On 12/27/2022 at 5:22 PM, Mac Mickmanus said:

That is a link to a charity and they are seeking donations , that isn't a credible news source

They’ve quoted ONS data.

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/excesswintermortalityinenglandandwales/previousReleases

24 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I've cut my grid power usage by 80%.

But you aren’t living in the UK.

 

Refer topic at top of the thread 

43 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

But you aren’t living in the UK.

 

Refer topic at top of the thread 

I was replying to the post, 'Britons have cut.... ', which applies to me wherever I live. 

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

I was replying to the post, 'Britons', which applies to me wherever I live. 

Perhaps it does, but has no relevance to the problems the UK is facing right now.

 

 

9 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Well , it isn't just you and me who have cut back on utility usage , the link below shows energy usage is down 10-15 % in the U.K which is the result of people cutting back on usage .

   (I really don't like having to keep providing links to people who keep doubting what I say, but, what else can I do ?)

Please spare me the sanctimonious, victimised claptrap.

 

If you've posted this link previously why didn't you simply point this out in your original reply and direct me to your original post?

 

Alternatively, are you suggesting that I accept each of your pronouncements as factual without question? If so, this is (misplaced) arrogance personified on your part. There are far too many counter-examples to allow me to do that e.g. your continual refusal to accept that Brexit has caused significant damage to the UK economy despite the wealth of data presented to support this view.

 

9 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

 

UK households have cut energy consumption by 10%, say suppliers

 

E.ON reports up to 15% drop as Grant Shapps writes to firms saying customers cutting back on energy use should not face direct debit rise

 

Britons have cut their gas and electricity use by more than 10% since October in the first evidence of the impact of the energy crisis on household habits, according to two of Britain’s biggest suppliers.

E.ON, Britain’s second-largest supplier, and Telecom Plus, which owns Utility Warehouse, have reported “double-digit” declines in recent weeks.

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/nov/27/uk-households-have-cut-energy-consumption-by-10-say-suppliers

Jeordan - Angela White & Autumnlls Have Squirtingrgasm

Good supporting evidence (provided by a link to a Guardian article!).

 

Looking forward to similar links to support your other contentions.

1 hour ago, RayC said:

Please spare me the sanctimonious, victimised claptrap.

 

If you've posted this link previously why didn't you simply point this out in your original reply and direct me to your original post?

 

Alternatively, are you suggesting that I accept each of your pronouncements as factual without question? If so, this is (misplaced) arrogance personified on your part. There are far too many counter-examples to allow me to do that e.g. your continual refusal to accept that Brexit has caused significant damage to the UK economy despite the wealth of data presented to support this view.

 

Good supporting evidence (provided by a link to a Guardian article!).

 

Looking forward to similar links to support your other contentions.

Mickmanus previously claimed to have stopped using the Guardian as a source because it predominated the results being produced by Google searches. That sounded very believable.

1 hour ago, RayC said:

Please spare me the sanctimonious, victimised claptrap.

 

If you've posted this link previously why didn't you simply point this out in your original reply and direct me to your original post?

 

Alternatively, are you suggesting that I accept each of your pronouncements as factual without question? If so, this is (misplaced) arrogance personified on your part. There are far too many counter-examples to allow me to do that e.g. your continual refusal to accept that Brexit has caused significant damage to the UK economy despite the wealth of data presented to support this view.

 

Good supporting evidence (provided by a link to a Guardian article!).

 

Looking forward to similar links to support your other contentions.

The damage being done by Brexit is continuing, it’s becoming more apparent and it’s impacting people’s lives.

 

The denial and even the unwillingness of politicians to discuss the matter are becoming less tenable by the day.

 

There are no ‘warm sunlit pastures’, Brexit promises are failing by the day.

 

Sit back and watch it unravel.

 

 

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Things have been bad in the past and got better and so it shall be this time. 

It’s never been self inflicted, and past performance is no guarantee of future returns.

28 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The damage being done by Brexit is continuing, it’s becoming more apparent and it’s impacting people’s lives.

 

The denial and even the unwillingness of politicians to discuss the matter are becoming less tenable by the day.

 

There are no ‘warm sunlit pastures’, Brexit promises are failing by the day.

 

Sit back and watch it unravel.

 

 

People who were pro Brexit most of them will keep defending their choice even though the numbers show your right. The UK is doing worse then other comparable EU countries. The only difference is Brexit. The facts are the facts, but no matter how much we repeat them the die hard Brexiteers wont change. The moderate ones and the ones willing to admit they were wrong (seen a more then a few) accept that that Brexit did more damage then good.

 

The others, don't waste your time it won't happen. But at least the truth is finally clear for those with an open mind.

 

But anyone with half a brain could have seen this coming cutting yourself off the biggest trading block near you and expecting the same privileges as before is not going to happen. BJ lied and lied and lied but people kept believing in him. 

15 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Things have been bad in the past and got better and so it shall be this time. 

Before I had doubts but now that you've provided evidence.... Who could doubt the validity of "and so it shall be this time"?

Personal attack and replies removed

3 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s never been self inflicted, and past performance is no guarantee of future returns.

Well I don't know I don't have a manic depressive disorder. ????

4 hours ago, placeholder said:

Mickmanus previously claimed to have stopped using the Guardian as a source because it predominated the results being produced by Google searches. That sounded very believable.

No I didn't , stop lying .

I said that I don't read Guardian links , I didn't say that I don't give Guardian links for other people to read . I need to post Guardian links because people wont believe its true if the same information is in another news source .

   If I posted a link to the Daily Mail with the same info, some posters would say it was untrue because its in the DM , that's why I post Guardian links, so people believe its true without question 

3 hours ago, robblok said:

People who were pro Brexit most of them will keep defending their choice even though the numbers show your right. The UK is doing worse then other comparable EU countries. The only difference is Brexit. The facts are the facts, but no matter how much we repeat them the die hard Brexiteers wont change. The moderate ones and the ones willing to admit they were wrong (seen a more then a few) accept that that Brexit did more damage then good.

 

The others, don't waste your time it won't happen. But at least the truth is finally clear for those with an open mind.

 

But anyone with half a brain could have seen this coming cutting yourself off the biggest trading block near you and expecting the same privileges as before is not going to happen. BJ lied and lied and lied but people kept believing in him. 

Anyone with half of brain as you put it knew things were not going to be easy, freedom never is easy as an open minded person would also know. 

I would say to any UK EU supporter also the contrary sort a few other thinhs got in the way of the final finishing of getting Brexit done, give it time.

5 hours ago, RayC said:

Please spare me the sanctimonious, victimised claptrap.

 

If you've posted this link previously why didn't you simply point this out in your original reply and direct me to your original post?

 

 

That's because I hadn't posted a link previously .

I can see with my own eyes that people have cut back with electric usage , at night time its quite obvious to see if lights are on or off .

  I have been to pubs where they uses candles and not electric for light and I have asked hundreds of people whether they have cut down on their utility usage and 100 % of them said that had .

  I knew that people have cut down on their utility usage and as you questioned that , I did a websearch and posted the results and the Guardian was the first result to appear

8 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

That's because I hadn't posted a link previously .

I can see with my own eyes that people have cut back with electric usage , at night time its quite obvious to see if lights are on or off .

  I have been to pubs where they uses candles and not electric for light and I have asked hundreds of people whether they have cut down on their utility usage and 100 % of them said that had .

  I knew that people have cut down on their utility usage and as you questioned that , I did a websearch and posted the results and the Guardian was the first result to appear

My daughter's cut down on home electric use because she spends most of her time waiting and sleeping in an NHS ambulance waiting to get a patient into hospital.

6 hours ago, RayC said:

 

Alternatively, are you suggesting that I accept each of your pronouncements as factual without question? If so, this is (misplaced) arrogance personified on your part. There are far too many counter-examples to allow me to do that e.g. your continual refusal to accept that Brexit has caused significant damage to the UK economy despite the wealth of data presented to support this view.

 

 

Ray , that is not true .

What I have stated is the Covid and Ukraine have been the main reason for UKs current economic woes , which is quite different to your incorrect statement about what I have claimed

44 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Ray , that is not true .

What I have stated is the Covid and Ukraine have been the main reason for UKs current economic woes , which is quite different to your incorrect statement about what I have claimed

No he’s correct. You keep refusing to accept brexit has played a major role in the uks economic woes. 

30 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

No he’s correct. You keep refusing to accept brexit has played a major role in the uks economic woes. 

A major role? A minor role? Who knows?

 

Closing the economy down for 2 years  played a role. It impacted output, retail sales, imports and exports.

 

A war also plays a role. 

 

Was the impact more or less than that of Brexit? Nobody knows for sure. Will things improve? Not sure but possible. Will things get worse? Not sure but possible.

 

Those who are so sure one way or the other should go out and buy a lottery ticket. Their ability to see into the future will surely help them choose the right numbers.

2 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

No I didn't , stop lying .

I said that I don't read Guardian links , I didn't say that I don't give Guardian links for other people to read . I need to post Guardian links because people wont believe its true if the same information is in another news source .

   If I posted a link to the Daily Mail with the same info, some posters would say it was untrue because its in the DM , that's why I post Guardian links, so people believe its true without question 

I don't read Guardian links either, they are left wing activists, not journalists.

2 minutes ago, proton said:

I don't read Guardian links either, they are left wing activists, not journalists.

This is why it's futile to debate with many on the right. They are stuck in the echo chamber of confirmation bias.

 

The Guardian is biased but it's factually reliable.

 

https://adfontesmedia.com/the-guardian-bias-and-reliability/

 

 

47 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

No he’s correct. You keep refusing to accept brexit has played a major role in the uks economic woes. 

But it was not all about economics and trade was it, it was about freedom from EU tyranny

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

This is why it's futile to debate with many on the right. They are stuck in the echo chamber of confirmation bias.

 

The Guardian is biased but it's factually reliable.

 

https://adfontesmedia.com/the-guardian-bias-and-reliability/

 

 

selected facts to support their agenda

Just now, proton said:

selected facts to support their agenda

You just earned a spot on my ignore list.

23 minutes ago, puchooay said:

A major role? A minor role? Who knows?

 

Closing the economy down for 2 years  played a role. It impacted output, retail sales, imports and exports.

 

A war also plays a role. 

 

Was the impact more or less than that of Brexit? Nobody knows for sure. Will things improve? Not sure but possible. Will things get worse? Not sure but possible.

 

Those who are so sure one way or the other should go out and buy a lottery ticket. Their ability to see into the future will surely help them choose the right numbers.

All the links I’ve posted so far on this thread show that brexit has played a major role. Go back and read them. 

7 minutes ago, proton said:

But it was not all about economics and trade was it, it was about freedom from EU tyranny

Nonsense.
 

Put the hyperbole away and smell the roses. 

17 minutes ago, proton said:

I don't read Guardian links either, they are left wing activists, not journalists.

Rubbish 

4 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

All the links I’ve posted so far on this thread show that brexit has played a major role. Go back and read them. 

And I've read articles that suggest other wise.

 

Like I said, nobody really knows the extent.

10 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

This is why it's futile to debate with many on the right. They are stuck in the echo chamber of confirmation bias.

 

The Guardian is biased but it's factually reliable.

 

https://adfontesmedia.com/the-guardian-bias-and-reliability/

 

 

Your link shows that the Guardian has a left wing bias to about the same extent as Fox news has a right wing bias 

2 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

No I didn't , stop lying .

I said that I don't read Guardian links , I didn't say that I don't give Guardian links for other people to read . I need to post Guardian links because people wont believe its true if the same information is in another news source .

   If I posted a link to the Daily Mail with the same info, some posters would say it was untrue because its in the DM , that's why I post Guardian links, so people believe its true without question 

Wow, that's even more believable. Which I didn't think was possible. You send links to articles you haven't read but are counting on to back up the points you raise? Who could doubt that? And you've been doing that all along, have you?