Sign up for U.S. Social Security at “my Social Security” or Manila office?

[srowndedbyh2o]

11 hours ago, EVENKEEL said:

I started having my monthly money deposited into US bank but about a year ago I changed my deposit numbers online to a Thai Bank, no problems. The same for my fed pension. 

When you say “…I changed my deposit numbers online to a Thai bank…”, are you saying you logged into the “my Social Security” website and made the change there?

[cmarshall]

The SSA is very specific in wanting to know your physical address.  You can also provide a mailing address as I did, but they don't seem to use it much.  The address of record that appears in your profile on ssa.gov will be your physical address.

 

We are also obliged to notify them when we move.  I think it is a bad idea not to be forthcoming with the SSA, who is emphatically not our enemy.

 

There is a wrinkle in the transition from spousal/own earnings benefits to survivor's benefits that is probably unlikely to apply in the OP's case, but is worth understanding nevertheless.  When the high earner dies, usually the husband, the surviving wife's spousal benefits will automatically convert to the higher survivor's benefit assuming that she is not entitled to benefits on her own earnings record.  This can be detrimental, because if the husband dies before she reaches her own Full Retirement Age, then her survivor's benefit will be permanently reduced.

 

However, if she is entitled to benefits based on her own earnings record at the time the husband dies she has the option of suspending her survivor's benefits, ideally until her FRA if she can afford to do so.  

 

The text of the applicable regulation in the SSA's POMS handbook is here:

https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0300207005

[EVENKEEL]

1 minute ago, srowndedbyh2o said:

When you say “…I changed my deposit numbers online to a Thai bank…”, are you saying you logged into the “my Social Security” website and made the change there?

Yes

[cmarshall]

Just now, EVENKEEL said:

Yes

He can make this change online, because his address of record is a US residential address.  If your physical address is outside the country the only way to make the change is through the relevant Federal Benefits Unit, which is Manila for us in Thailand.

[EVENKEEL]

3 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

He can make this change online, because his address of record is a US residential address.  If your physical address is outside the country the only way to make the change is through the relevant Federal Benefits Unit, which is Manila for us in Thailand.

Yes, I have a US address for my benefits. I also collect benefits for my daughter in Thailand and as you said any change for her money must go through Manilla.

[srowndedbyh2o]

2 hours ago, mrwebb8825 said:

NO fees and NO cut in exchange rate - the code used is AUTO when it goes in. (at least that's what the sms says)

I believe BKK Bank NY and BKK Bank Thailand both charge fees for those transfers, however, @Pib posted a good comparison between ACH and IDD transfers ( here ) and ACH comes out slightly ahead, as far as net Baht. For my own situation, the unrestricted bank in Thailand with the IDD method still outweighs the small amount of extra Baht the ACH method offers.

YMMV.

[Jingthing]

3 hours ago, srowndedbyh2o said:

 

Just curious; If a person is living in Thailand, what benefit would there be to “posing” as a U.S. resident for SS benefits?

To avoid the annual SSA Form 7162 ("Proof of Life") letter.

 

 

 

[cmarshall]

44 minutes ago, srowndedbyh2o said:

I believe BKK Bank NY and BKK Bank Thailand both charge fees for those transfers, however, @Pib posted a good comparison between ACH and IDD transfers ( here ) and ACH comes out slightly ahead, as far as net Baht. For my own situation, the unrestricted bank in Thailand with the IDD method still outweighs the small amount of extra Baht the ACH method offers.

YMMV.

Here is another alternative that you might consider.  If you open an account at State Dept Federal Credit Union and if you direct your SS benefits (or any other pension) to be deposited to your account there, then you qualify for "Emeritus Status" the best benefit of which is that you can do a domestic wire transfer in any amount for $6 a pop.  Since Bangkok Bank is a US bank with an ABA number a transfer to your account at Bangkok Bank is a domestic wire transfer that will cost $6 and always arrives the first thing in the morning the next day because of the time difference.  BBK Bank always codes them correctly as international transfers.  Of course, you still pay the same receiving charge to BBK Bank.

 

SDFCU is for several reasons my preferred bank these days.  They don't close accounts for expats, for example.

Edited January 6, 2022 by cmarshall

[Pib]

3 hours ago, mrwebb8825 said:

NO fees and NO cut in exchange rate - the code used is AUTO when it goes in. (at least that's what the sms says)

Yes there are fees when using the ACH transfer method....two Bangkok Bank fees.  One Bangkok Bank New York branch fee (typically $5 or $10 depending on the transfer amount) as the funds pass thru them....that is, they slice off their fee and forward the remaining to your in-Thailand branch.  And then an in-Thailand Bangkok Bank receiving fee of 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max). 

 

Both of these fees are applied "prior" to posting to your account and do not appear anywhere on your passbook/online statement.   This fools a lot of people into thinking no fees were applied but the two fees were indeed applied.  Now, if you are signed up for the Fee SMS Remittance Service the SMS received upon funds posting will show the amount of funds arriving your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch (minus the NY branch fee), the receiving fee, and the exchange rate given.

 

The exchange rate given is the bank's TT Buying Rate...usually the 0830/opening TT Buying Rate for the day.  

 

AUTO just relates to a transfer channel used.  The coding received is International Transfer on online banking and in the passbook FTT which stands for Foreign Telegraphic Transfer.

 

Now if using the IDD transfer method above two fees "do not" apply due to different routing/transfer system....only a BAHTNET receiving fee of Bt100 is applied since the final leg of the transfer is via the BAHTNET system....this fee is also applied prior to posting and will not appear anywhere except in the SMS notice you can get.   The bank's TT Buying Rate does not apply as the well as the U.S. Treasuring converts dollars to baht before sending using a U.S. Treasury/contractor bank exchange rate from several business days earlier.   The contractor bank the U.S. Treasury uses for IDD to Thailand is Citibank....Citibank Thailand does not do the exchange rate as the funds arrive already in baht....Citibank Thailand is just accomplishing the last leg of the transfer via BAHTNET.  The coding you will see in your passbook/online for an IDD payment will be BAHTNET/BTN vs International Transfer/FTT for ACH.

 

Bangkok Bank fees when using the Bangkok Bank NY branch routing method.

 

 

[Pib]

2 hours ago, srowndedbyh2o said:

When you say “…I changed my deposit numbers online to a Thai bank…”, are you saying you logged into the “my Social Security” website and made the change there?

 

2 hours ago, EVENKEEL said:

Yes

EVENKEEL has his U.S. address on file with the SSA.  With a U.S. address on file you can change your U.S. bank direct deposit in your myssa online acct; but when having a foreign address on file you can not change direct deposit in myssa; instead, you must contact a SS office like Manila. The Bangkok Bank NY branch is a licensed U.S. bank so a person can enter the Bangkok Bank NY branch ACH routing number and in-Thailand branch acct number. 

 

With a U.S. address on-file with the SSA your mySSA acct allows some additional options like changing your direct deposit info; but if having a foreign address on file some online options are not allowed....must contact a SS office instead.

[Pib]

6 hours ago, srowndedbyh2o said:

This is why I posted the question to @mrweb8825 as to why he chose to use the ACH BKK Bank NY routing number.

I did not know there was a choice. I was under the impression that for those already receiving benefits deposited to their Thai bank prior to the implementation of the IDD system, the SS dept. just stayed with that, and all newer applicants automatically went into the the IDD system. I thought that rather than going through the hassle of changing everyone over to IDD, the SS was just going to allow all of the ‘ACH’ accounts to “drop away”, eventually leaving only those in the IDD system. But it sounds like you can still choose.

@Pib. I’ve read your posts comparing net Baht using ACH vs IDD, but for me personally, I think the advantages of the IDD account outweighs the small difference in Baht. If I was already receiving deposits through the ‘ACH’ system, I might just leave it alone, but since I will be changing over from deposits to our U.S. bank to our Thai bank, I think we will go with the IDD. I’m trying to keep things as simple and seamless as possible for my wife once I pass away. If we are both receiving our SS benefits IDD to the same Thai bank account, that is one less thing my wife will have to deal with.

You can still choose between the two methods.  The ACH method is still the predominate method used because its been in place for decades...was the only direct deposit method up until late 2018 when IDD arrived on the scene for Thailand....Bangkok Bank makes more fees/profit from the ACH method vs the IDD method...many people are slow to change...many people are comfortable with the ACH method even with its Bangkok Bank special acct restrictions...the ACH method provides International Transfer coding which many people doing annual extension of stay need to make their immigration office happy...many people don't know that IDD is now available, depending on your benefit amount the ACH method beats out the IDD method for most baht posting to your acct after all the fee/exchange rate dust settles (over approx $1,125 is where ACH beats out IDD)... etc....etc....etc.....just lots of reason people still go with/stay with ACH.

 

Each person's situation will be different....the pros and cons will vary from person to person.  My Thai wife receives her SS pension via IDD.....she switched from ACH to IDD because IDD method was best for her....I pushed her to change otherwise she would have never changed.....the mention of IDD was just something that made her eyes roll back into her head.    Since she gets paid via IDD each month it allowed me to calculate the exact IDD exchange and do a cost comparison which included fees and exchange rate with the ACH method.  After doing this for 12 months I stopped my tracking....below is a 12 months comparison for various benefit amounts as of Jun 2020.

 

 

 

 

 

[srowndedbyh2o]

On 1/4/2022 at 3:47 PM, mudcat said:

You have appointed each other as your representative payees - if not it is a simple signup and spouses no longer need to keep detailed records

Thank you very much for that tip. We both have a financial power of attorney and had (incorrectly) assumed that was all we needed if one of us could no longer make our own financial decisions, including dealing with Social Security. After reading your post, I looked into it further and found that a financial power of attorney “…(does) not give legal authority to negotiate and manage a beneficiary's Social Security…”.

I just logged into ‘my Social Security’ and took care of it.

Thanks again!

[mudcat]

We designated our PoA agents in the U.S. as our alternate representative payees - they could struggle through almost any bureaucracy should the need arise - anyone here would need to be able to read, write, and communicate in English - in our village that thins the options considerably so we stayed with our U.S. PoA agents - not a good option, but all we could manage.  If there is time, the option to identify a local person is a simple matter, but the burden for anyone other than a spouse is considerable to avoid elder abuse/fraud.

 

Steve 

 

 

[srowndedbyh2o]

3 hours ago, cmarshall said:

If you open an account at State Dept Federal Credit Union and if you direct your SS benefits (or any other pension) to be deposited to your account there, then you qualify for "Emeritus Status"

I was unaware of the $6 wire transfer and the “qualify for "Emeritus Status” if maintaining direct deposit with SDFCU.

Back in Nov. 2020 I tried to open a joint account with SDFCU, and we were declined. Actually, they told me that my wife was declined, but that I could open an account alone. My wife has been a U.S. citizen since 2006 and never had any negative financial issues. When I asked SDFCU why my wife was being denied an account, they said “…we are not privy to the specifics regarding what information could not be verified or authenticated due to the proprietary nature of the software being used for that verification/authentication process”.

One of the main reasons we had applied with SDFCU was because they were ok with us having a physical address in Thailand, and they have an international wire service. I hadn't thought about a 'domestic' wire through BKK Bank NY.

Maybe we should reapply.

[cmarshall]

10 minutes ago, srowndedbyh2o said:

I was unaware of the $6 wire transfer and the “qualify for "Emeritus Status” if maintaining direct deposit with SDFCU.

Back in Nov. 2020 I tried to open a joint account with SDFCU, and we were declined. Actually, they told me that my wife was declined, but that I could open an account alone. My wife has been a U.S. citizen since 2006 and never had any negative financial issues. When I asked SDFCU why my wife was being denied an account, they said “…we are not privy to the specifics regarding what information could not be verified or authenticated due to the proprietary nature of the software being used for that verification/authentication process”.

One of the main reasons we had applied with SDFCU was because they were ok with us having a physical address in Thailand, and they have an international wire service. I hadn't thought about a 'domestic' wire through BKK Bank NY.

Maybe we should reapply.

I think it would be a good idea.  I opened my account a few years ago while here in Thailand without much difficulty.  When my US citizen wife went to open her account last year they rejected one of her documents for, as it seemed to me, a technical reason.  Nevertheless, we corrected the document in question although it took several months.  She applied again and got the account the second time round.

 

After her account at SDFCU has been open for a year I will ask to add her as a joint tenant with rights of survivorship to my account.  Sometime later she will apply for the no foreign-exchange-fee SDFCU credit card.  

 

For the low additional price of the $6 my transfer always gets executed the next business day.  Also, there are limits on the amount of ACH transfers.  So, when I was doing a larger than usual transfer I would have to stagger a couple of separate transfers.  It's worth the $6 to me to be able to forget about such concerns.

 

Another small benefit is that the transfers are easy to execute.  The first transfer to BKK Bank that you do you fill out the detailed form online and put it through.  After that you send an email to [email protected] and ask them to create a template based on your last transfer.  They will reply with the name of the template Blow-Joe.  Thereafter whenever you want to do a transfer you just send an email to [email protected] asking them to do a transfer using the Blow-Joe template in the amount of $XXX.  You'll get an automated confirmation and it will be processed.

 

Once you have had your solo account there for a while they might look a little more favorably on your spouse, although you probably still need to identify the problem and fix it for her.  You might check her credit report for anomalies.

[OneZero]

19 hours ago, Pib said:

ACH is still available/works for U.S. govt payments; but will not work for individual transfers like a person initiating an ACH bank transfer unless the U.S. bank uses International ACH Transaction (IAT) format which to few to none use.     And Bangkok Bank will happily setup a person for ACH DD deposit because that earns them more payment/transfer fees than IDD DD. 

 

 

I am reposting my question here due to no response on a different post.  My situation is as follows.

On 9/23/2021 at 7:50PM Pib said:

 ….keep in mind there are two different types of direct deposit methods.  (ACH and IDD)

 One is the original ACH transfer method where the Bangkok Bank NY branch routing number along with your in-Thailand branch acct number is used.  This method is for for the restricted direct deposit acct with Bangkok Bank where you can only withdraw/transfer funds by physically visiting any branch, no debit card allowed, acct can be in your name only, etc..

 The other direct deposit method is the International Direct Deposit (IDD) method .........

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Pib, or anybody else with experience to share:

1. Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai Kad Suan Kaew branch assisted me with form to direct deposit my SSA pension to my existing acct into which I currently already receive my OPM pension (This Acct solely my name & I need to show ID to withdraw, No ATM). The OPM pension arrives Thailand US dollars with FEX in Thailand coded FTT.  Fine so far.  Beginning 04Jan2022 I received my first SSA pension direct deposit to same acct.

 

2. But something I don't like about the SSA deposit:

The US dollars were converted to Thai Baht in NYC (Bkk Bk branch) first.  I received the baht, but at a reduced FEX rate from what was being used here in Thailand if US dollars arrived.  Also, the deposit showed up in my bank book coded as "BTN" (whatever that means) as opposed to my desired code  "FTT" (which I understand to mean Foreign Transaction).  

 

3. I talked to the manager at Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai, Kad Suan Kaew branch, who told me that there is nothing he can do to change it so that US dollars will arrive in Thailand before being converted to THB in NYC. He insisted that it is just the way that SSA & Bkk Bk NYC must do it.  I'm not sure he is correct about that, but rather than argue I accepted that there was nothing that he (the mgr) was willing to do to assist. 

 

4. So, I also sent an email to SSA Manila office asking them if there is anything they can do to assist.  However, knowing the bureaucracy can at times also be unhelpful, or at least slow, I thought it potentially beneficial to ask aseannow readers for comments ref their experience with SSA direct deposits to Bkk Bk.  Thanks in advance for sharing your experience /

[OneZero]

19 hours ago, Pib said:

ACH is still available/works for U.S. govt payments; but will not work for individual transfers like a person initiating an ACH bank transfer unless the U.S. bank uses International ACH Transaction (IAT) format which to few to none use.     And Bangkok Bank will happily setup a person for ACH DD deposit because that earns them more payment/transfer fees than IDD DD. 

 

 

I am reposting my question here due to no response on a different post.  My situation is as follows.

On 9/23/2021 at 7:50PM Pib said:

 ….keep in mind there are two different types of direct deposit methods.  (ACH and IDD)

 One is the original ACH transfer method where the Bangkok Bank NY branch routing number along with your in-Thailand branch acct number is used.  This method is for for the restricted direct deposit acct with Bangkok Bank where you can only withdraw/transfer funds by physically visiting any branch, no debit card allowed, acct can be in your name only, etc..

 The other direct deposit method is the International Direct Deposit (IDD) method .........

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Pib, or anybody else with experience to share:

1. Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai Kad Suan Kaew branch assisted me with form to direct deposit my SSA pension to my existing acct into which I currently already receive my OPM pension (This Acct solely my name & I need to show ID to withdraw, No ATM). The OPM pension arrives Thailand US dollars with FEX in Thailand coded FTT.  Fine so far.  Beginning 04Jan2022 I received my first SSA pension direct deposit to same acct.

 

2. But something I don't like about the SSA deposit:

The US dollars were converted to Thai Baht in NYC (Bkk Bk branch) first.  I received the baht, but at a reduced FEX rate from what was being used here in Thailand if US dollars arrived.  Also, the deposit showed up in my bank book coded as "BTN" (whatever that means) as opposed to my desired code  "FTT" (which I understand to mean Foreign Transaction).  

 

3. I talked to the manager at Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai, Kad Suan Kaew branch, who told me that there is nothing he can do to change it so that US dollars will arrive in Thailand before being converted to THB in NYC. He insisted that it is just the way that SSA & Bkk Bk NYC must do it.  I'm not sure he is correct about that, but rather than argue I accepted that there was nothing that he (the mgr) was willing to do to assist. 

 

4. So, I also sent an email to SSA Manila office asking them if there is anything they can do to assist.  However, knowing the bureaucracy can at times also be unhelpful, or at least slow, I thought it potentially beneficial to ask aseannow readers for comments ref their experience with SSA direct deposits to Bkk Bk.  Thanks in advance for sharing your experience /

[OneZero]

19 hours ago, Pib said:

ACH is still available/works for U.S. govt payments; but will not work for individual transfers like a person initiating an ACH bank transfer unless the U.S. bank uses International ACH Transaction (IAT) format which to few to none use.     And Bangkok Bank will happily setup a person for ACH DD deposit because that earns them more payment/transfer fees than IDD DD. 

 

 

On 9/23/2021 at 7:50PM Pib said:

 ….keep in mind there are two different types of direct deposit methods.  (ACH and IDD)

 One is the original ACH transfer method where the Bangkok Bank NY branch routing number along with your in-Thailand branch acct number is used.  This method is for for the restricted direct deposit acct with Bangkok Bank where you can only withdraw/transfer funds by physically visiting any branch, no debit card allowed, acct can be in your name only, etc..

 The other direct deposit method is the International Direct Deposit (IDD) method .........

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Pib, or anybody else with experience to share:

1. Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai Kad Suan Kaew branch assisted me with form to direct deposit my SSA pension to my existing acct into which I currently already receive my OPM pension (This Acct solely my name & I need to show ID to withdraw, No ATM). The OPM pension arrives Thailand US dollars with FEX in Thailand coded FTT.  Fine so far.  Beginning 04Jan2022 I received my first SSA pension direct deposit to same acct.

 

2. But something I don't like about the SSA deposit:

The US dollars were converted to Thai Baht in NYC (Bkk Bk branch) first.  I received the baht, but at a reduced FEX rate from what was being used here in Thailand if US dollars arrived.  Also, the deposit showed up in my bank book coded as "BTN" (whatever that means) as opposed to my desired code  "FTT" (which I understand to mean Foreign Transaction).  

 

3. I talked to the manager at Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai, Kad Suan Kaew branch, who told me that there is nothing he can do to change it so that US dollars will arrive in Thailand before being converted to THB in NYC. He insisted that it is just the way that SSA & Bkk Bk NYC must do it.  I'm not sure he is correct about that, but rather than argue I accepted that there was nothing that he (the mgr) was willing to do to assist. 

 

4. So, I also sent an email to SSA Manila office asking them if there is anything they can do to assist.  However, knowing the bureaucracy can at times also be unhelpful, or at least slow, I thought it potentially beneficial to ask aseannow readers for comments ref their experience with SSA direct deposits to Bkk Bk.  Thanks in advance for sharing your experience /

[shortstop2]

29 minutes ago, OneZero said:

Also, the deposit showed up in my bank book coded as "BTN" (whatever that means) as opposed to my desired code  "FTT" (which I understand to mean Foreign Transaction).  

My social security payments show up in my Bangkok Bank restricted account coded FTT. 

29 minutes ago, OneZero said:

The US dollars were converted to Thai Baht in NYC (Bkk Bk branch) first. 

Is there a website that publishes the NYC rate?   If it is a small difference it is possible that it is the time of day or date it is credited to your account rather than a difference in the rate between the NYC branch and Thai branch.   

Edited January 6, 2022 by shortstop2

[Pib]

20 minutes ago, OneZero said:

On 9/23/2021 at 7:50PM Pib said:

 ….keep in mind there are two different types of direct deposit methods.  (ACH and IDD)

 One is the original ACH transfer method where the Bangkok Bank NY branch routing number along with your in-Thailand branch acct number is used.  This method is for for the restricted direct deposit acct with Bangkok Bank where you can only withdraw/transfer funds by physically visiting any branch, no debit card allowed, acct can be in your name only, etc..

 The other direct deposit method is the International Direct Deposit (IDD) method .........

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Pib, or anybody else with experience to share:

1. Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai Kad Suan Kaew branch assisted me with form to direct deposit my SSA pension to my existing acct into which I currently already receive my OPM pension (This Acct solely my name & I need to show ID to withdraw, No ATM). The OPM pension arrives Thailand US dollars with FEX in Thailand coded FTT.  Fine so far.  Beginning 04Jan2022 I received my first SSA pension direct deposit to same acct.

 

2. But something I don't like about the SSA deposit:

The US dollars were converted to Thai Baht in NYC (Bkk Bk branch) first.  I received the baht, but at a reduced FEX rate from what was being used here in Thailand if US dollars arrived.  Also, the deposit showed up in my bank book coded as "BTN" (whatever that means) as opposed to my desired code  "FTT" (which I understand to mean Foreign Transaction).  

 

3. I talked to the manager at Bangkok Bank Chiang Mai, Kad Suan Kaew branch, who told me that there is nothing he can do to change it so that US dollars will arrive in Thailand before being converted to THB in NYC. He insisted that it is just the way that SSA & Bkk Bk NYC must do it.  I'm not sure he is correct about that, but rather than argue I accepted that there was nothing that he (the mgr) was willing to do to assist. 

 

4. So, I also sent an email to SSA Manila office asking them if there is anything they can do to assist.  However, knowing the bureaucracy can at times also be unhelpful, or at least slow, I thought it potentially beneficial to ask aseannow readers for comments ref their experience with SSA direct deposits to Bkk Bk.  Thanks in advance for sharing your experience /

Above answered below

 

[JimGant]

On 1/4/2022 at 7:00 PM, Jingthing said:

Presenting yourself as a U.S. resident (and your wife) when you definitely are not is seen as fraud by Social Security. It can potentially lead to your benefits being stopped

Oh, get off this silly agenda. There already was a thread with a vigorous discussion on this subject: but, apparently, because too many people asked for a link to your unsubstantiated accusations, you asked the mods to shut the thread down, which they did. Too bad, as some good info was being devolved, including -- importantly in my estimation -- that folks were confusing reporting requirements for SSI recipients as the same for those getting SS retirement benefits. Anyway, I won't repeat from that thread; instead, read here:

https://aseannow.com/topic/1219672-usa-topic-expats-telling-social-security-they-live-at-a-us-address-is-that-fraud/page/2/#comments

 

I've never presented myself as a US resident. When I sold my US residence, I got a mail forwarding address in Texas, which I plugged into my profile on MySSA, which asks for "Mailing Address." It then asks if this is my residential address, to which I indicated 'no.' Thus, no misrepresentation. And certainly no FRAUD, which implies faulty information leading to unauthorized payments. Only if I was on SSI, or had moved to Cuba-- and not reported this to the SSA --would there be unauthorized payments dictating fraud. The taxpayer's not out of a dime by my indicating on MySSA that my mailing address is in the US. [And no place to indicate physical address, which is probably a nod to full time RVers.] Thus, no fraud.

 

The simple answer to all this dialogue is: I had an MySSA account established before moving to Thailand; was drawing SS before the move; changed my address on MySSA to mail forwarding address when physical residence sold; and then no need to notify Manilla, to muddy an already simple situation. I guess some would argue that I needed to do this, but my reading of SSA instructions is: "Only if profile changes that would affect your payments" And moving to Thailand doesn't fit that dictum. Same as if I lived full time in an RV in Canada.

 

Anyway, too much info, I'm sure, for OP. But here's another thread that might help your decision:

https://aseannow.com/topic/1207540-want-to-start-collecting-usa-social-security/

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by JimGant

[Jingthing]

18 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Oh, get off this silly agenda. There already was a thread with a vigorous discussion on this subject: but, apparently, because too many people asked for a link to your unsubstantiated accusations, you asked the mods to shut the thread down, which they did. Too bad, as some good info was being devolved, including -- importantly in my estimation -- that folks were confusing reporting requirements for SSI recipients as the same for those getting SS retirement benefits. Anyway, I won't repeat from that thread; instead, read here:

https://aseannow.com/topic/1219672-usa-topic-expats-telling-social-security-they-live-at-a-us-address-is-that-fraud/page/2/#comments

 

I've never presented myself as a US resident. When I sold my US residence, I got a mail forwarding address in Texas, which I plugged into my profile on MySSA, which asks for "Mailing Address." It then asks if this is my residential address, to which I indicated 'no.' Thus, no misrepresentation. And certainly no FRAUD, which implies faulty information leading to unauthorized payments. Only if I was on SSI, or had moved to Cuba-- and not reported this to the SSA --would there be unauthorized payments dictating fraud. The taxpayer's not out of a dime by my indicating on MySSA that my mailing address is in the US. [And no place to indicate physical address, which is probably a nod to full time RVers.] Thus, no fraud.

 

The simple answer to all this dialogue is: I had an MySSA account established before moving to Thailand; was drawing SS before the move; changed my address on MySSA to mail forwarding address when physical residence sold; and then no need to notify Manilla, to muddy an already simple situation. I guess some would argue that I needed to do this, but my reading of SSA instructions is: "Only if profile changes that would affect your payments" And moving to Thailand doesn't fit that dictum. Same as if I lived full time in an RV in Canada.

 

Anyway, too much info, I'm sure, for OP. But here's another thread that might help your decision:

https://aseannow.com/topic/1207540-want-to-start-collecting-usa-social-security/

 

 

 

 

 

You have misrepresented that other thread to support an ad homenem attack. Shame on you. Also it's quite obnoxious to dredge into old forum history to support your dubious personal attacks.

 

But of course mailing and residence addresses are not the same thing.

 

Let's say a person wanted a new SS claim and his residence was Thailand but he was going to falsely claim to be a US resident. Well in such a clean case its obvious that Manila FBU is not the place to contact.

Edited January 6, 2022 by Jingthing

[shortstop2]

4 hours ago, Pib said:

You can still choose between the two methods.  The ACH method is still the predominate method used because its been in place for decades...was the only direct deposit method up until late 2018 when IDD arrived on the scene for Thailand....Bangkok Bank makes more fees/profit from the ACH method vs the IDD method...many people are slow to change...many people are comfortable with the ACH method even with its Bangkok Bank special acct restrictions...the ACH method provides International Transfer coding which many people doing annual extension of stay need to make their immigration office happy...many people don't know that IDD is now available, depending on your benefit amount the ACH method beats out the IDD method for most baht posting to your acct after all the fee/exchange rate dust settles (over approx $1,125 is where ACH beats out IDD)... etc....etc....etc.....just lots of reason people still go with/stay with ACH.

 

Each person's situation will be different....the pros and cons will vary from person to person.  My Thai wife receives her SS pension via IDD.....she switched from ACH to IDD because IDD method was best for her....I pushed her to change otherwise she would have never changed.....the mention of IDD was just something that made her eyes roll back into her head.    Since she gets paid via IDD each month it allowed me to calculate the exact IDD exchange and do a cost comparison which included fees and exchange rate with the ACH method.  After doing this for 12 months I stopped my tracking....below is a 12 months comparison for various benefit amounts as of Jun 2020.

 

 

 

 

 

I think the difference between the ACH method and IDD method reaches a local maxima at exactly $2000 since the fixed fee increases from $5 to $10 at $2001 then declines a bit before turning around at some point with the true max difference being at $4194 the maximum possible benefit in 2022. 

[Jingthing]

Referring to the included document from Social.Security ...

 

“Your Payments While You Are Outside the United States.”

 

...

 

you will find this information:

 

You are required to inform them of changes of address.

 

"If you fail to report changes in a timely manner or if you intentionally make a false statement, we may stop your benefits."

 

 

EN-05-10137.pdf

Edited January 6, 2022 by Jingthing

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Referring to the included document from Social.Security ...

 

“Your Payments While You Are Outside the United States.”

 

...

 

you will find this information:

 

You are required to inform them of changes of address.

 

"If you fail to report changes in a timely manner or if you intentionally make a false statement, we may stop your benefits."

 

 

EN-05-10137.pdf 1 MB · 1 download

You continuously beat this same drum over and over. I'm a US citizen who owns multiple homes in the US who just happens to spend some time in Thailand. I don't have Thailand down for my home address anywhere. That would be stupid. Why complicate life.

[Jingthing]

10 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

You continuously beat this same drum over and over. I'm a US citizen who owns multiple homes in the US who just happens to spend some time in Thailand. I don't have Thailand down for my home address anywhere. That would be stupid. Why complicate life.

I am not talking about snowbirds, ambiguous cases, or whatever it is that you're doing although there are of course guidelines to determine which country a person resides in as their primary residence.

The obvious point is that if a person actually does reside abroad, social security expects to know that fact in fact claimants are required to inform them in a timely manner.

How is this controversial?

Edited January 6, 2022 by Jingthing

[JimGant]

Quote

 If you receive benefits from Social Security, you have a legal obligation to report changes, which could affect your eligibility for disability, retirement, and Supplemental Security Income (SSI) benefits. You must report any changes that may affect your benefits immediately, and no later than 10 days after the end of the month in which the change occurred.

https://blog.ssa.gov/reporting-changes-is-your-responsibility/

Moving to Thailand does NOT affect your retirement benefits -- only SSI and disability benefits. Thus, no legal obligation to report your move to Thailand if retirement benefits are what you're receiving from the SSA. But, yeah, move to North Korea or Cuba, you're now obligated to report such a move, as you're no longer eligible for benefits as long as you remain in those countries.

[Jingthing]

10 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Moving to Thailand does NOT affect your retirement benefits -- only SSI and disability benefits. Thus, no legal obligation to report your move to Thailand if retirement benefits are what you're receiving from the SSA. But, yeah, move to North Korea or Cuba, you're now obligated to report such a move, as you're no longer eligible for benefits as long as you remain in those countries.

I never said moving to Thailand affected your retirement benefits. Not on this topic or any other old thread that you might wish to dredge up.

 

Again:

 

 

“Your Payments While You Are Outside the United States.”

 

...

 

you will find this information:

 

You are required to inform them of changes of address.

 

"If you fail to report changes in a timely manner or if you intentionally make a false statement, we may stop your benefits."

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by Jingthing

[JimGant]

10 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I never said moving to Thailand affected your retirement benefits. Not on this topic or any other old thread that you might wish to dredge up.

Talk about a circle jerk..... You've moaned that it's "fraud" if you don't report your move to Thailand to the SSA. My post, above, iterates that your legal responsibility to report address changes to the SSA is only if such changes affect your eligibility to receive retirement benefits; which a move to Thailand clearly does not. What's so hard to understand? Are you still erroneously focused on reporting address changes while receiving SSI?

 

Suggest you pick a new cause celebre.

[Jingthing]

13 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Talk about a circle jerk..... You've moaned that it's "fraud" if you don't report your move to Thailand to the SSA. My post, above, iterates that your legal responsibility to report address changes to the SSA is only if such changes affect your eligibility to receive retirement benefits; which a move to Thailand clearly does not. What's so hard to understand? Are you still erroneously focused on reporting address changes while receiving SSI?

 

Suggest you pick a new cause celebre.

I never mentioned SSI and you know it. Enough of this stupidity.

 

Here is what anyone can do.

 

Contact social security and tell them that you are moving to Thailand permanently and have an old age claim but that you would like to keep your US address with them as your residence address of record indefinitely even though you will actually be living in Thailand. Will that be OK? Hmm?

Edited January 6, 2022 by Jingthing