Advice For Visa Runners who were on multiple covid extensions: Do not return as 'visa exempt'

[JoseThailand]

6 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

By myself, always. Well dressed, well groomed, perfume on, with the girlfriend/wife, sometimes accompanied with my Thai kid as well, always smile on all occasions, do a wai salute at the I/O, include anything between 1,000 and 3,000 THB between the first 3 pages of your passport and very importantly; let the wife do all the talking for you, let the wife take the passport from your hand to give it to the I/O, never hand out your own passport yourself (when there is money in it so you can't be accused of attempting to bribe an officer, your Thai wife is the one handing out the passport, so if things go REALLY pear shaped you can pretend it wasn't you and it was a misunderstanding) also pretend you don't understand Thai and your English is nearly non existent, that way you can't answer any questions the I/O may have, your wife will do the talking for you.

 

You took your wife to the border with you every month? That's quite an ordeal!

[MajorTom]

No one has abused anything. Covid extensions has been completely legal.

A certain crowd in Thai immigration does not like this and has done everything they can to scare people away. Remember the amnesty periods in 2020. Every time it was about to end some buffoon came out: Get out now! Last chance! At the same time the government was desperately trying to attract tourists...

 

I was given hassle once in 2014 when they had one of their "crackdowns". Too many exempt stamps. They wrote a warning in my passport saying "Next time must have visa". On my way to Thailand that time i got a message that my father had just passed away. I had to leave for the funeral a couple of days later. I was back in Thailand within a week - with the same passport. I was stamped 30 days, not a question. Since then i have probably had another 50 entries. Never had a problem since.

 

If you meet one of these self important clowns don't get worked up about it. They like to intimidate, but have no legal grounds to deny you.

[NanaSomchai]

1 minute ago, Mac Mickmanus 2 said:

They will either go abroad and get a Visa and return  or go abroad and not come back . 

   Hardly "dearly paying the price" 

Until they get denied over other fallacious made up reasons.

[NanaSomchai]

1 minute ago, JoseThailand said:

You took your wife to the border with you every month? That's quite an ordeal!

Not every month but I'd say on 80% of my visa runs, yes.

[Mac Mickmanus 2]

4 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

Which is why I would recommend anyone acquiring the Cambodian citizenship, very easily doable if you're not already married and are under 50.

 

Just need to pay about US $ 350 000 for the donation and agency fees to get Cambodian citizenship 

[NanaSomchai]

1 minute ago, MajorTom said:

If you meet one of these self important clowns don't get worked up about it. They like to intimidate, but have no legal grounds to deny you.

Excepted that they do, the immigration clowns (as you elegantly put it out) have every say and they always have the last word.

[NanaSomchai]

Just now, Mac Mickmanus 2 said:

Just need to pay about US $ 350 000 for the donation and agency fees to get Cambodian citizenship 

Absolutely not. It's free. But yeah nice trolling, a new profile with 2 disruptive posts, I see you.

[arithai12]

1 hour ago, aldriglikvid said:

Thanks for the info! I was self curious to see how soon they will start to repel visitors at the airport as they did pre-covid. They almost bounced me arriving on a completely new tourist visa. 

Sure, I respect your sovereignty and I don't have a right to a tourist visa. But, if one is applied for and given to me by your embassy - honor it. End of discussion. 

About your last statement, a visa is issued by an Embassy abroad (or consulate), but Immigration has the last say whether you are allowed in or not. They may have reasons for refusing entry that the Embassy does not know about. I'd say this is the same for every country.

[Mac Mickmanus 2]

1 minute ago, NanaSomchai said:

Absolutely not. It's free. But yeah nice trolling, a new profile with 2 disruptive posts, I see you.

I lost my last profile (with the same name) after getting locked out of everything when I logged in on a new computer in a different Country . A message was sent to my E-mail address to confirm my identify and I couldnt get into my E-mail address 

   Anyway :

   "A foreigner could also be accorded Cambodian citizenship if he donates 1 billion riels (about US$250,000) or more to the national budget."

 

A foreigner who invests 1.25 billion riels (around US$312,500) in Cambodia can be eligible for naturalization by investment. In this case, the seven-year residency is waived. However, other requirements for naturalization like language fluency still apply. The business project needs to be approved by the government:

 

Agent fees are estimated between US$75,000 – US$85,000 for the main applicant and US$5,000 per dependent.

 

https://globalresidenceindex.com/news-cambodia-citizenship-investment/#:~:text=Cambodian citizenship has also been,family members to get naturalized.

[arithai12]

1 hour ago, EricTh said:

The last time I checked Cambodia, Vietnam, Philippines are already opened. Malaysia may open next month from what I read.

 

The problem is abusing the system by doing multiple visa-runs/Covid extensions and not whether one can get a tourist visa.

 

A tourist visa won't be granted if immigration sees that one is not a genuine tourist.

Immigration does not grant visas.

I think what you mean is that Immigration will not accept a visa if they have their reasons.

[MajorTom]

6 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

Excepted that they do, the immigration clowns (as you elegantly put it out) have every say and they always have the last word.

I'm aware its "up to every officer". But to deny someone who has a qualifying passport a 30 day exempt arriving by air is in my experience extremely unlikely.

[NanaSomchai]

1 minute ago, arithai12 said:

About your last statement, a visa is issued by an Embassy abroad (or consulate), but Immigration has the last say whether you are allowed in or not. They may have reasons for refusing entry that the Embassy does not know about. I'd say this is the same for every country.

Absolutely accurate statement at 200%.

 

Embassies and consulates abroad are basically "branches" tied to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

 

Meanwhile the Immigration Bureau is a fully fledged branch of the RTP (Royal Thai Police), as such they are under orders of the Prime Minister, a different "Ministry" to put it.

 

Here is a prime example; I know of a case of an Australian bloke who was deported from Thailand by the immigration, blacklisted and barred entry for the Kingdom for 15 years following a court case where he pleaded guilty, yet he was able to get another new TR visa from the Australian embassy again a month after being back in his home country while being on the immigration's blacklist. This is yet another case of the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing.

 

What truly matters at the end is what they (the immigration bureau) has on file about you in their database and how far the immigration officer dealing with you is willing to push it and whether or not "tea money" can be used to round the edges.

 

To get back on the topic: Rest assured that (unless it gets wiped someday or you get a legal name change in your home country), the immigration bureau databases contains every addresses you have ever registered yourself to in Thailand, every time you have entered and exited the Kingdom and every time they have granted you an extension and on which grounds was it, including these COVID-19 extensions.

 

Also if you were blacklisted before, if you've been deported previously, if you have a court case pending in the Kingdom (like if you are on bail and are attempting to flee, skip court), if you have any sorts of criminal records (remember they are a branch of the RTP) and even if you have previously overstayed even if it's just for a day.

 

They know everything, they see everything.

 

[NanaSomchai]

12 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus 2 said:

 "A foreigner could also be accorded Cambodian citizenship if he donates 1 billion riels (about US$250,000) or more to the national budget."

 

A foreigner who invests 1.25 billion riels (around US$312,500) in Cambodia can be eligible for naturalization by investment. In this case, the seven-year residency is waived. However, other requirements for naturalization like language fluency still apply. The business project needs to be approved by the government:

 

Agent fees are estimated between US$75,000 – US$85,000 for the main applicant and US$5,000 per dependent.

 

https://globalresidenceindex.com/news-cambodia-citizenship-investment/#:~:text=Cambodian citizenship has also been,family members to get naturalized.

Getting married to a Cambodian citizen is free, you become eligible for the citizenship after 5 years of continuous life in Cambodia, no need to invest any funds and there is no language fluency requirement either. Easy way out.

 

Why would you even want to pay for something that you can get for free?

 

Having the Cambodian citizenship and it's passport is the best way to bounce back and forth between Thailand, however you will be allowed to stay in Thailand only 15 days at a time, so this might not be suitable to those in remote places like Phuket.

 

[audaciousnomad]

5 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

They know everything, they see everything.

 

Unpaid debts too?

[NanaSomchai]

12 minutes ago, MajorTom said:

I'm aware its "up to every officer". But to deny someone who has a qualifying passport a 30 day exempt arriving by air is in my experience extremely unlikely.

It happens more often than you would guess. Any futile reasons may be invoked, the most frequent one is "alien has no ways or funds to sustain himself in the Kingdom for 30 days" they stamp you with that, deny you entry in the Kingdom, flag you in their systems database and you're being sent back home.

 

Which is why the only sensible thing to do is to always carry 20,000 baht in cash on you. They do not care if you have bank assets, credit cards, debit cards, Thai book banks, Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency portfolio, they want to see hard cash.

 

When one lands to Suvarnabhumi airport, the first thing to do is to reach out to an ATM machine and withdraw 20,000 THB with you, then you carry on onto the immigration lane, not the other way around.

 

And yes, there a few ATM machines before the immigration desks.

 

[NanaSomchai]

12 minutes ago, audaciousnomad said:

Unpaid debts too?

No, unless there was a court order against you forcing you to pay your debts, this is also why they are introducing the ominous mandatory 300 THB tax upon entering the Kingdom, one could go to Thai hospitals, get surgery done or expensive quality dental healthcare (one of the few things this country still does right), leave the premises, skip the bills, be unreachable on purpose and fly home shortly after receiving healthcare, the Thai immigration wouldn't know about it unless a court sentence has been handed out against you or you're wanted by the Police for questioning, aka; a warrant for arrest is out.

Edited March 1, 2022 by NanaSomchai

[MajorTom]

1 minute ago, NanaSomchai said:

It happens more often than you would guess. Any futile reasons may be invoked, the most frequent one is "alien has no ways or funds to sustain himself in the Kingdom for 30 days" they stamp you with that, deny you entry in the Kingdom, flag you in their systems database and you're being sent back home.

 

Which is why the only sensible thing to do is to always carry 20,000 baht in cash on you. They do not care if you have bank assets, credit cards, debit cards, Thai book banks, Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency portfolio, they want to see hard cash.

 

When one lands to Suvarnabhumi airport, the first thing to do is to reach out to an ATM machine and withdraw 20,000 THB with you, then you carry on onto the immigration lane, not the other way around.

 

And yes, there a few ATM machines before the immigration desks.

 

Well. I have not counted exactly, but i promise i have done around 100 visa exempt entries up until 2020. I have never been denied or asked to show any cash.

 

[itsari]

57 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

There is also no limit on visa exempt entries via land either if you happen to be a passport holder of specific nations. Unlike on these forums not everything revolves around the Brits (thank God).

 

After 10 years of visa runs you have learnt little . Must be your faith in God that got you through 

Two border runs was the limit before covid arrived .

 

 

 

[NanaSomchai]

2 minutes ago, itsari said:

After 10 years of visa runs you have learnt little . Must be your faith in God that got you through 

Two border runs was the limit before covid arrived .

Wrong. Again it all boils down to your passport's nationality/citizenship. Not every passport is equal to the Thai immigration.

 

[Mac Mickmanus 2]

3 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

Wrong. Again it all boils down to your passport's nationality/citizenship. Not every passport is equal to the Thai immigration.

 

Which Countries passports allow more than two land border entries on visa exempt per calendar year ?

[NanaSomchai]

32 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus 2 said:

Which Countries passports allow more than two land border entries on visa exempt per calendar year ?

A very few do. Myself I use my Brazilian passport. It bears no limitations or restrictions at all.

 

https://jonesyinthailand.com/visa/thailand-tourist-visa-exemption/#:~:text=90 Days Exemption (no visa,a visa for 90 days.

 

90 Days Exemption (no visa required):

 

Argentina, Brazil, Chile, South Korea and Peru have bilateral visa agreements with Thailand. Citizens of both countries (bilateral) can visit each other for 90 days without a visa for 90 days.

 

Also, out of these five countries, I know for a fact the Chilean passport is limited to one land entry per calendar year, while the Brazilian one bears no such restriction.

 

In my case what I do is:

 

Enter the Kingdom on a 90 days exemption, as it is about to end head to the local immigration office and pay 1,900 THB get a 60 days extension on the basis of being a parent of a Thai national (not 30 days, 60 days), that grants me a whopping 90+60 days a pop, 150 days (5 months) then do a border visa run quick hop and re-enter and get another 90+60 days, 300 days (10 months) out of 12, I then usually do my best to time it in a way that this is over the span of the 2 calendar years in case the I/O dares to complain, then I ask them to look up at their own rules and when they see the Brazilian passport has no restrictions or limits of entry per calendar year.

 

The I/O is left with accepting the bribe and stamping me, I get in, he gets a tip, 30 minutes later I'm out of his office and everyone is happy.

 

Document from 2016:

 

Also: https://bic.moe.go.th/images/stories/visa_TH_10-02-59_1.pdf

 

This document was originally hosted on the immigration.go.th websites but has been taken off, it is now mirrored on the MOE, Ministry of Education websites, notice the address is .go.th, officially endorsed/ran website of the Thai government, also exists a more recent revision of that document which mentions the border entries restrictions whereas applicable. I'm looking for it as we speak.

 

Document from 2022:

 

https://image.mfa.go.th/mfa/0/zE6021nSnu/เอกสาร/THA.pdf

 

Ministry of Foreign Affairs. It can't get any better than that, still hunting for the version I've seen before that has the entries restrictions details. It exists, I've had it in the past.

 

Here we go:

 

The current revision of the document is hidden somewhere in there:

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/?page_id=1447

 

Sadly the whole thing is available in Thai only.

Edited March 1, 2022 by NanaSomchai

[BritTim]

4 hours ago, aussiexpat said:

Why do we have to believe what some random people on Facebook says just because you quoted them. Isn't this forum for actual members to give their experience and people in other threads have already said they did a visa run no problem

 

This is ridiculous, if you're from a country eligible for visa exempt, you will get a visa exempt entry (unless a dodgy visa agent screwed you on your covid extension by triggering a red flag) 

 

To me, the report has the ring of truth. It is consistent with the attitude towards visa exempt entry of Immigration at Thai airports prior to Covid. There are official announcements from several years ago to the effect that using visa exempt entry "to stay longer in Thailand than is consistent with regular tourism" will not be permitted. If you are lucky, you will be able to enter through an airport visa exempt, regardless of your prior immigration history. However, when deciding whether to grant you a visa exempt entry, immigration officials are basically providing the same function as consular officials do when you apply for a visa. They decide whether you are a genuine short term tourist and can deny entry if they decide you are not.

 

I would note that, while airport immigration officials are well within their rights to deny you a visa exempt entry, they ought not to be allowed to deny you an entry when you have an actual visa. In that case, you have already been vetted by the consulate, and Immigration has no business overruling the decision of consular officials, except as laid out in Section 12 of the Immigration Act. However, this has been known to happen at some airports, including both Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang.

[at15]

What is the deal with getting tourist visas now? I know pre-covid we had go apply at an embassy then pickup the next day, but now everything is all online? So does it even matter what city you do a visa run to?

[StayinThailand2much]

6 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

If Laos and Vietnam go over to E-visa that'll be them out of the picture too.

Why is that? Because of the missing visa sticker/stamp? If so, I couldn't arrive from, say, my home country...

[KhaoYai]

2 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Why is that? Because of the missing visa sticker/stamp? If so, I couldn't arrive from, say, my home country...

No. When an embassy or consulate goes over to the E-visa system, visa applications are only allowed from that country's citizens or those who have legal residence there.

[tonray]

6 hours ago, NanaSomchai said:

include anything between 1,000 and 3,000 THB between the first 3 pages of your passport

The most absurd thing I have ever heard....actually smacks of desperation...how about just saving enough for a real extension ?

[StayinThailand2much]

13 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

No. When an embassy or consulate goes over to the E-visa system, visa applications are only allowed from that country's citizens or those who have legal residence there.

Ouch! Got it. 

 

But that is kinda inconvenient. If I travelled the world for, say, 6 months, I'd either have to get all those visas in advance, or travel back to my home country every time I needed a new E-visa.

Edited March 2, 2022 by StayinThailand2much

[JayClay]

7 hours ago, NanaSomchai said:

Hate it so say it again but here we are yet again; Told you so.

Don't lie. You're actually clearly taking great pleasure is saying it yet again...

[JoseThailand]

6 hours ago, MajorTom said:

I have never been denied or asked to show any cash.

 

Except the 1000-3000 baht in your passport ????

[DezLez]

6 hours ago, NanaSomchai said:

also pretend you don't understand Thai

Not a good idea if you are using your ED visa to re-enter!