if it were only double the hospital system would be in crisis, it already is.

Edited December 24, 2021 by ozimoron

[Cherrytreeview]

21 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Right next to that number is another number. Interesting that you chose that stat because it suited your agenda, The other stats was that 30% to 45% less likely to go to A&E. So, which is the more salient number. Likely to go to hospital or likely to go to A&E? I have also read that once in ICU, the outcomes for both delta and omicron are similar.

 

While on the subject of numbers, I think we all agree that omicron is far more infectious than delta. Let's just say for illustration that that number is 10 times more infectious. It may be less but the point will still be valid. Assuming that figure then more than 5 times as many people will wind up in A&E. That will totally overwhelm the hospital system and why we still must vaccinate and socially isolate where possible. Even if it were only double the hospital system would be in crisis, it already is.

You obviously having been reading my posts.

I have already made the point you make.

Half the severity but double the cases gets you back to square one.

Maybe you should have a look at my previous posts.

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by Cherrytreeview
Edit

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Cherrytreeview said:

You obviously having been reading my posts.

I have already made the point you make.

Half the severity but double the cases gets you back to square one.

Maybe you should have a look at my previous posts.

Double the cases? Really? The number is four times according to this article so more than twice as many in A&E.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-12-09/omicron-four-times-more-transmissible-than-delta-in-japan-study

[Cherrytreeview]

Just now, ozimoron said:

Double the cases? Really? The number is four times according to this article so more than twice as many in A&E.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-12-09/omicron-four-times-more-transmissible-than-delta-in-japan-study

I am agreeing with you.

You don't seem to understand that.

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, ozimoron said:

The other stats was that 30% to 45% less likely to go to A&E. So, which is the more salient number. Likely to go to hospital or likely to go to A&E? I have also read that once in ICU, the outcomes for both delta and omicron are similar.

Not as startling as one would hope.... from say 100 people formerly going to A&E, we now would have 55 to 70 going. I would expect the outcomes ex ICU to be similar too, you presumably recover or die.

[ozimoron]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Not as startling as one would hope.... from say 100 people formerly going to A&E, we now would have 55 to 70 going. I would expect the outcomes ex ICU to be similar too, you presumably recover or die.

What happens when there are four times more cases? This was pointed out to you, why are you trying to misrepresent what I posted? Let me explain it to you. For 100 people formerly going to A&E there are now 400 people going. The "recover for die" comment is brain dead to be frank. The upshot is that more than twice as many people will go to A&E as they did previously and a total of twice as many will die as were dying previously. Those figures assume no vaccinations.

[jacko45k]

2 hours ago, ozimoron said:

What happens when there are four times more cases? This was pointed out to you, why are you trying to misrepresent what I posted? Let me explain it to you. For 100 people formerly going to A&E there are now 400 people going. The "recover for die" comment is brain dead to be frank. The upshot is that more than twice as many people will go to A&E as they did previously and a total of twice as many will die as were dying previously. Those figures assume no vaccinations.

You used percentages, if you do not know what that means, I think you should learn that before having a go at me!

You also wrote the 'outcome' phrase, so who does that make brain dead?

You also did not  mention 4x cases in that post., ..  I quoted you fully. So where was it pointed out to anybody?

On ignore!

[Thunglom]

On 12/24/2021 at 12:30 AM, herfiehandbag said:

I was pretty sure that metaphor was not the correct term, which is why I included the question mark - I was having a "mental block" and couldn't recall the word "allegory".

 

Incidentally, why "fickle" - which defines as " changing frequently, especially as regards one's loyalties, interests, or affection"?

whatever your "goalposts" were -you are incorrect and presenting a false argument.

[herfiehandbag]

9 hours ago, Thunglom said:

whatever your "goalposts" were -you are incorrect and presenting a false argument.

Was I?

OK, and there was I thinking that I was merely reinforcing the point you had made by extending the allegory!

 

It is still less than clear where " fickle", and now even more bizarrely " goalposts" come into the matter - neither by any stretch of the mind can be applied - and I wasn't really presenting an argument, although you do seem determined to pick one!

 

Never mind!

[Thunglom]

9 hours ago, herfiehandbag said:

Was I?

OK, and there was I thinking that I was merely reinforcing the point you had made by extending the allegory!

 

It is still less than clear where " fickle", and now even more bizarrely " goalposts" come into the matter - neither by any stretch of the mind can be applied - and I wasn't really presenting an argument, although you do seem determined to pick one!

 

Never mind!

QED

[herfiehandbag]

4 hours ago, Thunglom said:

QED

What on earth are you blethering on about now?

[The Hammer2021]

On 12/23/2021 at 11:25 AM, cyril sneer said:

You spend a lot time replying (angrily) to my very brief posts

 

Take a chill pill 

Try taking your own advice  and do less trolling and flaming..

[Bkk Brian]

On 12/23/2021 at 11:14 AM, The Hammer2021 said:

It's an outdoor event so little chanice of transmission according to research done over the last year

Agree with that, however is it the same for Omicron:

 

Until now, Puerto Rico has led the rest of the United States in vaccination rates and low COVID-19 infection rates. But an outdoor Bad Bunny concert there may be connected to at least 2,000 cases. I emphasize, it was an outdoor concert. Those in attendance had to show proof of vaccination. 

 

https://www.poynter.org/reporting-editing/2021/here-are-the-best-and-worse-case-scenarios-for-omicron-both-are-bad/

https://www.elnuevodia.com/noticias/locales/notas/mas-de-2000-positivos-a-covid-19-entre-personas-que-asistieron-al-concierto-de-bad-bunny/

[Thunglom]

2 hours ago, herfiehandbag said:

What on earth are you blethering on about now?

QED X2!!

[cyril sneer]

10 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Try taking your own advice  and do less trolling and flaming..

not sure what flaming means

 

I don't think it's trolling to say WHO is biased towards China

 

anyway this was from last Wednesday, not sure why it's being brought up again

[herfiehandbag]

9 hours ago, Thunglom said:

QED X2!!

I assume that you are talking in Batco. Send key settings!

( A joke which will only be recognised by a small segment of the British membership).

[The Hammer2021]

1 hour ago, cyril sneer said:

not sure what flaming means

 

I don't think it's trolling to say WHO is biased towards China

 

anyway this was from last Wednesday, not sure why it's being brought up again

Er so why are you reacting to it if its from last week?

Apparently  as well not knowing what flaming means you don't understand  how 'threads' work.

Carry on.

 

[The Hammer2021]

11 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Agree with that, however is it the same for Omicron:

 

Until now, Puerto Rico has led the rest of the United States in vaccination rates and low COVID-19 infection rates. But an outdoor Bad Bunny concert there may be connected to at least 2,000 cases. I emphasize, it was an outdoor concert. Those in attendance had to show proof of vaccination. 

 

https://www.poynter.org/reporting-editing/2021/here-are-the-best-and-worse-case-scenarios-for-omicron-both-are-bad/

https://www.elnuevodia.com/noticias/locales/notas/mas-de-2000-positivos-a-covid-19-entre-personas-que-asistieron-al-concierto-de-bad-bunny/

Yes indeed. So there is lots of contradictory information about covid spread.  But most research for over a year observing outdoor  events including political  demonstrations and beach holiday concluded covid spreads less easily  outdoors and more easily indoors. The current advice is to keep indoor spaces well ventilated. But I'm  sure  you can find research  indicating  the opposite!

[Bkk Brian]

7 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Yes indeed. So there is lots of contradictory information about covid spread.  But most research for over a year observing outdoor  events including political  demonstrations and beach holiday concluded covid spreads less easily  outdoors and more easily indoors. The current advice is to keep indoor spaces well ventilated. But I'm  sure  you can find research  indicating  the opposite!

Why would I want to find research that points to the opposite of advice on good ventilation? The point I was making was that with Omicron it is of course still safer in outdoor gatherings then indoors but the parameters may have changed a little, something to think about thats all.

Edited December 28, 2021 by Bkk Brian

[cyril sneer]

34 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Er so why are you reacting to it if its from last week?

Apparently  as well not knowing what flaming means you don't understand  how 'threads' work.

Carry on.

 

I was responding to your out of the blue post criticising me from 12 hours ago

[Thunglom]

8 hours ago, cyril sneer said:

I don't think it's trolling to say WHO is biased towards China

Not trolling but an extremely ill-informed comment.

[Thunglom]

On 12/28/2021 at 3:08 AM, The Hammer2021 said:

So there is lots of contradictory information about covid spread

Not really - the difficulty is analysing the information and sifting through peoples opinions. There is a lot od pseudo-science and unscientific stuff- but that isn't information, it's misinformation.

[The Hammer2021]

4 minutes ago, Thunglom said:

Not really - the difficulty is analysing the information and sifting through peoples opinions. There is a lot od pseudo-science and unscientific stuff- but that isn't information, it's misinformation.

Very erudite..but meaningless

[The Hammer2021]

On 12/28/2021 at 5:29 PM, Thunglom said:

Not trolling but an extremely ill-informed comment.

Well informed...The relationship  between the Chinese  dictatorship and the WHO has robbed the WHO of credibility.  We want to hear about the measures Taiwan took but China won't  let us

[The Hammer2021]

On 12/28/2021 at 10:41 AM, cyril sneer said:

I was responding to your out of the blue post criticising me from 12 hours ago

 And now? What's  your point? You are not in the Thai  time zone?

[The Hammer2021]

WHO hi so don't follow  their own advice..

[Thunglom]

35 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Very erudite..but meaningless

you realise that's an oxymoron?

 

[Thunglom]

33 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Well informed...The relationship  between the Chinese  dictatorship and the WHO has robbed the WHO of credibility.  We want to hear about the measures Taiwan took but China won't  let us

we know exactly hat's happening in Taiwan.. have you been under a rock?

[Saanim]

On 12/23/2021 at 11:26 AM, possum1931 said:

Simply because it is of financial benefit for governments and media, not to mention the medical profession, insurance companies, certain hotels etc.

How it is (Omicron fuss) of financial benefit for government (in Thailand)? The govt is supporting holidays for travelling, currently very long weekend with additional days  (after New Year) for govt employees (also banks, etc).