TAX number without work permit

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

can i get a thai tax number without having a work permit?

some lawyers say yes, some say no, i wanted to ask here for your expereince,

before i try getting it.

and if yes, how to do it?

[sometimewoodworker]

Yes you can, just go down to your local tax office. It will help if you have a long  black haired interpreter a yellow book and pink card are not required but can make life easier. If you have all the documents needed it will take about an hour.

Edited May 8, 2022 by sometimewoodworker

[JeffersLos]

Yes, just go to the local tax office. No need for a lawyer, especially one that incorrectly says it cannot be done. 

[cnx1204]

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

29 minutes ago, cnx1204 said:

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

well, you can pay taxes, if you have income

[HampiK]

33 minutes ago, cnx1204 said:

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

You can become back the 15% withholding tax from your interest.

[Gottfrid]

YES!

Follow these simple instructions:

 

1. Take copy and original of your passport and a proof of residence.
2. Go to the Revenue office.
3. Tell them that you want a TIN-number because you are eager to pay tax in Thailand.
4. Swooosh, and you will have one faster than lightning.

Edited May 8, 2022 by Gottfrid

[Captain Monday]

34 minutes ago, cnx1204 said:

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

You can file a tax return and possibly claw back a portion of tax automatically withdrawn from bank savings accounts.

[skatewash]

1 hour ago, cnx1204 said:

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

Two benefits concern tax withholding on interest earned in a Thai bank account.

If you have a Thai Tax ID and register that number with your Thai bank savings account they will not withhold 15% tax from the first baht of interest earned but only after you have earned 20,000 baht.  For many people this will mean that they have zero tax withheld and therefore don't need to file a Thai Income Tax Return to reclaim any tax withheld for the simple reason that it is not withheld in the first place.  Note this works with regular savings accounts but not fixed deposit accounts.  Tax is always withheld on the latter and you would need to file a Thai Income Tax Return to reclaim that.

Secondly, it allows you to file a Thai Income Tax Return to get back tax withheld on interest earned.  You need the Thai Tax ID card to do this.  With a Thai Tax ID you can file online.  It can be done at the Tax Revenue Office.  In fact, they are usually kind enough to do it for you at the Tax Revenue Office if they understand what you are trying to do.  In fact, if you have the tax withholding documents you can get from your Thai bank then they will clearly understand why you are asking for a Thai Tax ID (despite the fact that you don't work or have a work permit) and they will issue you a Thai Tax ID and file out the Thai Income Tax Return (PND-90) for you.  Get a copy of that form before it's filed and you can use as a template for future year's filings wherein only the numbers from your Thai bank withholding amounts change.

[skatewash]

37 minutes ago, Gottfrid said:

YES!

Follow these simple instructions:

 

1. Take copy and original of your passport and a proof of residence.
2. Go to the Revenue office.
3. Tell them that you want a TIN-number because you are eager to pay tax in Thailand.
4. Swooosh, and you will have one faster than lightning.

If you don't work in Thailand and don't have a work permit, then it's a whole lot easier to just go to your Thai bank beforehand and get the free tax withholding documentation for any tax withheld on interest earned.  Go to the Revenue Department with this document and it will be readily apparent why you are there, why you need a Thai Tax ID, and they will give you the Thai Income Tax Return (PND-90) and often even fill it out for you.  

[asiaexpat]

1 hour ago, cnx1204 said:

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

The 13 digit number on your Pink ID is your Tax number.

[skatewash]

5 minutes ago, asiaexpat said:

The 13 digit number on your Pink ID is your Tax number.

True, if you obtained your Pink ID prior to getting your Tax ID Number and you used your Pink ID to obtain your Thai Tax ID number.  Otherwise, not necessarily true.  For instance, my ID number on my Pink ID and Yellow Book is the same, but differs from my Thai Tax ID number on my Thai Tax ID card.  This has never been a problem for me.

[asiaexpat]

3 hours ago, skatewash said:

True, if you obtained your Pink ID prior to getting your Tax ID Number and you used your Pink ID to obtain your Thai Tax ID number.  Otherwise, not necessarily true.  For instance, my ID number on my Pink ID and Yellow Book is the same, but differs from my Thai Tax ID number on my Thai Tax ID card.  This has never been a problem for me.

"can i get a thai tax number without having a work permit?: I assume from this the OP has no Tax ID, let alone one prior to Pink ID.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

14 minutes ago, asiaexpat said:

"can i get a thai tax number without having a work permit?: I assume from this the OP has no Tax ID, let alone one prior to Pink ID.

what is pink ID <comment removed>

Edited May 8, 2022 by ubonjoe
inflammatory comment removed

[skatewash]

3 minutes ago, asiaexpat said:

"can i get a thai tax number without having a work permit?: I assume from this the OP has no Tax ID, let alone one prior to Pink ID.

You can get a Thai Tax ID number without having a work permit.  As explained above involves going to the local Revenue Department and requesting one.  What Tax ID number you are issued may or may not match your Thai ID number as listed in your yellow book or pink ID (if you even have one or both of those).

If you're saying that once you have a Thai ID number from a yellow book/pink ID then you can simply use that number as your Thai Tax ID, I'm not sure that would work.  Seems to me it's different than going to the local Revenue Department and requesting a Thai Tax ID and showing your yellow book/pink ID card.  Doing so may result in your being issued a Thai Tax ID that matches that number or it may be a different number.  In my case I showed my yellow book with Thai ID number (didn't have the pink ID card yet) and it did NOT result in my getting the same number for my Thai Tax ID.  Instead I was issued a different Thai Tax ID number (not matching my yellow book ID number).

I was responding to your comment that the numbers (Thai Tax ID and yellow book/pink ID card) are always the same.  They aren't necessarily.

 

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

what is pink ID <comment removed>

It is a ID card issued after you apply for and get a yellow house book. They are issued at a Amphoe.

The color of it is not really relevant.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

25 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

a yellow house book

??

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

??

It is a house book that can be issues to a foreigner that is about the same as a blue house book issued to Thais. Getting yellow house book also includes a ID number that can be used for many things and it proves your place of residence.

There have been many topics about getting a yellow house book.

[Crossy]

11 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

??

 

I find it very difficult to believe that a long term member with over 2k posts is unaware of the yellow tabien baan (house book for foreigners) and the pink "foreigner" ID card.

 

[Gottfrid]

4 hours ago, skatewash said:

If you don't work in Thailand and don't have a work permit, then it's a whole lot easier to just go to your Thai bank beforehand and get the free tax withholding documentation for any tax withheld on interest earned.  Go to the Revenue Department with this document and it will be readily apparent why you are there, why you need a Thai Tax ID, and they will give you the Thai Income Tax Return (PND-90) and often even fill it out for you.  

As I said. According to my instructions.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

4 hours ago, Crossy said:

 

I find it very difficult to believe that a long term member with over 2k posts is unaware of the yellow tabien baan (house book for foreigners) and the pink "foreigner" ID card.

 

i heard about it here and there but was not sure what is it

[Sheryl]

On 5/8/2022 at 9:06 AM, cnx1204 said:

I have the pink ID card and am retired.  What benefit can I get with a tax number?

You can apply for a refund of tax paid on bank account interest (if applicable)

 

That's why I got one.

[Digitalbanana]

On 5/8/2022 at 10:31 AM, skatewash said:

On 5/8/2022 at 10:23 AM, asiaexpat said:

The 13 digit number on your Pink ID is your Tax number.

True, if you obtained your Pink ID prior to getting your Tax ID Number and you used your Pink ID to obtain your Thai Tax ID number.  Otherwise, not necessarily true.  For instance, my ID number on my Pink ID and Yellow Book is the same, but differs from my Thai Tax ID number on my Thai Tax ID card.  This has never been a problem for me.

I obtained my Thai Tax # using my Thai ID (Yellow book#) and the numbers are not the same. I don't have a Pink ID, but if I did the number would be same as Yellow Book.

[JimGant]

If you're a Yank, and the only reason for a Thai tax ID is to get back your withholding on bank acount interest -- forget it. Just enter the withholding amount on the tax credit line on your Form 1040 -- and viola, you get your Thai tax withholding back without expending any shoe leather on Thai bureaucracy. You don't even need to file the tax credit Form 1116, if your credit is less than $600, filing jointly (and the Form 1116 is easy to do, if you need to).

 

Yes, the rules state, if you can get a refund, then you don't qualify for a tax credit. But, hey, reading Asean Now, and other Thai forums, I find that to get a refund, I need a Thai tax ID, and further reading gives examples of this being impossible without a work permit, which I don't have. You'd never get audited for a piddly tax credit -- but if you did, just print out an Asean Now response about no-can-do.

 

Ethically bereft? Naaa. You're still paying the same amount of tax; but in this case, Thailand gets to keep the taxes, and the US doesn't. Seems fair, that the country where the interest is earned gets first taxation rights.

 

 

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

3 minutes ago, JimGant said:

If you're a Yank, and the only reason for a Thai tax ID is to get back your withholding on bank acount interest -- forget it. Just enter the withholding amount on the tax credit line on your Form 1040 -- and viola, you get your Thai tax withholding back without expending any shoe leather on Thai bureaucracy. You don't even need to file the tax credit Form 1116, if your credit is less than $600, filing jointly (and the Form 1116 is easy to do, if you need to).

 

Yes, the rules state, if you can get a refund, then you don't qualify for a tax credit. But, hey, reading Asean Now, and other Thai forums, I find that to get a refund, I need a Thai tax ID, and further reading gives examples of this being impossible without a work permit, which I don't have. You'd never get audited for a piddly tax credit -- but if you did, just print out an Asean Now response about no-can-do.

 

Ethically bereft? Naaa. You're still paying the same amount of tax; but in this case, Thailand gets to keep the taxes, and the US doesn't. Seems fair, that the country where the interest is earned gets first taxation rights.

 

 

The reason you might want a thai tax ii.d. is the beurocracy in many other countries that

are asking you for your tax i.d. if you want to open a bank account there or just transfer money.,

in many countries, you cannot do anything on line without providing some tax i.d. number.

[skatewash]

2 hours ago, JimGant said:

If you're a Yank, and the only reason for a Thai tax ID is to get back your withholding on bank acount interest -- forget it. Just enter the withholding amount on the tax credit line on your Form 1040 -- and viola, you get your Thai tax withholding back without expending any shoe leather on Thai bureaucracy. You don't even need to file the tax credit Form 1116, if your credit is less than $600, filing jointly (and the Form 1116 is easy to do, if you need to).

 

Yes, the rules state, if you can get a refund, then you don't qualify for a tax credit. But, hey, reading Asean Now, and other Thai forums, I find that to get a refund, I need a Thai tax ID, and further reading gives examples of this being impossible without a work permit, which I don't have. You'd never get audited for a piddly tax credit -- but if you did, just print out an Asean Now response about no-can-do.

 

Ethically bereft? Naaa. You're still paying the same amount of tax; but in this case, Thailand gets to keep the taxes, and the US doesn't. Seems fair, that the country where the interest is earned gets first taxation rights.

 

 

A non-refundable tax credit on your US taxes gets you no money unless you happen to have a US tax liability that same year.  Filing the Thai Income Tax Return always gets you any money that was withheld on interest earned (assuming you have no other reportable income in Thailand and you don't have over 20,000 baht in interest income).  Once you have the Thai Tax ID you can file your PND-90 Thai Income Tax Return online.  A few weeks later you get a check in the mail from the Revenue Department.  The only running around beyond the first year is remembering to ask for your Tax Withholding Document from your Thai bank when you visit it after the new year begins.

By registering your Thai Tax ID with your Thai bank savings accounts you can avoid having the 15% tax on interest earned withheld in the first place (until you earn more than 20,000 baht in interest).

Edited May 9, 2022 by skatewash

[JackGats]

Before I got my tax number, I asked at least 2 lawyers/consultants. Both told me I couldn't have a TIN in Thailand because I didn't pay tax in Thailand. Then I heard many people had got one by going to ask for one at the nearest government tax office. I did so and got one no questions asked.