First UK passport unlikely to arrive on time, can my kid get a UK Visa instead?

[Satcommlee]

We are desperate to get away to visit a sick relative, whilst in good faith I started a first UK passport for my son in Mid-March, it seems to have only been processed in Trendy on 29th April and put into HMPO system on 10th May. They say it can take 13 weeks and the contact center is quite useless as applications made abroad are not trackable, I was very lucky to get some info after mailing Liverpool office directly, basically saying its in the pile waiting to be looked at.

 

I have fears that I won't get a passport in time and am looking at plan B..

 

I have had mixed messages from UK FCO regarding Emergency Travel documents (due to him not ever having a passport), one guy said it could be done, another said it could not be done.

 

I am considering the UK Visa route for my 11 year old son, he has a Thai passport but his birth was also registered at the British embassy.

Does anyone have any similar experience, ie: technically half British kid getting a Visa to go to the UK?

 

Would appreciate any thoughts or advice..

 

[brewsterbudgen]

Technically, someone who is British cannot be issued with a UK visa.  In your circumstances, it would be nice to see exceptions being made.  But even if it were possible, the delays on issuing visas are nearly as bad as those for passports.  Brexit/Boris shambles.

[blackcab]

Others will be able to tell you if they have managed it, however if the UK government know your child is a UK citizen they will refuse to issue a visa.

 

This is because a visa puts time limits on the holder, and a UK Citizen cannot be limited in this way.

 

You might want to try the Emergency Travel Document route. You could ask a question in the British Consular Forum here about whether or not an ETD would be issued to your child even though they have not yet received their first UK passport.

[Satcommlee]

One thing the FCO did tell me, but I have had mixed messages is that not being "In Possession" of a UK passport, may make a difference but can't get a straight answer.

Edited June 15, 2022 by Satcommlee

[richard_smith237]

42 minutes ago, blackcab said:

You might want to try the Emergency Travel Document route. You could ask a question in the British Consular Forum here about whether or not an ETD would be issued to your child even though they have not yet received their first UK passport.

IF possible, this may be the best option.... However, you may find yourself stuck in the UK while a Passport from the original application is sent to Thailand....  

 

The only other option then is, IF you could get back on an Emergency Travel document to apply for a Passport in the UK (online fast track booking), but I don’t know how that could work because you’d effectively have two passport applications in progress at the same time.

I wonder if while applying for a passport (in the UK) they could cancel the other application allowing you to apply in the UK. It could get messy. 

 

 

 

[Tropicalevo]

I have a British friend who had planned to go to the UK on 21/6.

Applied for a visa for his Thai son 10 weeks ago.

He has been told that the British embassy has been told to give priority to Ukrainians on humanitarian grounds.

He is looking at cancelling his trip.

Sorry that this is not helpful - just additional info.

 

[Satcommlee]

25 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said:

I have a British friend who had planned to go to the UK on 21/6.

Applied for a visa for his Thai son 10 weeks ago.

He has been told that the British embassy has been told to give priority to Ukrainians on humanitarian grounds.

He is looking at cancelling his trip.

Sorry that this is not helpful - just additional info.

 

Thanks for the info, do you now whether this was a simple visit visa or more complex like Family visa?

[PPGuy]

My experience is from the mid 90's so rules and regs may well have changed since then.

 

However, my then 6 year old son (Thai/Brit) with only a Thai passport, was given a visa to enter the UK. This was issued at the Brit Embassy in Bangkok and, from memory, was placed at the back of his Thai passport as that was deemed appropriate. Not sure of the validity period / type of visa but had no issues entering the UK. The dual national status of my son was fully understood so that did not prove to be a show stopper. Our circumstances meant that obtaining a UK passport was more problematic then, as he was born before I married his mother. Sorted that out later.

 

Of course having the decision makers all under one roof at that time likely simplified the process. Now.....?

 

Good luck.

[SidJames]

You should be able to apply for an emergency travel document under these circumstances.

The UK visa process is itself taking 10 weeks in itself according the email that was sent to me by the New Delhi office who seem to handling the visas sent from Thailand.

It might be an idea to also apply for an Irish visa as well in case that is easier/quicker then go up to Belfast & either get the ferry or fly over to the UK.

[hotandsticky]

UK Visas are taking about 4 weeks.

 

The most recent one I saw was submitted to UKVI on 17 May and the 'passport dispatched' email was sent on 8 June  (22 days, virtually back to the stndard 15 working day processing).

[Satcommlee]

Thank you everyone for your replies, I post the followiing in case anyone else is in the same boat, it is regarding emergency passports..
 

Dear Sender, 

Thank you for your enquiry about making a First Time Application for an Emergency Travel Document for a person who has not previously held a British passport, or has previously held a British passport more than 10 years ago.    

 

In most circumstances you will not be able to make a First Time Application for an Emergency Travel Document. You will need to apply to Her Majesty’s Passport Office (HMPO) for a full validity passport. Further details of how to apply can be found here.   

 

The circumstances when you can apply for an Emergency Travel Document are limited, must be evidenced by supporting documentation and include:   

   

• Urgent medical need for the applicant (or parent if applicant is a child) and where treatment cannot be sought in the residing country   

  

If we consider that you may have exceptional circumstances and could be entitled to a British Emergency Travel Document, we will send you a hyperlink to follow which will allow you to submit an application. Please monitor your Spam folder actively. 

 

These applications are different to straightforward Emergency Travel Document applications. There are additional eligibility, nationality and safeguarding checks and an interview is mandatory in all cases. We are therefore unable to provide an estimate of how long an application may take, however this is usually several weeks and can be longer depending on the documents provided and your individual circumstances.   

If you do not receive a hyperlink or a response from us within 5 working days this means we will not be proceeding with your application and you should contact HMPO to start or escalate your application for a full validity passport. 

 

We are currently experiencing a surge in applications and it may take longer than usual for us to respond.  

 

Please do not call or email to ask for updates as these will not be responded to. We will contact you when we have an update on your application. 

 

You should only contact us if there has been a material change in your circumstances. 

 

Kind regards, 

 

Emergency Travel Documents Centre | Consular Directorate 

[Eff1n2ret]

16 hours ago, Satcommlee said:

I started a first UK passport for my son in Mid-March, it seems to have only been processed in Trendy on 29th April

That's disgraceful. They only have to look through the paperwork and stick it in the envelope for DHL, there is no other "processing". Any explanation from VFS why it took over a month?

[richard_smith237]

An extremely p!ss poor response... 

 

Basically, we may or may not help you, we may or may not let you know in 5 days. 

If we don’t let you know if we can help you it means we can’t.

Try and apply for a passport but that’s going to take a long time. 

 

 

How did the Government of G8 nation ever let standards at their passport office drop to such an outrageously atrocious level of service that a British Citizen is unable to travel to his home country ?

 

This is an utter embarrassment for anyone working in the British civil service - It seems inefficiency, apathy and polite but utterly useless responses to serious queries are order of the day. 

 

IF this were a private run company people would have stopped using them years ago...  unfortunately, they operate without competition at the speed of the lowest common denominator with the consideration of the whoever gives the least £ucks......   

 

Wholly disappointing...   What can we do... renew passports a year ahead of time when we know we will not need to travel.

For anyone with a British Child, apply for their first passport immediately.

 

 

And... what of those who require regular travel for work ?...  a passport renewal means no travel for 12 weeks until they get the new passport ??

 

The passport office is slow slow, is it now necessary for people to have two passports to cover themselves against the utter inefficiency of the British Passport office ?

 

 

 

 

[Satcommlee]

7 minutes ago, Eff1n2ret said:

That's disgraceful. They only have to look through the paperwork and stick it in the envelope for DHL, there is no other "processing". Any explanation from VFS why it took over a month?

It was not VFS fault in this case, there was a 3rd party involved. It's my fault for not doing it in person.

[Eff1n2ret]

1 minute ago, Satcommlee said:

It was not VFS fault in this case, there was a 3rd party involved. It's my fault for not doing it in person.

Is that a discreet way of saying agents aren't all they're cracked up to be?

[Eff1n2ret]

16 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

An extremely p!ss poor response...

I agree - to be telling an applicant that their Emergency application may take several weeks makes a total mockery of the word emergency. I greatly sympathise with the OP. If he could be sure of his lad getting a visa in time for his trip I would recommend him to go for it, although as has already been pointed out an Immigration or Visa Officer has no authority to place entry restrictions on a British Citizen, and should therefore not issue a visa. The great irony is that if the lad could present himself at passport control in the UK with the document registering him as a british citizen they'd have to let him in - but of course no airline would take the risk of boarding him.

If I were the OP I would be inclined to ignore the instructions not to contact the Embassy, and create merry hell until they get off their backsides and issue him with a travel doc. They really don't care about us, witness the moribund Consular Forum where they haven't posted for a month or more, and their stock response to most queries is "not me guv" and a link to another department.

[richard_smith237]

Op has the following options to cover his bases.

 

1) UK Passport Application - In place: Await arrival of passport. Timing is out of his control. 

 

2) Await a response from Embassy regarding emergency travel document: He’s taken those steps, ensure he has all his paperwork (particularly documented illness of relatives highlighting need to return urgently and a full length version of his Birth Certificate). The rest is out of his control.

 

3) Apply for UK Visa with his sons Thai Passport - This is in his control he should do this ASAP and then await a response - timing of result is out of his control. 

 

 

Thus: All the Op can do now is ensure he has required documents for #2 and #3 apply for UK Visa with his sons Thai Passport...

 

After that there is no point worrying over that which he has no influence. 

 

[Satcommlee]

Yes, some really helpful posts here guys, thanks

[Dogmatix]

On 6/15/2022 at 9:52 PM, PPGuy said:

My experience is from the mid 90's so rules and regs may well have changed since then.

 

However, my then 6 year old son (Thai/Brit) with only a Thai passport, was given a visa to enter the UK. This was issued at the Brit Embassy in Bangkok and, from memory, was placed at the back of his Thai passport as that was deemed appropriate. Not sure of the validity period / type of visa but had no issues entering the UK. The dual national status of my son was fully understood so that did not prove to be a show stopper. Our circumstances meant that obtaining a UK passport was more problematic then, as he was born before I married his mother. Sorted that out later.

 

Of course having the decision makers all under one roof at that time likely simplified the process. Now.....?

 

Good luck.

I expect the OP's case has been resolved one way or another by now.  But for the record the current rule is that they will not issue UK visas to UK citizens who have valid UK passports.  If you are British but do not have a valid passport, you are theoretically eligible for a visa in a foreign passport.  I think in the OP's case they would, however, not issue a visa to someone they knew has applied for a British passport. 

 

The rules changed in 2007 AFAIK.  Before that there was no prohibition on issuing Brits with UK visas in foreign passports.  In fact they used to issue the Certificate of Entitlement which was equivalent to UK permanent residence and was valid for life and could be transferred to new passports free of charge. That was extremely useful for people who didn't want to reveal they had UK citizenship.  No need to even get a British passport.  You could stay in the UK as long as you wanted with full citizenship right but no British passport. Sadly those days are gone.  The COEs are no more and those with valid UK passports cannot get a UK visa. 

[Satcommlee]

Just to follow up, after weeks of being told told the passport is in some pile somewhere still waiting to be looked it, it was all of a sudden processed in a week, sent  to Thailand and in total it took a total of 8-9 weeks. (First Passport for a child submitted at Trendy on 29th April 2022)

 

Thankyou everyone for the input above.