LTR Visa is Now available for Long Term Residency

[Ben Zioner]

53 minutes ago, makescents said:

Having to re-certify every 5 years isn't great. If you lose your job you lose the visa.

We were talking about retirement visas, hence the 800,000 deposit. So no job to be lost...

[JimGant]

10 hours ago, mudcat said:

I also wish to point out for U.S. people cashing out the ThB 800,000 bank account and keeping your combined overseas bank balance at any day of the year less than $10,000 removes the requirement to file FinCEN ,114 to comply with FATCA.  

 

The FinCEN 114 FBAR form takes about five minutes to fill out, even with single and joint accounts, using last year's refillable PDF form. Not sure why some get so worked up over this requirement. Granted, it's a stupid requirement -- FBARS's $10000 threshold should be acclimated with FATCA's $50000 threshold -- and apparently there are efforts to do that. Meanwhile, I'll leave my 800k in its bank account, and bring more over -- as it's becoming clearer that my money in the States, slated by POD for my worthless niece and nephew, would be better served left to my wife's Thai nieces and nephews, who have become very helpful. Opportunity cost of having my money in a Thai bank account? One day's movement in my stocks corrects for that.

 

Nope. A lot easier in the long term by getting my money over here soonest, to be left to Thai relatives -- than retaining a lawyer in the States for final settlement -- since I can't POD my Thai relatives.

 

 

[mudcat]

I understand that FinCEN 114 is relatively easy to complete once you have a template, but explaining to my Thai wife who is a U.S. citizen that failure to file this form could put her Social Security survivor benefit at risk has been a long struggle.  Estate planning for U.S. assets is relatively easy with beneficiary statements and joint accounts - here not so much so I leave the bulk of my assets in my U.S. Roth IRA until I pass. 

 

I agree that a $50K threshold makes more sense, but once my wife inherits and moves assets to here (which is her decision) even $50K will not exempt her from the necessity to file, so we go through the exercise of extracting interest and high balance from each of her accounts each year.  

 

The latest issue I have with FinCEN 114 is the necessity of having Acrobat Reader installed to download or open the pdf form.  I can complete and file her template with my Acrobat 9 program, but needing to have a computer (desktop or laptop) may prove to be a problem in the future for her.

 

 

 

 

[Misty]

14 hours ago, JimGant said:

 

The FinCEN 114 FBAR form takes about five minutes to fill out, even with single and joint accounts, using last year's refillable PDF form. Not sure why some get so worked up over this requirement. Granted, it's a stupid requirement -- FBARS's $10000 threshold should be acclimated with FATCA's $50000 threshold -- and apparently there are efforts to do that. Meanwhile, I'll leave my 800k in its bank account, and bring more over -- as it's becoming clearer that my money in the States, slated by POD for my worthless niece and nephew, would be better served left to my wife's Thai nieces and nephews, who have become very helpful. Opportunity cost of having my money in a Thai bank account? One day's movement in my stocks corrects for that.

 

Nope. A lot easier in the long term by getting my money over here soonest, to be left to Thai relatives -- than retaining a lawyer in the States for final settlement -- since I can't POD my Thai relatives.

 

 

 

It's really good to hear that there are efforts to increase the FBAR threshold figure to be closer to FATCA's.  I didn't know that. In fact FATCA's Form 8938 threshold for expats (US taxpayers living outside the US) is even higher than the $50,000 domestic threshold as per below.  It would be very helpful if FBAR threshold could go to the expat Form 8938 threshold, and then be inflation adjusted:

• Unmarried taxpayer threshold - more than $200k on last day of tax year or more than $300k at any time during the tax year.
• Married Filing Jointly--more than $400k on the last day of the tax year or more than $600k at any time during the tax year.

https://www.irs.gov/instructions/i8938#en_US_2020_publink55389wd0e825

 

[SHA 2 BKK]

2 hours ago, Misty said:

 

It's really good to hear that there are efforts to increase the FBAR threshold figure to be closer to FATCA's.  I didn't know that. In fact FATCA's Form 8938 threshold for expats (US taxpayers living outside the US) is even higher than the $50,000 domestic threshold as per below.  It would be very helpful if FBAR threshold could go to the expat Form 8938 threshold, and then be inflation adjusted:

• Unmarried taxpayer threshold - more than $200k on last day of tax year or more than $300k at any time during the tax year.
• Married Filing Jointly--more than $400k on the last day of the tax year or more than $600k at any time during the tax year.

https://www.irs.gov/instructions/i8938#en_US_2020_publink55389wd0e825

 

Geez you Yanks gotta jump through some hoops every year.   I gotta file back in Oz still as I earn some coin there.  But that takes me half an hour online.  Uncle Sam sure wants his Pound of Flesh.   

[JimGant]

2 hours ago, Misty said:

It's really good to hear that there are efforts to increase the FBAR threshold figure to be closer to FATCA's.  I didn't know that.

 

I guess I got that from ACA:

 

Quote

ACA advocates for the harmonization of these two reporting systems into one form. In absence of harmonization, ACA advocates for increasing the threshold for FBAR reporting, which has never been adjusted for inflation, to mirror the reporting threshold for FATCA reporting.

https://www.americansabroad.org/news/aca-requests-improvements-to-the-bank-secrecy-act/

 

Actually, reading further down on this excellent ACA article, you'll find my biggest dislike of the Patriot Act, namely, making expats with US bank accounts restricted from many banking activities.

[Pib]

18 minutes ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

Uncle Sam sure wants his Pound of Flesh.   

Uncle Sam is now warming-up to the metric system and now wants his Kilogram of Flesh especially after he found out there is 2.2 pounds in a kilogram.

[JimGant]

1 hour ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

 Uncle Sam sure wants his Pound of Flesh.   

 

Hey, it takes a lot of money to defend the free world. We're still paying for kicking out the Japanese from Guadalcanal, so that Oz remained free, and allowed our Marines to have the best liberty of their lives in Melbourne. My grandfather died telling Oz stories, before he had to head out for Cape Gloucester.

[SHA 2 BKK]

3 hours ago, JimGant said:

 

Hey, it takes a lot of money to defend the free world. We're still paying for kicking out the Japanese from Guadalcanal, so that Oz remained free, and allowed our Marines to have the best liberty of their lives in Melbourne. My grandfather died telling Oz stories, before he had to head out for Cape Gloucester.

Agree with you cobber.  It was the Aussies and Yanks that stopped the Japs first - that being the Battle of the Coral Sea (before Midway).   My dear departed Grandad fought on Kokoda and then through the battles on the North Coast of New Guinea.  America was and has been a great friend of Australia.   However an interesting story took place in this relationship 20 odd years before. 
 

During the Treaty of Versailles negotiations after the Great War, US President Woodrow Wilson argued strongly that German New Guinea be given to the then allied Empire of Japan as a protectorate.  Australias’ Prime Minister Billy Hughes was having none of it and wanted the former German colony to join Australian controlled Papua.  
 

Wilson looked at this diminutive, half deaf PM from a nation of 4 million people,  that had only been had its own Government for 18 years and said to Hughes “I sir represent 60 million Americans”.  
 

Hughes responded that with due respect he represented “60,000 dead Australians”.   
 

Fortunately Hughes won the argument and Papua New Guinea became an Australian protectorate until its independence in 1975. 
 

 

[JimGant]

5 hours ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

Wilson looked at this diminutive, half deaf PM from a nation of 4 million people,  that had only been had its own Government for 18 years and said to Hughes “I sir represent 60 million Americans”.

Yeah, Yanks can be bloody arrogant. I apologize. Aussies have been our finest allies, sticking with us through our worst follies, like Vietnam.

OK, enough thread creep. Sorry.

Edited January 16 by JimGant

[SHA 2 BKK]

7 hours ago, JimGant said:

Yeah, Yanks can be bloody arrogant. I apologize. Aussies have been our finest allies, sticking with us through our worst follies, like Vietnam.

OK, enough thread creep. Sorry.

No apologies needed cobber - we are mates.

[makescents]

On 1/14/2024 at 11:41 PM, Ben Zioner said:

We were talking about retirement visas, hence the 800,000 deposit. So no job to be lost...

Ah ok. I’m talking about LTR for remote workers. Retirement visa can’t lead to PR I believe because you aren’t paying taxes. 

[TravelerEastWest]

I have my LTR Pension visa now I am applying for the digital work permit.

 

I have uploaded all the requested documents and have a "Qualification Approved" status and am on screen 1.

 

How do I now get an appointment?

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Misty]

16 hours ago, TravelerEastWest said:

I have my LTR Pension visa now I am applying for the digital work permit.

 

I have uploaded all the requested documents and have a "Qualification Approved" status and am on screen 1.

 

How do I now get an appointment?

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Is there a red bell in the upper left side of your screen you can click on? Or otherwise, try clicking on the 3 vertical dots next to the "View" button in the screenshot above.  If neither of those pull up the calendar to schedule a visit, my best suggestion is just call the LTR unit and ask.

 

 

[Misty]

Spotted this announcement on the LTR Facebook page. The last bullet point looks to be good news for LTR visa holders doing annual reporting:

 

https://www.facebook.com/LTRVisaThailand/posts/pfbid0t8EooPqgfL8RQmgfS1eFtNDKjXMEC1PQqBzo9ZZ7dHBAaotjFvBH33dAjoHrqQy9l

 

[Pib]

4 hours ago, Misty said:

Spotted this announcement on the LTR Facebook page. The last bullet point looks to be good news for LTR visa holders doing annual reporting:

 

https://www.facebook.com/LTRVisaThailand/posts/pfbid0t8EooPqgfL8RQmgfS1eFtNDKjXMEC1PQqBzo9ZZ7dHBAaotjFvBH33dAjoHrqQy9l

 

 

Thanks, Misty.

 

I like how these various announcements/new media report regarding the online day reporting system---making it sound like it was just launched when in fact it's been in operation for a couple of years....the new system (now around 2 years old) replaced the "old online" system.   Basically immigration trying to rewrap/re-gift a present from a couple of years ago.  I don't know why they didn't package their announcement as online system "Ver 2.0" (as in an upgrade) versus trying to make it sound like it's a brand new online system...recently born. 

 

Unless something has changed since I lasted visit BOI Chamchuri Sq Immigration in late Dec 2023 to do my LTR 1 year address report (I live in Bangkok and the immigration office is only about 30 minutes drive time from me) two immigration officers told me a LTR/SMART visa 1 year address report still can not be done online; only certain other BOI-managed visas which require 90 day address reporting can be done online.  These two immigration officers basically reconfirmed what three other immigration officers told me several months earlier which I visited BOI on another issue. 

 

But as of 27 Jan 2024 nothing has changed "wording-wise" on the online reporting system where it talks BOI-managed visas....and as I already mentioned numerous Chamchuri Sq immigration officers told me that wording only deals with BOI-managed visa's which required 90 day address reporting; it can not currently be used for 1 year LTR/SMART visa report.   See snapshot at bottom.

 

However, back on 11 Jan 2024 in this thread @TravelerEastWest said he had a friend who did his LTR 1 year address report online but when several of us questioned is the friend sure he got a receipt to report again in 1 year or maybe it was just 90 days TravelerEastWest said he would need to follow-up with his friend to double check.  Unless I missed it, I haven't seen a response yet. 

I do hope the system is updated soon to allow online 1 year address reporting for the LTR and SMART visas.  I'm sure BOI has been asked many times by LTR holders as why 1 year address reporting is not supported online.   And who knows, maybe once LTR/SMART visa 1 year address reporting can be done online the current wording may not change...or maybe it will change....who knows.    Sure would like to see a couple LTR holders chime in with confirmation they have successfully accomplished 1 year address reporting online....and their address report receipt shows next report is due 1 year down the road.

 

Snapshot from 90 Day Online Reporting System as of 27 Jan 2024 (same wording that's been there for a long time).

 

 

 

 

[Ben Zioner]

Maybe, implementing a reporting period that is determined by the visa type is just too mind boggling for a Thai IT graduate. I have a mental picture their code with "90" hard coded all over the place.

[mrmagyar]

Has anyone with an LTR visa (Wealthy Pensioner, Wealthy Citizen or WFT) bothered to get a Thai tax ID?

 

I understand that there are no Thai tax obligations with these visas but wondered if anyone had got the tax ID and filed proactively, or planned to do so?

[SHA 2 BKK]

1 hour ago, mrmagyar said:

Has anyone with an LTR visa (Wealthy Pensioner, Wealthy Citizen or WFT) bothered to get a Thai tax ID?

 

I understand that there are no Thai tax obligations with these visas but wondered if anyone had got the tax ID and filed proactively, or planned to do so?

 

I haven't and hope not to get drawn into the Thai Tax system if at all possible - even if no tax is owed.  I did make sure I have enough In Thailand this year to hopefully get us through 2024 so no need to do anything until things get a bit clearer. 

 

However, my understanding of Royal Decree 743, is that as income remitted but earned in a previous year is not subject to Thai Tax regulations I can't see the need for a Thai Tax ID unless one earned some income in Thailand and I certainly don't.  

 

Be very happy if anyone could offer further advice.

[Ben Zioner]

2 hours ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

 

I haven't and hope not to get drawn into the Thai Tax system if at all possible - even if no tax is owed.  I did make sure I have enough In Thailand this year to hopefully get us through 2024 so no need to do anything until things get a bit clearer. 

 

However, my understanding of Royal Decree 743, is that as income remitted but earned in a previous year is not subject to Thai Tax regulations I can't see the need for a Thai Tax ID unless one earned some income in Thailand and I certainly don't.  

 

Be very happy if anyone could offer further advice.

I do is slightly differently; early January I have transferred my 2023 pension, which is non taxable because of Paw. 162 and RD 743. But in 2025, 206, 2026, if RD. 743 gets repealed, I'll transfer 1.5 M a year, which would then generate 150k to 200k of income tax, instead of 750k if I transferred my whole pension. 2028 would then become a sabbatical in Vietnam or Malaysia depending on my health/demise. I wouldn't mind paying these 150k, as they would be a fair contribution, make me look a good boy and keep my local RD office happy.

 

And  @mrmagyar  I din't get a TIN but I have now a Thai ID with a number that can be used when dealing with the RD. I didn't want to go to the RD to look like an idiot sheep volunteering unduly to the slaughterhouse.

Edited January 29 by Ben Zioner

[SHA 2 BKK]

11 hours ago, Ben Zioner said:

I do is slightly differently; early January I have transferred my 2023 pension, which is non taxable because of Paw. 162 and RD 743. But in 2025, 206, 2026, if RD. 743 gets repealed, I'll transfer 1.5 M a year, which would then generate 150k to 200k of income tax, instead of 750k if I transferred my whole pension. 2028 would then become a sabbatical in Vietnam or Malaysia depending on my health/demise. I wouldn't mind paying these 150k, as they would be a fair contribution, make me look a good boy and keep my local RD office happy.

 

And  @mrmagyar  I din't get a TIN but I have now a Thai ID with a number that can be used when dealing with the RD. I didn't want to go to the RD to look like an idiot sheep volunteering unduly to the slaughterhouse.

Pray for Royal Decree 743.  Amen.

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

Pray for Royal Decree 743.  Amen.

Not sure about that, Yahweh is egalitarian while Buddah isn't...

But seriously, there are two schools of thought here; those who believe that expats are the target,  while others claim that RD wants to nail affluent Thai dodgers. What happens to RD 743 will give us an indication.

[SHA 2 BKK]

2 hours ago, Ben Zioner said:

Not sure about that, Yahweh is egalitarian while Buddah isn't...

But seriously, there are two schools of thought here; those who believe that expats are the target,  while others claim that RD wants to nail affluent Thai dodgers. What happens to RD 743 will give us an indication.

Sathu.  

[TravelerEastWest]

On 1/27/2024 at 11:27 AM, Misty said:

 

Is there a red bell in the upper left side of your screen you can click on? Or otherwise, try clicking on the 3 vertical dots next to the "View" button in the screenshot above.  If neither of those pull up the calendar to schedule a visit, my best suggestion is just call the LTR unit and ask.

 

 

Thank you Misty - yes three dots but nothing happens... I will email them - I didn't know that calling was an option...

[TravelerEastWest]

On 1/27/2024 at 4:18 PM, Pib said:

 

However, back on 11 Jan 2024 in this thread @TravelerEastWest said he had a friend who did his LTR 1 year address report online but when several of us questioned is the friend sure he got a receipt to report again in 1 year or maybe it was just 90 days TravelerEastWest said he would need to follow-up with his friend to double check.  Unless I missed it, I haven't seen a response yet. 

 

 

My friend actually didn't tell me if he got a receipt but after looking at an example from this thread of the one year form he said that one looks better...

[Misty]

11 hours ago, TravelerEastWest said:

Thank you Misty - yes three dots but nothing happens... I will email them - I didn't know that calling was an option...

 

Yes, I found phone calls to the LTR unit to be invaluable, also in-person visits when all else failed.  If you call, be prepared for long wait times, so have something to do or read while you wait. You'll probably first get the BOI switchboard and get put on hold.  Ask for the LTR unit, and you'll probably get put on hold again.  But once you get someone at the LTR unit, they'll be able to look up your case by the "DOC number" which if it's a digital work permit that you applied for this year, starts out "LTRDWP2401..."   Hope it goes well and you get your appointment!

[Pib]

13 hours ago, TravelerEastWest said:

 

My friend actually didn't tell me if he got a receipt but after looking at an example from this thread of the one year form he said that one looks better...

Not at all sure what your post means...especially the ".....he said that one looks better...." part.

 

If he got a receipt it will show whether he got a 90 day or 365 day "next report date."  If he did it online but maybe lost the receipt he can logon today and print out the receipt again.   Like when I was still on a Non-O type visa (before getting my LTR visa) I used the online reporting system to do my 90 day address reports.   Now I had low success with it because 60% of my report were rejected for unknown reasons but the ones that were approved include a receipt telling me it was approved and when my next report is due...and those receipts can be download/viewed long after they have come and gone....like I just viewed my 17 May 2022 report from almost 2 years ago.

 

Yea, maybe your friend was successful in doing an online report for this LTR 365 day address report but it goes against what immigration has said that LTR address reporting has "yet to come....but hopefully soon."    Plus no one else has posted, at least in this thread, that they have successfully accomplished their LTR 365 day address report online.  

 

[TravelerEastWest]

8 hours ago, Misty said:

 

Yes, I found phone calls to the LTR unit to be invaluable, also in-person visits when all else failed.  If you call, be prepared for long wait times, so have something to do or read while you wait. You'll probably first get the BOI switchboard and get put on hold.  Ask for the LTR unit, and you'll probably get put on hold again.  But once you get someone at the LTR unit, they'll be able to look up your case by the "DOC number" which if it's a digital work permit that you applied for this year, starts out "LTRDWP2401..."   Hope it goes well and you get your appointment!

Misty

 

Thank you for your help - I have appointments available now! I am in Chiang Mai so I have to try for 11am unless I get up at 5am... for an early flight...

[TravelerEastWest]

5 hours ago, Pib said:

Not at all sure what your post means...especially the ".....he said that one looks better...." part.

 

If he got a receipt it will show whether he got a 90 day or 365 day "next report date."  If he did it online but maybe lost the receipt he can logon today and print out the receipt again.   Like when I was still on a Non-O type visa (before getting my LTR visa) I used the online reporting system to do my 90 day address reports.   Now I had low success with it because 60% of my report were rejected for unknown reasons but the ones that were approved include a receipt telling me it was approved and when my next report is due...and those receipts can be download/viewed long after they have come and gone....like I just viewed my 17 May 2022 report from almost 2 years ago.

 

Yea, maybe your friend was successful in doing an online report for this LTR 365 day address report but it goes against what immigration has said that LTR address reporting has "yet to come....but hopefully soon."    Plus no one else has posted, at least in this thread, that they have successfully accomplished their LTR 365 day address report online.  

 

 

My friend liked the one from this thread better than the one he filled out - I sent him an email with a copy of the one from this thread - not sure I think it was form 95?

 

Two possibilities:

 

1) The form he filled out won't work and they will tell him at some point - not a big problem.

 

or

 

2) He filled out the wrong form but they said mai pen rai and accepted it... Note it was not rejected.

 

i think number 2

[oldcpu]

On 1/29/2024 at 3:49 PM, mrmagyar said:

Has anyone with an LTR visa (Wealthy Pensioner, Wealthy Citizen or WFT) bothered to get a Thai tax ID?

 

I understand that there are no Thai tax obligations with these visas but wondered if anyone had got the tax ID and filed proactively, or planned to do so?

 

I have an LTR-WP, and I have not made any special effort to get a Thai tax ID - nor have I filed a Thai tax return.

 

Details:

 

As part of my application for the LTR-WP, I ended up having to show an investment of $250K US$ equivalent in Condo.  Since both my name and my wife's name is on my Thai condo deed, I could only use 1/2 of my condo purchase price toward my $250K US$ equivalent (for an investment in Thailand).  So I ended up buying 2-million THB in Thai government bonds to put me over the $250K US$ investment (with some margin).

 

As part of the Thai bond application, in the online application system being used by Bangkok Bank, they had to enter a tax-ID, else the application for the bond would fail.   

 

I pointed out to them they had been taking a 'withholding' tax from my Thai bank account for years (from interest my Thai account earned), and I asked what Tax ID they used for that?  I only received 'blank stares'.    

 

In Thailand, I am told the # on Thai people's ID cards, is also their tax ID.  So my Thai wife suggested to the bank that the bank use the number on my Thai "pink-ID" for the "Tax-ID" column.  They entered that, and their computer accepted that.

 

Having typed that, I doubt that the "pink-ID' is the "Tax-ID" for a foreigner, and I too am waiting to see whether as time passes if I will eventually end up getting a tax ID.

 

At present, I do not plan to file a Thai tax return, (as my Thai income (ie income in Thailand) is less than the level necessary for filing a Thai tax return, but things can change - so I also am curious to learn here.

Edited February 1 by oldcpu