Toyota Motors (Thailand) ordered to pay ฿10bn in outstanding import taxes and fees

[DrPhibes]

On 9/16/2022 at 12:51 PM, Tiuangmoh said:

Until the wheels fall off, if you’ll pardon the pun ????

Due to being forced to buy Thai substandard parts instead of well made ones.

[josephbloggs]

1 hour ago, DrPhibes said:

Due to being forced to buy Thai substandard parts instead of well made ones.

What are you talking about??

Just more racist anti Thai rubbish with no basis in truth.  Yawn.

[smutcakes]

1 hour ago, DrPhibes said:

Due to being forced to buy Thai substandard parts instead of well made ones.

You will of course be aware Toyota manufacture a lot of their own parts through Denso, a company they partially own, and these parts are manufactured in Thailand......

 

And of course all auto companies can buy parts from whichever supplier they want, local or abroad.... Funny as reading this thread you would think Thailand is awful for manufacturers which makes it strange that off the top of my head i can think of the following auto companies with large facilities here:

 

Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Ford, Suzuki, BMW, Ducati, MG, GWP, Hino, Mazda, Harley D, Triumph, Yamaha,

[josephbloggs]

1 hour ago, smutcakes said:

You will of course be aware Toyota manufacture a lot of their own parts through Denso, a company they partially own, and these parts are manufactured in Thailand......

 

And of course all auto companies can buy parts from whichever supplier they want, local or abroad.... Funny as reading this thread you would think Thailand is awful for manufacturers which makes it strange that off the top of my head i can think of the following auto companies with large facilities here:

 

Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Ford, Suzuki, BMW, Ducati, MG, GWP, Hino, Mazda, Harley D, Triumph, Yamaha,

Mercedes too.  Car assembly factory and also a battery plant.

[smutcakes]

5 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

Mercedes too.  Car assembly factory and also a battery plant.

Strictly speaking Mercedes don't. Thonburi Automotive are their assembler.

[newnative]

20 hours ago, josephbloggs said:

So a company can cheat on import duties to the value of 10 billion baht and it should just be waived to show good will.  That would show the world that companies can come and work in Thailand and just do what they want because they will be let off.  Brilliant.

Have you read the detailed court verdict?  Have you read the cases of both sides?  Where do you get your information from that says this is the tax department being short sighted and dumb?  Or are you just saying that because it is Thailand and Thailand must be wrong?  Toyota have already said they will comply and pay up.  

I haven't read the detailed judgement or the detailed cases of either side.  I therefore am in no place to make a judgement.  And I am sure that is the case for every other poster here.  Yet you all jump to the same automatic conclusion that Thailand = wrong.

     Totally missing the point.  Did I read the 'detailed court verdict?', you ask.   Of course not.  Did I 'read the cases of both sides?'  Again, a big no.  Neither will 99% of the people who see the news article--and, apparently that also includes you, from your above post. 

    Many readers will come to the conclusion, as I did, that Thailand is being vindictive and petty to a large company that is important to Thailand.  It's all about perception--and the perception is bad.  Your final sentence makes my point nicely: 'Yet you all jump to the same conclusion that Thailand= wrong.'   Yes, we're all coming to the conclusion that Thailand is wrong in its actions in this case, and it's not a good look for Thailand, especially given some past bad behavior with foreign companies working in Thailand.  I stand by my previous post.

[josephbloggs]

4 hours ago, newnative said:

     Totally missing the point.  Did I read the 'detailed court verdict?', you ask.   Of course not.  Did I 'read the cases of both sides?'  Again, a big no.  Neither will 99% of the people who see the news article--and, apparently that also includes you, from your above post. 

    Many readers will come to the conclusion, as I did, that Thailand is being vindictive and petty to a large company that is important to Thailand.  It's all about perception--and the perception is bad.  Your final sentence makes my point nicely: 'Yet you all jump to the same conclusion that Thailand= wrong.'   Yes, we're all coming to the conclusion that Thailand is wrong in its actions in this case, and it's not a good look for Thailand, especially given some past bad behavior with foreign companies working in Thailand.  I stand by my previous post.

Feel free to stand by it.  I stand by my assertion that is a company (large or small) is caught cheating taxes and breaking laws they should expect to be punished and should not just be let off in order to not give out a "bad look".  If you do that then everyone knows they can act with impunity and Thailand will be too scared to take them to court less it be seen badly.

You are aware that there are also two corruption investigations ongoing; one in Thailand and a federal US enquiry that are looking into allegations that Toyota paid several million dollars in an attempt to bribe Supreme Court judges to overturn their tax dodging conviction.

 

https://www.law360.com/articles/1495998?scroll=1&related=1

But yeah, this is bad form by Thailand, Toyota should be let off the hook because, erm, just because.

[spidermike007]

On 9/16/2022 at 5:07 PM, bdenner said:

IMHO, Toyota did not enter Thailand without having all their ducks in a row. They're too big for that.

The Thais, as they do with we Farang, have jerked around with the "goal posts" now trying to screw the pooch.

Chevrolet had no problem packing up and moving out others could well follow.

I guess that is what you get when Generals, who could barely run an army, have their sticky fingers in a countries ecconomy.

Correct. The generals would not know what integrity looked like if it bit them on the butt. Breaking promises is no big deal for them, if they think it is of some benefit. However, like most dinosaurs, they do not have any vision, and they just don't understand the international corporate mindset. They want stability. They want partners they can count on to fulfill a simple promise of a tax break. 

 

After this disastrous and unethical judicial Toyota decision, I expect many companies to start looking elsewhere. This will likely cause huge long term damage, and continue the backwards trajectory the nation has been on for some time now. This was way, way beyond stupid. 

Edited September 18, 2022 by spidermike007

[billd766]

On 9/16/2022 at 5:33 PM, tomazbodner said:

 

Remind me who was running Thailand 2010-2012, please.

Well from December 2008 until August 2011 it was Abhisit and the Democrats and from August 2011 it was Yingluck and the Pheu Thai, followed by Prayuth and the current lot.

 

Does that make you happy?

 

Of course you could have done a Google search here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_prime_ministers_of_Thailand all by yourself.

[tomazbodner]

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

Well from December 2008 until August 2011 it was Abhisit and the Democrats and from August 2011 it was Yingluck and the Pheu Thai, followed by Prayuth and the current lot.

 

Does that make you happy?

 

Of course you could have done a Google search here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_prime_ministers_of_Thailand all by yourself.

That was for gentleman quoted in that post, who slammed "generals" for this fiasco..

[DrPhibes]

On 9/17/2022 at 4:14 PM, smutcakes said:

You will of course be aware Toyota manufacture a lot of their own parts through Denso, a company they partially own, and these parts are manufactured in Thailand......

 

And of course all auto companies can buy parts from whichever supplier they want, local or abroad.... Funny as reading this thread you would think Thailand is awful for manufacturers which makes it strange that off the top of my head i can think of the following auto companies with large facilities here:

 

Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Ford, Suzuki, BMW, Ducati, MG, GWP, Hino, Mazda, Harley D, Triumph, Yamaha,

Apologies to all.  My mistake to take my past experience with Thai manufactured home goods and project that.

[PremiumLane]

9 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Correct. The generals would not know what integrity looked like if it bit them on the butt. Breaking promises is no big deal for them, if they think it is of some benefit. However, like most dinosaurs, they do not have any vision, and they just don't understand the international corporate mindset. They want stability. They want partners they can count on to fulfill a simple promise of a tax break. 

 

After this disastrous and unethical judicial Toyota decision, I expect many companies to start looking elsewhere. This will likely cause huge long term damage, and continue the backwards trajectory the nation has been on for some time now. This was way, way beyond stupid. 

They broke the tax laws, so what are you prattling on about? 

[kwak250]

36 minutes ago, PremiumLane said:

They broke the tax laws, so what are you prattling on about? 

We all thought it but you said it.

[SidJames]

When Toyota leave then Thailand can make it's own brand of vehicles in the new Thaiota factories.

The same goes for the Thai moon rocket.

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, PremiumLane said:

They broke the tax laws, so what are you prattling on about? 

Incorrect. Research this. Thailand promised tax breaks to Toyota. They are the ones who broke the promise. Toyota simply followed what they were allowed to do, and then they took the shaft for doing so, with an undependable partner. Now, Thailand is claiming things that were not part of the original agreement. Toyota has been fighting this unjustice for a decade. This is a very bad omen for the future of manufacturing here. 

[PremiumLane]

25 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Incorrect. Research this. Thailand promised tax breaks to Toyota. They are the ones who broke the promise. Toyota simply followed what they were allowed to do, and then they took the shaft for doing so, with an undependable partner. Now, Thailand is claiming things that were not part of the original agreement. Toyota has been fighting this unjustice for a decade. This is a very bad omen for the future of manufacturing here. 

evidence for this?

[spidermike007]

2 hours ago, PremiumLane said:

evidence for this?

I am currently searching. There was alot of news on it, when the Thai govt. started reneging. Toyota sued them, not the other way around. 

[smutcakes]

On 9/16/2022 at 3:00 PM, spidermike007 said:

Because it is total PR. No doubt Toyota and countless other Japanese and international firms are looking at a way out, as we type. They needs partners they can count on, to keep their word on promises of tax relief, and other benefits, that were factored into the decision to manufacture here, and set up plants at great expense. 

Were you surprised to see AWS 5 billion USD investment announced over the next 15 years?

[Ralf001]

On 9/19/2022 at 10:08 AM, spidermike007 said:

Incorrect. Research this. Thailand promised tax breaks to Toyota. They are the ones who broke the promise. Toyota simply followed what they were allowed to do, and then they took the shaft for doing so, with an undependable partner. Now, Thailand is claiming things that were not part of the original agreement. Toyota has been fighting this unjustice for a decade. This is a very bad omen for the future of manufacturing here. 

A promise is not a law.