Building a new house in Isaan

[Encid]

Just now, sometimewoodworker said:

Just a clarification for those who may misunderstand. It is not the wall thickness, except tangentially, that gives the higher friction losses, but the reduced internal diameter.

Yes, I should have been more concise... as you can see from the charts below, there is a significant 5mm difference in the ID between D32 PN10 pipe and D32 PN20 pipe... between 26.2mm and 21.2mm.

 

[Encid]

All the internal and external cement rendering of the building (except for the bathroom) is now complete, and the next work face is the gutters/roof drainage.

 

The number and size of the drains are being modified from 2" to 4" as agreed with our builder, and will be completed, sealed, and tested for leaks before the roof goes on.

 

The drains will pass through the wall and the rain water will cascade down to the lower roof level, which in turn will be drained into a 12" PVC pipe in the carport which will initially discharge to the West side of the building... away from the retaining wall.

 

All these drains will be concealed by the ceiling(s).

 

Should we get any leaks in the system in the future, the leaks will be on the walls in the rooms on the South side of the building, ie. the bathroom and the internal kitchen.

We have no plans for any electrical appliances to be inside the kitchen so if leaks do occur they will not be too much of a problem.

If leaks do occur we can always cut the AAC blocks and the concrete gutter and install more 4" drains... but I am hoping that we have over-designed it sufficiently so this will never happen. 

 

Future plans of rain water harvesting may be possible and fairly simple to implement, as it would only involve re-routing the 12" PVC pipe... but that is another project and not being considered seriously just now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Muhendis]

Lots of good thinking going on here.

Personally, I would place a bit more emphasises on harvesting for gardening et al. Depends on what is fun for you and yours though.

[Rimmer]

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[carlyai]

Did you tap all the plastered walls to see if there's any sound difference?

We rendered some of the pool when it was too hot and some places didn't stick to the concrete...had to cut out and do again.

[Encid]

Just now, carlyai said:

Did you tap all the plastered walls to see if there's any sound difference?

No to be honest I hadn't even considered that... what did you use for the tapping?

 

Am I likely to hear any difference between tapping a cement rendered AAC block and a cement rendered RC lintel or RC column?

[Encid]

1 hour ago, XiomarBorjas said:

It sounds like you're making great progress with planning your new house build in Isaan. Your consideration of a passive house design with double-glazed uPVC windows and an on-grid hybrid solar system is a smart choice for energy efficiency.

Thank you!

 

Although we have tried to make it "reasonably passive" we also wanted to retain a modern and eye-catching look to the building, as well as providing functionality for practical outdoor living/eating/drinking areas.

 

We will have large areas of glass on the North and East sides of the building, but the double-glazing (as well as suitable curtains) should keep most of the heat out, except in the cool season when a bit of morning warmth from the sun will be most welcome.

 

The only changes we have made to the architect's original plans are 1) a concealed sloping steel roof instead of a flat concrete roof, and 2) a 15° sloping roof on the South facing carport which will provide support for near-future PV solar panels.

 

[carlyai]

1 hour ago, Encid said:

No to be honest I hadn't even considered that... what did you use for the tapping?

 

Am I likely to hear any difference between tapping a cement rendered AAC block and a cement rendered RC lintel or RC column?

Maybe AAC block is different, but with render on cement walls you can have this problem.

As I said it was extremely hot in the hole rendering the cement pool walls.

Just tapping with my knuckles I could hear a different sound in some areas of the rendered wall.

Others may no (probably will) more than me.

[Encid]

Just now, carlyai said:

Maybe AAC block is different, but with render on cement walls you can have this problem.

As I said it was extremely hot in the hole rendering the cement pool walls.

Just tapping with my knuckles I could hear a different sound in some areas of the rendered wall.

Others may no (probably will) more than me.

I can understand how hot it could get inside a concrete pool hole with no shade and poor ventilation... but our building was rendered above ground with good ventilation.

 

I will however give a few walls "the knock test" next time I am on site. 

 

Does anyone else know of problems relating to the adherence of the cement rendering to AAC blocks?

 

Apart from wetting the wall first before applying the plastering mortar there is nothing in the QCON Handbook on the subject.

[HighPriority]

@carlyaiis on the money @Encid

if you take a screwdriver and just lightly trail the metal end across the wall, no force required, imagine the screwdriver is a paint brush.

You will distinctly hear the difference between bonded and “drummy” render.

[Encid]

18 hours ago, HighPriority said:

@carlyaiis on the money @Encid

if you take a screwdriver and just lightly trail the metal end across the wall, no force required, imagine the screwdriver is a paint brush.

You will distinctly hear the difference between bonded and “drummy” render.

In that case I will test the walls next time I am on site.

First time that I will have taken a screwdriver to the building site... 

 

Thanks for the suggestions @HighPriority and @carlyai 

[Encid]

Well it's been a couple of weeks since my last post and I have visited the building site twice in that time.

 

I am very happy to advise that there no "drummy" rendered walls... both inside and outside the house.

 

But as with all projects not everything has gone to plan... not a disaster but some rectification work has been needed to be done in a number of areas, particularly with the water piping.

 

Firstly, at the raw water storage tanks the plumber decided to reduce the outlet of the pump discharge piping from 1" to 1/2" before it went into the 2" ring main around the pond.

Why?

Because that's how it's done in Thailand!

 

 

I spoke to my builder abut it and showed him where he could salvage most of the piping already in place but remove and replace the 1/2" reduced section to enable full 1" unrestricted flow to the ring main.

 

He agreed with me without questioning, and was also scratching his head as to why his plumber would pipe it up like that!

 

The next issue was the raw water supply to the GH.

 

It was run underground in a 2" PVC pipe across the building site to the edge of our retaining wall, where I wanted it to branch in several directions... 1 to supply the water filters and water tank in the carport, and 3 more to supply 1/2" taps for watering our future garden along the retaining wall.

 

After the filtered water fill pipe to the tank, all piping from the tank to the pump and then to the water distribution system in the house was to be D32 (1") PPR piping up until the wall outlets which would be 1/2" female treaded joints. So it was a simple concept (so I thought)... PVC piping for the raw water system, and PPR piping for the filtered water system.

 

The PPR fittings required at the outlets are these ones:

 

 

 

But somehow all of this got lost in translation (despite detailed drawings and schematics) and the plumber ended up doing this:

 

 

 

He had connected the unfiltered raw water supply directly to the PPR distribution system for the house! 

 

I also noted that the fitting he used upstream of the tap in the photo above (which is for the washing machine in the carport) was actually D25 x 1/2" and that the D32 pipe had been reduced to D25, which made me suspect all of the other PPR water outlets in the house (whose piping by now had been covered up by cement render) and sure enough, they were all D25 x 1/2" too.

 

I spoke to my builder who talked with his plumber and apparently he was unable to buy the D32 x 1/2" fittings at the shop he went to, so he bought reducers and D25 x 1/2" reducing elbows instead.

 

I told my builder that this was unacceptable and they all needed to be replaced with the correctly sized components.

 

I did test the water pressure of the hose connected to the tap in the picture, and it was strong enough to sufficiently fill our water tank (or a washing machine) so I told him that that particular outlet could remain as-is, however all the other water outlets in the house must be changed to the correct fitting size so we can get full pump water pressure and flow rate.

 

He agreed with me without questioning.

 

I am sure that he will have words with his plumber for not following the drawings and the specifications.

 

We had a brief chat about talking with me first before deviating from any drawings and specifications, and "taking initiatives".

 

If "initiatives" are deemed (by me, the customer) to be an improvement to the design or a cost saving, then they will be considered, otherwise there are to be no deviations at all... and my builder has agreed.

 

We shall see... 

[Encid]

And on the 16th of June some roof sections were finally delivered and erected.

 

The carport is being done first so the area can be used for storage and also shelter from the rain.

 

 

 

In the end we opted to go with the 25mm thick PU foam backed metal sheet roofing from Sangthai Group.

If we opted to go with the 50mm thick PU foam we would have incurred an additional 52,500 baht.

 

 

With the savings from the roof material we will be spending about 30,000 baht on this good stuff instead:

 

 

[Encid]

And when we visited site on the 20th June we could see that the roof was nearing completion... only the sealing and flashing to finish off.

 

From the air you can see how the real roof is hidden by the AAC block façade, and how the guttering/drains system works. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Encid]

One small problem... birds!

 

Many birds of all shapes, sizes, and varieties are now trying to make nests in the gutters and also pecking out the PU foam on the carport roof as well.

 

So we have come up with some solutions.

 

For the exposed edges of the carport roof we will install pieces of Conwood that have been cut to match the profile of the steel roofing material.

 

 

For the gutters we will install some expanded aluminium mesh sections that overlap each other and are fixed via SS screws to 2" x 1" steel box sections that will run the full length of the gutters. Only the steel box sections will need painting, as the fixing screws and the mesh are corrosion resistant.

 

We looked at using polypropylene bird mesh netting, but it is really only good for a few years before it degrades in the strong sunlight.

 

This is a much more durable solution that will hopefully last for 10 years or more.

 

 

 

 

 

[PoorSucker]

The contractor probably want you to have a blue roof, insist on red roof.

Cheaper and cooler.

[Encid]

And now that it is more or less weather-proof inside the building, today (25th June) the tiling work has started, although we are no longer there to see it in person.

 

SIL is now charged with providing us with daily progress photos as our niece has gone back to university, so the quality of photos is not as good as before.

 

We bought the tiles over a month ago at Boonthavorn and they were delivered to site last week.

 

Good to see that the builder heeded my request to use tile spacers and wedge-based levelling system for the tiling work.

 

 

 

A line has also been etched (using a laser level) on the walls 1m up from the FFL (finished floor level) so the uPVC window and door manufacturer can come and perform his final site survey and measurements for the windows and doors.

[Encid]

Just now, PoorSucker said:

The contractor probably want you to have a blue roof, insist on red roof.

Cheaper and cooler.

555... My wife wanted a blue roof but I insisted on a white roof. 

[HighPriority]

Sorry to laugh @Encid ????

Ive never seen clips used when wet bedding before… and I still haven’t ????

The tiler is using the clips as spacers, which is ok but he’s using them upside down and without the wedges ????

 

It looks flat and lip free from what I can see in the pic, I probably would let it slide mate, unless they’ve hit you with a big charge for using them.

[GarryP]

I think two of the biggest issues I've had are plumbing and tiling. They really do not have much experience with PPR piping in our areas. As a result they screwed up both with pipe size and outlet joints/fittings. As I wasn't on site, and by the time I caught the problem the bathrooms had already been tiled, I just complained but let it slide as while the pressure was not as high as it should be, it was sufficient for showers. 

 

They also went off plan with where the piping was supposed to be laid, but in my case that was a positive, as if I decide to go ahead with redoing the plumbing in the bathrooms, it will be much easier than if they'd followed the plans.

 

Please keep a close eye on the tiling. I had them redo some of the floor, but it is far from a professional job (a couple of Boonthavorn fitters visited my house for some other work and were surprised at the poor tiling work). Hopefully, you got a better tiling team. 

 

I won't be having another house build done, but based on my own experience, if I did, I would want to be on site nearly every day. 

 

Having said all that, I do love my new house and look forward to spending the rest of my retirement here.  

[sometimewoodworker]

4 hours ago, Encid said:

And now that it is more or less weather-proof inside the building, today (25th June) the tiling work has started, although we are no longer there to see it in person.

 

SIL is now charged with providing us with daily progress photos as our niece has gone back to university, so the quality of photos is not as good as before.

 

We bought the tiles over a month ago at Boonthavorn and they were delivered to site last week.

 

Good to see that the builder heeded my request to use tile spacers and wedge-based levelling system for the tiling work.

 

 

 

 

He is not using the levelling system, the white units are upside down and are just being used as spacers, there are none of the green or orange wedges being used. It is just a smoke screen.

[BenStark]

5 hours ago, Encid said:

One small problem... birds!

 

Many birds of all shapes, sizes, and varieties are now trying to make nests in the gutters and also pecking out the PU foam on the carport roof as well.

 

So we have come up with some solutions.

 

For the exposed edges of the carport roof we will install pieces of Conwood that have been cut to match the profile of the steel roofing material.

Isn't there supposed to be some airflow under the roof, to prevent the space underneath heating up too much?

 

I hace seen the same material at Thaiwatsadu, don't know if conwood or another name, which has small slits. So you till close it, but not completely from the air flow.

[BenStark]

4 hours ago, GarryP said:

Please keep a close eye on the tiling. I had them redo some of the floor, but it is far from a professional job (a couple of Boonthavorn fitters visited my house for some other work and were surprised at the poor tiling work). Hopefully, you got a better tiling team. 

I had a team, who had just finished a big job in a respectable project.

 

When they arrived, all their tools were new. Red flag No. 1

 

My tiles are 60 x 60 and lay on dry cement. I had to tell them they had to use "glue" as well.

 

After the first day I checked and told them to remove everything they laid that day, as it didn't line up.

 

At the end of the next day I told them the same, and during the night they came pick up their tools, never to be seen again.

 

It was then that the guy doing the wall tiles told me they were actually aluminium window fitters, but didn't have a job.

 

In fact my floors were done 3 times, with one time having to remove 120 sqm of tiles in the living room and kitchen, as they had mixed up the boxes, and having to buy new tiles

[carlyai]

4 hours ago, BenStark said:

I had a team, who had just finished a big job in a respectable project.

 

When they arrived, all their tools were new. Red flag No. 1

 

My tiles are 60 x 60 and lay on dry cement. I had to tell them they had to use "glue" as well.

 

After the first day I checked and told them to remove everything they laid that day, as it didn't line up.

 

At the end of the next day I told them the same, and during the night they came pick up their tools, never to be seen again.

 

It was then that the guy doing the wall tiles told me they were actually aluminium window fitters, but didn't have a job.

 

In fact my floors were done 3 times, with one time having to remove 120 sqm of tiles in the living room and kitchen, as they had mixed up the boxes, and having to buy new tiles

Yes, been there, done that.

Famous Things I Learnt Not To Do:

1. Ask a tiler if they are sure they can do the job.

2. Leave the job site.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

6 hours ago, BenStark said:

In fact my floors were done 3 times, with one time having to remove 120 sqm of tiles in the living room and kitchen, as they had mixed up the boxes, and having to buy new tiles

We have just had tiles laid using the same spacers and wedges. Our worker had never used the system before but had purchased it himself, for 12 square meters of tile he took 3 days, but they are almost perfect. That is how I know it’s a smoke screen, as the diamond shaped base is captured by the tiles and left behind so each tile will use 4 of the white spacers, or if you look at a single tile in isolation it uses 8 of the bases, 2 on each corner. 
I am not sure of the benefits of the system, certainly a really good tilling team will be orders of magnitude faster not using it. A total newbi may be able to do a good job but it isn’t as simple as it looks.

[HighPriority]

6 hours ago, carlyai said:

Yes, been there, done that.

Famous Things I Learnt Not To Do:

1. Ask a tiler if they are sure they can do the job.

2. Leave the job site.

 

@carlyaihave we met ? 
????????

[HighPriority]

@Encidits a simple and quick system after a few jobs to get your head around it. 
It’s normally used with stick down on concrete slabs as opposed to wet bedding. 
Depending on skill level we’d bedding should give a perfectly flat lip free finish if the tiles are actually flat… which yours probably are.  Plank tiles are often not flat and usually layed with an offset in the joint accentuates the lips. 
I would inform the builder that the system isn’t being used correctly (he may not know) but I wouldn’t recommend using the system properly in any case because of the wet bedding. 

[Muhendis]

17 hours ago, Encid said:

One small problem... birds!

 

Many birds of all shapes, sizes, and varieties are now trying to make nests in the gutters and also pecking out the PU foam on the carport roof as well.

 

So we have come up with some solutions.

 

For the exposed edges of the carport roof we will install pieces of Conwood that have been cut to match the profile of the steel roofing material.

 

 

For the gutters we will install some expanded aluminium mesh sections that overlap each other and are fixed via SS screws to 2" x 1" steel box sections that will run the full length of the gutters. Only the steel box sections will need painting, as the fixing screws and the mesh are corrosion resistant.

 

We looked at using polypropylene bird mesh netting, but it is really only good for a few years before it degrades in the strong sunlight.

 

This is a much more durable solution that will hopefully last for 10 years or more.

 

 

 

 

 

I like the idea of the screen. Although it's not clear from the picture, I guess your roof fixed box section will be attached to the high points of the roof steel.

Will you be making it in removable units for access/ease of replacement?

[sometimewoodworker]

Just a FWIW we were passing a place in walking street Pattaya and saw this example 

[Muhendis]

31 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Just a FWIW we were passing a place in walking street Pattaya and saw this example 

Too many spots of yellow paint for me...........